Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Dev]

It’s good hear the WISPA is taking a thoughtful look.

Meanwhile, if you as a vendor refuse to fix your product, which leaves network 
operators little choice but to seek other options, then you sue them along with 
the other guy who came up with other options, it’s easy to see why network 
operators take a negative view.

Also, while you continue to not fix the problem you release some other useless 
product aimed at indoor lighting or some such, the network operator truly feels 
on their own to try to fix things so the customers stop calling. The customers 
don’t call the vendor, and you’re stuck supporting unsupported hardware issues 
as a sort of forced Tier 1.

>> We as a board are listening to all of you.
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Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Carl Peterson]

Funny thing here is that this is finally a correct usage of the word hack
or hacking.  Of course hacking isn't at all illegal when you are hacking
hardware that you own.  Not sure where UBNT has a case here.  At most there
is a possible end user EULA violation, which isn't illegal and has nothing
to do with Cambium.  This is no different then running your own software on
your tractor, car, or computer.

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 1:39 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

> We'll see what facts come out in court I suppose.
> If there was actual hacking or reverse engineering going on then Ubiquiti
> has a case.  If it's just loading a different Linux build on the same
> hardware, then I don't think they do.
> They would feel compelled to try to protect their investment in either
> case.
>
> -Adam
>
>
> On 8/15/2018 8:26 AM, Jeremy wrote:
>
> Afaik it was still possible on OFDM, albeit with a JTAG.  4meg to 20meg,
> SM to AP, etc.  Still, it is a very similar argument and they also got
> lawyers involved.
>
> The point is simply that the licensing agreement on both vendors have
> limitations on what you are allowed to do with the hardware and software.
> I am pretty sure that public posts on how to dump firmware, modify or
> replace firmware, and load different firmware is prohibited on both
> vendor's devices.  I am certain that they would sue me if I publicly
> detailed the process to do so, WISP owner or not.  Whether or not this is
> warranted is definitely a matter of debate, likely best left up to the
> courts.
>
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 7:15 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:
>
>> I suspect Cambium wouldn't care a whole lot at this point, since that
>> hardware is all pretty much obsolete. If you did something like turning a
>> PMP450 SM into a PTP450, then you might get a lawsuit.
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 1:46 PM Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> It survived a reboot with one more minor change, and a little bird told
>>> me that it was possible on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how to
>>> do it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would bet you money that
>>> the lawsuit would hit very swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong.  Cambium, do you
>>> mind if someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is this a
>>> one-sided argument?  Does your license agreement allow me to reverse
>>> engineer Cambium radios, as a WISP, and then show my fellow colleagues how
>>> I can do it?
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 6:39 PM Jason McKemie <
>>> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>>>
 I'd agree with most of this, however I do think their decision to go
 after a WISP was a mistake.

 On Wednesday, August 15, 2018, Jeremy  wrote:

> Read the licensing agreement on both provider's radios.  You will find
> that UBNT we're well within their right to sue, and I am honestly 
> surprised
> that it did not happen sooner.  The attitude of 'I own it, and can do what
> I want with it', doesn't hold up according to both of their licensing
> agreements.
>
> You may recall when vendors and customers were changing a couple of
> hexadecimal digits in order to turn Canopy SMs into APs.  As I recall, 
> this
> went on for a long time, and only stopped because Cambium sent their
> lawyers after everyone involved.
>
> This issue is pretty cut and dry, and UBNT are well within their
> rights on this, and will almost certainly prevail in this lawsuit.
>
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 5:34 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
>> Chuck,
>>
>> Thank you for your response and thank you for the board looking into
>> the matter.  Yes an ultimatum is an extreme position but I didn't start
>> this, Ubiquiti did.
>>
>> This is an extremely serious matter for all the members so i decided
>> to scream loudly and publicly, i'm not a politician, just a business 
>> owner
>> that sees our industry under attack.  We are a *service provider
>> association*, not a *vendor association* and we are nice enough to
>> let vendors into our group and give them access to our members.  I know
>> they also supply some much needed funding for WISPA, but it's a two way
>> street and the association should be *EXTREMELY concerned when a
>> vendor sues it's own customer*.  Yes it will be tried in a court of
>> law but that doesn't mean WISPA can't also take action.
>>
>> I'm not trying to cause a division, ubiquiti is at fault for that.
>> I'm just raising alarm bells that they are attacking us, their customers.
>>
>> I look forward to the board's response.
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 10:44 AM, Chuck Hogg <
>> ch...@allpointsbroadband.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Sean,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> When I joined WISPA, it was for many of the same reasons you joined.
>>> I loved the community, wanted to be a part of it, and wanted to ensure 
>>> that
>>> everyone in the WISP industry is given a fair 

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Bill Prince]

  
  
The only potentially legitimate issue is with the bootloader, and
  then only with regard to version. The old bootloader was open
  source GNU, and would load anything. Rolling back to an old
  bootloader would be all you have to do to avoid the hacking claim.


bp



On 8/16/2018 11:39 AM, Adam Moffett
  wrote:


  
  We'll see what facts come out in court I suppose.
  If there was actual hacking or reverse engineering going on then
  Ubiquiti has a case.  If it's just loading a different Linux build
  on the same hardware, then I don't think they do.
  They would feel compelled to try to protect their investment in
  either case.
  
  -Adam
  
  
  On 8/15/2018 8:26 AM, Jeremy wrote:
  
  

Afaik it was still possible on OFDM, albeit with
  a JTAG.  4meg to 20meg, SM to AP, etc.  Still, it is a very
  similar argument and they also got lawyers involved.  
  
  
  The point is simply that the licensing
agreement on both vendors have limitations on what you are
allowed to do with the hardware and software.  I am pretty
sure that public posts on how to dump firmware, modify or
replace firmware, and load different firmware is prohibited
on both vendor's devices.  I am certain that they would sue
me if I publicly detailed the process to do so, WISP owner
or not.  Whether or not this is warranted is definitely a
matter of debate, likely best left up to the courts.



  On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 7:15 PM Mathew Howard
 wrote:
  
  
I suspect Cambium wouldn't care a whole lot
  at this point, since that hardware is all pretty much
  obsolete. If you did something like turning a PMP450 SM
  into a PTP450, then you might get a lawsuit.



  On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 1:46 PM Jeremy 
wrote:
  
  
It survived a reboot with one more minor
  change, and a little bird told me that it was possible
  on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how to do
  it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would
  bet you money that the lawsuit would hit very
  swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong.  Cambium, do you mind if
  someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is
  this a one-sided argument?  Does your license
  agreement allow me to reverse engineer Cambium radios,
  as a WISP, and then show my fellow colleagues how I
  can do it?


  On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 6:39 PM Jason
McKemie 
wrote:
  
  I'd
agree with most of this, however I do think their
decision to go after a WISP was a mistake.

On Wednesday, August 15, 2018, Jeremy 
wrote:

  Read the licensing agreement on
both provider's radios.  You will find that UBNT
we're well within their right to sue, and I am
honestly surprised that it did not happen
sooner.  The attitude of 'I own it, and can do
what I want with it', doesn't hold up according
to both of their licensing agreements.  


You may recall when vendors and
  customers were changing a couple of
  hexadecimal digits in order to turn Canopy SMs
  into APs.  As I recall, this went on for a
  long time, and only stopped because Cambium
  sent their lawyers after everyone involved. 


This issue is pretty cut and
  dry, and UBNT are well within their rights on
  this, and will almost certainly prevail in
  this lawsuit.
  
  
  
On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 5:34 PM
  Sean Heskett 
  wrote:


  Chuck,


 

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Mathew Howard]

SM to AP probably wouldn't work too well with 430/450, since the AP
hardware is completely different (well, with one or two exceptions).

But anyway, yes, they most likely would sue you to at least get that info
taken down. But posting information on how to hack a radio to do something
it's not supposed to do, is a lot different than being involved in a case
study for a commercial product (which is all we know of that the WISP in
question actually did, at this point). Of course it's entirely possible
that this WISP did do a lot more than that, and was involved in
who-knows-what, that justifies them being sued... but if that is the case,
it seems to be that it would be in UBNT's best interests to get that
information out there as fast as they can, because right now, it looks like
they're going after these guys just for buying a product that most of us
assumed was legal, based on the fact that it was being sold by a reputable
company.

On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 2:32 PM Jeremy  wrote:

> Afaik it was still possible on OFDM, albeit with a JTAG.  4meg to 20meg,
> SM to AP, etc.  Still, it is a very similar argument and they also got
> lawyers involved.
>
> The point is simply that the licensing agreement on both vendors have
> limitations on what you are allowed to do with the hardware and software.
> I am pretty sure that public posts on how to dump firmware, modify or
> replace firmware, and load different firmware is prohibited on both
> vendor's devices.  I am certain that they would sue me if I publicly
> detailed the process to do so, WISP owner or not.  Whether or not this is
> warranted is definitely a matter of debate, likely best left up to the
> courts.
>
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 7:15 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:
>
>> I suspect Cambium wouldn't care a whole lot at this point, since that
>> hardware is all pretty much obsolete. If you did something like turning a
>> PMP450 SM into a PTP450, then you might get a lawsuit.
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 1:46 PM Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> It survived a reboot with one more minor change, and a little bird told
>>> me that it was possible on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how to
>>> do it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would bet you money that
>>> the lawsuit would hit very swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong.  Cambium, do you
>>> mind if someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is this a
>>> one-sided argument?  Does your license agreement allow me to reverse
>>> engineer Cambium radios, as a WISP, and then show my fellow colleagues how
>>> I can do it?
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 6:39 PM Jason McKemie <
>>> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>>>
 I'd agree with most of this, however I do think their decision to go
 after a WISP was a mistake.

 On Wednesday, August 15, 2018, Jeremy  wrote:

> Read the licensing agreement on both provider's radios.  You will find
> that UBNT we're well within their right to sue, and I am honestly 
> surprised
> that it did not happen sooner.  The attitude of 'I own it, and can do what
> I want with it', doesn't hold up according to both of their licensing
> agreements.
>
> You may recall when vendors and customers were changing a couple of
> hexadecimal digits in order to turn Canopy SMs into APs.  As I recall, 
> this
> went on for a long time, and only stopped because Cambium sent their
> lawyers after everyone involved.
>
> This issue is pretty cut and dry, and UBNT are well within their
> rights on this, and will almost certainly prevail in this lawsuit.
>
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 5:34 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
>> Chuck,
>>
>> Thank you for your response and thank you for the board looking into
>> the matter.  Yes an ultimatum is an extreme position but I didn't start
>> this, Ubiquiti did.
>>
>> This is an extremely serious matter for all the members so i decided
>> to scream loudly and publicly, i'm not a politician, just a business 
>> owner
>> that sees our industry under attack.  We are a *service provider
>> association*, not a *vendor association* and we are nice enough to
>> let vendors into our group and give them access to our members.  I know
>> they also supply some much needed funding for WISPA, but it's a two way
>> street and the association should be *EXTREMELY concerned when a
>> vendor sues it's own customer*.  Yes it will be tried in a court of
>> law but that doesn't mean WISPA can't also take action.
>>
>> I'm not trying to cause a division, ubiquiti is at fault for that.
>> I'm just raising alarm bells that they are attacking us, their customers.
>>
>> I look forward to the board's response.
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 10:44 AM, Chuck Hogg <
>> ch...@allpointsbroadband.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Sean,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> When I joined WISPA, it was for many of the same reasons 

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Mathew Howard]

I suspect Cambium wouldn't care a whole lot at this point, since that
hardware is all pretty much obsolete. If you did something like turning a
PMP450 SM into a PTP450, then you might get a lawsuit.

On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 1:46 PM Jeremy  wrote:

> It survived a reboot with one more minor change, and a little bird told me
> that it was possible on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how to do
> it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would bet you money that the
> lawsuit would hit very swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong.  Cambium, do you mind
> if someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is this a one-sided
> argument?  Does your license agreement allow me to reverse engineer Cambium
> radios, as a WISP, and then show my fellow colleagues how I can do it?
>
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 6:39 PM Jason McKemie <
> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>
>> I'd agree with most of this, however I do think their decision to go
>> after a WISP was a mistake.
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 15, 2018, Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> Read the licensing agreement on both provider's radios.  You will find
>>> that UBNT we're well within their right to sue, and I am honestly surprised
>>> that it did not happen sooner.  The attitude of 'I own it, and can do what
>>> I want with it', doesn't hold up according to both of their licensing
>>> agreements.
>>>
>>> You may recall when vendors and customers were changing a couple of
>>> hexadecimal digits in order to turn Canopy SMs into APs.  As I recall, this
>>> went on for a long time, and only stopped because Cambium sent their
>>> lawyers after everyone involved.
>>>
>>> This issue is pretty cut and dry, and UBNT are well within their rights
>>> on this, and will almost certainly prevail in this lawsuit.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 5:34 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>>>
 Chuck,

 Thank you for your response and thank you for the board looking into
 the matter.  Yes an ultimatum is an extreme position but I didn't start
 this, Ubiquiti did.

 This is an extremely serious matter for all the members so i decided to
 scream loudly and publicly, i'm not a politician, just a business owner
 that sees our industry under attack.  We are a *service provider
 association*, not a *vendor association* and we are nice enough to let
 vendors into our group and give them access to our members.  I know they
 also supply some much needed funding for WISPA, but it's a two way street
 and the association should be *EXTREMELY concerned when a vendor sues
 it's own customer*.  Yes it will be tried in a court of law but that
 doesn't mean WISPA can't also take action.

 I'm not trying to cause a division, ubiquiti is at fault for that.  I'm
 just raising alarm bells that they are attacking us, their customers.

 I look forward to the board's response.

 On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 10:44 AM, Chuck Hogg <
 ch...@allpointsbroadband.com> wrote:

> Sean,
>
>
>
> When I joined WISPA, it was for many of the same reasons you joined. I
> loved the community, wanted to be a part of it, and wanted to ensure that
> everyone in the WISP industry is given a fair shake.
>
>
>
> I appreciate you raising this issue, although I wish you would have
> called me or another WISPA board member before giving WISPA an ultimatum 
> on
> the members’ listserv. I’m concerned that your approach stokes division 
> and
> argument, rather than unity.
>
>
>
> Like you, I'm sad that these WISPA members have been unable to work
> out the issues between them and have resorted to duking it out in court. I
> hate to see little guys get caught up in this mess. But as others have
> said, we have no idea at this time whether the allegations are true or
> false. They're just allegations at this point.
>
>
>
> Nonetheless, these are serious issues, and you've asked the board to
> act. We will of course consider your request, meaning we will gather what
> information we can and determine whether and when we can make an informed
> and meaningful decision.
>
>
>
> Please feel free to reach out to us directly as this case continues to
> unfold.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 2:46 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
>> An Open Letter to WISPA, the Board of Directors and all WISPA members.
>>
>> Our industry and indeed WISPA itself if founded on the bedrock of
>> helping one another to further our industry and our businesses.  This 
>> group
>> is a dedicated, committed group of IT cowboys that try their hardest to 
>> get
>> things done and move forward.  When one of our members suffers or has
>> difficulty, we are all there to stand with them and provide whatever help
>> necessary.  When disaster strikes we 

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[chuck]

That is an Easter Egg.

-Original Message- 
From: Seth Mattinen 
Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2018 12:58 PM 
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA... 


On 8/15/18 04:41, Jeremy wrote:
It survived a reboot with one more minor change, and a little bird told 
me that it was possible on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how 
to do it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would bet you money 
that the lawsuit would hit very swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong. Cambium, 
do you mind if someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is 
this a one-sided argument?  Does your license agreement allow me to 
reverse engineer Cambium radios, as a WISP, and then show my fellow 
colleagues how I can do it?



That's not reverse engineering.

--
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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

--
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AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Seth Mattinen]

On 8/15/18 04:41, Jeremy wrote:
It survived a reboot with one more minor change, and a little bird told 
me that it was possible on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how 
to do it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would bet you money 
that the lawsuit would hit very swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong. Cambium, 
do you mind if someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is 
this a one-sided argument?  Does your license agreement allow me to 
reverse engineer Cambium radios, as a WISP, and then show my fellow 
colleagues how I can do it?



That's not reverse engineering.

--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Jeremy]

It survived a reboot with one more minor change, and a little bird told me
that it was possible on v11 as well.  I wonder, if I show you all how to do
it simply with a JTAG if I'd get a lawsuit.  I would bet you money that the
lawsuit would hit very swiftly.  Perhaps I am wrong.  Cambium, do you mind
if someone sends these WISPs down the rabbit hole, or is this a one-sided
argument?  Does your license agreement allow me to reverse engineer Cambium
radios, as a WISP, and then show my fellow colleagues how I can do it?

On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 6:39 PM Jason McKemie <
j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:

> I'd agree with most of this, however I do think their decision to go after
> a WISP was a mistake.
>
> On Wednesday, August 15, 2018, Jeremy  wrote:
>
>> Read the licensing agreement on both provider's radios.  You will find
>> that UBNT we're well within their right to sue, and I am honestly surprised
>> that it did not happen sooner.  The attitude of 'I own it, and can do what
>> I want with it', doesn't hold up according to both of their licensing
>> agreements.
>>
>> You may recall when vendors and customers were changing a couple of
>> hexadecimal digits in order to turn Canopy SMs into APs.  As I recall, this
>> went on for a long time, and only stopped because Cambium sent their
>> lawyers after everyone involved.
>>
>> This issue is pretty cut and dry, and UBNT are well within their rights
>> on this, and will almost certainly prevail in this lawsuit.
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 5:34 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>>
>>> Chuck,
>>>
>>> Thank you for your response and thank you for the board looking into the
>>> matter.  Yes an ultimatum is an extreme position but I didn't start this,
>>> Ubiquiti did.
>>>
>>> This is an extremely serious matter for all the members so i decided to
>>> scream loudly and publicly, i'm not a politician, just a business owner
>>> that sees our industry under attack.  We are a *service provider
>>> association*, not a *vendor association* and we are nice enough to let
>>> vendors into our group and give them access to our members.  I know they
>>> also supply some much needed funding for WISPA, but it's a two way street
>>> and the association should be *EXTREMELY concerned when a vendor sues
>>> it's own customer*.  Yes it will be tried in a court of law but that
>>> doesn't mean WISPA can't also take action.
>>>
>>> I'm not trying to cause a division, ubiquiti is at fault for that.  I'm
>>> just raising alarm bells that they are attacking us, their customers.
>>>
>>> I look forward to the board's response.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2018 at 10:44 AM, Chuck Hogg <
>>> ch...@allpointsbroadband.com> wrote:
>>>
 Sean,



 When I joined WISPA, it was for many of the same reasons you joined. I
 loved the community, wanted to be a part of it, and wanted to ensure that
 everyone in the WISP industry is given a fair shake.



 I appreciate you raising this issue, although I wish you would have
 called me or another WISPA board member before giving WISPA an ultimatum on
 the members’ listserv. I’m concerned that your approach stokes division and
 argument, rather than unity.



 Like you, I'm sad that these WISPA members have been unable to work out
 the issues between them and have resorted to duking it out in court. I hate
 to see little guys get caught up in this mess. But as others have said, we
 have no idea at this time whether the allegations are true or false.
 They're just allegations at this point.



 Nonetheless, these are serious issues, and you've asked the board to
 act. We will of course consider your request, meaning we will gather what
 information we can and determine whether and when we can make an informed
 and meaningful decision.



 Please feel free to reach out to us directly as this case continues to
 unfold.


 Regards,

 Chuck




 On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 2:46 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:

> An Open Letter to WISPA, the Board of Directors and all WISPA members.
>
> Our industry and indeed WISPA itself if founded on the bedrock of
> helping one another to further our industry and our businesses.  This 
> group
> is a dedicated, committed group of IT cowboys that try their hardest to 
> get
> things done and move forward.  When one of our members suffers or has
> difficulty, we are all there to stand with them and provide whatever help
> necessary.  When disaster strikes we jump in and help as in the case of
> several hurricanes and bad storms over the years.  We also actively strive
> to help each other solve difficult problems whether it be configuring a
> server, securing financing, finding the best hardware solution to solve a
> problem or any other myriad of issues our businesses face the members of
> WISPA are there to 

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Steve Jones]

is somebody pickin a fight with wispa? im in


On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 2:23 PM Lewis Bergman 
wrote:

> It appears that I was the canary in the WISP coal mine all those years
> ago. I thought Ubiquiti was a WISPA member as well. I mean, I used very
> little of their gear compared to Cambium but still. If they are both
> members why is Sean asking to take sides? I get the suing WISPA memer is
> bad thing, but the rest of it would seem to be an internal issue.
>
> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 2:12 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
>> Make sure to put Cambium right next to UBNT in the exhibit hall.
>>
>> Which one of them is the fascist and which is antifa?
>>
>> *From:* Jay Weekley
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 14, 2018 12:59 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Members ; tcof...@wispa.org ; 
>> Arielle
>> Coffey ; Will Peterson ; ghelm...@wispa.org ; bo...@wispa.org ; Trina
>> Coffey ; Alan Belvo
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...
>>
>> Will make for an interesting conference in October.
>>
>> Sean Heskett wrote:
>>
>> An Open Letter to WISPA, the Board of Directors and all WISPA members.
>>
>> Our industry and indeed WISPA itself if founded on the bedrock of helping
>> one another to further our industry and our businesses.  This group is a
>> dedicated, committed group of IT cowboys that try their hardest to get
>> things done and move forward.  When one of our members suffers or has
>> difficulty, we are all there to stand with them and provide whatever help
>> necessary.  When disaster strikes we jump in and help as in the case of
>> several hurricanes and bad storms over the years.  We also actively strive
>> to help each other solve difficult problems whether it be configuring a
>> server, securing financing, finding the best hardware solution to solve a
>> problem or any other myriad of issues our businesses face the members of
>> WISPA are there to help!  I joined WISPA because I felt it was a great
>> thing for me and my business and I want to support WISPA anyway I can,
>> however our membership is being attacked from within and I call on the
>> board to take corrective action immediately and forcefully!
>>
>> Ubiquiti Networks has recently sued Cambium as well as Blip Networks (a
>> fellow WISP), Winncom Technologies (a WISPA vendor), Sakid Ahmed (Cambium
>> VP of engineering) and Dmitry Moiseev (project engineer at Cambium) over
>> Cambiums “Elevate technology”.  I’ve attached the legal complaint so you
>> can read all the details yourself.  Basically the group is accused of
>> “hacking” ubiquiti equipment by loading a different operating system and
>> user interface on Ubiquiti subscriber radios so that they interoperate with
>> Cambium ePMP access points.  This is no different than someone loading
>> windows on a Mac, or vise versa someone building a Hackintosh out of PC
>> parts and loading MacOS on it.  Or more to the point someone loading
>> DD-WART on a linksys WiFi router.  However, regardless of the merits of the
>> complaint, what Ubiquiti is doing is a clear violation of everything that
>> WISPA stands for!
>>
>> I’ve also attached the WISPA mission statement, Goals, Code of ethics,
>> and Article 8 of the By Laws.  Ubiquiti is in clear violation of all these
>> sections and *I hear by call on the board to terminate Ubiquiti’s
>> membership in WISPA.  A HOUSE DIVIDED CANNOT STAND!*  We must get rid of
>> any bad actors amongst us so that we can continue to accomplish everything
>> WISPA stands for.
>>
>> *IT IS EXTREMELY UNNERVING TO SEE UBIQUITI SUE ONE OF OUR FELLOW WISPS.*
>> What kind of business actively sues it's own customers?  Who will be next?
>> Our businesses are too small to be forced to defend ourselves from this bad
>> actor in our organization.  I fear that any one of us could be next on the
>> chopping block and i’ve invested way too much time, energy, sweat blood and
>> tears to see my business or a fellow WISP attached by a wall street company
>> with deep pockets that can sue us out of existence.
>>
>> I hope the rest of the membership will join in signing this letter and
>> that the board will remove Ubiquiti from our organization and send a
>> message that we will not put up with this kind of business ethics.  If the
>> board is unwilling to remove Ubiquiti then I will be forced to remove
>> myself and my company from WISPA because this is not what we stand for.
>>
>>
>> VERY DISGUSTED,
>>
>> Sean Heskett
>>
>> ZIRKEL Wireless
>> High-Speed Internet for NW Colorado
>> 970-871-8500 x100 <(970

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Lewis Bergman]

It appears that I was the canary in the WISP coal mine all those years ago.
I thought Ubiquiti was a WISPA member as well. I mean, I used very little
of their gear compared to Cambium but still. If they are both members why
is Sean asking to take sides? I get the suing WISPA memer is bad thing, but
the rest of it would seem to be an internal issue.

On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 2:12 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

> Make sure to put Cambium right next to UBNT in the exhibit hall.
>
> Which one of them is the fascist and which is antifa?
>
> *From:* Jay Weekley
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 14, 2018 12:59 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Members ; tcof...@wispa.org ; Arielle
> Coffey ; Will Peterson ; ghelm...@wispa.org ; bo...@wispa.org ; Trina
> Coffey ; Alan Belvo
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...
>
> Will make for an interesting conference in October.
>
> Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> An Open Letter to WISPA, the Board of Directors and all WISPA members.
>
> Our industry and indeed WISPA itself if founded on the bedrock of helping
> one another to further our industry and our businesses.  This group is a
> dedicated, committed group of IT cowboys that try their hardest to get
> things done and move forward.  When one of our members suffers or has
> difficulty, we are all there to stand with them and provide whatever help
> necessary.  When disaster strikes we jump in and help as in the case of
> several hurricanes and bad storms over the years.  We also actively strive
> to help each other solve difficult problems whether it be configuring a
> server, securing financing, finding the best hardware solution to solve a
> problem or any other myriad of issues our businesses face the members of
> WISPA are there to help!  I joined WISPA because I felt it was a great
> thing for me and my business and I want to support WISPA anyway I can,
> however our membership is being attacked from within and I call on the
> board to take corrective action immediately and forcefully!
>
> Ubiquiti Networks has recently sued Cambium as well as Blip Networks (a
> fellow WISP), Winncom Technologies (a WISPA vendor), Sakid Ahmed (Cambium
> VP of engineering) and Dmitry Moiseev (project engineer at Cambium) over
> Cambiums “Elevate technology”.  I’ve attached the legal complaint so you
> can read all the details yourself.  Basically the group is accused of
> “hacking” ubiquiti equipment by loading a different operating system and
> user interface on Ubiquiti subscriber radios so that they interoperate with
> Cambium ePMP access points.  This is no different than someone loading
> windows on a Mac, or vise versa someone building a Hackintosh out of PC
> parts and loading MacOS on it.  Or more to the point someone loading
> DD-WART on a linksys WiFi router.  However, regardless of the merits of the
> complaint, what Ubiquiti is doing is a clear violation of everything that
> WISPA stands for!
>
> I’ve also attached the WISPA mission statement, Goals, Code of ethics, and
> Article 8 of the By Laws.  Ubiquiti is in clear violation of all these
> sections and *I hear by call on the board to terminate Ubiquiti’s
> membership in WISPA.  A HOUSE DIVIDED CANNOT STAND!*  We must get rid of
> any bad actors amongst us so that we can continue to accomplish everything
> WISPA stands for.
>
> *IT IS EXTREMELY UNNERVING TO SEE UBIQUITI SUE ONE OF OUR FELLOW WISPS.*
> What kind of business actively sues it's own customers?  Who will be next?
> Our businesses are too small to be forced to defend ourselves from this bad
> actor in our organization.  I fear that any one of us could be next on the
> chopping block and i’ve invested way too much time, energy, sweat blood and
> tears to see my business or a fellow WISP attached by a wall street company
> with deep pockets that can sue us out of existence.
>
> I hope the rest of the membership will join in signing this letter and
> that the board will remove Ubiquiti from our organization and send a
> message that we will not put up with this kind of business ethics.  If the
> board is unwilling to remove Ubiquiti then I will be forced to remove
> myself and my company from WISPA because this is not what we stand for.
>
>
> VERY DISGUSTED,
>
> Sean Heskett
>
> ZIRKEL Wireless
> High-Speed Internet for NW Colorado
> 970-871-8500 x100 <(970)%20871-8500> - Office
> 970-846-8065 <(970)%20846-8065> - mobile
>
>
>
> ***
>
> MISSION AND GOALS
> http://www.wispa.org/About-Us/Mission-and-Goals
>
> MISSION STATEMENT:
>
> WISPA works to promote the development, advancement and unification of the
> wireless Internet service provider industry.

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Chuck McCown]

Make sure to put Cambium right next to UBNT in the exhibit hall.  

Which one of them is the fascist and which is antifa?

From: Jay Weekley 
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 12:59 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Members ; tcof...@wispa.org ; Arielle 
Coffey ; Will Peterson ; ghelm...@wispa.org ; bo...@wispa.org ; Trina Coffey ; 
Alan Belvo 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

Will make for an interesting conference in October.


Sean Heskett wrote:

  An Open Letter to WISPA, the Board of Directors and all WISPA members. 

  Our industry and indeed WISPA itself if founded on the bedrock of helping one 
another to further our industry and our businesses.  This group is a dedicated, 
committed group of IT cowboys that try their hardest to get things done and 
move forward.  When one of our members suffers or has difficulty, we are all 
there to stand with them and provide whatever help necessary.  When disaster 
strikes we jump in and help as in the case of several hurricanes and bad storms 
over the years.  We also actively strive to help each other solve difficult 
problems whether it be configuring a server, securing financing, finding the 
best hardware solution to solve a problem or any other myriad of issues our 
businesses face the members of WISPA are there to help!  I joined WISPA because 
I felt it was a great thing for me and my business and I want to support WISPA 
anyway I can, however our membership is being attacked from within and I call 
on the board to take corrective action immediately and forcefully!  

  Ubiquiti Networks has recently sued Cambium as well as Blip Networks (a 
fellow WISP), Winncom Technologies (a WISPA vendor), Sakid Ahmed (Cambium VP of 
engineering) and Dmitry Moiseev (project engineer at Cambium) over Cambiums 
“Elevate technology”.  I’ve attached the legal complaint so you can read all 
the details yourself.  Basically the group is accused of “hacking” ubiquiti 
equipment by loading a different operating system and user interface on 
Ubiquiti subscriber radios so that they interoperate with Cambium ePMP access 
points.  This is no different than someone loading windows on a Mac, or vise 
versa someone building a Hackintosh out of PC parts and loading MacOS on it.  
Or more to the point someone loading DD-WART on a linksys WiFi router.  
However, regardless of the merits of the complaint, what Ubiquiti is doing is a 
clear violation of everything that WISPA stands for!  

  I’ve also attached the WISPA mission statement, Goals, Code of ethics, and 
Article 8 of the By Laws.  Ubiquiti is in clear violation of all these sections 
and I hear by call on the board to terminate Ubiquiti’s membership in WISPA.  A 
HOUSE DIVIDED CANNOT STAND!  We must get rid of any bad actors amongst us so 
that we can continue to accomplish everything WISPA stands for.

  IT IS EXTREMELY UNNERVING TO SEE UBIQUITI SUE ONE OF OUR FELLOW WISPS.  What 
kind of business actively sues it's own customers?  Who will be next?  Our 
businesses are too small to be forced to defend ourselves from this bad actor 
in our organization.  I fear that any one of us could be next on the chopping 
block and i’ve invested way too much time, energy, sweat blood and tears to see 
my business or a fellow WISP attached by a wall street company with deep 
pockets that can sue us out of existence.  

  I hope the rest of the membership will join in signing this letter and that 
the board will remove Ubiquiti from our organization and send a message that we 
will not put up with this kind of business ethics.  If the board is unwilling 
to remove Ubiquiti then I will be forced to remove myself and my company from 
WISPA because this is not what we stand for.


  VERY DISGUSTED,

  Sean Heskett

  ZIRKEL Wireless 
  High-Speed Internet for NW Colorado
  970-871-8500 x100 - Office
  970-846-8065 - mobile


  
***

  MISSION AND GOALS
  http://www.wispa.org/About-Us/Mission-and-Goals

  MISSION STATEMENT:

  WISPA works to promote the development, advancement and unification of the 
wireless Internet service provider industry.

  WISPA GOALS:


  • Encourage Congress and the FCC to write laws that support the survival and 
success of community-based wireless Internet service providers (WISPs).

  • Provide online technical forums that enable and encourage the sharing and 
exchange of information between all the members of the WISP community.

  • Demystify government rules and regulations.

  • Publicize, promote, demonstrate and maintain a Code of Ethical Business 
Practices.

  • Promote and support industry-wide communication, coordination and 
cooperation between local WISP organizations, national WISP organizations, 
community wireless organizations and wireless industry vendors.


  
***


  CODE OF ETHICS

Re: [AFMUG] Dear WISPA...

[Jay Weekley]

  
  
Will make for an interesting conference in October.

Sean Heskett wrote:


  An
  Open Letter to WISPA, the Board of Directors and all WISPA
  members.


Our
  industry and indeed WISPA itself if founded on the bedrock of
  helping one another to further our industry and our
  businesses.  This group is a dedicated, committed group of IT
  cowboys that try their hardest to get things done and move
  forward.  When one of our members suffers or has difficulty,
  we are all there to stand with them and provide whatever help
  necessary.  When disaster strikes we jump in and help as in
  the case of several hurricanes and bad storms over the years. 
  We also actively strive to help each other solve difficult
  problems whether it be configuring a server, securing
  financing, finding the best hardware solution to solve a
  problem or any other myriad of issues our businesses face the
  members of WISPA are there to help!  I joined WISPA because I
  felt it was a great thing for me and my business and I want to
  support WISPA anyway I can, however our membership is being
  attacked from within and I call on the board to take
  corrective action immediately and forcefully!  


Ubiquiti
  Networks has recently sued Cambium as well as Blip Networks (a
  fellow WISP), Winncom Technologies (a WISPA vendor), Sakid
  Ahmed (Cambium VP of engineering) and Dmitry Moiseev (project
  engineer at Cambium) over Cambiums “Elevate technology”.  I’ve
  attached the legal complaint so you can read all the details
  yourself.  Basically the group is accused of “hacking”
  ubiquiti equipment by loading a different operating system and
  user interface on Ubiquiti subscriber radios so that they
  interoperate with Cambium ePMP access points.  This is no
  different than someone loading windows on a Mac, or vise versa
  someone building a Hackintosh out of PC parts and loading
  MacOS on it.  Or more to the point someone loading DD-WART on
  a linksys WiFi router.  However, regardless of the merits of
  the complaint, what Ubiquiti is doing is a clear violation of
  everything that WISPA stands for!  


I’ve
  also attached the WISPA mission statement, Goals, Code of
  ethics, and Article 8 of the By Laws.  Ubiquiti is in clear
  violation of all these sections and I hear by call on the
board to terminate Ubiquiti’s membership in WISPA.  A HOUSE
DIVIDED CANNOT STAND!  We must get rid of any bad actors
  amongst us so that we can continue to accomplish everything
  WISPA stands for.


IT
IS EXTREMELY UNNERVING TO SEE UBIQUITI SUE ONE OF OUR FELLOW
WISPS.  What kind of business actively sues it's own
  customers?  Who will be next?  Our businesses are too small to
  be forced to defend ourselves from this bad actor in our
  organization.  I fear that any one of us could be next on the
  chopping block and i’ve invested way too much time, energy,
  sweat blood and tears to see my business or a fellow WISP
  attached by a wall street company with deep pockets that can
  sue us out of existence.  


I
  hope the rest of the membership will join in signing this
  letter and that the board will remove Ubiquiti from our
  organization and send a message that we will not put up with
  this kind of business ethics.  If the board is unwilling to
  remove Ubiquiti then I will be forced to remove myself and my
  company from WISPA because this is not what we stand for.




VERY
  DISGUSTED,


Sean
  Heskett
  
  ZIRKEL Wireless 
  High-Speed Internet for NW Colorado
  970-871-8500 x100 - Office
  970-846-8065 - mobile




***

  MISSION AND GOALS
  http://www.wispa.org/About-Us/Mission-and-Goals
  
  MISSION STATEMENT:
  
  WISPA works to promote the development, advancement and
  unification of the wireless Internet service
  provider industry.
  
  WISPA GOALS:
  
  	• Encourage
Congress and the FCC to write laws that support the survival
and success of community-based wireless Internet service
providers (WISPs).
  
  	•