Re: [OSM-talk] new Wikidata+OSM data in one RDF database
Nice work Yuri, I hope the next version will have geometries in GeoSPARQL and an output directly on a map, but one step after another. I believe for the moment it's not so important to have all the OSM objects without Wikidata link inside the database. To handle this amount of data would be much harder. Very cool project. Best regards Tim alias Kolossos Am 12.05.2017 um 18:03 schrieb Yuri Astrakhan: > TLDR: A SPARQL (rdf) database with both OSM and Wikidata data is up for > testing. Allows massive cross-referenced queries between two datasets. > The service is a test, and needs a permanent home to stay alive. > > Overpass Turbo is awesome, but sadly it does not have data from > Wikidata, nor does it support some SQL-like conditions. I have setup a > temporary RDF database that has both OSM & Wikidata. You can use SPARQL > queries to find: > > * All OSM objects with wikidata tag that references a Wikipedia > disambiguation page. Get the name of the page in first available > language ru, fr, de, en.http://tinyurl.com/mzlfb26 > > * OSM relations with wikidata tag pointing to a person (also tries > multiple language fallbacks). http://tinyurl.com/m6fh3wx > > * OSM relations with duplicate Wikidata IDs http://tinyurl.com/mvhhogx > > > == OSM data structure == > osmnode, osmway, osmrel - OSM object prefix, e.g. osmnode:1234 > osmt - tag, e.g. osmt:name:en (only has tags with latin chars, -, _, > :, digits > osmm - meta data about the object -- type, isClosed, version. > > I try to preserve OSM data without much changes. Every tag's value is > stored as a string, except for wikidata and wikipedia tags which are > converted to a URL, the same format as stored in Wikidata. > > osmway:29453885 > osmt:name "Samina"; > osmt:waterway "river"; > osmt:wikidata wd:Q156065; > osmt:wikipedia <https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samina>; > osmm:type "w"; could be "r", "w", and "n" > osmm:isClosed false; this meta property is only for OSM ways > osmm:version 24. > > Wikidata data structure is identical to https://query.wikidata.org (see > help) > > > == Current limitations == > * Only includes OSM objects with either "wikidata" or "wikipedia" tags > * The OSM data only contains tags with only Latin letters, digits and > symbols - : _ > * OSM geometry info is not imported, e.g. no center point or bounding > box, except for osmm:isClosed (true/false) property for ways. > * Does not include OSM object inheritance data - e.g. cannot query for > "find a node that is part of a way which is part of a relation that has > wikidata tag that ..." > * Wikidata is updated every second, but OSM does not yet update at all, > imported from a full db dump as of a few days ago. > > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Can wikidata links help fight name inflation?
I was the person who adds most of the labels to London, so I want to share also my thoughts. I did this for all capitals and countries in the world to be able to create worldmaps in different languages. Such world maps in local languages are known from each school atlas and are used in local television news. For this action I use Wikipedia article names. So London was in each language important enough to write an article about it in this language. Which is a lot of work, someone invested. Before this action I checked and discuss that there was no legal issue by using Wikipedia article names. Now they are at Wikidata under CC-0 so definitely free. The bias in this discussion that English labels are ok and helpful but other languages are not, is scary for me. Please take a look at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_number_of_native_speakers and find that English is only on place 3 of the list. We have a good chance that we will see in short-therm multilingual maps in lots of websites by using vector tiles. And in this moment we really want to make it harder to add such translations? Now to Frederiks proposal: To use Wikidata is really an interesting idea to reduce duplicated work, also for more than place names. With some pre-condition we could talk more positive about Frederiks proposal: *There should be in the future an additional, official version of planet-dumps and diffs that are enrich with content from Wikidata. Such a service must be stable as the other planet dumps. This service would kill the argument that it is harder to use external database Wikidata for apps. If not we create duplicated work for developers that we want to avoid elsewhere. *We would need much more Wikidata tags in OSM, now we have only 35.000 and for wikipedia-Tags we have also only 450.000. But I have a database of 3.5 Mio Wikipedia-objects that have a coordinate. So there is work for years. *We should also discuss with the Wikidata community the scope of there project. Perhaps we can come to a point where everything is inside the scope that is interesting for a Wikimedia project AND for OpenStreetMap. But if we come with the idea that we want to store opening hours for little shops in Wikidata I'm sure that the Wikidata community would not be amused to it. (I already try it.) So before we have something of the pre-conditions on the horizont I think it's easier go further with the way of name tags we have now for years. Tim alias Kolossos ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata
Ok, lets take the second example of Wind turbines: power=generator + generator:source=wind The first tag "power=generator" is a more general tag and you have the specific tag "generator:source=wind". For the second tag you have a Wiki page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:generator:source%3Dwind On this wiki-page you can find that the general tag "power=generator" is obligatory. So this tag delivers no additional information, because it exist in each case. In my eyes the first general tag exist only for historical reasons and for software/render-styles that are not very specific, they can work so without an update after each creation of a new tag. So please see the project as a project to link from Wikidata to OSM-Wiki and taginfo, not as a project to register all combinations of tags. Greetings Tim Am 30.12.2014 um 11:29 schrieb Janko Mihelić: > > > 2014-12-30 2:06 GMT+01:00 Kolossos <mailto:t...@alder-digital.de>>: > > > Perhaps you have a better example to let me re-think this topic. > "cuisine=fastfood" is only used 12 times [2]. > > > For example bike paths (Q221722), highway=path + bicycle=designated + > foot=designated + segregated=yes > > Wind turbine (Q49833), power=generator + generator:source=wind > > I can list all the other generator types here. > > Reservoir (Q131681), natural=water + water=reservoir > plus all the other types of water. > > man_made=tower + > tower:type=communication/climbing/bell_tower/cooling/lighting > > Each one could have its Wikipedia page. > > So, there are a lot. If you don't find a way to use multiple tags, I > think this will not be a serious project. Maybe there's a way to delimit > strings and use a format that can use n strings? > > Janko Mihelić > > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata
I would like to keep it as simple as possible and I don't want to replace the OSM-Wiki where all usefull combinations of tags are described. You would not only destroy the URL to the OSM-Wiki you would also damage the format checking tools that we have in Wikidata[1]. Perhaps you have a better example to let me re-think this topic. "cuisine=fastfood" is only used 12 times [2]. Greeting Tim alias Kolossos [1] https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property_talk%3AP1282&diff=163539475&oldid=163111676 [2] http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/cuisine=fastfood#overview Am 29.12.2014 um 13:40 schrieb Janko Mihelić: > 2014-12-29 12:26 GMT+01:00 Kolossos <mailto:t...@alder-digital.de>>: > > It's possible to build 1:n and n:1 relations. > > That means "amenity=marketplace" links to 2 Wikidata entries Q330284 > (marketplace) and Q132510 (streetmarket). In the other direction > "power=minor_line" and "power=line" are linking both to Q2144320 > (Overhead power line). It's in both cases a OR-connection. > As far I can see it's not possible to support an AND. > > > For this to be a valuable resource, I think we need an AND. What if we used: > > Tag:amenity=restaurant+cuisine=fastfood > > But then the Formater URL Statement of the P1282 wouldn't be entirely > correct. I think that's a small price. > > I have another suggestion. Sometimes tags mean different things in > different countries. For example highway=primary means Q765207 in > Croatia, but it means Q792334 in Belgium. For these cases I would use a > qualifier P131 (located in the administrative territorial entity) and > that means that the tag (or combination of tags) only works in that > administrative entity. > > Janko > > > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata
I'm also a little bit sceptical to handle such data twice, my hope was to use Taginfo-integration to bring the data to the osm-wiki. I think together with a little js-script like qlable [1] we would be able to provide translations in different language, but for a search in the wiki it would not help. Greetings Tim [1]https://googleknowledge.github.io/qlabel/ Am 29.12.2014 um 19:56 schrieb Andy Mabbett: > On 28 December 2014 at 22:33, Kolossos wrote: >> I work the last weeks to bring the OSM-tagging to >> Wikidata, by using: >> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property_talk:P1282 > > Great work, thank you! > > I have enabled tagging in the reverse direction, like this: > > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:bridge&diff=prev&oldid=1077814 > > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag%3Awaterway%3Driver&diff=1122164&oldid=976981 > > Of course, being OSM, some people already have objected to this... > > > > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata
It's possible to build 1:n and n:1 relations. That means "amenity=marketplace" links to 2 Wikidata entries Q330284 (marketplace) and Q132510 (streetmarket). In the other direction "power=minor_line" and "power=line" are linking both to Q2144320 (Overhead power line). It's in both cases a OR-connection. As far I can see it's not possible to support an AND. Thanks for the interesting question. Greetings Tim Am 29.12.2014 um 11:55 schrieb Janko Mihelić: > Very interesting project! Keep it up, I might come and help you. > > What if you add more tags in Wikidata? Does that mean that an object in > OSM needs to have all those tags, or just one of them? Is it an AND or > an OR? > > For example, in Wikidata you have an element "Fastfood restaurants" > (Q1751429). How do you add "amenity=fastfood" and a combination of > "amenity=restaurant + cuisine=fastfood"? Both are fastfood restaurants. > > Janko > > 2014-12-28 23:33 GMT+01:00 Kolossos <mailto:t...@alder-digital.de>>: > > Hello, > I work the last weeks to bring the OSM-tagging to > Wikidata, by using: > https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property_talk:P1282 > > I work through the "Map features"-site from top to down. > (It was a funny job to find right Wikipedia-articles.) > Not in all cases it was possible to find a right matching. > > The main use-case I see in translations of our tagging system in smaller > languages. This can be interesting for tools like ID-editor or for the > search in the OSM-Wiki. Wikidata can also be a hub to connect to other > projects. > > At the end I hope also this connection can help to give OSM objects an > Wikipedia/Wikidata-Tag. So I hope we can check a tagging with the "is > instance of"-property in Wikidata. > > Taginfo already support this 626 connections: > http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/projects/wikidata_org#tags > > Greetings Tim alias Kolossos > > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org <mailto:talk@openstreetmap.org> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > > > > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata
Hello, I work the last weeks to bring the OSM-tagging to Wikidata, by using: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property_talk:P1282 I work through the "Map features"-site from top to down. (It was a funny job to find right Wikipedia-articles.) Not in all cases it was possible to find a right matching. The main use-case I see in translations of our tagging system in smaller languages. This can be interesting for tools like ID-editor or for the search in the OSM-Wiki. Wikidata can also be a hub to connect to other projects. At the end I hope also this connection can help to give OSM objects an Wikipedia/Wikidata-Tag. So I hope we can check a tagging with the "is instance of"-property in Wikidata. Taginfo already support this 626 connections: http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/projects/wikidata_org#tags Greetings Tim alias Kolossos ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] ImageInOsm: a photomapping mobile application
For discussions use: *https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Village_pump *https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/commons-l Greetings Tim Am 29.08.2013 16:47, schrieb Gilles Bassière: > > I'm currently exploring Commons. I know that uploading a file is not as > trivial as Flickr (that's one of the reason Flickr has been implemented > first). I was about to post my technical questions on mediawiki-api > mailing list. I'm not sure of the preferred way to contact the WM > Commons community... Do you recommand a mailing list or a forum? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] ImageInOsm: a photomapping mobile application
Hello Gilles, you can use additionally also: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:image So you would have links in both direction. Do you want to use Geocoding? All Smartphones have GPS, but you need a feature to adjust the position, and an camera-app with this feature would be very helpful. I'm a member of Wikimedia Commons community. I'm relatively sure that this community will be sad if someone uploads tons on pictures where you only see housenumbers. Thats what mappers doing. Each picture on Commons also need a description, category and so on. This makes a lot of work. I like the idea of a cooperation between OSM an Wikimedia, but I see Commons only as place for a selection of pictures that mappers make. Commons is also without your project on a good way to become a media garbage dump. So please give the user a chance to make a selection for an upload to Commons. If you want to go an other way, please discuss this with Commons community. Wikimedia Commons supports with over 3.5 Mio pictures also geocoding: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Geocoding Each geocoded image gets also a link the description page to an OSM-map. (I'm the maintainer of this map-frontend.) Example map: https://toolserver.org/~kolossos/openlayers/commons-on-osm.php?zoom=16&lat=51.05&lon=13.73 So geocoding is long-time stable, working for years and I can't see a benefit by using a reference to in-stable OSM-ID's. Perhaps you can explain the benefit you see. Greetings Tim alias Kolossos Am 28.08.2013 16:58, schrieb Gilles Bassière: > Hi All, > > I'd like to introduce ImageInOsm [1], a photomapping mobile application. > > The app is intended for on-the-field users. It is very easy to use (see > screenshots [1]): > 1. the user select an OSM object that he is seeing on the ground > 2. he takes a picture of this object > 3. the picture is sent to Flickr with the OSM id in the tags > > You can already try it: > - for Android, just download and install this test package [2], > - for iOS, we are unforunately not aware of any easy solution to publish > a test package, you will have to build and install from the source code > (you will need a Mac with the XCode software). > > Compared to traditionnal photomapping process, ImageInOsm promotes > collaboration. Indeed, the pictures will not remain on a hard/flash > drive, they will immediately be shared on the Web with metadata allowing > others to find and use them. > > Please note that (as the name does NOT imply) pictures will not be > stored on any OSM server. Instead, they will be sent to a 3rd-party > server (Flickr, ...) under your own account. The sole innovation > consists in linking the picture to the OSM object that it references. > > So far, the application only works with Flickr as a backend. The tagging > convention used makes the pictures compatible with LizPOI [3] and > OsmFlickr [4]. We hope that one day these pictures will be easily > available in your editor (a JOSM plugin would do the job but we this is > not on our roadmap, if anyone is interested). > > We are grateful to Jean-Louis Zimmermann from "Ville d'Orange" for > having initiated and supported this project. > > Technically speaking, this app is built upon: > - Cordova 3.0 > - JavaScript + BackboneJS > - HTML/CSS + Bootstrap 2.x > Source code is available on Github [5], distributed under the Apache > license 2.0. Of course, any contribution will be happily received: code, > documentation, bug report, propositions, etc. > > We are aware that the project is not completely mature but the code is > under active development. We are already planning the following updates: > - support Wikimedia as a picture backend (ongoing development) > - configurable filters for OSM objects so that users can make thematic > campaign > - improve user experience (see issues on GitHub) > > [1] http://naturalsolutions.github.io/ImageInOsm/ > [2] http://depot.natural-solutions.eu/ImageInOsm/ImageInOsm-0.1.apk > [3] http://lizpoi.3liz.com/demo/index.php/lizpoi/map/?tree_id=1 > [4] > http://www.3liz.com/blog/rldhont/index.php?post/2013/02/18/OsmFlickr-:-Gestion-des-liens-OpenStreetMap-Flickr > > [5] https://github.com/NaturalSolutions/ImageInOsm/ > > Best regards > > Gilles Bassière > NATURAL SOLUTIONS > http://www.natural-solutions.eu ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Please test this "Native wikipedia link" - feature
Hello Tirkon, the tool is working, but it would also no problem to write such a tool on base of Wikipedias interwikilinks. Wikipedia article names are human readable, and I would be careful to call a link to "Q1" native for somebody. We had a proposal for a Wikidata-Tag. Please read my comment there: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3AProposed_features%2FWikidata&diff=884867&oldid=883084 So I believe we will need Wikidata, but only for entries without an Wikipedia article. Greetings Kolossos Am 26.06.2013 18:13, schrieb Tirkon: Michael Kugelmann wrote: did you take care about WIWOSM? http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WIWOSM Of course I do. ;-) - This already works fine since more than one year. - the tagging scheme can handle different language even in parallel - BUT: the tagging of ONE LANGUAGE is SUFFICIENT, the rest is handled as linking within Wikipedia Just a few days after the collaboration of Wikipedia and OSM began, I posted a whole bunch of ideas what could be done, i.e. generating maps like this automaticely from OSM. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vorlage:Imagemap_Landkreis_Aurich This would be far beyond that, what is done by WIWOSM. Thus I am really happy to have WIWOSM. Thus I wrote a German guide just the day after it was introduced on the FOSSGIS. Sadly we have the problem, that it does not work in the Internet Explorer. So long it is problematical to convince Wikipedians using WIWOSM instead of the old less advantageous tools. My intension was and is to advertise this collaboration. All this should make clear that I really care about WIWOSM. My focus on the collaboration of Wikipedia and OSM is also the reason, why I came up with the idea of this thread. At the moment the only question is whether it works or not - nothing more. You are right: For WIWOSM one language link is sufficient. You wrote that the rest has to be done in Wikipedia. Again you are right. And this thread is the first beginning of testing just that. If it works, the next step could be to find the Wikidata object from the link to one discretionary language article. But the essential part that needs testing is what I brang up here. If it works, everybody has the possibility to use a "Native wikipedia link", i.e. in a posting or a mail, in an OSM map or in another project. I never asked to implement something in OSM. I only begged for a test in order to make this feature possible. Thus the title of this thread is: "Please !!TEST!! this "Native wikipedia link" - feature" and not "Please implement this "Native wikipedia link" - feature". Be assured that I will not ask to implement something in OSM without caring about WIWOSM. ;-) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM relation ID property in Wikidata
Hello Andreas, It seems in principle possible to support anchor-links but it was not in our focus, because our frontend had only one map per article. (You can believe me the sytem was complex enough ;-)). I will talk about this topic with my co-creator and the developer of WikiMiniAtlas. It will also have some problems with articles in different languages connected by Interwikilinks because the anchors could be different, so I would like to support it later with Wikidata part 3 (lists). Greetings Tim Am 06.05.2013 11:03, schrieb Andreas Labres: On 05.05.13 14:55, Kolossos wrote: I don't like to support different reference systems in WIWOSM. I see the point. But WIWOSM seems not to work with anchor-links: Neither http://toolserver.org/~kolossos/openlayers/kml-on-ol-json3.php?lang=de&title=Liste%20der%20denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten%20Objekte%20in%20Wien%2FPenzing%23objektid-25020 <http://toolserver.org/%7Ekolossos/openlayers/kml-on-ol-json3.php?lang=de&title=Liste%20der%20denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten%20Objekte%20in%20Wien%2FPenzing%23objektid-25020> nor http://toolserver.org/~kolossos/openlayers/kml-on-ol-json3.php?lang=de&title=Liste_der_denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten_Objekte_in_Wien%2FPenzing%23objektid-25026 <http://toolserver.org/%7Ekolossos/openlayers/kml-on-ol-json3.php?lang=de&title=Liste_der_denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten_Objekte_in_Wien%2FPenzing%23objektid-25026> (don't know how you want spaces encoded) does find the object in OSM. And I'm not talking of a different reference system in WIWOSM. Wikipedia/Wikidata should uniquely "name" those objects that only exist in Wikipedia lists. We (OSM as well as WIWOSM) should only use those "names". /al ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM relation ID property in Wikidata
Hello Andreas, to c) I don't like to support different reference systems in WIWOSM. Each country has it's own for monuments and than somebody starts with vulcanos or brigdes We would have to update WIWOSM each week without the generic system we have now. Greetings Tim Am 05.05.2013 11:26, schrieb Andreas Labres: Tim, There are different problems, let's keep them separate (vielleicht reden wir auch - Englisch - aneinander vorbei... ;) a) There is a problem in the code of osm.org how it links wikipedia articles. You can't do a link like this: $PATH#anchor?uselang=en This is bad URL syntax. You (osm.org) have to do $PATH?uselang=en#anchor https://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/4802 b) It is "not a good idea" to link objects in Wikipedia lists like Liste der denkmalgeschützten Objekte in Wien/Penzing#objektid-25026 This object should have its own "name" in Wikipedia, which then redirects to whereever this object can be found. This shouldn't be "external" but a feature in Wikipedia/Wikidata/Wikiwhatsoever. c) The objectID I'm referencing is nothing "external", it's a nationally unique ID given by the Austrian Bundesdenkmalamt which identifies each "monument" in Austria. Therefore it's the best idea to use /this/ as /the/ reference to the given object (with reference to it being a historic monument). Alex Wagner, who created all the "Denkmalgeschützte Objekte" in Austria in the Wikipedia used it when he created the Wikipedia pages. http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-at/2013-April/005542.html ff OSM could save this objectID, say: ref:monument=AT:25026 and WIWOSM then knows how to find this (uniquely identified) object in Wikipedia. /al ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM relation ID property in Wikidata
Hello Andreas, I hope Wikidata part 3 solve the problem with the list, so that an object would be one Wikidata entry and can be a member in different lists but can also have an own article. A map with objects in the example article is here:[1] I have no influence on the way how http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/48434939 links to Wikipedia, I could also only ask an admin. With a link to index.php it would be easy to solve[2]. An external project with m:n-relations between OSM and WP would have it's own problems. Greetings Tim alias Kolossos [1]http://toolserver.org/~kolossos/openlayers/kml-on-ol.php?lang=de&uselang=de&title=Liste%20der%20denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten%20Objekte%20in%20Wien%2FPenzing&zoom=15&lat=48.21428&lon=16.22318&layers=B00FFTTF [2]http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?uselang=de&title=Liste_der_denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten_Objekte_in_Wien/Penzing#objektid-25026 Am 05.05.2013 08:08, schrieb Andreas Labres: Tim, There are problems with WIWOSM that aren't solved at all... Example: Historic monuments in Austria. They are all covered in Wikipedia, but mostly only in Lists. And they do have a distinguishable objectID, but I can't really state this in OSM. For instance: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/207854465 ist such a historic monument with objectID 25020. It can be found in Wikipedia here: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_der_denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten_Objekte_in_Wien/Penzing#objektid-25020 So I can only state the tag wikipedia:de = Liste der denkmalgeschützten Objekte in Wien/Penzing#objektid-25020 This has the effect that the link in OSM doesn't work (because OSM adds a userlang parameter behind the anchor reference which I consider a bug of OSM [did already report it]). And also WIWOSM can't reference the distict object. Though it seems to be able to reference some of the "Liste_der_denkmalgeschützten_Objekte_in_Wien/Penzing". It can't do all because some of the objects do have their own wikipedia entrance, for instance Mariarunn church: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/48434703 http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pfarr-_und_Wallfahrtskirche_Mariabrunn So what would be necessary is that wikipedia and OSM would agree on some kind of generic ID, which could in the case of historic monuments in Austria be some /monument/AT/$objectID, e.g. /monument/AT/25020, which then would redirect to http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_der_denkmalgesch%C3%BCtzten_Objekte_in_Wien/Penzing#objektid-25020 whereas /monument/AT/24616 could redirect to http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pfarr-_und_Wallfahrtskirche_Mariabrunn /al ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM relation ID property in Wikidata
Hello,
as co-creator of WIWOSM I was also against this Wikidata-property, but I
came too late.
WIWOSM links are not only more stable and human-readable, the are also
much more flexible. So in WIWOSM we can suport relations but also
multirelations, ways, multiways nodes, multinodes. I'm waiting for the
day where the people starts to create relations for each building only
to be able to link on it from Wikidata.
We have now Wikipedia-Tags for over 300.000 objects and I would prefer
to concentrate the power of the community to one system instead to split
it.
In my eyes, what Wikidata perhaps need is one bit (created by a bot)
with the information yes there is an matching OSM object to create a
link to a map, the rest can come from WIWOSM.
Later if Wikidata starts to have entries without an own
Wikipedia-article we should support a Wikidata-Tag, but thats on way[2].
This will happen at part 3 of Wikidata-project were they want to support
list creation. With projects like WikiLovesMonuments I'm sure that we
will have on some places a link for each building, so the problem above
is not only theory.
Greetings Tim alias Kolossos
[1] http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/wikipedia
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Wikidata
Am 04.05.2013 01:49, schrieb Claus Stadler:
Hi,
Shouldn't OSM use Wikipedia URLs as UUIDs where applicable rather than
Wikipedia referring to database identifiers? (The answer is a clear
'yes' from my side.)
In fact there are the (wikipedia, *) tags - but not sure how good the
quality is - what can be seen on a first glance is, that people mix URLs
and article names, and also encoding.
Cheers,
Claus
On 05/04/2013 01:34 AM, Jason Remillard wrote:
Hi,
In general is seems like it might be useful to have some kind of
somewhat permanent URL to an element inside of OSM. However, given
what exists today shouldn't Wikipedia be using the overpass API for
referencing OSM?
Thanks
Jason.
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 6:46 PM, Paul Norman wrote:
From: andrzej zaborowski [mailto:balr...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:08 PM
To: Frederik Ramm
Cc: OpenStreetMap
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] OSM relation ID property in Wikidata
I am less concerned about the Wikidata side - if they make a bad
judgement then it is their mess to clean up. I am however concerned
that if more people simply assume that the status quo is there to stay
("IDs are stable enough"), this will put pressure on *us* and limit
our flexibility in the future.
The OSMF has sent a pretty strong message saying that object IDs are
stable enough to base impactful legal decisions on them. It will look
silly for them to go back to the stance that IDs aren't stable after
all.
There's two sides to ID stability. One is stability during software
or data
model changes and the other is stability during normal mapping.
Frederik's
post was concerned more with the former.
The latter is more complicated. Because the original message linked to
London, it's worth pointing out that a few admin relations did get
new IDs
in the redaction process for technical reasons and that periodically
relations get given new IDs because old large complex relations don't
interact well with the /history call.
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Re: [OSM-talk] Translating the world
Good starting point for such an application seems to be the Amenity Editor: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Amenity_Editor In the moment it's difficult to select and editing nodes cities for large area. Only way I see is to use overpass API with a more or less cryptical URL[1] and adding a new name-tag is not so simple as it could be. So a simple to use webservice could involve more people. So any help is welcome to create such a translating tool. Greetings Kolossos [1] JOSM remote control: http://localhost:8111/import?url=http%3A%2F%2Foverpass-api.de%2Fapi%2Fxapi_meta%3F%2A%5Bplace%253Dcity%5D%5Bbbox=4,45,9,52%5D Am 29.10.2012 18:06, schrieb Ab_fab: Hi Tim, This looks very promising. I'm sure that many people fluent in two or more languages could get involved in the project, once a proper editing interface is set-up. There's already a lot to do for the regions and cities names. I'm thinking of one of my korean friend living in France at the moment, for who it would be easy to set the French city names and administrative subdivisions in hangul, based on the default (French) name. In my opinion, one should be able to _ log with his OSM account, _ set his translation language (e.g. Korean) _ set the desired area, and the type of administrative subdivision level (coutry, region, city ...) And the interface could propose _ the list of subdivisions found (for example by Nominatim), _ names in the translation language already present in the database _ names proposed, based on interwiki links _ check boxes to confirm that default name can apply in the destination language / or confirm that interwiki proposal is ok _ Fields to allow adjustment / addition of name in the destination language. Bye ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Translating the world
Hello, we had this topic on legal-talk one year ago[1] and there were no opposition against my arguments. So it seems to be uncritical. I also present the idea lots of wikipedians and there was also no protest. Wikipedia want's the cooperation with OpenStreetMap and doesn't reclaim "database protection". Greetings Kolossos [1]http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/legal-talk/2011-April/005907.html Am 28.10.2012 14:08, schrieb Fabien SK: Hi, Some times ago, I used also used data from Wikipedia to complete the names of Japanese cities. But someone pointed out that it is not allowed because: - the Openstreetmap and Wikipedia licenses are not compatible - even if the names cannot be copyrighted, there is in the European Union a "database directive" that protects the databases (=the result of collecting data; even if it contains only well-known data) in a similar way that the copyright. In the US and in Australia, it would be allowed. So I gave up on that idea and rolled-back my modifications. I limited my modifications to the addition of the wikipedia tag to the japanese train stations (in progress; discussion in the OSM-tagging and japanese mailing lists). I used offline dumps of OSM and Wikipedia, OSMembrane, python scripts and JOSM to do that. Fabien ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Translating the world
Am 27.10.2012 17:10, schrieb Stephan Knauss: Hello Tim, On 25.10.2012 22:27, Kolossos wrote: > Other important thing would be to translate large cities or isles. > Any comments and ideas? You should certainly get in contact with the local community before doing any sort of mass import of names in a language you don't understand. For example last time your Vietnamese names had not been that satisfactory. Did you read my answer in german Mailinglist and the link to further discussion? *http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User_talk:Kolossos#Re:_CLDR_is_an_unreliable.2C_inconsistent_source_for_Vietnamese_names It was not so negative. How about providing an easy to proof-read extract for the local communities before doing the actual import? And maybe also double-checking that the admin boundaries of 3166-2 you're going to use are accurate. My vague idea to do this is to create a table in the wiki. Stephan ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Translating the world
Hello, in the last two weeks I translated all countries in all languages that are available in the unicode-Project CLDR[1]. For this I used Overpass-API link for country codes ISO3166-1[2]. In the second step I translated all capitals in tons of languages by using InterWikiLinks of Wikipedia and Addtags[3] together with Overpass-API[4] and Nominatim. You can check the results for zoom levels 0-6 with map on Wikimedia-toolserver[5], by changing languages under "options" (You can use up- and down-key). I hope I didn't make more mistakes than native speaker would do by hand. These things were a small step to support multilingual-maps[6] on low zoom levels. For the next steps more people are necessary. In my eyes it seems useful to work as next step on the regions that are regulated in ISO3166-2, but we have no clean tagging schema for this. A source for translation could by a debian project[7], but I need to clarify the legal aspects. Other important thing would be to translate large cities or isles. Any comments and ideas? Greetings Tim alias Kolossos [1]http://cldr.unicode.org/ [2]http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/country_code_iso3166_1_alpha_2 [3]http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/RemoteControl/Add-tags [4]http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/capital=yes [5] http://toolserver.org/~kolossos/openlayers/kml-on-ol-json3.php?lang=en&zoom=3&lat=50.51632&lon=5.85569&layers=0BTFFF [6]http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_maps_Wikipedia_project [7]http://pkg-isocodes.alioth.debian.org/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Huge Berlin map - OSM?
They are paiting the airports Tempelhof and Tengel, so they don't use the map from 1851. But I also found no indications that they take OSM. Greetings Kolossos Am 05.08.2012 21:20, schrieb Mike Dupont: "A map of Berlin from an atlas published in 1851. Image via pio3 /Shutterstock" Looks like out of copyright mike On Sun, Aug 5, 2012 at 7:16 PM, Martijn van Exel wrote: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/arts-and-lifestyle/2012/08/happy-birthday-berlin-heres-giant-map/2830/ I'm wondering: is it based off of OSM data? If so, attribution? Image of the week? Can it be reproduced elsewhere? -- martijn van exel http://oegeo.wordpress.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] WIWOSM is now activated at all Wikipedia languages
It works now in pl.wp. Greetings Kolossos Am 18.07.2012 04:51, schrieb Kolossos: The problem is that the map application get not the article name from MediaWiki. See, my request here: http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyskusja_pomocy:OpenStreetMap#transfer_the_article_title_to_the_map For this job we need an admin. The easiest way to handle the title is to follow http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilfe:OpenStreetMap/en#Installation and using code from Meta, this cleanup your lokal js-code and keep you up-to-date. Greetings Kolossos Am 17.07.2012 21:18, schrieb Jacek Konieczny: On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 07:04:35PM +0200, Kolossos wrote: I activate now WIWOSM[1] on all language versions of Wikipedia that support the OSM-Gadget[2]. Great News! So, it should now work on the Polish Wikipedia? It doesn't fully work now, there is no city outline on the map at http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gliwice while the boundary is properly displayed at http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gliwice Is there something missing? Greets, Jacek ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] WIWOSM is now activated at all Wikipedia languages
The problem is that the map application get not the article name from MediaWiki. See, my request here: http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyskusja_pomocy:OpenStreetMap#transfer_the_article_title_to_the_map For this job we need an admin. The easiest way to handle the title is to follow http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilfe:OpenStreetMap/en#Installation and using code from Meta, this cleanup your lokal js-code and keep you up-to-date. Greetings Kolossos Am 17.07.2012 21:18, schrieb Jacek Konieczny: On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 07:04:35PM +0200, Kolossos wrote: I activate now WIWOSM[1] on all language versions of Wikipedia that support the OSM-Gadget[2]. Great News! So, it should now work on the Polish Wikipedia? It doesn't fully work now, there is no city outline on the map at http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gliwice while the boundary is properly displayed at http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gliwice Is there something missing? Greets, Jacek ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] WIWOSM is now activated at all Wikipedia languages
I activate now WIWOSM[1] on all language versions of Wikipedia that support the OSM-Gadget[2]. But it's still beta-status because it's not running on IE (we work on that.). WIWOSM is a project to highlighting objects that are described in the article by using the Wikipedia-Tag inside OSM. It would be nice we you can help to make the Wikipedia-Tags more popular. We have in the moment 168.000 Wikipedia-tags[3] in OSM but nearly 2 Mio. coordinates in Wikipedia, so there is a lot of work to do. Important is that the Wikipedia-Tag contains the language and the article. Later we can use this connection of both projects also for other features. To connect both projects we create two tools: *Wikipedia-Plugin in JOSM *http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/RemoteControl/Add-tags Greetings Kolossos [1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WIWOSM [2] http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilfe:OpenStreetMap/en [3] http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/wikipedia ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Announcement: "Add-tags" a tool to connect OpenStreetMap & Wikipedia
Ok, I modify the script to: "wikipedia=lang:*". I my mind had flexibility a higher priority but now it seem better to use "wikipedia:lang=" only as fallback if it doesn't work over InterWikiLinks. Tim alias Kolossos Am 09.04.2011 15:58, schrieb Tobias Knerr: Kolossos wrote: there is a new tool to bring more Wikipedia-Tags inside OSM-database and connect so both projects more and more. It can be found here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/RemoteControl/Add-tags A tagging style issue: What's the reason for using the wikipedia:lang=* form, rather than the wikipedia=lang:* form? I was under the impression that using a single link with the wikipedia key as the primary (and usually only) wikipedia link and relying on Wikipedia's interlanguage links for other languages was a somewhat accepted tagging style. Using wikipedia:lang=* is only a good idea in addition to wikipedia=lang:*, and only in those cases where interlanguage links cannot work (e.g. when one of the Wikipedia versions uses a collective article for several objects). But if I understand your tool correctly, the individual objects in these these cases wouldn't be listed anyway, so there's really no reason for it to suggest wikipedia:lang=* tags. Tobias Knerr ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Announcement: "Add-tags" a tool to connect OpenStreetMap & Wikipedia
Hello, there is a new tool to bring more Wikipedia-Tags inside OSM-database and connect so both projects more and more. It can be found here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/RemoteControl/Add-tags It's the idea to use later this connections to highlight the matching OSM objects in the map that we use in Wikipedia. It brings also the information that was collected collected in Wikipedia like Interwikilinks into OSM to render better multilingual-maps. Greetings Kolossos ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
