Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
Two games I have played which are accessible are Wii Sports and Punchout. Wii Sports: The Baseball, Boxing, and Tennis can be completely accessible, and bowling and Golf can be done with some sighted assistance. Punchout: The game play in this is almost completely accessible. Every character makes some sort of either taunt or sound effect for almost every attack. From an accessibility standpoint, there are only two characters who have some challenges. I can outline them in more detail if you want. Navigating the menus in any WII game can be somewhat challenging, because if it does not let you use the arrows, you must point at the item you want. However, there is usually a sound effect and a slight vibration when you are selecting something. Also, the menus are static so you can memorize their locations. HTH, Karl From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of lelia [struv...@yahoo.com] Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 6:14 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering what if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? thanks lelia --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
I've heard some game reviews about this game console that said that the games are accessible, only to find out that the games cannot be accurately played. For example, how can you tell what pins remain standing after you roll your first ball in bowling? How do you know where to aim on any shot? I don't want to guess or to have a pretty good idea. I want to actually know, before I bowl, what I am aiming at, and where it is. The same goes for tennis or any of the other games. I want skill, not luck, to be the determining factor in how well I play. As far as that goes, I want this in any game I play. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "lelia" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 1:14 PM Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering what if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? thanks lelia --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
The other problem with blind people playing the WII games is that one main idea of the WII is logging your stats, so as you get better your WII opponents get better. There is no way I have found to independently log my stats, so to the WII's"thinking" I never get better so it doesn't throw better and better adversaries. I'm afraid that sooner or later my opponents would get too easy and less fun. - Original Message - From: "Karl Belanger" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Two games I have played which are accessible are Wii Sports and Punchout. Wii Sports: The Baseball, Boxing, and Tennis can be completely accessible, and bowling and Golf can be done with some sighted assistance. Punchout: The game play in this is almost completely accessible. Every character makes some sort of either taunt or sound effect for almost every attack. From an accessibility standpoint, there are only two characters who have some challenges. I can outline them in more detail if you want. Navigating the menus in any WII game can be somewhat challenging, because if it does not let you use the arrows, you must point at the item you want. However, there is usually a sound effect and a slight vibration when you are selecting something. Also, the menus are static so you can memorize their locations. HTH, Karl From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of lelia [struv...@yahoo.com] Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 6:14 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering what if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? thanks lelia --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
Our sighted 10 year old son enjoys having us play games on the Wii with him, but I get frustrated because with bowling, for instance, as you mentioned, I don't know which pins are still standing, and Deven has to aim for me so I can have a shot at knocking down the rest. We play Wii sports with him sometimes because it makes him happy, but I get easily frustrated playing games where someone has to do practically everything for me except the movements. So perhaps there are other Wii games more accessible for completely blind players. The boxing one is kind of fun because some of the sounds alert you to which player is getting their butt kicked, and once the round begins you just do your best to box all areas of your opponent's body. Rhonda - Original Message - From: "Charles Rivard" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 10:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? I've heard some game reviews about this game console that said that the games are accessible, only to find out that the games cannot be accurately played. For example, how can you tell what pins remain standing after you roll your first ball in bowling? How do you know where to aim on any shot? I don't want to guess or to have a pretty good idea. I want to actually know, before I bowl, what I am aiming at, and where it is. The same goes for tennis or any of the other games. I want skill, not luck, to be the determining factor in how well I play. As far as that goes, I want this in any game I play. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "lelia" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 1:14 PM Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering what if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? thanks lelia --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
I often play Wii Sports Bowling with my sighted folks. The only thing they have to do is tell me where to aim by telling me how many clicks to move the D-pad in a given direction to aim. I do everything myself and my folks just direct me. Then I play Wii Fit. My mom or dad makes the menu selectsions of course but I do everything else. Homer: Hey, uh, could you go across the street and get me a slice of pizza? Vender: No pizza. Only Khlav Kalash. - Original Message - From: "Rhonda Scott" To: "Charles Rivard" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Our sighted 10 year old son enjoys having us play games on the Wii with him, but I get frustrated because with bowling, for instance, as you mentioned, I don't know which pins are still standing, and Deven has to aim for me so I can have a shot at knocking down the rest. We play Wii sports with him sometimes because it makes him happy, but I get easily frustrated playing games where someone has to do practically everything for me except the movements. So perhaps there are other Wii games more accessible for completely blind players. The boxing one is kind of fun because some of the sounds alert you to which player is getting their butt kicked, and once the round begins you just do your best to box all areas of your opponent's body. Rhonda - Original Message - From: "Charles Rivard" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 10:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? I've heard some game reviews about this game console that said that the games are accessible, only to find out that the games cannot be accurately played. For example, how can you tell what pins remain standing after you roll your first ball in bowling? How do you know where to aim on any shot? I don't want to guess or to have a pretty good idea. I want to actually know, before I bowl, what I am aiming at, and where it is. The same goes for tennis or any of the other games. I want skill, not luck, to be the determining factor in how well I play. As far as that goes, I want this in any game I play. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "lelia" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 1:14 PM Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering what if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? thanks lelia --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
If you are the only person in the room, can you play the games with accuracy? If not, then it is not accessible in my opinion. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "Bryan Peterson" To: "Rhonda Scott" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 7:28 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? I often play Wii Sports Bowling with my sighted folks. The only thing they have to do is tell me where to aim by telling me how many clicks to move the D-pad in a given direction to aim. I do everything myself and my folks just direct me. Then I play Wii Fit. My mom or dad makes the menu selectsions of course but I do everything else. Homer: Hey, uh, could you go across the street and get me a slice of pizza? Vender: No pizza. Only Khlav Kalash. - Original Message - From: "Rhonda Scott" To: "Charles Rivard" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? > Our sighted 10 year old son enjoys having us play games on the Wii with > him, > but I get frustrated because with bowling, for instance, as you mentioned, > I > don't know which pins are still standing, and Deven has to aim for me so I > can have a shot at knocking down the rest. We play Wii sports with him > sometimes because it makes him happy, but I get easily frustrated playing > games where someone has to do practically everything for me except the > movements. So perhaps there are other Wii games more accessible for > completely blind players. The boxing one is kind of fun because some of > the > sounds alert you to which player is getting their butt kicked, and once > the > round begins you just do your best to box all areas of your opponent's > body. > > Rhonda > > - Original Message - > From: "Charles Rivard" > To: "Gamers Discussion list" > Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 10:49 PM > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? > > > I've heard some game reviews about this game console that said that the > games are accessible, only to find out that the games cannot be accurately > played. For example, how can you tell what pins remain standing after you > roll your first ball in bowling? How do you know where to aim on any > shot? > I don't want to guess or to have a pretty good idea. I want to actually > know, before I bowl, what I am aiming at, and where it is. The same goes > for tennis or any of the other games. I want skill, not luck, to be the > determining factor in how well I play. As far as that goes, I want this > in > any game I play. > --- > In God we trust! > - Original Message - > From: "lelia" > To: "Gamers Discussion list" > Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 1:14 PM > Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? > > > Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering > what > if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? > > thanks > > lelia > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the > list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the > list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the > list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Ga
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
Unless you're a pro at keeping your hand steady and in the same place everytime memorizing the placement of the menus won't help because you might hold the controller in a different spot the next time and that thing is delicate like I said in another post I spent 2 hours trying to find the menu option on the screen so I could start playing my game. Wii Sports resort is pretty much accessible once you get in to it, cause you can arrow around the options, just memorize where they are, you don't need any help with the bowling really except for on the second frame of each game so some can tell you where to move to hit your pins. Basketball on the wii resort game is all accessible as is the frisby and sword fighting, also canoeing is fun too. Another game you might check out, again already seaid this once, is dragonball Z Budokai Tenkaichi 3, the menus talk and it's a 3d fighting game, so it's fun plus you have to use the motion sensor to do their special moves and such, all that takes is someone reading it to you a couple of times, eventually you can play that game pretty independently with no help whatsoever including the online play. But if you are going for completely accessible for the most part then don't get a wii, get a ps3 or a 360 ast your preference, personally, I prefer ps3 because in the end it has the better processor, better graphic, better gameplay, and most importantly, better sound. Plus the online play on ps3 is free and you have to pay for xbox live. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 3:51 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? If you are the only person in the room, can you play the games with accuracy? If not, then it is not accessible in my opinion. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "Bryan Peterson" To: "Rhonda Scott" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 7:28 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? I often play Wii Sports Bowling with my sighted folks. The only thing they have to do is tell me where to aim by telling me how many clicks to move the D-pad in a given direction to aim. I do everything myself and my folks just direct me. Then I play Wii Fit. My mom or dad makes the menu selectsions of course but I do everything else. Homer: Hey, uh, could you go across the street and get me a slice of pizza? Vender: No pizza. Only Khlav Kalash. - Original Message - From: "Rhonda Scott" To: "Charles Rivard" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? > Our sighted 10 year old son enjoys having us play games on the Wii with > him, > but I get frustrated because with bowling, for instance, as you mentioned, > I > don't know which pins are still standing, and Deven has to aim for me so I > can have a shot at knocking down the rest. We play Wii sports with him > sometimes because it makes him happy, but I get easily frustrated playing > games where someone has to do practically everything for me except the > movements. So perhaps there are other Wii games more accessible for > completely blind players. The boxing one is kind of fun because some of > the > sounds alert you to which player is getting their butt kicked, and once > the > round begins you just do your best to box all areas of your opponent's > body. > > Rhonda > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Charles Rivard" > To: "Gamers Discussion list" > Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 10:49 PM > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? > > > I've heard some game reviews about this game console that said that the > games are accessible, only to find out that the games cannot be accurately > played. For example, how can you tell what pins remain standing after you > roll your first ball in bowling? How do you know where to aim on any > shot? > I don't want to guess or to have a pretty good idea. I want to actually > know, before I bowl, what I am aiming at, and where it is. The same goes > for tennis or any of the other games. I want skill, not luck, to be the > determining factor in how well I play. As far as that goes, I want this > in > any game I play. > --- > In God we trust! > - Original Message - > From: "lelia" > To: "Gamers Discussion list" > Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 1:14 PM > Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? > > > Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have
Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we?
I've never tried it but I've heard of people being able to do it. Homer: Hey, uh, could you go across the street and get me a slice of pizza? Vender: No pizza. Only Khlav Kalash. - Original Message - From: "Charles Rivard" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 2:51 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? If you are the only person in the room, can you play the games with accuracy? If not, then it is not accessible in my opinion. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "Bryan Peterson" To: "Rhonda Scott" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 7:28 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? I often play Wii Sports Bowling with my sighted folks. The only thing they have to do is tell me where to aim by telling me how many clicks to move the D-pad in a given direction to aim. I do everything myself and my folks just direct me. Then I play Wii Fit. My mom or dad makes the menu selectsions of course but I do everything else. Homer: Hey, uh, could you go across the street and get me a slice of pizza? Vender: No pizza. Only Khlav Kalash. - Original Message - From: "Rhonda Scott" To: "Charles Rivard" ; "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Our sighted 10 year old son enjoys having us play games on the Wii with him, but I get frustrated because with bowling, for instance, as you mentioned, I don't know which pins are still standing, and Deven has to aim for me so I can have a shot at knocking down the rest. We play Wii sports with him sometimes because it makes him happy, but I get easily frustrated playing games where someone has to do practically everything for me except the movements. So perhaps there are other Wii games more accessible for completely blind players. The boxing one is kind of fun because some of the sounds alert you to which player is getting their butt kicked, and once the round begins you just do your best to box all areas of your opponent's body. Rhonda - Original Message - From: "Charles Rivard" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 10:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? I've heard some game reviews about this game console that said that the games are accessible, only to find out that the games cannot be accurately played. For example, how can you tell what pins remain standing after you roll your first ball in bowling? How do you know where to aim on any shot? I don't want to guess or to have a pretty good idea. I want to actually know, before I bowl, what I am aiming at, and where it is. The same goes for tennis or any of the other games. I want skill, not luck, to be the determining factor in how well I play. As far as that goes, I want this in any game I play. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "lelia" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 1:14 PM Subject: [Audyssey] hey what games if any are accessible with the we? Hi all, well, lots of family and friends have the we and I am wondering what if any games or exercises or such are accessible for us? thanks lelia --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyss