Re: Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library
The only drawbacks being the need to upgrade the library managers to a level that will support TS1120, and the maintenance costs compared to a TS3500 et al. [RC] On Sep 11, 2007, at 1:56 PM, Strand, Neil B. wrote: John, If you are experienced with the 3494 library, they are working well and tape mount speed is acceptable, you may consider just replacing the 3590 drives with TS1120 (3592) drives. The cartridges fit in the same slots as 3590 cartridges and you can significantly increase the capacity of the library allowing you to remove a few frames if necessary. You could migrate from 3590 to 3592 in the same library by installing the new drives while keeping the old drives in place for a few weeks. You may also consider keeping the 3590 drives and cartridges for copypool/offsite storage. This would reduce your initial new media cost. Eventually, you could migrate to all 3592 media. Cheers, Neil -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John C Dury Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 9:42 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library We currently have two 3494 libraries with 6 3590-H drives in each that have each been paid for and depreciated and are still working well for the most part. One of the libraries is offsite but accessible via dark fiber we own and is setup as a copy storage pool for DR. We are looking into upgrading the tape components of our TSM system to two libraries with 4 LTO-4 drives in each because the speed and capacity difference with LTO-4 drives is so much larger than the 3494 library. We will also save lots of floor space as newer libraries are a fraction of the size of the 3494s we have that currently have 7 frames each. The 3494 is partitioned so that part is for TSM and part for the mainframe but when this is all said and done, the mainframe will be going away so a newer tape library will only be used for open systems. So far we have talked to several vendors about their products including: IBM,STK and EMC and have even looked at some third party vendors like Overland. Right now everything is open to suggestion but we are severely budget challenged. Some of the questions I'm looking for advice about are: If we currently have 6 3590-h drives in the 3494 library, do you think can we get by with 4 LTO-4 drives in the new libraries given that speed and storage capacity is so much better with LTO-4 drives? Most of the tape activity is backups only. Occasionally we have a file restore or two. We are hoping to keep the new tape library for 5+ years so reliability is a big factor. Any LTO-4 libraries more reliable than others? Do tapes last 5 years? Any advice or ideas are very welcome as everything is undecided right now. John IMPORTANT: E-mail sent through the Internet is not secure. Legg Mason therefore recommends that you do not send any confidential or sensitive information to us via electronic mail, including social security numbers, account numbers, or personal identification numbers. Delivery, and or timely delivery of Internet mail is not guaranteed. Legg Mason therefore recommends that you do not send time sensitive or action-oriented messages to us via electronic mail. This message is intended for the addressee only and may contain privileged or confidential information. Unless you are the intended recipient, you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone any information contained in this message. If you have received this message in error, please notify the author by replying to this message and then kindly delete the message. Thank you.
Re: Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library
To echo that, used 3494 tape libraries are going for cheap these days. We recently bought a used one that had 7 frames and 5 new TS1120 tape drives for under 100K. That's somewhere between 660TB and 1.8PB for $100K. For this case where we have about 8TB a day of seldom accessed archives that we have to keep for 2 years, it's a cost/GB that couldn't be beat. -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Strand, Neil B. Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 2:56 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library John, If you are experienced with the 3494 library, they are working well and tape mount speed is acceptable, you may consider just replacing the 3590 drives with TS1120 (3592) drives. The cartridges fit in the same slots as 3590 cartridges and you can significantly increase the capacity of the library allowing you to remove a few frames if necessary. You could migrate from 3590 to 3592 in the same library by installing the new drives while keeping the old drives in place for a few weeks. You may also consider keeping the 3590 drives and cartridges for copypool/offsite storage. This would reduce your initial new media cost. Eventually, you could migrate to all 3592 media. Cheers, Neil -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John C Dury Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 9:42 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library We currently have two 3494 libraries with 6 3590-H drives in each that have each been paid for and depreciated and are still working well for the most part. One of the libraries is offsite but accessible via dark fiber we own and is setup as a copy storage pool for DR. We are looking into upgrading the tape components of our TSM system to two libraries with 4 LTO-4 drives in each because the speed and capacity difference with LTO-4 drives is so much larger than the 3494 library. We will also save lots of floor space as newer libraries are a fraction of the size of the 3494s we have that currently have 7 frames each. The 3494 is partitioned so that part is for TSM and part for the mainframe but when this is all said and done, the mainframe will be going away so a newer tape library will only be used for open systems. So far we have talked to several vendors about their products including: IBM,STK and EMC and have even looked at some third party vendors like Overland. Right now everything is open to suggestion but we are severely budget challenged. Some of the questions I'm looking for advice about are: If we currently have 6 3590-h drives in the 3494 library, do you think can we get by with 4 LTO-4 drives in the new libraries given that speed and storage capacity is so much better with LTO-4 drives? Most of the tape activity is backups only. Occasionally we have a file restore or two. We are hoping to keep the new tape library for 5+ years so reliability is a big factor. Any LTO-4 libraries more reliable than others? Do tapes last 5 years? Any advice or ideas are very welcome as everything is undecided right now. John IMPORTANT: E-mail sent through the Internet is not secure. Legg Mason therefore recommends that you do not send any confidential or sensitive information to us via electronic mail, including social security numbers, account numbers, or personal identification numbers. Delivery, and or timely delivery of Internet mail is not guaranteed. Legg Mason therefore recommends that you do not send time sensitive or action-oriented messages to us via electronic mail. This message is intended for the addressee only and may contain privileged or confidential information. Unless you are the intended recipient, you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone any information contained in this message. If you have received this message in error, please notify the author by replying to this message and then kindly delete the message. Thank you.
Re: Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library
John, If you are experienced with the 3494 library, they are working well and tape mount speed is acceptable, you may consider just replacing the 3590 drives with TS1120 (3592) drives. The cartridges fit in the same slots as 3590 cartridges and you can significantly increase the capacity of the library allowing you to remove a few frames if necessary. You could migrate from 3590 to 3592 in the same library by installing the new drives while keeping the old drives in place for a few weeks. You may also consider keeping the 3590 drives and cartridges for copypool/offsite storage. This would reduce your initial new media cost. Eventually, you could migrate to all 3592 media. Cheers, Neil -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John C Dury Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 9:42 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library We currently have two 3494 libraries with 6 3590-H drives in each that have each been paid for and depreciated and are still working well for the most part. One of the libraries is offsite but accessible via dark fiber we own and is setup as a copy storage pool for DR. We are looking into upgrading the tape components of our TSM system to two libraries with 4 LTO-4 drives in each because the speed and capacity difference with LTO-4 drives is so much larger than the 3494 library. We will also save lots of floor space as newer libraries are a fraction of the size of the 3494s we have that currently have 7 frames each. The 3494 is partitioned so that part is for TSM and part for the mainframe but when this is all said and done, the mainframe will be going away so a newer tape library will only be used for open systems. So far we have talked to several vendors about their products including: IBM,STK and EMC and have even looked at some third party vendors like Overland. Right now everything is open to suggestion but we are severely budget challenged. Some of the questions I'm looking for advice about are: If we currently have 6 3590-h drives in the 3494 library, do you think can we get by with 4 LTO-4 drives in the new libraries given that speed and storage capacity is so much better with LTO-4 drives? Most of the tape activity is backups only. Occasionally we have a file restore or two. We are hoping to keep the new tape library for 5+ years so reliability is a big factor. Any LTO-4 libraries more reliable than others? Do tapes last 5 years? Any advice or ideas are very welcome as everything is undecided right now. John IMPORTANT: E-mail sent through the Internet is not secure. Legg Mason therefore recommends that you do not send any confidential or sensitive information to us via electronic mail, including social security numbers, account numbers, or personal identification numbers. Delivery, and or timely delivery of Internet mail is not guaranteed. Legg Mason therefore recommends that you do not send time sensitive or action-oriented messages to us via electronic mail. This message is intended for the addressee only and may contain privileged or confidential information. Unless you are the intended recipient, you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone any information contained in this message. If you have received this message in error, please notify the author by replying to this message and then kindly delete the message. Thank you.
Re: Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library
> If we currently have 6 3590-h drives in the 3494 library, do you think can > we get by with 4 LTO-4 drives in the new libraries given that speed and > storage capacity is so much better with LTO-4 drives? Most of the tape > activity is backups only. Occasionally we have a file restore or two. It depends. "Probably", if your host can PUSH the data to the LTO-4 drives faster than they currently push it to the 3590's. > We are hoping to keep the new tape library for 5+ years so reliability is > a > big factor. Any LTO-4 libraries more reliable than others? Absolutely. There are Enterprise-class libraries, mid-range tape libraries, and entry-level libraries. Since you are talking 4 drives, you are talking mid-range or Enterprise class libraries. The 3584 (now mysteriously renamed to the TS3500) is the replacement for the 3584, and will give you the same or BETTER reliability. You can also buy it with a "limited capacity" option (which is either 80 or 100 slots, don't remmeber), and it is muich more economical that way. The Quantum/Adic i2000 will give you the same reliability, although I don't like it because it won't autoclean. The large STK libraries are also enterprise-class. I don't know if Overland has an Enterprise-class library. Speaking from personal experience, any models below those, aren't going to give you the kind of reliability you are used to with the 3494. Just my opionion, and nobody else's. W Do tapes last > 5 > years? > > Any advice or ideas are very welcome as everything is undecided right now. > > John >
Re: Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library
On Sep 7, 2007, at 9:42 AM, John C Dury wrote: ...Any LTO-4 libraries more reliable than others? Do tapes last 5 years? ... Tape life is limited by usage. Manufacturers will quote various number on archival lifetime (sitting on shelf; usually 30 years), number of load/unload operations, and number of passes of the media over the head. See the Availability section in http:// www.storagetek.com/products/product_page48.html for an example. An HP Ultrium warranty statement (http://h2.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/ TechSupport/Document.jsp? locale=en_US&taskId=120&prodSeriesId=34648&prodTypeId=12169&objectID=lpg 50212) is "one million passes or 260 full back ups (FVB) or combination of FVB and Restores (whichever is soonest)". Also, see article http://searchstorage.techtarget.com/tip/ 0,289483,sid5_gci1253102,00.html on LTO lifespan for perspective. Further, a given technology may quickly become obsolete, rather than wear out: an LTO-4 cartridge finally taken off the shelf in 2037 will be a knickknack rather than usable media. Richard Sims
Request advice on moving from IBM 3494 Library
We currently have two 3494 libraries with 6 3590-H drives in each that have each been paid for and depreciated and are still working well for the most part. One of the libraries is offsite but accessible via dark fiber we own and is setup as a copy storage pool for DR. We are looking into upgrading the tape components of our TSM system to two libraries with 4 LTO-4 drives in each because the speed and capacity difference with LTO-4 drives is so much larger than the 3494 library. We will also save lots of floor space as newer libraries are a fraction of the size of the 3494s we have that currently have 7 frames each. The 3494 is partitioned so that part is for TSM and part for the mainframe but when this is all said and done, the mainframe will be going away so a newer tape library will only be used for open systems. So far we have talked to several vendors about their products including: IBM,STK and EMC and have even looked at some third party vendors like Overland. Right now everything is open to suggestion but we are severely budget challenged. Some of the questions I'm looking for advice about are: If we currently have 6 3590-h drives in the 3494 library, do you think can we get by with 4 LTO-4 drives in the new libraries given that speed and storage capacity is so much better with LTO-4 drives? Most of the tape activity is backups only. Occasionally we have a file restore or two. We are hoping to keep the new tape library for 5+ years so reliability is a big factor. Any LTO-4 libraries more reliable than others? Do tapes last 5 years? Any advice or ideas are very welcome as everything is undecided right now. John
