Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
Hi all,
I'm new'ish to OSM and have been mapping the largely unmapped area around me.
We've got lots of undefined (in the OSM sense) National Parks nearby and was
wondering if there'd been any progress on getting park boundary data. Note
yahoo imagery around me is of low quality so difficult to do any accurate
tracing.
Ta, jeffp_oz
[talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundariesLiz edodd at billiau.net
Wed Dec 17 10:58:04 GMT 2008
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On Wed, 17 Dec 2008, Matt White wrote:
> How are people mapping National Park (or state forest or other
> government mandated areas)? It seems that in a lot of cases, there is no
> way of actually doing an on the ground survey - a lot of the boundaries
> aren't marked, the areas can be massively inaccessible etc.
>
> Add to that things like marine park boundaries, or no fishing areas
> which are often defined on marine maps as just a set of GPS locations
> (and there is obviously no way of physically mapping those areas), and
> it seems there are a lot of things that we have to rely on getting the
> data from other sources for.(I include marine park/no fishing areas as
> my partners father asked about it - I see no good reason why such
> features couldn't be added to OSM)
>
> Question is: is it legit to use park/forest boundaries taken from
> government sources? If not, how on earth are we going to solve this
> little problem?
>
> Matt
>
My significant other is trying to obtain national park data as defined lat and
long co-ordinates.
I think that putting points in on co-ordinates which are defined does not
infringe anyone's copyright.___
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Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
A friend of mine found this: http://www.naturemaps.sa.gov.au/output/NatureDownload_leela2614832.zip ERSI shapefiles for the nat parks in SA. So "somebody" should approach some government department of unknown name about getting that under CC-BY-SA (or public domain.) I converted it to kml and had a look in google earth (I don't have any applications to look at shapefiles) and it's quite interesting to look at from the perspective of "useless land that nobody could farm on and so the government ended up with it." ~Cameron ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
Hugh Barnes wrote: > On Thu, 18 Dec 2008 19:41:59 +1100 > Matt White wrote: > > >>> >>> >> I have a sneaking suspicion that National Parks and State Forests are >> defined by acts of Parliament at the federal and state levels >> respectively, so the co-ord are probably in Hansard somewhere... >> >> > > Well, Hansard is just the transcriptions of parliament. I guess you > mean the legislation. And you'd be right, but … > > Too true. Guilty of emailing when pissed, your honour... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
On Thu, 18 Dec 2008 19:41:59 +1100 Matt White wrote: > > > I have a sneaking suspicion that National Parks and State Forests are > defined by acts of Parliament at the federal and state levels > respectively, so the co-ord are probably in Hansard somewhere... > Well, Hansard is just the transcriptions of parliament. I guess you mean the legislation. And you'd be right, but … We spoke about this at the 2nd Brisbane Mapping party. Apparently it's not as unambiguously phrased as you might hope. Perhaps someone else can fill in the details there. Here are the legislations listed: http://www.naa.gov.au/records-management/create-capture-describe/describe/agls/encoding-scheme-jurisdiction.aspx#section2 Cheers ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
Liz wrote: > On Wed, 17 Dec 2008, Matt White wrote: > >> How are people mapping National Park (or state forest or other >> government mandated areas)? It seems that in a lot of cases, there is no >> way of actually doing an on the ground survey - a lot of the boundaries >> aren't marked, the areas can be massively inaccessible etc. >> >> Question is: is it legit to use park/forest boundaries taken from >> government sources? If not, how on earth are we going to solve this >> little problem? >> >> Matt >> >> > My significant other is trying to obtain national park data as defined lat > and > long co-ordinates. > I think that putting points in on co-ordinates which are defined does not > infringe anyone's copyright. > > I have a sneaking suspicion that National Parks and State Forests are defined by acts of Parliament at the federal and state levels respectively, so the co-ord are probably in Hansard somewhere... Matt ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008, Matt White wrote: > How are people mapping National Park (or state forest or other > government mandated areas)? It seems that in a lot of cases, there is no > way of actually doing an on the ground survey - a lot of the boundaries > aren't marked, the areas can be massively inaccessible etc. > > Add to that things like marine park boundaries, or no fishing areas > which are often defined on marine maps as just a set of GPS locations > (and there is obviously no way of physically mapping those areas), and > it seems there are a lot of things that we have to rely on getting the > data from other sources for.(I include marine park/no fishing areas as > my partners father asked about it - I see no good reason why such > features couldn't be added to OSM) > > Question is: is it legit to use park/forest boundaries taken from > government sources? If not, how on earth are we going to solve this > little problem? > > Matt > My significant other is trying to obtain national park data as defined lat and long co-ordinates. I think that putting points in on co-ordinates which are defined does not infringe anyone's copyright. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
b.schulz...@scu.edu.au wrote: > As it stands this hasn't really been addressed. Generally I just mark > what's on the ground, ie the natural=wood boundary as this tends to > give a reasonable indication of the national park boundary anyway. > Obviously this has limits, but unless some government authority grants > us use of their maps there's nothing we can really do about it. > > It's worth noting that I don't believe that anyone's actually tried > approaching a government body about it. > > As for marine boundaries go, why isn't a set of GPS co-ordinates > sufficient to map out various zones? Unless there's some form of > copyright on the location of the zone itself it should be ok just to > draw onto the map purely based on these numbers. > I guess the issue is similar to using street names off a government provided source - we would have to copy "factual" information, rather than get out on the ground. I've found a few goverment agencies that provide the polygons of national parks etc, but they seem to want to charge for it An example - Marine park list from DSE: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.parkweb.vic.gov.au%2Fresources%2F17_1990.pdf&ei=r-FISbr6FKWsswK39MHyDQ&usg=AFQjCNEVG5JGEpjq8PJHhy4WjcDiUBi9Cg&sig2=qzkD4ifwSoyvytO9n3P_sw On a similar note, does anyone have polygons of the Oz states. Would like them to use to extract the OSM data for the garmin map creation prcoess, rather than the oversized square approach I'm using at the moment. Matt ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
As it stands this hasn't really been addressed. Generally I just mark what's on the ground, ie the natural=wood boundary as this tends to give a reasonable indication of the national park boundary anyway. Obviously this has limits, but unless some government authority grants us use of their maps there's nothing we can really do about it. It's worth noting that I don't believe that anyone's actually tried approaching a government body about it. As for marine boundaries go, why isn't a set of GPS co-ordinates sufficient to map out various zones? Unless there's some form of copyright on the location of the zone itself it should be ok just to draw onto the map purely based on these numbers. If you want to get a bit more adventurous it's probably possible to programme in the set of co-ordinates as a GPS route then hop in a boat and trace the lines out in real life, but I don't see why this would really be required. Brent. - Original Message - From: Matt White Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 9:37 pm Subject: [talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries To: OSM Australian Talk List > How are people mapping National Park (or state forest or other > government mandated areas)? It seems that in a lot of cases, > there is no > way of actually doing an on the ground survey - a lot of the > boundaries > aren't marked, the areas can be massively inaccessible etc. > > Add to that things like marine park boundaries, or no fishing > areas > which are often defined on marine maps as just a set of GPS > locations > (and there is obviously no way of physically mapping those > areas), and > it seems there are a lot of things that we have to rely on > getting the > data from other sources for.(I include marine park/no fishing > areas as > my partners father asked about it - I see no good reason why > such > features couldn't be added to OSM) > > Question is: is it legit to use park/forest boundaries taken > from > government sources? If not, how on earth are we going to solve > this > little problem? > > Matt > > ___ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] National Park & Marine Park boundaries
How are people mapping National Park (or state forest or other government mandated areas)? It seems that in a lot of cases, there is no way of actually doing an on the ground survey - a lot of the boundaries aren't marked, the areas can be massively inaccessible etc. Add to that things like marine park boundaries, or no fishing areas which are often defined on marine maps as just a set of GPS locations (and there is obviously no way of physically mapping those areas), and it seems there are a lot of things that we have to rely on getting the data from other sources for.(I include marine park/no fishing areas as my partners father asked about it - I see no good reason why such features couldn't be added to OSM) Question is: is it legit to use park/forest boundaries taken from government sources? If not, how on earth are we going to solve this little problem? Matt ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
