I agree. I Loooove Stanwyck Crawford, Davis and add Ida Lupino to the list. (although I mostly like her because of her being the first female director in Hollywood with muscle. ) Those women are not raving beauties, but growing up I thought they were toooo cool! They were the original kick-ass broads.
I do not get what has happened to Stone and Turner. I think it is obsession with targeting youth. During the Golden Age films targeted adults and kids went along for the ride. Now they target youth and adults either must go along for the ride or seek out independent films -----Original Message----- From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kelwyn Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 7:42 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem I am going to say something paradoxical here (I've been thinking about this all night), stars like Rita Hayward, Bette Davis and Joan Crawford have to be taken off the board. (Yes, I know Rita Hayward was hot and Bette Davis and Joan Crawford were not. But Ms. Davis and Ms. Crawford were sick with sexual power). I say this because during Hollywood's Golden Age there were many strong women represented on the big screen (Miss Barbara Stanwyck, anyone?), which was in direct opposition to the strength of women in society at large. I suggest male dominated box office (beginning with Clint Eastwood and Burt Reynolds in the late seventies) is in direct opposition to women's lib and the advancement of women in the workplace. To address Rita Hayward specifically, her most famous role was "Gilda," where she flaunted her sexual power like nobody's business. "Gilda" is a terrific fusion of "sexual heat, jealosy, fear and hatred," of the kind we haven't seen since "Basic Instinct" (1992). Which reminds of great strong, sexual screen presences like Kathleen Turner and Sharon Stone and how they are largely considered menopausal jokes now. ~(no)rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Martin Baxter <truthseeker...@...> wrote: > > > rave, what about Rita Hayworth? > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > From: ravena...@... > Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2009 14:18:57 +0000 > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ann Margaret was eye and arm candy. Her most iconic role was as a sexy, beautiful woman who is shamelessly punked by Jack Nicholson in Mike Nichol's "Carnal Knowledge." To my point, in one of the few movies she headlined,"Kitten with a Whip," in which she played a juvenile delinquent who escapes from reform school by stabbing a matron and attempting to burn down the building, proved to be her personal "Catwoman." > > > > Ditto for Marilyn Monroe (victim, eye and arm candy). > > > > Angelina Jolie fits the bill but she did not become a box office star until her rogue sexuality was softened by adoption and motherhood. > > > > Ava Gardner is an excellent example but her overt sexuality was acceptable because she was always coupled with strong iconic men like big, robust Howard Keel in "Showboat" and Clark Gable in "Magambo" - men who could literally put her in her "place." > > > > But you make my point best in your last paragraph: none of the previews showed her looking appealing, but instead as an exaggerated terrifying her that looked like she might bite off a guys important part. I knew someone who edited a forum/penthouse letters publication once, and stuff like was considered a no-no when it came to targeting mainstream males. > > > > Hall and Oates wrote a song about it. Wanna hear it? Here it go: > > > > She's deadly man, she could really rip your world apart > > Mind over matter > > Ooh, the beauty is there but a beast is in the heart > > (Oh-oh, here she comes) Watch out boy she'll chew you up > > (Oh-oh, here she comes) She's a maneater > > (Oh-oh, here she comes) Watch out boy she'll chew you up > > (Oh-oh, here she comes) She's a maneater > > > > ~rave! > > > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, "Tracey de Morsella" <tdlists@> wrote: > > > > > > What about Ann Margaret, Ava Gardner, Marilyn Monroe, Angelina Jolie ( > > > before the Anorexia), J-Lo, the blond from Grey's Anatomy, Katherine Heigl, > > > Sophia Loren, Scarlett Johansson, Natalie Portman, Jessica Biel > > > > > > All of them have been in hits I believe and are considered sexy > > > > > > Are you saying women reject sexy women. I think we seek to be them. I do > > > not think the jealousy factor is at work here. I used to love movies with > > > Hot Kick Ass Broads because I wanted to be one. I was taking notes, I was > > > buying bustiers, leathers skirts and thigh high boots. (back in the day, > > > those things were in okay, so stop laughing. > > > > > > I will probably check out Jennifer's Body on DVD, but my sense is it was > > > poorly marketed. Fox has some image problems than include she is nothing > > > but a body and then she star's in a movie called Jennifer's body in which > > > the previews do not reveal that it is a comedy. Some decided to sell in the > > > previews a pure slasher horror. If I had not read the reviews, I would have > > > thought that she decided to play up that she is nothing but a body. > > > Regarding young guys.. none of the previews showed her looking appealing, > > > but instead as an exaggerated terrifying her that looked like she might > > > bite off a guys important part. I knew someone who edited a forum/penthouse > > > letters publication once, and stuff like was considered a no-no when it came > > > to targeting mainstream males. She did not look sexy in the previews, and > > > the previews is what people use to determine whether to go see it. If I > > > were a young guy who thought she was hot, I would have popped in a > > > transformers DVD instead, based on those previews > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Kelwyn > > > Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 9:32 PM > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > I defy you to name a Racquel Welch helmed hit (excluding her first, "One > > > Million Years B.C."). Pam Grier was used and abused (raped and beaten up)in > > > all her movies before she was allowed to kick triumphant butt. Liz Taylor > > > is perhaps the exception that proves the rule but she, too, was slapped > > > around in a number of her iconic roles and the films where she exuded pure > > > female sexual power ("Cleopatra") were not box office hits. > > > > > > And, to be clear about this, the article stated females rejected Fox not for > > > being "too sexy and beautiful" but because of her "pure, raw sexuality," > > > which is something else altogether. Barbie is "too sexy and beautiful." > > > Fox is no Barbie doll. > > > > > > There is an ongoing dynamic going on but you may ignore it if it suits you. > > > > > > ~rave! > > > > > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson <KeithBJohnson@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Did I fall asleep? Since when is the pure horror genre driven by female > > > audiences? > > > > And as for women not responding to Fox, is it that she's too sexy and > > > beautiful for them, or (more likely) that she hasn't displayed a range and > > > depth that makes them interested in anything she has to say on screen? I > > > mean, there have been untold numbers of actresses over the years who've been > > > classified as beautiful and sexy in the extreme, from Liz Taylor to Racquel > > > Welch, from Pam Grier to Halle Berry. Such women have always found a female > > > audience, depending on the roles they play. > > > > I think this is more the script and Fox's one-note facial expressions. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Kelwyn" <ravenadal@> > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > > Sent: Monday, October 5, 2009 1:39:45 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > > > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From Entertainment Weekly, October 9, 2009: > > > > > > > > "Jennifer's Body" deadly $6.8 million debut is attributed to Megan Fox's > > > "sexy-beast" persona proving off-putting to women, without whom a horror > > > movie don't stand a chance. "The genre is driven by the female audience, and > > > I don't know that girls relate to her," says the executive. "Megan leads > > > with pure, raw sexuality, and for girls it's a turnoff." > > > > > > > > Fox's drawing power will be tested again with next summer's western "Jonah > > > Hex," aimed at her core: young guys. > > > > > > > > "If I were cutting the "Hex" trailer," says a studio strategist, "I'd make > > > sure she was in as much of it as possible - in compromising positions." > > > > > > > > I imagine it would do even better if she could be raped during the movie. > > > > > > > > ~(no)rave! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Post your SciFiNoir Profile at > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYa > > > hoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222984/direct/01/ > ------------------------------------ Post your SciFiNoir Profile at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYa hoo! Groups Links
