This is exactly the situation that the midnite AIO is addressing or similar.
Lets say that you go with 11 panels ( and that works keeping it under 600voc). If you go with enphase, thats about $3000 with cable. Plus you’ll need larger wire due to it only being 240vac vs closer to 380vdc for a DC series. That 600v controller will set you back between $1200-2000 with BOS and smaller wire. Using the $2000, and $3000. If the AIO is say $4500. Then for $2500 your getting 3 inputs, 600vdc, AFCI, and all the other bells and whistles. Much higher efficiency than AC coupling. And a 12 kw vs 8kw inverter. And if customer decides to go more solar, then the AIO is already set up to add more with $0 expense on the CC side. A whole new world Jay > On Apr 10, 2024, at 11:06 AM, Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches > <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote: > > Logan > > Is MidNite making the AIO or is it rebrand like the other guys? > > If MidNite is actually making it, that adds a whole new level of interest. > MidNite makes great products already. This would be a game changer. > > > Thank you, > > Maverick > > Maverick Brown > Off-Grid Solar Commander since 2006 > Maverick Solar Enterprises, Inc. > • Solar Commander Remote Power > • SunFlow Systems Cathodic Protection > maver...@mavericksolar.com > 512-460-9825 > > > >> On Apr 10, 2024, at 10:54 AM, William Bryce via RE-wrenches >> <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote: >> >> >> All >> >> As a Beta tester and being a part of the development of the MNS All in One, >> MNS is working to ensure that the current limitations from the use of LA >> batteries will be addressed and supported. >> >> MNS is addressing the concerns of using an AOI inverter because failure will >> require the R&R of the unit. This AIO is designed to be completely field >> serviceable and MNS will stock the boards and will provide the technical >> help to get the system back up and running in the field. >> >> Thanks >> >> Logan >> >> On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 11:01 AM Steve Higgins via RE-wrenches >> <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote: >> Good Morning Wrenches... >> >> When it comes to lead batteries, just be cautious of the all-in-ones and >> some of the hybrid inverters. >> >> Most of these inverters were not designed for Lead batteries and will >> struggle to charge them, resulting in sulfation (undercharging) issues. >> Eventually, this will lead to swelling of VRLA or excessive gassing on >> Flooded Batteries. Unfortunately, many of the "Hybrid" or "All-in-One" >> inverters released in the past 5-8 years are tailored more to >> lithium-chemistry batteries. I can't tell you how many battery banks have >> been cooked over the past couple of years due to the inability to control >> charging settings. >> >> If you can't control the Bulk/Absorb Voltage and Time, as well as the end >> amps termination setpoints, you will generally struggle to get and keep a >> Lead-Acid battery charged regardless of the battery you are using. >> >> I looked at the Midnite site and I don't see a user manual yet, once it's >> posted I'll take a look and see if it's compatible for Rolls Batteries, I'm >> pretty sure it will as Midnight has been asking battery charging questions >> the last couple of years. >> >> >> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> >> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/> <http://www.rollsbattery.com/>Steve Higgins ⋅ >> Technical Services Manager >> t +1.902.597.4020 m +1.206.790.5840 >> f +1.902.597.8447 e st...@surrette.com <mailto:st...@surrette.com> >> <http://www.facebook.com/RollsBattery> >> <https://www.youtube.com/user/RollsBattery> >> <https://www.youtube.com/RollsBatteryEngineering> >> <https://www.youtube.com/RollsBatteryEngineering> >> <https://www.youtube.com/RollsBatteryEngineering> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/rolls-battery-engineering> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/rolls-battery-engineering> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/rolls-battery-engineering> >> <http://www.instagram.com/RollsBattery> >> <http://www.instagram.com/RollsBattery> >> CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted herein is intended only for the >> addressee and may contain confidential, proprietary and/or privileged >> material. Any unauthorized review, distribution or other use of or the >> taking of any action in reliance upon this information is prohibited. If you >> receive this email in error, please contact the sender and delete or destroy >> this message and all copies. >> >> >> On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 7:29 AM jay via RE-wrenches >> <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote: >> Can you explain what changes the eg4 18 inverter has vs the Envy as to LA >> programming? >> >> To me the Envy has a big advantage due to it having AGS warm up/cool down >> that the EG4 does not. >> >> Jay >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Apr 10, 2024, at 7:49 AM, Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches >>> <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote: >>> >>> John, >>> If you are thinking of pairing the Envy with lead-acid batteries, I would >>> strongly suggest not doing it. Even though Fortress sales advertises the >>> Envy to be compatible with lead-acid, after trying it in my off-grid home, >>> I would emphatically say that it is not. The programming is inadequate, to >>> put it kindly. And their support really doesn't have a clue about lead-acid >>> - Fortress support literally said that they don't recommend pairing the >>> Envy with l-a. However, I don't have an opinion about how it does with >>> closed loop Li batteries. >>> I did recently install an EG4 18k system, off-grid, with the client's >>> knowledge that this was a bit of an experiment for me. Both the Envy and >>> the EG4 are made by LuxPower and have been, to date, physically and >>> programmatically almost identical. I had stayed away from EG4 since it >>> seemed to be primarily aimed at the DIY market. However, the 18k appears to >>> be a serious contender so far, although this installation is a fairly low >>> stress situation. I've been fairly impressed with the system. While this >>> 18k is paired with EG4 Lithium batteries, EG4 has been making adjustments >>> to the firmware to make it much more friendly to lead-acid. If you decide >>> to go this route, check with EG4 (installer support - ask for Jarrett or >>> Colt) to see where they are at with upgrading the firmware. >>> I am also eagerly awaiting Midnite's AIO entry... >>> >>> Howie >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 9:02 AM John Blittersdorf via RE-wrenches >>> <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote: >>> Time will tell where the failure modes are. I still don't like all the >>> eggs in one basket. Do you have to send the units back for repair? Had >>> enough of that with Trace SW series inverters.. >>> For off grid, I'll stick to the tried and true for now. For Grid tie it is >>> just a financial hit. For off-grid power loss it is more important to deal >>> with right away.. >>> >>> I am going to try a Fortress Envy at my off grid home but will keep my >>> Outback field repairable VFXR wired in just in case. I had a massive >>> lightning strike between my house and a guest cabin 1/4 mile away and I >>> lost power from my Fortress Eflex battery at the cabin and my Outback >>> inverter at my house. I replaced the control board on my inverter ( I >>> always keep one in reserve as it is usually the only board failure due to >>> lightning) and was back on line in 1/2 hour and Fortress rushed me a new >>> BMS board for the E-flex and a day later and a half hour swap had it back >>> in service, Now it is a different story with 2 Simpliphi batteries I have >>> from a customer that failed. I have to ship them to California to have >>> them evaluated to see if we had damaged them by misuse. Lots of expense >>> and time lost. >>> >>> >>> >>> John Blittersdorf >>> CV Wind Service / Off Grid Vermont >>> 802-770-8625 >>> >>> On Tue, Apr 9, 2024 at 11:43 PM Scot Arey via RE-wrenches >>> <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote: >>> Wow, are we in the golden age of inverter/chargers? If it had 200-a.p pass >>> thru it would be near perfect. >>> >>> Begs the question: are stand alone charge controllers becoming a historical >>> artifact? >>> >>> Howard "Scot" Arey >>> Owner, Solar CenTex >>> 254-300-1228 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>> >>> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >>> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >>> >>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> <mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the >>> other: >>> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ >>> <https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/> >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> List rules & etiquette: >>> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>> <http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm> >>> >>> Check out or update participant bios: >>> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>> >>> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >>> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >>> >>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> <mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the >>> other: >>> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ >>> <https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/> >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> List rules & etiquette: >>> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>> <http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm> >>> >>> Check out or update participant bios: >>> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>> >>> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >>> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >>> >>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> <mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the >>> other: >>> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ >>> <https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/> >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >>> >>> List rules & etiquette: >>> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>> <http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm> >>> >>> Check out or update participant bios: >>> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >> >> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >> >> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >> <mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> >> >> Change listserver email address & settings: >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >> >> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the >> other: >> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ >> <https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/> >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >> >> List rules & etiquette: >> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >> <http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm> >> >> Check out or update participant bios: >> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >> >> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >> >> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >> <mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> >> >> Change listserver email address & settings: >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >> >> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the >> other: >> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ >> <https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/> >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org> >> >> List rules & etiquette: >> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >> <http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm> >> >> Check out or update participant bios: >> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >> >> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >> >> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >> >> Change listserver email address & settings: >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> >> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the >> other: >> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> >> List rules & etiquette: >> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >> >> Check out or update participant bios: >> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org >> > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the > other: > https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List rules & etiquette: > http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > http://www.members.re-wrenches.org >
_______________________________________________ List sponsored by Redwood Alliance Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change listserver email address & settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the other: https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules & etiquette: http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out or update participant bios: http://www.members.re-wrenches.org
