It just occurred to me that I can use a good FD that still has the outer throw limit arm -- the extension of the parallelogram that contacts the bottom of the outer limit screw; I cut off that on my 7400 when using it with a Silver triple -- the throw was just right sans stop to get the chain onto the 46 t ring -- and ditto for the 7402, to get *that* one to work with a wide-Q (172 mm IIRC) Bontrager Race Lite pipe spindle external bearing triple. That too serendipitously worked perfectly without any except design limit to its outer throw. But I should replace the 7402 with the 7400 on the Matthews because with 158 mm Logic (triple converted to double) there is far more throw on the 7402 than needed -- whence a "manual" stop when I shift -- while the design limit on the 7400 ought to be just right for this Logic.
On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 3:15 PM Patrick Moore <bertin...@gmail.com> wrote: > I don't see the latter listing (auction had closed when I looked) but I'll > honor my commitment; the various other DA FDs that popped up were in tht > $40 to $60 range, which I don't mind paying. And I'm 9/10 convinced that > yours will work fine. > > On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 3:08 PM Robert Calton <ncal...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> That is extremely generous of you, Patrick, wow! I will then order this >> derailleur <https://www.ebay.com/itm/256209530268?var=556202231378> with >> delight (it's a little nicer condition than the other one). I plan to have >> my local, independent bike shop assemble the bike when all the parts arrive >> -- just waiting on this then and the wheels. They've got the right ethos >> for this community (they only sell steel, normal folk's bikes and mostly >> older "rescue" bikes they recondition), so I trust that they are experts on >> installation. I'll keep in touch after the build, hopefully with a >> successful report and some glamor shots :) >> >> On Saturday, May 11, 2024 at 4:54:47 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote: >> >>> Robert: If you will be using a 9 speed cassette, I'll go out on a limb >>> and predict that the first-gen DA will work fine. I'll go so far as to >>> offer: If after trying it and getting expert advice if it * does not* work, >>> and as long as the FD is in the same condition as when you bought it, I'll >>> buy the 1st gen DA from you for your full purchase price minus your >>> shipping expense from the seller. (I'll pay *your* shipping cost *to >>> me,* of course.) >>> >>> On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 2:45 PM Robert Calton <nca...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks for the wealth of information Patrick :) I am excited to learn >>>> more about bicycles in general and thrilled to build this Homer over the >>>> next month. I will be running a 9-speed cassette, so I don't think that >>>> I'll be trying to find a super narrow FD cage. I'll look into the DA 7402 >>>> and similar derailleurs. I like the all-silver look. >>>> >>>> On Saturday, May 11, 2024 at 4:40:32 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote: >>>> >>>>> Forgot to address one of your questions: * Does me running 11-36 >>>>> cassette have anything to do with the front derailleur choice?* >>>>> >>>>> It might, since with such a small outer cog the chain will be closer >>>>> to the chainstay and bottom of the FD cage than with a bigger outer like a >>>>> 13 or 14. Whether this makes a difference in your case, I cannot say for >>>>> sure, but again I'd *guess* that, since you will be using the 11 only >>>>> with the 38, this won't matter. >>>>> >>>>> There's also the matter of a wider cassette and chain rub on the >>>>> derailleur cage. Is your cassette 11 speed or more? If so, I can't speak >>>>> to >>>>> that, but the wider the change in chain angle and the narrower the FD cage >>>>> (as, for a 1st-gen DA road FD for 5 o 6 speed freewheels) the more chance >>>>> of chain rub on the extreme outside and inside cogs unless you trim the >>>>> FD. >>>>> For me, I use my DA 7402 (I am pretty sure) FD with a 10 sp cassette and >>>>> when I set the FD "in the middle" of its range there is no chain rub >>>>> either >>>>> in small or big cogs, and I think there's still futher leeway for chain >>>>> angle without rubbing. >>>>> >>>>> Also affecting chain angle is chainstay length, but as this the RBW >>>>> list and not rec.bicycles.tech or Cat.6.fredlist, I'd guess that will not >>>>> be a problem for you. >>>>> >>>>> On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 2:29 PM Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I've not used a first-gen DA FD, but I have used a 7400 and a 740n -- >>>>>> either 01 or 02; I think it's the latter. Again, it shifts very well >>>>>> over a >>>>>> 44/28 and also did so ove a 38/24. >>>>>> >>>>>> Now, I may simply be less demanding about FD performance; and I don't >>>>>> shift the front a great deal (my setups since the 2X9 on the Fargo are >>>>>> 1X + >>>>>> granny) but when I do shift the front, I don't have any more problems >>>>>> than >>>>>> I had with more typical road doubles or old-time mtb tripls. >>>>>> >>>>>> I do have a chain catcher mounted to the chainstay just aft of the bb >>>>>> to prevent chain suck, but I first installed that on the Fargo with the >>>>>> 46/36/24 triple when I was having chainsuck problems; I've not had that >>>>>> problem with the 2Xs. >>>>>> >>>>>> To sum up and answer your question directly re the 1st-gen DA FD: I >>>>>> guess it will work fine. But if you ask me in court, I'll deny >>>>>> everything. >>>>>> >>>>>> Good luck! And keep us informed. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 1:16 PM Robert Calton <nca...@gmail.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks Patrick! I saw a really nice bottom pull DA front mech used >>>>>>> on eBay, first gen >>>>>>> <https://www.ebay.com/itm/156203422002?itmmeta=01HXMGZA1GWNBSX67S31YDQ76P&hash=item245e731132:g:n34AAOSw~59licD5&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAABEF1YcKCwhxvKTsO9pDaGLqEXCL0Zi0kr4wWrhnmkXjTQ2DnCoH2NdAhg7jvIOaNU%2BDO%2B1iOqOy1Mo%2FY0SQofRIqFYHaL9YHrRUAiJDD1GC0OvjtIe0ZVNzEUywGtzFUS5AN19PPQQM0iCrSseVeaxlRJ%2BH1NkJkLh4eT6Pe858pxyG92ZQmkqvsPbPmunr9Erlc40hS3bat4nMl1FFYG5Su3gSBAbk5YwwJj3681dYYD%2FKfndZlcixKY7m6bPtuHcIS9s3dVFNUnFrFam0E%2FFKWNxIDN%2F8Z31DgEyMDXRPQjXvJijx5FBXP4EtaA2hMWmnfebdUiI3Wy6whpTfUGDpFDixjJxbrYTgDIxWgNs%2F8D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR-qg_ZDtYw>, >>>>>>> and it says it has a 16T capacity. Since I'm at 14T differential on my >>>>>>> front chainrings (38-24), would this work? Does me running 11-36 >>>>>>> cassette >>>>>>> have anything to do with the front derailleur choice? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Saturday, May 11, 2024 at 2:54:01 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Robert: About 10 years ago I swapped out a 3X7 drivetrain on my >>>>>>>> 2010 Fargo for a 2X9. The 3X7 consisted of 46/36/24 rings pulling >>>>>>>> (iirc) a >>>>>>>> 15-24 7sp cassette, and I swapped that out for a 38/24 X something-like >>>>>>>> 13-26 9 speed (29 1/2" Schwalbe Big Apples, then ditto Big Ones). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The derailleurs were both LX of the period. When I converted the >>>>>>>> chainrings I simply swapped the 46 outer for a (BBG) bashguard, >>>>>>>> swapped the >>>>>>>> 36 for a 38, and adjusted the FD throw limit screw. I did *not* change >>>>>>>> the position of the FD on the seat tube. After all, the FD shifted the >>>>>>>> 36/24 properly in that position, and it's not surprising that it >>>>>>>> shifted >>>>>>>> the 38/24 properly in the same position. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Later I swapped the LX FD for an ancient Dura Ace FD which I did >>>>>>>> mount a bit lower, but for the bottom of the cage to clear the >>>>>>>> chainstay as >>>>>>>> well as for the lower edge of the cage to clear the (IIRC, 48 t-size) >>>>>>>> bash >>>>>>>> guard, the FD had to be placed much where it would have been placed >>>>>>>> for a >>>>>>>> 46/36/24. The DA FD worked just as well as the LX. Again, 38/24 X >>>>>>>> 15-24 (or >>>>>>>> close) drivetrain. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Nowadays, I have a 44/28 wide-range "subcompact" setup and the same >>>>>>>> DA FD positioned high enough above the 44 to clear the 48-t-equivalent >>>>>>>> bashguard; here too front shifts are just fine. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> FWIW. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Matthews "road bike for dirt" with 42/28 (before I installed the >>>>>>>> 44) and Dura Ace 740-something FD. There must be close to an inch of >>>>>>>> gap >>>>>>>> between the bottom of the outer FD cage plate and the top of the teeth >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> the 42 t ring: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> [image: image.png] >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 12:35 PM Robert Calton <nca...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Good afternoon group! :) Hoping to tap into the collective wisdom >>>>>>>>> here to pick a front derailleur for my Homer build, it's the last >>>>>>>>> piece! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I'll be using the Silver 38/24 crankset, 11-36 cassette with >>>>>>>>> the Shimano Deore XT M761 rear derailleur. I saw that the matching XT >>>>>>>>> front >>>>>>>>> says it's for a triple chainring, so I need to find something that's >>>>>>>>> for a >>>>>>>>> double. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What would folks recommend? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c50dbf4b-e953-4239-bc7a-72d746aeebfcn%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c50dbf4b-e953-4239-bc7a-72d746aeebfcn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other >>>>>>>> writing services >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/92e2d715-bf04-4c19-bd8e-1702f335093fn%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/92e2d715-bf04-4c19-bd8e-1702f335093fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> >>>>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other >>>>>> writing services >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> >>>>>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>>>>> >>>>>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>>>>> >>>>>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other >>>>> writing services >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>>>> >>>>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>>>> >>>>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>> >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/6cab37ed-55cd-4dd4-a4d9-b71b4564689cn%40googlegroups.com >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/6cab37ed-55cd-4dd4-a4d9-b71b4564689cn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Patrick Moore >>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing >>> services >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>> >>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>> >>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/33eba3fc-6f22-4beb-bab0-707d274f829fn%40googlegroups.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/33eba3fc-6f22-4beb-bab0-707d274f829fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > > > -- > > Patrick Moore > Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing > services > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* > > *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* > > *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* > -- Patrick Moore Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgsYRpeag4QDJDxdbRGDAke5fQ_WwymE8-Z7znSnLK5NUw%40mail.gmail.com.
