Re: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
She's talking about Exchange 2007. Go look at the ms Exchange blog site and you'll see some references. (http://msexchangeteam.com/default.aspx)The nice thing about it is that most everything that I saw that they were doing with a command line you could do with the GUI. The only difference is that you can script something in a command line, while building scripting for a GUI is a lot more of a pain and a lot less reliable. Here's a good reference link:http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/scripts/message/exch2007/default.mspx?mfr=true I think that has a list of most all of the commands that you can do in the exchange command line. Again though, while you *can* do a lot of the stuff in Exchange 2007 with scripts, I believe that you can do more (everything) in the GUI. A lot more. From one of the demos on the exchange team blog site, I believe that if you do something in the GUI, it will create a command in the CLI window and you can evaluate what it is and how it works. Looks really interesting to me and I'm about as far as you can get from a 'script kiddie'. On 7/15/06, Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Command line for Exchange.. .yuck?There isn't one to speak of now, although Monad had some fundamentalissues last I saw/heard as far as the utility of the commands in largeenvironments. Thanks,Brian Desmond[EMAIL PROTECTED]c - 312.731.3132 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:ActiveDir- [EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Susan Bradley, CPA aka Ebitz - SBS Rocks [MVP] Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 9:13 PM To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Download details: Introduction to the Exchange Management Shell: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=1dc0f61b-d30f- 44a2-882e-12ddd4ee09d2displaylang=en Command line for Exchange.. .yuck -- Letting your vendors set your risk analysis these days? http://www.threatcode.com If you are a SBSer and you don't subscribe to the SBS Blog... man ... I will hunt you down... http://blogs.technet.com/sbs List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspxList FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspxList archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx
RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
Yeah that doc is supposed to be about what they are doing with MONAD for Exchange. I, for one, based on some EHLO blog posts am concerned about its functionality and how it will work in large environments. I will try to download and read that doc to see if it has any meat in it but most Exchange docs tend to shy away from implementation details and you have to actually get the tools out and do things with it and watch closely what it does. My main concern so far based on what the Exchange team indicated was that this command line stuff is going to be just as fat as the GUI stuff in terms of traffic which will actually be felt in a worse way because with the GUI you tend to pick and choose what you want and command line you are usually trying to hit mass quantities. It sounds like if you say wanted one little piece of info for every mailbox, say mailbox last logon date or something you would have to pull back ALL info for the mailbox and then just display the little bit of info you want. That will be fine in small LAN environments with small numbers of users (say thousands or less) but in a large environments with tens or hundreds of thousands of users or millions of users or working across slow WAN links that is going to be lacking considerably. If you you thought WMI slow... Just wait! I hope it doesn't turn out that way but I don't have a lot of faith in MSFT's large scale management strategies and tools for the most part. Especially in the Exchange realm. I haven't seen a larger company yet (read company 100k users) that could actually use the MSFT Exchange management tools to do the needed work and even smaller companies tend to run pretty inefficiently using the tools. -- O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition - http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 11:05 PM To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Command line for Exchange.. .yuck ? There isn't one to speak of now, although Monad had some fundamental issues last I saw/heard as far as the utility of the commands in large environments. Thanks, Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] c - 312.731.3132 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:ActiveDir- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Susan Bradley, CPA aka Ebitz - SBS Rocks [MVP] Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 9:13 PM To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Download details: Introduction to the Exchange Management Shell: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=1dc0f61b-d30f- 44a2-882e-12ddd4ee09d2displaylang=en Command line for Exchange.. .yuck -- Letting your vendors set your risk analysis these days? http://www.threatcode.com If you are a SBSer and you don't subscribe to the SBS Blog... man ... I will hunt you down... http://blogs.technet.com/sbs List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx
RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
Actually, you've got that a bit backwards. The Exchange GUI for 2007 is built completely on Monad/PowersHell cmdlets. In more recent builds, the GUI displays the cmdlet it executes to help the admin (if he/she so chooses) to learn the scripting. I don't think those builds are generally available yet. The command line is much more powerful than the GUI. Much. I've not tested in large environments, I'm a mid-sized guy. But it worksquite wellin my lab mockups of my production environment on decrepit hardware. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt HargravesSent: Sunday, July 16, 2006 9:43 AMTo: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.orgSubject: Re: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange She's talking about Exchange 2007. Go look at the ms Exchange blog site and you'll see some references. (http://msexchangeteam.com/default.aspx)The nice thing about it is that most everything that I saw that they were doing with a command line you could do with the GUI. The only difference is that you can script something in a command line, while building scripting for a GUI is a lot more of a pain and a lot less reliable. Here's a good reference link:http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/scripts/message/exch2007/default.mspx?mfr=true I think that has a list of most all of the commands that you can do in the exchange command line. Again though, while you *can* do a lot of the stuff in Exchange 2007 with scripts, I believe that you can do more (everything) in the GUI. A lot more. From one of the demos on the exchange team blog site, I believe that if you do something in the GUI, it will create a command in the CLI window and you can evaluate what it is and how it works. Looks really interesting to me and I'm about as far as you can get from a 'script kiddie'. On 7/15/06, Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Command line for Exchange.. .yuck?There isn't one to speak of now, although Monad had some fundamentalissues last I saw/heard as far as the utility of the commands in largeenvironments.Thanks,Brian Desmond[EMAIL PROTECTED]c - 312.731.3132 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:ActiveDir- [EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Susan Bradley, CPA aka Ebitz - SBS Rocks [MVP] Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 9:13 PM To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Download details: Introduction to the Exchange Management Shell: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=1dc0f61b-d30f- 44a2-882e-12ddd4ee09d2displaylang=en Command line for Exchange.. .yuck
Re: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
I'll be really interested to know if the underlying protocol for talking to Exchange remotely is any different than webdav in the next release. I admit to not having looked at the Power Shell stuff for Exchange yet, so I have no idea. I kind of hate programming Exchange, so I tend to avoid it. If there is a different protocol, then there might be hope that non-Power Shell programmers will have a way in as well. There may also be an underlying provider that provides access to features than the default wrappers in PS. There is a chance that would be managed code though, so I'm sure that would be a big frown for you. :) I do think we'll see more and more of that kind of thing though (APIs written in managed code with no straight C bindings). As far as PS itself is concerned, I'm pretty excited about it. It is a very cool shell with a lot of interesting features. It is also pretty intensely geeky, so I think the learning curve is going to be pretty steep for a lot of people. Joe K. - Original Message - From: joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2006 8:44 AM Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Yeah that doc is supposed to be about what they are doing with MONAD for Exchange. I, for one, based on some EHLO blog posts am concerned about its functionality and how it will work in large environments. I will try to download and read that doc to see if it has any meat in it but most Exchange docs tend to shy away from implementation details and you have to actually get the tools out and do things with it and watch closely what it does. My main concern so far based on what the Exchange team indicated was that this command line stuff is going to be just as fat as the GUI stuff in terms of traffic which will actually be felt in a worse way because with the GUI you tend to pick and choose what you want and command line you are usually trying to hit mass quantities. It sounds like if you say wanted one little piece of info for every mailbox, say mailbox last logon date or something you would have to pull back ALL info for the mailbox and then just display the little bit of info you want. That will be fine in small LAN environments with small numbers of users (say thousands or less) but in a large environments with tens or hundreds of thousands of users or millions of users or working across slow WAN links that is going to be lacking considerably. If you you thought WMI slow... Just wait! I hope it doesn't turn out that way but I don't have a lot of faith in MSFT's large scale management strategies and tools for the most part. Especially in the Exchange realm. I haven't seen a larger company yet (read company 100k users) that could actually use the MSFT Exchange management tools to do the needed work and even smaller companies tend to run pretty inefficiently using the tools. -- O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition - http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx
RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
I've heard there's ASP.Net webservices that expose a lot of this stuff. Thanks, Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] c - 312.731.3132 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:ActiveDir- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Kaplan Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2006 2:57 PM To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange I'll be really interested to know if the underlying protocol for talking to Exchange remotely is any different than webdav in the next release. I admit to not having looked at the Power Shell stuff for Exchange yet, so I have no idea. I kind of hate programming Exchange, so I tend to avoid it. If there is a different protocol, then there might be hope that non- Power Shell programmers will have a way in as well. There may also be an underlying provider that provides access to features than the default wrappers in PS. There is a chance that would be managed code though, so I'm sure that would be a big frown for you. :) I do think we'll see more and more of that kind of thing though (APIs written in managed code with no straight C bindings). As far as PS itself is concerned, I'm pretty excited about it. It is a very cool shell with a lot of interesting features. It is also pretty intensely geeky, so I think the learning curve is going to be pretty steep for a lot of people. Joe K. - Original Message - From: joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2006 8:44 AM Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Yeah that doc is supposed to be about what they are doing with MONAD for Exchange. I, for one, based on some EHLO blog posts am concerned about its functionality and how it will work in large environments. I will try to download and read that doc to see if it has any meat in it but most Exchange docs tend to shy away from implementation details and you have to actually get the tools out and do things with it and watch closely what it does. My main concern so far based on what the Exchange team indicated was that this command line stuff is going to be just as fat as the GUI stuff in terms of traffic which will actually be felt in a worse way because with the GUI you tend to pick and choose what you want and command line you are usually trying to hit mass quantities. It sounds like if you say wanted one little piece of info for every mailbox, say mailbox last logon date or something you would have to pull back ALL info for the mailbox and then just display the little bit of info you want. That will be fine in small LAN environments with small numbers of users (say thousands or less) but in a large environments with tens or hundreds of thousands of users or millions of users or working across slow WAN links that is going to be lacking considerably. If you you thought WMI slow... Just wait! I hope it doesn't turn out that way but I don't have a lot of faith in MSFT's large scale management strategies and tools for the most part. Especially in the Exchange realm. I haven't seen a larger company yet (read company 100k users) that could actually use the MSFT Exchange management tools to do the needed work and even smaller companies tend to run pretty inefficiently using the tools. -- O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition - http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx
Re: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
The plot thickens. I'd assume that PS and ASP.NET are using the same network layer to do the actual heavy lifting, so the question is then, what is that based on? :) Joe K. - Original Message - From: Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2006 3:12 PM Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange I've heard there's ASP.Net webservices that expose a lot of this stuff. Thanks, Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] c - 312.731.3132 List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx
RE: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange
Command line for Exchange.. .yuck ? There isn't one to speak of now, although Monad had some fundamental issues last I saw/heard as far as the utility of the commands in large environments. Thanks, Brian Desmond [EMAIL PROTECTED] c - 312.731.3132 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:ActiveDir- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Susan Bradley, CPA aka Ebitz - SBS Rocks [MVP] Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 9:13 PM To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: [ActiveDir] OT: Command line for exchange Download details: Introduction to the Exchange Management Shell: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=1dc0f61b-d30f- 44a2-882e-12ddd4ee09d2displaylang=en Command line for Exchange.. .yuck -- Letting your vendors set your risk analysis these days? http://www.threatcode.com If you are a SBSer and you don't subscribe to the SBS Blog... man ... I will hunt you down... http://blogs.technet.com/sbs List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ: http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ml/threads.aspx
