All of what Jason said, and I'll add what I think I remember about Nitto's concern for Mark's Rack: I believe they worry about the adjustable struts and that most folks connect them at the mid-fork braze-ons; that's not a very strong load-bearing situation and things can get bad fast if the rack decides to slide down the struts. The Basket Rack has a lot more "putting too much stuff on it" security built in.
Some of the floppiness of front loads show on Rivs is due to the high trail design. When you see rando bikes with a big boxy bag on the front those are usually low trail frames which actually handle better with a front load. I don't know why the math works this way but I had a Crust low trail bike and it felt twitchy and weird without a front load, I did NOT like it. High trail Rivs with loads on the rear, this is the way for me šāāļø Caveat: High vs. low trail will bring out the arguments with the quickness. This is one man's opinion! On Sunday, October 9, 2022 at 12:57:19 PM UTC-7 Jason Fuller wrote: > Oh yes, it will be great to see that brake and head badge again! > Hopefully the marks on the front bag aren't too noticeable since it'll be > "the back side" from most viewing angles. > > Regarding using racks like the M-18 and M1-B with a basket: they do have a > pretty low load rating (4.4lbs?), though I am certain there's a large > safety margin vs. other rack brands. I add the irish strap connection from > the "tombstone" to the handlebar as a safeguard against failure. Also, if > you run a metal front fender, that will break the rack's "fall" if it fails > too. These two factors combined leave me unconcerned with running the small > racks with up to maybe 15lbs load. More than that and the steering is > slowed down a lot anyway. This is a personal risk assessment, not a > recommendation! > > Regarding pannier racks, there's no black and white, right or wrong, but I > find that especially with the long rear ends of modern Rivs, you barely > notice the weight on the rear rack compared to the front. They both do the > job, and I've carried heavy front loads on mine, but even with 40lbs on the > rear rack I find Rivs to ride quite normal, but put 40 lbs on the front and > it's a true upper body workout to steer, and if you had to suddenly swerve > around a car door or something, the slowed steering may become a danger > > > > > > > > > > > On Sunday, 9 October 2022 at 12:35:59 UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote: > >> Well, we are going to try it, so Iām glad you guys think it looks ok. >> Jason, that poor bag has black marks from the basket rubbing on it. I hope >> it isnāt too noticeable, what a shame. I think it will be nice to see that >> headbadge and my mismatched colored brakes again, too: >> >> [image: image0.jpeg] >> >> >> [image: image1.jpeg] >> >> Regarding smaller racks for the front: Didnāt Rivendell tell us Nitto no >> longer wanted us using racks for baskets? Werenāt we supposed to only use >> the Basket Rack for baskets? This is one hesitation I have with moving my >> basket to the rear, but maybe Iām misunderstanding? >> >> Also, what makes a Rivendell better with a rear pannier rack, Jason? I >> have heard this more than once and am curious. I carried heavy front loads >> on my Betty for years and never noticed a problemā¦but then I also never >> noticed things like worn out chains and bald tires, soā¦. >> >> Leah >> >> On Oct 9, 2022, at 3:24 PM, Joe Bernard <joer...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> ļ»æ"I think the rear basket looks quite good actually, to my surprise to be >> honest!" >> >> Jason, I was surprised, too. I think it's the long stays, there's so much >> room back there behind the saddle and it fills the space like it belongs >> there. I like it! š >> On Sunday, October 9, 2022 at 10:49:33 AM UTC-7 Jason Fuller wrote: >> >>> I think the rear basket looks quite good actually, to my surprise to be >>> honest! And up front, it'll allow that Fab's bag to hang without >>> impediment and you can mount the headlight off the fork crown, which are >>> some big wins in the elegance department. >>> >>> I love the aesthetic and convenience of front cargo, but I'm coming to >>> accept that Rivs are best with a rear pannier rack and only a small front >>> "rando" rack and 137 basket for "overflow" capacity. I pulled the Pass & >>> Stow rack off my Bombadil and am not looking back! I'll put a small Nitto >>> rack on and will have saved over half a kg still. >>> On Saturday, 8 October 2022 at 17:57:45 UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote: >>> >>>> You already know what my opinion will be but I love to hear the sound >>>> of my own voice so I'll say it anyway! š >>>> >>>> I think your new plan is the way and the basket on the back looks fine. >>>> I wouldn't worry about overloading the basket/bags..Platys aren't built >>>> for >>>> full-on touring loads but you've got a lot of triangulation back there >>>> with >>>> the mid-stays, I think you'll be fine. Just try to remember when you're e >>>> in the store that you brought the bike, not a van! š¤£ >>>> >>>> On Saturday, October 8, 2022 at 4:39:08 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding >>>> Ding! wrote: >>>> >>>>> Piaw has a point. It could come to that! (A trailer.) I went out and >>>>> did a mock-up of how my bike would look with a rear basket. Not as nice, >>>>> but there would be no wheel flop and Iād lose the weight of that heavy >>>>> rackā¦ >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone[image: image0.jpeg] >>>>> >>>>> On Oct 8, 2022, at 7:18 PM, Piaw Na <pi...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ļ»æI think the "weight doesn't matter" statement only applies to say, >>>>> the 3 pound difference between my Roadini and my custom Ti touring bike. >>>>> Nobody would say that when comparing my Roadini and my triplet (65 pounds >>>>> empty, 320+ pounds loaded with myself, 2 kids, a 2 panniers for a 3 week >>>>> tour). Having said that, even on the triplet I shave every ounce I can >>>>> because it matters when you're at your limit and you're climbing a >>>>> mountain >>>>> in 100F. If I were Leah, I would get a trailer that I could easily >>>>> mount/remove for when I needed to carry a lot of stuff. I have had a >>>>> Yakima >>>>> single-wheeled trailer for 20+ years (out of production now but a similar >>>>> one can be found here: >>>>> https://www.mayacycle.com/bike-trailer-products/maya-cycle-bike-trailer). >>>>> It easily detaches so when you have no load your bike rides like a normal >>>>> bike (no wheel flop, etc), and then when you attach it you get a trailer! >>>>> Even better, with the trailer there are ways of maneuvering it so that >>>>> the >>>>> trailer acts as a kickstand. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Saturday, October 8, 2022 at 12:37:28 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> And now..a rant: >>>>>> >>>>>> This topic brings up a rather glaring fallacy with the "weight >>>>>> doesn't matter" ethos, you have to lift the darn thing sometimes. Every >>>>>> time I see someone toss a 17 lbs. road bike up on a roof rack like a >>>>>> feather I sigh a little. I love fully loaded steel bikes for the stuff >>>>>> they >>>>>> can do, but they can be a struggle to live with if you have to get them >>>>>> off >>>>>> the ground regularly. >>>>>> >>>>>> Joe "oh good..stairs" Bernard >>>>>> >>>>>> On Saturday, October 8, 2022 at 11:35:41 AM UTC-7 Robert Tilley wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I have that rack on my Hubbuhubbuh tandem. The rest of the bike is >>>>>>> heavy enough that I donāt even notice the rack weight. I like the >>>>>>> functionality of the rack so the weight doesnāt bother me much. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Robert Tilley >>>>>>> San Diego, CA >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Oct 7, 2022, at 2:00 PM, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! < >>>>>>> jonasa...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ļ»æHi friends, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Can we just talk about the Nitto Basket Rack for one sec? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I was so excited when this was made and I got one soon after. I have >>>>>>> it on my Overkill Shopping Platypus, and I like the way it looks and >>>>>>> its >>>>>>> utility but it is SO HEAVY. Noticeably heavy. Like, when I lift the >>>>>>> unloaded bike onto my van bike rack I struggle - and Iām no wimp. This >>>>>>> Platy outweighs my rear-racked and Backabikeād Clem, and I think the >>>>>>> Basket >>>>>>> Rack is mostly to blame. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Iām toying with the idea of removing it, but then Iād have to get a >>>>>>> new setup for my dyno headlight, so I hesitate. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I donāt think Iāve heard anyone else complain about the weight of >>>>>>> the Basket Rack; I feel like Iām the only one, which makes me suspect >>>>>>> Iām >>>>>>> wrong. Before I do anything drastic, I just wanted to see if this has >>>>>>> been >>>>>>> anyone elseās experience. Is the Basket Rack a beast? Has anyone else >>>>>>> tried >>>>>>> it and disliked it? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I know thereās a whole discussion out there about carrying weight on >>>>>>> the front. I guess Iāve never had a real issue with it, aside from not >>>>>>> liking that the bars swing around when parked. Iām not really talking >>>>>>> about >>>>>>> THAT; Iām wondering if anyone else finds this Nitto rack unnecessarily >>>>>>> heavy. Not that Iām going for lightweight, here. I mean, look at these >>>>>>> pics. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Leah >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/2c944f39-b5c8-4f9e-8ce7-1f4676c689f2n%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/2c944f39-b5c8-4f9e-8ce7-1f4676c689f2n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> [image: 34914B4C-02B7-4E75-953F-74A84DCB4B73.jpeg][image: >>>>>>> 14090565-7395-47C9-9C92-7DC230E4F4DE.jpeg] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/78mAv_Gw6a0/unsubscribe >>>>> . >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>>> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/14cfecd6-c8c8-41b6-b6c8-c4e0c4aab55en%40googlegroups.com >>>>> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/14cfecd6-c8c8-41b6-b6c8-c4e0c4aab55en%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> . >>>>> >>>>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/78mAv_Gw6a0/unsubscribe >> . >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >> >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/08a62d15-891f-464b-8ee2-d58f6c06f67an%40googlegroups.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/08a62d15-891f-464b-8ee2-d58f6c06f67an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. 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