Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
This is an issue with turn-key systems. If you buy an application from a vendor and plan to hold them responsible for the application's uptime/availability and data restoration, it is reasonable that the vendor can dictate the hardware/os used, the ability to run other software on the system and the backup methodology implemented. You end up with some systems being outside the TSM back-up environment but that is part of the price paid when you must have a critical, third party vendor application. You still have to perform due diligence such as a demonstration of restoration at the time of implementation. Milton -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tyree, David Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 12:29 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
We are currently using TSM in a hospital environment and we have found a way around the vendor claims of how to backup the servers. Vendors will not guarantee the data if they do not have control over the backup process, so we are able to get them to agree to doing the database dump from their application to a dedicated file system on the server. We then in turn will have TSM backup that file system. The responsibility, in a case of emergency will be split, where we will be responsible for restoring the data to that dedicated area then the vendor will be able to recover the application as needed. Mario McKell Sr. System Engineer PHNS (301) 315-3692 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6/21/2006 10:04 am This is an issue with turn-key systems. If you buy an application from a vendor and plan to hold them responsible for the application's uptime/availability and data restoration, it is reasonable that the vendor can dictate the hardware/os used, the ability to run other software on the system and the backup methodology implemented. You end up with some systems being outside the TSM back-up environment but that is part of the price paid when you must have a critical, third party vendor application. You still have to perform due diligence such as a demonstration of restoration at the time of implementation. Milton -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tyree, David Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 12:29 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. -
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
We do the same thing here, so I can second that. -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mario McKell Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 12:24 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment We are currently using TSM in a hospital environment and we have found a way around the vendor claims of how to backup the servers. Vendors will not guarantee the data if they do not have control over the backup process, so we are able to get them to agree to doing the database dump from their application to a dedicated file system on the server. We then in turn will have TSM backup that file system. The responsibility, in a case of emergency will be split, where we will be responsible for restoring the data to that dedicated area then the vendor will be able to recover the application as needed. Mario McKell Sr. System Engineer PHNS (301) 315-3692 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6/21/2006 10:04 am This is an issue with turn-key systems. If you buy an application from a vendor and plan to hold them responsible for the application's uptime/availability and data restoration, it is reasonable that the vendor can dictate the hardware/os used, the ability to run other software on the system and the backup methodology implemented. You end up with some systems being outside the TSM back-up environment but that is part of the price paid when you must have a critical, third party vendor application. You still have to perform due diligence such as a demonstration of restoration at the time of implementation. Milton -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tyree, David Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 12:29 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. - - Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email message is privileged and confidential information and intended only for the use of the individual or entity named in the address. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this information is strictly prohibited. If you received this information in error, please notify the sender and delete this information from your computer and retain no copies of any of this information.
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
We have the same problem here and in general do the same thing Mario suggested. In cases where the db has a supported tdp I sometimes back up the db using the tdp as well just to be safe. Cory L. Heikel Tivoli Systems Administrator Milton S. Hershey Medical Center (717) 531-7972 *E-Mail Confidentiality Notice* This message (including any attachments) contains information intended for a specific individual(s) and purpose that may be privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure pursuant to applicable law. Any inappropriate use, distribution or copying of the message is strictly prohibited and may subject you to criminal or civil penalty. If you have received this transmission in error, please reply to the sender indicating this error and delete the transmission from your system immediately. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6/21/2006 1:23:56 PM We are currently using TSM in a hospital environment and we have found a way around the vendor claims of how to backup the servers. Vendors will not guarantee the data if they do not have control over the backup process, so we are able to get them to agree to doing the database dump from their application to a dedicated file system on the server. We then in turn will have TSM backup that file system. The responsibility, in a case of emergency will be split, where we will be responsible for restoring the data to that dedicated area then the vendor will be able to recover the application as needed. Mario McKell Sr. System Engineer PHNS (301) 315-3692 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6/21/2006 10:04 am This is an issue with turn-key systems. If you buy an application from a vendor and plan to hold them responsible for the application's uptime/availability and data restoration, it is reasonable that the vendor can dictate the hardware/os used, the ability to run other software on the system and the backup methodology implemented. You end up with some systems being outside the TSM back-up environment but that is part of the price paid when you must have a critical, third party vendor application. You still have to perform due diligence such as a demonstration of restoration at the time of implementation. Milton -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tyree, David Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 12:29 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. -
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
We are in the process of installing the GE Centricity RIS/PACs system for our radiology department. At this point GE is telling our project manager that nothing can be installed on the servers. The guy on our side and GE has been going around and around on this but it looks like GE will have the final say on this. I suspect that someone on our side didn't completely read (and understand) the contract that was signed with them. -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Barnhart, Troy Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 1:51 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Been there done (and still doing) that... We have TSM and related products for our facilities. (We have standardized our database backups on BMC's SqlBackTrack.) We weigh the need of the app and usually strong-arm them back... If a vendor says that we can't touch their data, we DON'T touch their data. We put them on the hook for recovery. I think most healthcare-vendors are use to hospitals that simply write a check to the vendor for services. We are very hands-on with our own data... Usually, a vendor's South Dakota support resources are not too spectacular, and after a disaster or two, they come around to our way of thinking. Plus, Hospitals seem to have a bit different IT enviroment as shops in other industries. We have literally hundreds of applications from different vendors. We have different servers, facilities, operating systems, VENDOR's REQUIREMENTS, etc... Anything specific giving you problems? Regards, Troy Troy Barnhart, Sr. Systems Programmer, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Rapid City Regional Hospital, Rapid City, South Dakota, 57701 ph: 605-719-8068 / fax: 605-719-4206 -Original Message- From: Tyree, David [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 11:29 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
OT? TSM in a hospital environment
Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
Been there done (and still doing) that... We have TSM and related products for our facilities. (We have standardized our database backups on BMC's SqlBackTrack.) We weigh the need of the app and usually strong-arm them back... If a vendor says that we can't touch their data, we DON'T touch their data. We put them on the hook for recovery. I think most healthcare-vendors are use to hospitals that simply write a check to the vendor for services. We are very hands-on with our own data... Usually, a vendor's South Dakota support resources are not too spectacular, and after a disaster or two, they come around to our way of thinking. Plus, Hospitals seem to have a bit different IT enviroment as shops in other industries. We have literally hundreds of applications from different vendors. We have different servers, facilities, operating systems, VENDOR's REQUIREMENTS, etc... Anything specific giving you problems? Regards, Troy Troy Barnhart, Sr. Systems Programmer, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Rapid City Regional Hospital, Rapid City, South Dakota, 57701 ph: 605-719-8068 / fax: 605-719-4206 -Original Message- From: Tyree, David [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 11:29 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
Yea, it is typically the case, especially with the GE folks. My take on this is, if we pay,,,we say what goes. Bruce A. Tamulis, CNA Network Desktop Support Tech III 616-752-6573 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Start using HEAT Self Serve (HSS) Today! Just click on the link below. http://hss.trinity-health.org/ This message may contain confidential information protected by law through attorney-client privilege or professional peer review/quality evaluation privilege. It is intended only for the individual or entity named above. It is prohibited for anyone else to disclose, copy, distribute or use the contents of this message. If you received this message in error, please notify me immediately at the above number. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Monday, June 19, 2006 Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
Yep, we support 5 hospitals here. The only problems I have run into with Application vendors is that they sometimes request that I exclude key app components from backup, and back up a copy they generate instead. Also, in case of SQL, I'll set up TDP to back up the databases on a separate schedule if they do not fully support the databases. I've heard other complain of GE, and I wonder if they are concerned that they are losing potential customers to Phillips and others over that very issue. Let's not innovate or anything... :) But, yes, some vendors are very picky about what they will allow you to back up, and how you can back it up. We have had many that try to blame TSM for ills that end up being THEIR app, TSM client hardware, etc...I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir. Not surprisingly, we win all of those battles. :) -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tyree, David Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 12:29 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] OT? TSM in a hospital environment Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. thanks David Tyree Enterprise Backup Administrator South Georgia Medical Center 229.333.1155 text pager [EMAIL PROTECTED] Confidential Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. - Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email message is privileged and confidential information and intended only for the use of the individual or entity named in the address. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this information is strictly prohibited. If you received this information in error, please notify the sender and delete this information from your computer and retain no copies of any of this information.
Re: OT? TSM in a hospital environment
-David Tyree wrote: - Are there any folks on the list that are using TSM in a hospital? Sometimes we have to battle with some of our software venders to allow us to backup their system using TSM. Sometimes they will tell us that the system is FDA approved as is and must be backed up using a built-in tape drive and we can't touch the system. Some times that might be believable but not always. It seems that GE appears to be especially hard headed in this regard. We bought into TSM because you back up anything (well most anything) and not have to worry about having assorted different tape drives scattered everywhere. I would like to compare notes with other TSM people if possible. We have usually been able to get vendors to agree to letting us use TSM. In many cases, this entailed agreeing to a contract clause stating that we accepted responsibility for the risk of not being able to recover a system using TSM backups. There have been a few cases where we were not able to persuade vendors to give up their favorite backup metadology. In most of these cases a hospital department ended up signing a contract despite strong suggestions from the IS department to consider competing products. There have been one or two cases where we ended up with a compromise, such as daily TSM backups of an entire system and weekly backups of the C drive to local tape.
