can we remove input/test/text-spanner.ly ?

[Graham Percival]

I'm not certain what
input/test/text-spanner.ly
is supposed to demonstrate.  Could we either clarify this example, 
delete it, or move it to the regression tests (if it's useful as such) 
?


Cheers,
- Graham



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Re: Lilypond on Mac OSX Terminal

[Graham Percival]

On 31-Mar-06, at 12:49 AM, Han-Wen Nienhuys wrote:


Graham Percival wrote:

On 29-Mar-06, at 7:10 PM, David Rogers wrote:

In your .profile somewhere, add this line:

export PATH=$PATH:/Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/bin

Thanks, I've added this to the manual.
- Graham


I'm not sure if this is the right solution though. That directory also 
contains private versions of (among others) Ghostscript, that require 
setting GS_LIB.


Could we set up a  .../Resources/external-bin/   directory, containing 
symlinks to the files in .../bin  that users should be able to run?  
(convert-ly, lilypond, lilypond-book, midi2ly, etc)


- Graham



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Re: lilypond ./ChangeLog scm/lily-library.scm lily/...

[Graham Percival]

On 31-Mar-06, at 1:13 AM, Han-Wen Nienhuys wrote:


Graham Percival wrote:

(format #f
-	   (_ "no \\version statement found,  add~afor future 
compatibility")
+	   (_ "no \\version statement found, please add~afor future 
compatibility")

   (format #f "\n\n\\version ~s\n\n" (lilypond-version))


Please revert.  "please" is a superfluous word.


True, but it's also a "nice" word.  It doesn't introduce any confusion, 
and it will make some users feel better.  I think it's worth keeping it 
in there.


- Graham



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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Trevor Bača]

On 3/31/06, Trevor Bača <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 3/31/06, Erlend Aasland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hi
> >
> >
> > On 3/31/06, Trevor Bača <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scores
> > > of Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through some
> > > this weekend and make a few small scans.
> >
> >
> > Great!
>
> OK, here are two nice examples.
>
> The first is near the end of the second page of Sciarrino's 'All'aure
> in una lontananza' and the second is the very last bit of 'Come
> vengono prodotti gli incantesimi?'.
>
> Note, too, the use of back-to-back hairpins in the first example, with
> the 'niente' circle at the center.
>
> [While we're looking at the notation, I'd like to take a moment to
> plug these pieces: the complete set of Sciarrino's flute music is one
> of the most attractive, hypnotic bodies of work you can ever hope to
> find. The small motions that build up each piece come from a
> pleasantly, bewilderingly different number of directions, and the
> cumulative psychological effect of listening through any one of the
> pieces is, for me anyway, a disassociation with time that is almost
> total. Also the notation is really cool. Very much recommended.]

Also the attachments would help.


--
Trevor Bača
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


all'aure.png
Description: PNG image


come-vengono.png
Description: PNG image
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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Trevor Bača]

On 3/31/06, Erlend Aasland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi
>
>
> On 3/31/06, Trevor Bača <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scores
> > of Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through some
> > this weekend and make a few small scans.
>
>
> Great!

OK, here are two nice examples.

The first is near the end of the second page of Sciarrino's 'All'aure
in una lontananza' and the second is the very last bit of 'Come
vengono prodotti gli incantesimi?'.

Note, too, the use of back-to-back hairpins in the first example, with
the 'niente' circle at the center.

[While we're looking at the notation, I'd like to take a moment to
plug these pieces: the complete set of Sciarrino's flute music is one
of the most attractive, hypnotic bodies of work you can ever hope to
find. The small motions that build up each piece come from a
pleasantly, bewilderingly different number of directions, and the
cumulative psychological effect of listening through any one of the
pieces is, for me anyway, a disassociation with time that is almost
total. Also the notation is really cool. Very much recommended.]


--
Trevor Bača
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Improvements to Postscript backend (patches included)

[David Feuer]

On 3/31/06, Han-Wen Nienhuys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> > According to the Postscript reference, selectfont can be used with CID
> > resources as well as regular fonts.  Unfortunately, I can't make the
> > utf-8 regression test work either with or without my changes, so I
> > can't be sure I got this right.
>
> unfortunately, Ghostscript disagrees. It throws a /typecheck error from
> --glyphshow-- , if you load the font as a regular font.

Yech.  I suspect this is a bug in Ghostscript, though I could be
reading the PostScript reference wrong.  Could you take a look at
section 5.11.3 (CIDFont Dictionaries), the entry for selectfont in the
operator index (page 656, or PDF page 670), and the entry for
glyphshow (page 602, PDF page 616)?


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Re: please spread release announcement

[Marco Gusy]

 
> * If you report a release somewhere, please send a note to 
> lilypond-devel to prevent double work.

did it in www.ziobudda.net


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Re: GUB: patch for linux_kernel_headers

[Jan Nieuwenhuizen]

Han-Wen Nienhuys writes:

> It was a few weeks ago, so I assume that debian throws away old
> versions quickly. I expect that this will break in the near future as
> well; can we figure out a mechanism that doesn't rely on Debian source
> archives? Or one that takes it from a stable version of ubuntu/debian?

Yes, we could, but then it would not be debian_unstable.py.  We may
want to disable downloading of debian-unstable stuff by default
(esp. because we do not build debian anyway) or make a switch to
debian_stable.py.

Jan.

-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | GNU LilyPond - The music typesetter
http://www.xs4all.nl/~jantien   | http://www.lilypond.org


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Re: Minor corrections

[Graham Percival]

On 31-Mar-06, at 3:18 AM, Erlend Aasland wrote:

The 2.8 news page 
(http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.8/Documentation/topdocs/NEWS.html) says 
"New features in 2.7...", but it should obviously say "New features in 
2.8".


Already fixed, thanks.
- Graham



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Re: collision of rehearsal marks, y-parent

[Werner LEMBERG]

> >  note heads and rests (with attached articulation grobs)
> >  stems
> >  beams
> >  octavation lines, trills, tuplets, etc.
> >  slurs and ties
> >  bar numbers
> >  clefs
>
> This is a problem: almost everything is not very specific.

Well, I gave a list, didn't I?

> Is there a general pattern of collision resolution that you can spot
> (ie. always sideways, or always upwards?)

Upwards, I think, should be sufficient.

> If you really want to find out, you can either
> 
> a. look at the engravers source code
> 
> b. add a small Scheme-callback to the rehearsalmark that prints the
> result of ly:grob-parent ; eg. you could attach it to the 'text
> property.

Hmm, I still think it belongs to the docs...


Werner


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convert-ly and verticalExtent

[Daniel Johnson]

I have begun migrating my 2.6 files to 2.8 syntax.  In 2.6, I have used 
the following combination to force vertical-extent of a Staff in a 
ChoirStaff so lyrics can be centered between staves:


\set Staff.minimumVerticalExtent = ##f
\set Staff.verticalExtent = #'(-3.25 . 3.25)

When I run this through convert-ly, it converts the first line to:
   \override Staff.VerticalAxisGroup #'minimum-Y-extent = ##f
However, it does NOT convert the second line at all.  For correct 
behaviour, the second line should be converted to the following:

   \override Staff.VerticalAxisGroup #'Y-extent = #'(-3.25 . 3.25)

Was this a conscious decision, or simply an oversight?

Regards,
--Daniel


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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Trevor Bača]

On 3/31/06, Erlend Aasland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi
>
>
> On 3/31/06, Trevor Bača <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scores
> > of Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through some
> > this weekend and make a few small scans.
>
>
> Great!

OK, yes: If you look in the Sciarrino flute works (which are
absolutely incredible pieces, by the way) the circled al-niente /
dal-niente markings are an integral part of the surfaces in 'All'aure
in una lontananza' and also in the material towards the end of
'Hermes', 'Come vengono prodotti gli incantesimi?' and also 'Canzona
di ringraziamento'.

One word of warning: the Sciarrino flute works are all hand copy, so
we will be able to determine the proper size of the open circles, but
we'll have to guess at the ideal weight of the (postscript) line in
the electronic version (since the weight of all the lines in the hand
copy are equal, save for beams); points again to a settable parameter
to afford different choices.

The examples towards the end of 'Come vengono ...' are so beautiful.
The scanner's in the closet at the moment so I'll have to wait until
later this evening to hook it up and send over the examples.


--
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[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Han-Wen Nienhuys]

Erlend Aasland wrote:

Hi

On 3/31/06, *Trevor Bača* <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> wrote:


Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scores
of Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through some
this weekend and make a few small scans.


Great!

IIRC I think the circles are a touch smaller, maybe about 80% of what
you've rendered here; again, I get the scans to help out. Could the
size of the circle be a configurable parameter?


Yes, I think so. Perhaps we should have a thickness parameter too?



I recommend you compute thickness and radius from the hairpin thickness 
and height. Otherwise, you must have to create a separate Grob.



--

Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen

LilyPond Software Design
 -- Code for Music Notation
http://www.lilypond-design.com



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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Trevor Bača]

On 3/31/06, Erlend Aasland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi
>
>
> On 3/31/06, Trevor Bača <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scores
> > of Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through some
> > this weekend and make a few small scans.
>
>
> Great!
>
> > IIRC I think the circles are a touch smaller, maybe about 80% of what
> > you've rendered here; again, I get the scans to help out. Could the
> > size of the circle be a configurable parameter?
>
>
> Yes, I think so. Perhaps we should have a thickness parameter too?

Ah, yes. Good call. Yeah, I can't remember exactly whether the weight
was somewhat more or less, so yeah, good idea.


--
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[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Erlend Aasland]

HiOn 3/31/06, Trevor Bača <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scoresof Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through somethis weekend and make a few small scans.Great! 
IIRC I think the circles are a touch smaller, maybe about 80% of whatyou've rendered here; again, I get the scans to help out. Could the
size of the circle be a configurable parameter?Yes, I think so. Perhaps we should have a thickness parameter too? Regards,  Erlend Aasland
--Trevor Bača[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Trevor Bača]

On 3/31/06, Erlend Aasland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Marcus
>
>
> On 3/16/06, Marcus Macauley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 09:29:43 -0800, Trevor Bača"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> >
>
> > > I'm interested in this kind of 'al niente' / 'de niente' thing, too,
> > > but haven't had a chance to figure out the right settings yet.
> > >
>
>
> This sounds interesting, do you have an image of a real world example? (I
> was unable to find one by googling). I wasn't aware of "al niente" until
> now, but I could certainly make use of it in some of my arrangements.
>
> > At least one music font/notation program, I forget which, includes for
> this
> > purpose a letter "n" in the same style as mrsfp for dynamics. So perhaps
> the
> > ideal way to implement this latter kind of niente notation (the hairpin
> circle
> > tip being the other kind) would be to create a new dynamic mark, called
> "n", and
> > syntax analogous to the other dynamics, thus:
> >
> > c2~\> c~ c r\n
>
>
> I made a quick hack for this just for fun (I'm sure Han-Wen would implement
> it more properly, especially the font); see the attached patch and test
> case.

Oh wow. This is really cool.

Yeah, you've definitely got the idea; the best examples are in scores
of Sciarrino's recent music and I'll have time to dig through some
this weekend and make a few small scans.

IIRC I think the circles are a touch smaller, maybe about 80% of what
you've rendered here; again, I get the scans to help out. Could the
size of the circle be a configurable parameter?




--
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[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Minor corrections

[Erlend Aasland]

Hi,The 2.8 news page (http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.8/Documentation/topdocs/NEWS.html) says "New features in 2.7...", but it should obviously say "New features in 
2.8".Regards,  Erlend Aasland
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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Erlend Aasland]

On 3/31/06, Han-Wen Nienhuys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Actually, it doesn't look bad.  Do you want to work on this further so Ican include the patch?Well, I've actually got some sparetime this weekend, so I might be able to work a little bit on it.
- the thickness of both stems should be better in balance. the left oneshould be heavier, or the right one lighter.
- the hole should be a bit wider.To properly balance it, you need to print it (on paper, not on screen)out next to other glyphs from the font (but not f and p, since they areextra heavy).
Well, as you can see, I just copied the m glyph and removed one stem. I can't promise anything, but I'll take a look at it. A scan of a real example would be of great help.
For the circle: use a circle output routine (see easy-notation.cc)Ok 
- the property should have a graphical name. eg. something like'circled-tipOk 
- this can be folded into one statement.   if ((grow_dir > 0) && !broken[LEFT])+   mol.add_at_edge (X_AXIS, LEFT, Stencil (circle), 0, 0);+  if ((grow_dir < 0) && !broken[RIGHT])
+   mol.add_at_edge (X_AXIS, RIGHT, Stencil (circle), 0, 0);OkI'll try to improve it and send an update.Regards,  Erlend Aasland 
--Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwenLilyPond Software Design  -- Code for Music Notation
http://www.lilypond-design.com
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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Han-Wen Nienhuys]

Erlend Aasland wrote:



I made a quick hack for this just for fun (I'm sure Han-Wen would 
implement it more properly, especially the font); see the attached patch 
and test case.


(I suspect that the circles are a bit misplaced, but as I said this is 
just a quick hack).


Actually, it doesn't look bad.  Do you want to work on this further so I 
can include the patch?



For the n glyph,

- the thickness of both stems should be better in balance. the left one 
should be heavier, or the right one lighter.


- the hole should be a bit wider.

To properly balance it, you need to print it (on paper, not on screen) 
out next to other glyphs from the font (but not f and p, since they are 
extra heavy).


For the circle: use a circle output routine (see easy-notation.cc)

- the property should have a graphical name. eg. something like 
'circled-tip


- this can be folded into one statement.

  if ((grow_dir > 0) && !broken[LEFT])
+   mol.add_at_edge (X_AXIS, LEFT, Stencil (circle), 0, 0);
+  if ((grow_dir < 0) && !broken[RIGHT])
+   mol.add_at_edge (X_AXIS, RIGHT, Stencil (circle), 0, 0);


--

Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen

LilyPond Software Design
 -- Code for Music Notation
http://www.lilypond-design.com



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Re: collision of rehearsal marks, y-parent

[Han-Wen Nienhuys]

Werner LEMBERG wrote:

Is it possible to add a collision resolver for rehearsal marks?  The

preventing what kind of collisions?


Almost everything:

 note heads and rests (with attached articulation grobs)
 stems
 beams
 octavation lines, trills, tuplets, etc.
 slurs and ties
 bar numbers
 clefs

Dynamics and scripts are probably not necessary because they are below
the staff line normally.


This is a problem: almost everything is not very specific. I will put it 
on the sponsorable feature list. Is there a general pattern of collision 
resolution that you can spot (ie. always sideways, or always upwards?)



But what is the `Y-parent'?

it depends. In case of teh rehearsal mark, I guess it will be the
System grob.


You `guess'.  Interesting :-)

Where can I find information about this?  Is it documented somewhere?


No, not really. Parent-child relationships are generally determined by 
contexts, but it can vary. Eg. a fingering instruction typically has a 
notehead both as X and Y-parent, so the fingering always moves along 
with any collision resolution for the head.


 For Y-side positioning it doesn't really matter, since the 
side-positioning will compensate for any movements that the Y-parent 
might make.


If you really want to find out, you can either

a. look at the engravers source code

b. add a small Scheme-callback to the rehearsalmark that prints the 
result of ly:grob-parent ; eg. you could attach it to the 'text property.


--

Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen

LilyPond Software Design
 -- Code for Music Notation
http://www.lilypond-design.com



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Re: al niente / de niente - was Re: (no subject)

[Erlend Aasland]

Hi MarcusOn 3/16/06, Marcus Macauley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 09:29:43 -0800, Trevor Bača"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm interested in this kind of 'al niente' / 'de niente' thing, too,> but haven't had a chance to figure out the right settings yet.>This sounds interesting, do you have an image of a real world example? (I was unable to find one by googling). I wasn't aware of "al niente" until now, but I could certainly make use of it in some of my arrangements.
At least one music font/notation program, I forget which, includes for this
purpose a letter "n" in the same style as mrsfp for dynamics. So perhaps theideal way to implement this latter kind of niente notation (the hairpin circletip being the other kind) would be to create a new dynamic mark, called "n", and
syntax analogous to the other dynamics, thus:c2~\> c~ c r\nI made a quick hack for this just for fun (I'm sure Han-Wen would implement it more properly, especially the font); see the attached patch and test case.
(I suspect that the circles are a bit misplaced, but as I said this is just a quick hack).Regards,  Erlend Aasland


niente.patch
Description: Binary data


niente-test.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document


niente-test.ly
Description: Binary data
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Re: collision of rehearsal marks, y-parent

[Werner LEMBERG]

> > Is it possible to add a collision resolver for rehearsal marks?  The
>
> preventing what kind of collisions?

Almost everything:

 note heads and rests (with attached articulation grobs)
 stems
 beams
 octavation lines, trills, tuplets, etc.
 slurs and ties
 bar numbers
 clefs

Dynamics and scripts are probably not necessary because they are below
the staff line normally.

> > But what is the `Y-parent'?
>
> it depends. In case of teh rehearsal mark, I guess it will be the
> System grob.

You `guess'.  Interesting :-)

Where can I find information about this?  Is it documented somewhere?


Werner


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Re: Improvements to Postscript backend (patches included)

[Han-Wen Nienhuys]

David Feuer wrote:

   (format #f "gsave
-  /~a ~a ~a output-scale div scalefont setfont\n~a grestore"
+  /~a ~a output-scale div selectfont\n~a grestore"
  postscript-font-name
- (if cid?
- " /CIDFont findresource "
- " findfont")

I don't understand this? How are CID resources supposed to be loaded now?


According to the Postscript reference, selectfont can be used with CID
resources as well as regular fonts.  Unfortunately, I can't make the
utf-8 regression test work either with or without my changes, so I
can't be sure I got this right.


unfortunately, Ghostscript disagrees. It throws a /typecheck error from 
--glyphshow-- , if you load the font as a regular font.


--

Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen

LilyPond Software Design
 -- Code for Music Notation
http://www.lilypond-design.com



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Re: lilypond ./ChangeLog scm/lily-library.scm lily/...

[Han-Wen Nienhuys]

Graham Percival wrote:

(format #f
-  (_ "no \\version statement found,  add~afor future compatibility")
+  (_ "no \\version statement found, please add~afor future 
compatibility")
   (format #f "\n\n\\version ~s\n\n" (lilypond-version))


Please revert.  "please" is a superfluous word.

--

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Re: collision of rehearsal marks, y-parent

[Han-Wen Nienhuys]

Werner LEMBERG wrote:

While working on a big score together with proper parts extraction I
find that vertical positioning of rehearsal marks needs manual
adjustments most often.

Is it possible to add a collision resolver for rehearsal marks?  The


preventing what kind of collisions?


`padding' option doesn't work well since it is important that
rehearsal marks are as near as possible to the staff lines.

BTW, how can I find out in lilypond-internals.info the `parent' of a
grob?  For example, this is for RehearsalMark objects:



But what is the `Y-parent'?  It would be great if this information
could be added there.


it depends. In case of teh rehearsal mark, I guess it will be the System 
grob.



--

Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen

LilyPond Software Design
 -- Code for Music Notation
http://www.lilypond-design.com



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Re: collision of rehearsal marks, y-parent

[Graham Percival]

On 30-Mar-06, at 11:51 PM, Werner LEMBERG wrote:


While working on a big score together with proper parts extraction I
find that vertical positioning of rehearsal marks needs manual
adjustments most often.


Absolutely.  :(

I use this method as a workaround:
\layout { \context { \Score
  \override RehearsalMark #'Y-offset = 
#ly:self-alignment-interface::aligned-on-y-parent

  \override RehearsalMark #'self-alignment-Y = #-1
}}

and sometimes override it with things like
\once \override Score.RehearsalMark #'self-alignment-Y = #0.7
in the piece.

Cheers,
- Graham



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