Re: [Accessibility-ia2] Plea for a new function

[Alexander Surkov]

Hi, Pete.

Options were discussed:
1) make text leaf accessible implement IAccessibleText (I didn't like
it, see 
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2012-November/001731.html)
2) make text leaf accessible implement IAccessibleHyperLink (I didn't
like it, see 
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2012-November/001731.html)
3) add a new method DescendantOffset(IAccessible* acc, long* offset)
like Brett suggested (see
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2012-November/001729.html).
I don't mind. It's easy to implement.
4) do nothing (Jamie mentioned that pure
IAccessibleText/HyperLink/HyperText should work also as alternative
approach to the approach described by Brett, but here we probably run
into restrictions of proprietary softwares).

Thank you.
Alex.


On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 2:31 AM, Pete Brunet  wrote:
> To all,
>
> Please review the thread Brett started at:
> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2012-November/001729.html
>
> to see if any further progress can be made on this issue.
>
>
> On 2/5/13 8:46 AM, Brett Lewis wrote:
>
> Hi,
> I wish we could get it in but it definitely sounded like there was no
> consensus on the issue, so let's let it go.
> Thanks,
> Brett
>
>
> 
> From: Pete Brunet [mailto:p...@a11ysoft.com]
> Sent: Monday, February 04, 2013 7:02 PM
> To: Brett Lewis
> Cc: IAccessible2 mailing list
> Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] Plea for a new function
>
> Hi Brett, Is this still an issue for you?  We're very near the end of
> discussions for IA2 1.3 and wanted to see if more discussion is needed on
> this issue.  -Pete
>
> On 11/26/12 7:03 PM, James Teh wrote:
>
> On 27/11/2012 8:02 AM, Brett Lewis wrote:
>
> I am getting the Iaccessible tree.  I then find that I want the text
> attributes for one of my leaf nodes and find that I have to go back up the
> Iaccessible tree to find the nearest Iaccessible node that allow QI to
> IAccessibleText and then trying to figure out how to map the result back
> down to my Iaccessible leaf node.
>
> If you can, for Mozilla, it's best to ignore leaf nodes altogether; i.e.
> pretend they don't exist. That way, you're only dealing with nodes that
> support IAccessibleText. However, there may well be a good reason you can't
> do this.
>
> Jamie
>
>
> --
> Pete Brunet
>
> a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
> (512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
> Skype: pete.brunet
> IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
> http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
> Ionosphere: WS4G
>
>
> --
> Pete Brunet
>
> a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
> (512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
> Skype: pete.brunet
> IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
> http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
> Ionosphere: WS4G
>
> ___
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> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2
>
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Re: [Accessibility-ia2] Plea for a new function

[Pete Brunet]

To all,

Please review the thread Brett started at:
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2012-November/001729.html

to see if any further progress can be made on this issue.

On 2/5/13 8:46 AM, Brett Lewis wrote:
> Hi,
> I wish we could get it in but it definitely sounded like there was no
> consensus on the issue, so let's let it go.
> Thanks,
> Brett
>  
>
> 
> *From:* Pete Brunet [mailto:p...@a11ysoft.com]
> *Sent:* Monday, February 04, 2013 7:02 PM
> *To:* Brett Lewis
> *Cc:* IAccessible2 mailing list
> *Subject:* Re: [Accessibility-ia2] Plea for a new function
>
> Hi Brett, Is this still an issue for you?  We're very near the end of
> discussions for IA2 1.3 and wanted to see if more discussion is needed
> on this issue.  -Pete
>
> On 11/26/12 7:03 PM, James Teh wrote:
>> On 27/11/2012 8:02 AM, Brett Lewis wrote:
>>> I am getting the Iaccessible tree.  I then find that I want the text
>>> attributes for one of my leaf nodes and find that I have to go back
>>> up the Iaccessible tree to find the nearest Iaccessible node that
>>> allow QI to IAccessibleText and then trying to figure out how to map
>>> the result back down to my Iaccessible leaf node.
>> If you can, for Mozilla, it's best to ignore leaf nodes altogether;
>> i.e. pretend they don't exist. That way, you're only dealing with
>> nodes that support IAccessibleText. However, there may well be a good
>> reason you can't do this.
>>
>> Jamie
>>
>
> -- 
> *Pete Brunet*
> 
> a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
> (512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
> Skype: pete.brunet
> IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
> http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
> Ionosphere: WS4G

-- 
*Pete Brunet*

a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
(512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
Skype: pete.brunet
IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
Ionosphere: WS4G
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[Accessibility-ia2] clipboard

[Pete Brunet]

Here is a summary of the prior discussion on clipboard functionality:

Malte 6/27/11 - IAEditableText2
- re start/end offsets see thread from Oct 2010 starting at
 
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2010-October/001223.html
- re mime types
  1) apps will choose which format they prefer when multiple formats are
available.
 I couldn't find any suggested solution for this
 AT shouldn't guess what format would be best
 spec should allow the string to be empty,
 which means that it's up to the app to choose the preferred format.
  2) when AT provides a mime type, but app doesn't support it, what
should happen?
 Should the app choose format, or ignore the call?
 If the later, how does AT know?
  3) It's not always text
 If in OOo Writer, and clipboard has OOo Calc stuff.
 A default paste will not paste an HTML table, but an OLE object.
 But the method is called pasteText, not pasteSpecial.
 app will not always choose some text format.
 prefer pasteSpecial over pasteText
  4) What about simply using a bool parameter?
- not convinced that AT want's to deal with mime types
  user normally simply wants to do paste-without-format vs.
paste-with-format
  If he really is interested in selecting a certain format, he can use a
dialog
- I guess most AT will only use 2 different strings:
  Empty string (assuming that means formatted+default), and "plain/text".
  With a bool, you don't have the issue described in 2)
  TRUE simply means to prefer formatted text if available/possible,
  otherwise fall back to unformatted text.

Carolyn 6/27 - IAEditableText2::pasteText
1) we need a mapping from mime type to platform-specific clipboard format
2) we need to allow all mime types but the name pasteText is wrong
3) What if mime type is empty string or NULL?
   What if mime type is unsupported? return E_INVALIDARG and paste nothing?
4) In MS Word clipboard commands operate on all selections,
   but insert (typing) only operates on the selection that contains the
caret.
   Perhaps pasteText should simply be specified to always operate on the
selection
   And if that is the case, remove the parameters from copyText and cutText

Carolyn 6/27 - IAEditableText2
- Why not just use dialog?
- Why have offsets (other than for copy for case of no selection)?
  Notes:
  cut/copy - no parms, just use selection
  paste - no parms, if there is a selection use it, otherwise use caret

Malte 6/28 - IAEditableText
- clipboard API is incomplete; no API for copy/paste on a drawing
document or a bitmap editor.

Pete 6/28 - IAEditableText
- Do any ATs use it?
  Notes (responses to this query):
  - JAWS and NVDA do not
  - Arnstein uses insertText, deleteText, and replaceText
  - GOK uses AccessibleAction and AccessibleRelation (and also the
setter in AccessibleValue).
- Why not use GUI?  Same question for IAAction.  Assume it's for
mobility impaired

Jamie 6/28 (off list) - IAEditableText, vs GUI, vs IAAction
- Use case: Sometimes, a user needs to access a control which isn't
keyboard focusable
  e.g. a control on a toolbar that isn't normally used by keyboard users
  In these cases, the user will use the screen reader's review
functionality to get to that object
  but then might want to perform actions on that object.
- copy, cut, paste, etc. should actually be implemented on the object
using IAAction,
  rather than having a separate IAccessibleEditableText.
  This would use the current selection within the object as is normally
the case.
- introduce a way to activate predefined action constants,
  rather than having to iterate through all actions and check their names.

Carolyn 6/29 - IAEditableText vs IAAction and IAEditableText
- could be useful for speech recognition systems.
- clipboard operations don't belong on IAccessibleEditableText.
  Having them on IAccessibleAction makes more sense
  clipboard operations are not just for text objects.
- these actions do merit some kind of quick access mechanism
  either they can have their own method names or predefined action
constants.
- They can operate on the current selection, removing the need for
offset parameters,
  and allowing multi-selection-capable apps to define their own
semantics for clipboard "actions".
- paste and pasteSpecial are boolean in nature, so they can be 2 actions.
  The clipboard format for pasteSpecial can (I think?) be handled on the
app side,
  i.e. ask the user whether they want to paste html or rtf or plain
text, etc

Thread "clipboard operations" starting 7/22/11
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-July/001495.html

Decision 2/9/12
- deprecate IAEditableText::cut/copy/pasteText
  add note that these functions are available via the app's GUI
- don't yet add 5 new actions for cut, copy, pasteDefault,
pasteFormatted, pasteUnformatted
  these can be added in the future if needed
- No negative responses received

Note that the decision to not add the new actions at this time i

Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 1.3 ready for review

[Pete Brunet]

On 2/5/13 8:31 AM, Brian Cragun wrote:
> In those threads, I had asked for "a way for IA2 Paste Text to provide
> both a Start and an
> End Offset parameter. Also to provide an Attributes parameter.
> Copy-with-parameters should be implemented as an additional method in
> IAccessibleText."
>
> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-June/001336.html
>
>
> This was from Carolyn McLeod who needed it in Eclipse for cut and paste.
Hi Brian, On 27 June 2011 in this post
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-June/001408.html
Carolyn said, "What I am getting at by all of this is that maybe
pasteText should not have any offset parameters at all, because
startOffset and endOffset are inadequate to define multiple selections).
Perhaps pasteText should simply be specified to always operate on the
selection, whatever that may be. "
>
> Brian Cragun
> IBM Master Inventor
> IBM AbilityLab Consultant
> Human Ability & Accessibility Center_
> __www.ibm.com/able_ & _w3.ibm.com/able_
> 
> W:(720)-663-2801 H:(507)288-2437
>
> */Subscribe to RSS feed and contribute to/**/Accessibility News
> community/*
> */on
> Connections/*
> _IBM Accessibility_ on
> Facebook ▼_IBMAccess_ on Twitter ▼_IBM
> Accessibility_ on LinkedIn
>
>
>
>
> From: Pete Brunet 
> To: Richard Schwerdtfeger/Austin/IBM@IBMUS,
> Cc: IAccessible2 mailing list
> 
> Date: 02/04/2013 11:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 1.3 ready for review
> Sent by: accessibility-ia2-boun...@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> 
>
>
>
>
> On 2/4/13 5:20 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> Partially.
>
> So, cut, copy copy selected text to the clipboard. The details are
> handled by the rouser. Paste pasts to selected text or the insertion
> point (collapsed selection). What is the concern about clipboard
> functionality?
> I'll have to dig through a month's worth of discussion on the list
> back in June 2011. I'll try to get to that at some point during the
> week. If you have time to look at it sooner look through the thread
> with subject, "next changes to IAccessible2" here:_
> __http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-June/thread.html_
>
>
> Rich
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 4, 2013, at 10:18 PM, "Pete Brunet" <_pete@a11ysoft.com_
> > wrote:
>
>
> On 2/4/13 4:56 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> Did you check with Nuance? What appends if replacetext is removed?
> If you have a contact at Nuance please ask them to join the list.
>
> Only the clipboard methods are deprecated, which bascially means don't
> use the cut/copy/paste methods until the IA2 spec can be changed to
> support the varying implementations and ambiguities of clipboard
> functionality. The rest of the methods are not deprecated, i.e.
> deleteText, insertText, replaceText, and setAttributes. Does that
> clarification help at all?
>
> Even if Nuance has not implemented it for say FF has someone
> approached them? We can' t just be supporting vision impairments.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 4, 2013, at 9:35 PM, "Pete Brunet" <_pete@a11ysoft.com_
> > wrote:
>
> Hi Rich, At this point, since we couldn't find consensus and since
> this release was supposed to done last Fall and since I was informed
> that noone has implemented or shown a need for the three clipboard
> operations, I'm inclined to not hold up the release any further and
> handle this in a follow-on release if a project comes along that needs
> clipboard functionality and provides resource to drive the spec toward
> a well thought out definition of the clipboard methods.
>
> Pete
>
> On 2/4/13 8:51 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> Hi Pete,
>
> The reason for the editing functions was to allow a voice reco
> solution to select text, edit it, and perform clipboard operations for
> the mobility impaired. It is additional work to have a voice reco
> solution have to go through the additional work of doing the
> additional keyboard simulations for doing that function.
>
> So, these are single actions. AccessibleEditableText also allows you
> to replace text, and set attributes, which takes offsets and
> replacement text/attributes. Accessible actions are single action
> functions that don't take parameters. ReplaceText is not the same as
> pasting from the clipboard. It is really nice to have all the features
> in the same interface. Note: One could bind the single command
> functions (cut, copy, paste) to the same actions in accessible actions.
>
> The other problem you have with actions is where do you apply it. Do
> you know to apply it only to the document. If E

Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 1.3 ready for review

[Pete Brunet]

On 2/4/13 11:13 PM, Pete Brunet wrote:
>
> On 2/4/13 5:20 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
>> Partially.
>>
>> So, cut, copy copy selected text to the clipboard. The details are
>> handled by the rouser. Paste pasts to selected text or the insertion
>> point (collapsed selection). What is the concern about clipboard
>> functionality?
> I'll have to dig through a month's worth of discussion on the list
> back in June 2011.  I'll try to get to that at some point during the
> week.  If you have time to look at it sooner look through the thread
> with subject, "next changes to IAccessible2" here:
> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-June/thread.html
There are a lot of topics in that thread and I'll try to separate out
and summarize the clipboard discussion later, but there is also a
following discussion which starts here:
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-July/001495.html
and one more post here:
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2012-February/001561.html
>>
>> Rich
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Feb 4, 2013, at 10:18 PM, "Pete Brunet" > > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On 2/4/13 4:56 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
 Did you check with Nuance? What appends if replacetext is removed?
>>> If you have a contact at Nuance please ask them to join the list.
>>>
>>> Only the clipboard methods are deprecated, which bascially means
>>> don't use the cut/copy/paste methods until the IA2 spec can be
>>> changed to support the varying implementations and ambiguities of
>>> clipboard functionality.  The rest of the methods are not
>>> deprecated, i.e. deleteText, insertText, replaceText, and
>>> setAttributes.  Does that clarification help at all?

 Even if Nuance has not implemented it for say FF has someone
 approached them? We can' t just  be supporting vision impairments.

 Sent from my iPad

 On Feb 4, 2013, at 9:35 PM, "Pete Brunet" >>> > wrote:

> Hi Rich, At this point, since we couldn't find consensus and since
> this release was supposed to done last Fall and since I was
> informed that noone has implemented or shown a need for the three
> clipboard operations, I'm inclined to not hold up the release any
> further and handle this in a follow-on release if a project comes
> along that needs clipboard functionality and provides resource to
> drive the spec toward a well thought out definition of the
> clipboard methods.
>
> Pete
>
> On 2/4/13 8:51 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
>> Hi Pete,
>>
>> The reason for the editing functions was to allow a voice reco
>> solution to select text, edit it, and perform clipboard
>> operations for the mobility impaired. It is additional work to
>> have a voice reco solution have to go through the additional work
>> of doing the additional keyboard simulations for doing that
>> function.
>>
>> So, these are single actions. AccessibleEditableText also allows
>> you to replace text, and set attributes, which takes offsets and
>> replacement text/attributes. Accessible actions are single action
>> functions that don't take parameters. ReplaceText is not the same
>> as pasting from the clipboard. It is really nice to have all the
>> features in the same interface. Note: One could bind the single
>> command functions (cut, copy, paste) to the same actions in
>> accessible actions.
>>
>> The other problem you have with actions is where do you apply it.
>> Do you know to apply it only to the document. If Editable text is
>> applied to text content within the document then you should now
>> where to find the interface.
>>
>> Rich
>>
>>
>> Rich Schwerdtfeger
>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> *Pete Brunet*
>>> 
>>> a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
>>> (512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
>>> Skype: pete.brunet
>>> IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
>>> http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
>>> Ionosphere: WS4G
>
> -- 
> *Pete Brunet*
> 
> a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
> (512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
> Skype: pete.brunet
> IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
> http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
> Ionosphere: WS4G
>
>
> ___
> Accessibility-ia2 mailing list
> Accessibility-ia2@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2

-- 
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a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
(512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
Skype: pete.brunet
IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
http://

Re: [Accessibility-ia2] Plea for a new function

[Brett Lewis]

Hi,
I wish we could get it in but it definitely sounded like there was no consensus 
on the issue, so let's let it go.
Thanks,
Brett



From: Pete Brunet [mailto:p...@a11ysoft.com]
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2013 7:02 PM
To: Brett Lewis
Cc: IAccessible2 mailing list
Subject: Re: [Accessibility-ia2] Plea for a new function

Hi Brett, Is this still an issue for you?  We're very near the end of 
discussions for IA2 1.3 and wanted to see if more discussion is needed on this 
issue.  -Pete

On 11/26/12 7:03 PM, James Teh wrote:
On 27/11/2012 8:02 AM, Brett Lewis wrote:
I am getting the Iaccessible tree.  I then find that I want the text attributes 
for one of my leaf nodes and find that I have to go back up the Iaccessible 
tree to find the nearest Iaccessible node that allow QI to IAccessibleText and 
then trying to figure out how to map the result back down to my Iaccessible 
leaf node.
If you can, for Mozilla, it's best to ignore leaf nodes altogether; i.e. 
pretend they don't exist. That way, you're only dealing with nodes that support 
IAccessibleText. However, there may well be a good reason you can't do this.

Jamie


--
Pete Brunet

a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
(512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
Skype: pete.brunet
IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
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Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 1.3 ready for review

[Brian Cragun]

In those threads, I had asked for "a way for IA2 Paste Text to provide 
both a Start and an 
End Offset parameter.  Also to provide an Attributes parameter.
Copy-with-parameters should be implemented as an additional method in 
IAccessibleText."

http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-June/001336.html

This was from Carolyn McLeod who needed it in Eclipse for cut and paste.

Brian Cragun
IBM Master Inventor
IBM AbilityLab Consultant
Human Ability & Accessibility Center
www.ibm.com/able & w3.ibm.com/able
W:(720)-663-2801H:(507)288-2437

Subscribe to RSS feed and contribute toAccessibility News communityon 
Connections
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on LinkedIn




From:   Pete Brunet 
To: Richard Schwerdtfeger/Austin/IBM@IBMUS, 
Cc: IAccessible2 mailing list 

Date:   02/04/2013 11:14 PM
Subject:Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 1.3 ready for review
Sent by:accessibility-ia2-boun...@lists.linuxfoundation.org




On 2/4/13 5:20 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
Partially.

So, cut, copy copy selected text to the clipboard. The details are handled 
by the rouser. Paste pasts to selected text or the insertion point 
(collapsed selection). What is the concern about clipboard functionality?
I'll have to dig through a month's worth of discussion on the list back in 
June 2011.  I'll try to get to that at some point during the week.  If you 
have time to look at it sooner look through the thread with subject, "next 
changes to IAccessible2" here:
http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2011-June/thread.html

Rich

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 4, 2013, at 10:18 PM, "Pete Brunet"  wrote:


On 2/4/13 4:56 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
Did you check with Nuance? What appends if replacetext is removed? 
If you have a contact at Nuance please ask them to join the list.

Only the clipboard methods are deprecated, which bascially means don't use 
the cut/copy/paste methods until the IA2 spec can be changed to support 
the varying implementations and ambiguities of clipboard functionality.  
The rest of the methods are not deprecated, i.e. deleteText, insertText, 
replaceText, and setAttributes.  Does that clarification help at all?

Even if Nuance has not implemented it for say FF has someone approached 
them? We can' t just  be supporting vision impairments.

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 4, 2013, at 9:35 PM, "Pete Brunet"  wrote:

Hi Rich, At this point, since we couldn't find consensus and since this 
release was supposed to done last Fall and since I was informed that noone 
has implemented or shown a need for the three clipboard operations, I'm 
inclined to not hold up the release any further and handle this in a 
follow-on release if a project comes along that needs clipboard 
functionality and provides resource to drive the spec toward a well 
thought out definition of the clipboard methods.

Pete

On 2/4/13 8:51 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
Hi Pete,

The reason for the editing functions was to allow a voice reco solution to 
select text, edit it, and perform clipboard operations for the mobility 
impaired. It is additional work to have a voice reco solution have to go 
through the additional work of doing the additional keyboard simulations 
for doing that function. 

So, these are single actions. AccessibleEditableText also allows you to 
replace text, and set attributes, which takes offsets and replacement 
text/attributes. Accessible actions are single action functions that don't 
take parameters. ReplaceText is not the same as pasting from the 
clipboard. It is really nice to have all the features in the same 
interface. Note: One could bind the single command functions (cut, copy, 
paste) to the same actions in accessible actions.

The other problem you have with actions is where do you apply it. Do you 
know to apply it only to the document. If Editable text is applied to text 
content within the document then you should now where to find the 
interface. 

Rich


Rich Schwerdtfeger


-- 
Pete Brunet
 
a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
(512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
Skype: pete.brunet
IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
Ionosphere: WS4G 

-- 
Pete Brunet
 
a11ysoft - Accessibility Architecture and Development
(512) 467-4706 (work), (512) 689-4155 (cell)
Skype: pete.brunet
IM: ptbrunet (AOL, Google), ptbru...@live.com (MSN)
http://www.a11ysoft.com/about/
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