Geoff, Years ago we tried maintenance agreements. We gave up on the idea. Some of our lessons to share here: First, we never worked out a fair approach. There's no fixed charge that was both fair to client and to us. We finally realized that the small percentage of customers who were interested in maintenance agreements really just wanted regular service and to minimize the likelihood of failure without doing their own maintenance. As these were all residential applications, each situation was unique. So our "agreement" is that on an agreed schedule, generally either once or twice/year, we contact the customer to set up an appointment. What we do depends on the client and system, but it's a standard T&M charge for time spent. In other words, our "agreement" is to contact the customer on a regular interval to do a service call. There's no charge to remember to call. Also, we learned that when work was slow, these service calls provided a modest amount of additional billable hours. However, when business is really hopping, these same obligations get in the way. Generally, one skilled technician is away from installations for several days, spread over a few weeks during spring and fall. These service calls are not particularly profitable, just part of our services offered. I think that what Joel describes below is a good application for a contract, as it spells out response time and covered activities. The customer is a commercial entity, and they are paying for access to prompt response. The system is much bigger. Allan at PosE -----Original Message----- From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Joel Davidson Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 12:45 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Maintenance agreements?
Hi Geoff, Hung over? Naay. I'm too excited about PV in the coming year. Washington has finally shifted away from Reagan's anti-solar. Here's hoping that the rest of the US out-shines California's booming solar industry. Model your battery maintenance agreements similar to UPS agreements. Some guidelines can be found on the internet. For example http://www.jantechups.com/Services/battery-maintenance-agreements/ PPAs depend on a reliable revenue stream which, in turn, depends on reliable equipment performance and careful monitoring. One PPA provider says: Maintenance falls into two primary categories; regularly scheduled and emergency. Emergency system maintenance is usually triggered by an alarm from the remote monitoring system. Regularly scheduled system maintenance takes place every few months with a more detailed annual inspection. Maintenance includes: - Washing the solar array - Inspection of electrical connections on the panels - Inspection of array tracking equipment to ensure mechanical operation - Testing inverter equipment to ensure optimal performance In 1996, Southern California Edison bought a 100 kW PV system for voltage support that they insisted have a 10-year service contract. I charged $2300/year based on what I thought would be make them happy: two 1-day site visits by an electrical engineer. The contract non-emergency response time for service calls was 3 business days. We had several non-emergency calls as the Omnion inverters aged and required manual resets. Emergency response time was within 4 hours after getting the phone call, but we never had an emergency call. Twice a year an engineer visited the system to inspect equipment. On the August inspection a few days before SCE's annual performance test, the engineer also hosed off the array. Total time for each service call including travel was less than 4 hours. A few years ago we did a PPA with several PV systems. Each system had a proprietary internet monitoring system that used an on-site weather station to model what the system should be producing and sent an email if actual production was off by a certain percentage. The maintenance supervisor would go on-line and test the system to determine if a technical team had to go to the site. Array washing was performed at least once a year or when production dropped to a certain point. Happy New Year! Joel Davidson _____ From: Geoff Greenfield <ge...@third-sun.com> To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> Cc: John Fanselow <j...@third-sun.com>; Kent Phillips <k...@third-sun.com> Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 8:28:36 AM Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Maintenance agreements? Thanks Joel - I left unsaid how this can all differ with different customer classes (large commerecial VS rural off-grid etc). The obvious maint of batteries... PPA agreements becoming a new type of entity... The benefits of remote diagnostics via fat spaniel, win-verter and others... More thoughts? You all can't still be hung over on holiday cheer???? For a brighter energy future, Geoff Greenfield Founder and CEO Third Sun Solar & Wind Power Ltd. 340 West State Street, Unit 25 Athens, OH 45701 740.597.3111 Fax 740.597.1548 www.Third-Sun.com <http://www.third-sun.com/> Clean Energy - Expertly Installed ----- "Joel Davidson" <joel.david...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > Hell Geoff, Maintenance agreements are no more "easy money" than any of your other labor earnings. Price maintenance work the same as other specialized labor and factor in travel time and costs and perhaps a little something extra for your client (who has become more than just a customer). The reason some people say maintenance agreements are easy money is because they don't actually do anything. I know a roofing company that charge annual maintenance fees and never visits the site unless they get a leak call. I stopped doing business with that roofer. I know other companies that use their maintenance service trips to stay in touch with their clients. They ask their clients if there is anything else they may want or need and ask if their neighbors or friends are interested in PV, wind, etc. Do this for several years and you build a powerful local referral network. Best wishes for a wonderful new year! Joel Davidson > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Geoff Greenfield <mailto:ge...@third-sun.com> > To: re-mark...@lists.re-wrenches.org ; re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > Cc: John Fanselow <mailto:j...@third-sun.com> > Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 6:43 AM > Subject: [RE-wrenches] Maintenance agreements? > > Hello and happy new year fellow listers... I am happy (as are my batteries) for longer solar days as we move forward around the sun... I am faced with yet another client who is surprised that I don't have a "maintenance agreement" or "plan" to offer them (similar I guess to such plans offered by HVAC contractors?). We have developed a simple one page explanation that basically says we will work at our hourly rate for non-warranty items, for labor not covered on warranted equipment, and for scheduled preventative maintenance (or unscheduled emergency maintenance) I keep hearing that maintenance agreements are "easy money" - (?). One of my HVAC contacts shared that they give a "preferred rate" as well as a "hotline 24 hr #" and priority service to those on a plan, as well as annual "start of season" tune up. I am considering something similar... > I am curious about the pros and cons of these agreements, as well as any other words of wisdom... links to reference materials would also yield kilowatts worth of appreciation. > For a brighter energy future, > Geoff Greenfield > Founder and CEO > Third Sun Solar & Wind Power Ltd. > 340 West State Street, Unit 25 > Athens, OH 45701 > 740.597.3111 Fax 740.597.1548 > www.Third-Sun.com > Clean Energy - Expertly Installed > > _____ _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Home Power magazine > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > Options & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > List-Archive: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > Check out participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> > > _______________________________________________ List sponsored by Home Power > magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > List-Archive: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules > & etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org
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