Hi Cybarite ( Sorry I don't really know your first name) and everybody,
I also found a moment to look back at the %easy-vid.r content.
Definitely needs a content update for what was then promised
as the last missing part when Carl did the job.
I am glad that you kindly offered to the community your help
to advance this part of the documentation - if I well understood
your intent. I'd be happy too if you wanted to contact me
personally so we could exchange about what content you exactly
planned to put in there. May be I can help in some way. Don't
hesitate to send me an email since I will later add myself some
parts to it when I will know more about the way VID internals
do their work. But I have so much to learn about REBOL itself
before.
And while I looked around for what Carl and collaborators had
done with the cookbook and the library I found precisely what
I was looking for as a newcomer. This can be expressed as follows
and I will follow my intuition to try to let the community implement
it this way if possible.
In fact it should not be too difficult as many of the pieces are already
in place. Just some optimization and this will be OK. I'll address
separately the FORUM that was pointed here recently in another thread.
As Sunanda also pointed before I propose my name to help advance
this file as I view it as a requirement to help any new beginner navigate
and learn more and easily.
During this time period I will also tryi to react positively to all the
suggestions that have been done and I hope will continue to flow
until some useful and durable difference appears to all the material that
already exists so that it become even more useful than now.
Don't forget that there is an enormous amount of material already
accessible - I simply suggest to fill some holes : some occur in the
presentation, some in the indexing and some in the examples offered
(or not offered yet) as support for beginners. That's all.
In my head and everybody is welcome to react to my teacher's view,
the things actually present themselves as I remember from my previous
first reading (already a couple of years ago) :
Remember that here I will not take into account all the parts related to the
professional use (as done by programmers) of all the products developed
and distributed by RT but I will concentrate only on the learning part of the
REBOL Core language and its View counterpart - which I have to learn
completely from start so I will surely need help...
A- A main web site (REBOL.COM) with :
1. The official DOCs for Core, View and other products
2. Many other DOCs to help learn and use "some part of" the
fundamentals. (those were appropriately named tutorials but
could have also been named as "Quick start" since they fall short
to further illustrate other more real small tasks as those found
in programmer's diary.
I would say of them that these DOCs do a real job to present
the reader at a glance the spirit in which REBOL and its other
constituents (View) can be used for many "simple" tasks" -
some are simple because of the power of REBOL but
nevertheless they are simple even for a newbie to grasp.
3. The official library - Remember that its actual main function is not
specifically related at all with newbies looking for learning material
not per se but more due to the fact that most of the material sitting
in the repository has not been designed - except for some exception -
to be used as real teaching material. They look more as concrete
projects that were learned by programmers - some being themselves
new to REBOL but others being gurus and the rest standing in the
between. So the library cannot be BLAMED and even less flamed
for anything in this sense and netheir their authors. But I personally
know the time and effort required to produce some useful teaching
material and I must say that the most requiring is the one produced
for the self-educated person. In this regards it is similar in some extent
to the way a computer program must be prepared and tested before
final production launching. If not completely tested for fault tolerance
there is no warranty that it will become a success story.
Remember when tried some program coded by another ppl.
The chances are great it did not function in all cases. When it arrived
how did you react ? Think that a newcomer will do the same.
So we must be better prepared to deliver some material as good as
can be done with our resources. In fact nothing forces us to do anything
all if we don't want but having been frustrated myself in the beginning,
I hope to fill the gaps I have met on my road. Many of what blocked me
before is already present but if I want to present ( or review) some new
material I will have to rely on a new knoledge I will acquire or share
this responsibility with some of the ML. And I am sure that it will be
done because we all have this feeling of something that can be done
better and we are the ones that are better placed to help others in
this regards.
I will leave out other parts that I'm not considering useful in the
learning arena for the moment.
B - A secondary web site (REBOL.NET) with :
4- The cookbook that is actually beginning to fill the gap described
above.So we must all contribute keep up the good job already
done there. There will be some need to classify what has already
been done and even as suggested Sunanda to include some
category in the Library that refers to the cookbook - and to some
extent the actual work done should be in a near converted and included
(say the two sites should better be intergated together instead of doing
overlapping work)
C - Many other web sites (not officially RT supported ) with :
5 - Many useful but sparse information pieces (tutorials, tips, tricks,
codes, examples)
for example: Compkarori, Vanilla, REBOLFrance, Forums,
Wikis, Chats, AltMe, ... even IOS and View Rebs
network
are in the band but they are officially part of REBOL.
We can't act upon them but their content can be referred and their
owner can contribute to our web site for some small specific part if we ask
them to look at what they can offer.
D- A lot of distribution tools and exchange of information
Should be minimized. Web presentation (XML + HTML + DB)
should be used preferably to other medium (see below) but REBOL
is welcome to help automate the tasks and help the generation and other tasks
like is done with the library. I will probably try Vanilla (with recent
Jason's invitation to support me) as my personal work tool.
E- Not much of outside visibility - better than a couple of years however
since Google reveals about 75000 pages when searching the REBOL word.
We'll have to plan and generate some real META Keyword tags to help
Google find our work This should be added automatically to any
HTML HEADER page by any HTML REBOL generator.
What I want to add to the library is some as clear as possible examples
with related explanations in the following categories :
1. Coding examples for every Word appearing in the official dictionary.
a- on a word by word basis with trivial but useful examples
b- can and will be teached in standalone mode
c- I would also like them to be put in perspective when compared
to something like, say VB.
This choice is very personal - and not negociable for me - since
this is the best I can do. If others want to contribute with their own,
they are welcome to do so.
d- every example will be offered according the following ways until something
is done to fusion them in a new format if necessary :
a- easy-vid as executable with explanations included -
The ultimate DEMO (try ans test) environment I dreamed of all my life
as a teacher (for VB) but it could be enhanced further by
incorporating
the EDITOR with save with versioning allowed on the original file
in use
or a copy. Later the inclusion of some way to view, select and mix
parts
of code coming from external sources should be added too.
(Looks like some kind of app for you Max with your Slim ;-)
b- Web - HTML (until I learn to work with XML)
c- Library (REBOL.ORG) for view and download from the Web.
d- Vanilla (during experimentation, exchange with others and cataloging)
Discussion open until tomorrow. I must go to bed.
Bye everybody,
Gerard
P.S. Sorry for the lenghty mail.
If you already some part of code related to any word send them to me. I'll classify
them
as soon as received and begin the work.
Others that have questions or suggestions can send me emails too - directly if not of
general concern.
I'll try to use as much transparency as possible.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cybarite" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 6:13 AM
Subject: [REBOL] Re: understanding rebol
> I have started to revive my 2001 version of easy-vid.r.
>
> ---Script and Outline
>
> I will have a version by Friday in two formats:
>
> a. vid-usage.r that can be posted to the script library
>
> b. the vid-usage.leo which is the LEO outline for the same
>
>
> ---Why Leo
>
> I like LEO for organizing scripts (although I have not heard of many people using it
> for REBOL). You need to install Python to
run it but this is fairly painless.
>
> refer: http://leo.sourceforge.net/
>
> You can use the version that you like. I'll have to investigate where I can promote
> the .leo file.
>
> ---Updates
>
> I would like to see update requests on AltME only. There is now an EasyVid Group
> on the REBOL world for this purpose.
>
> ---Exclusion
>
> If you do not want to see the EasyVid group updates, send me (cybarite) a message on
> AltME privately and I will exclude you from
that group.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
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>
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