Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Mike Hammett]

I was going to bring up that their product looks good on paper. I haven't gone 
any further with it. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Steve D" <bigd...@gmail.com> 
To: "af" <af@afmug.com> 
Sent: Friday, March 2, 2018 11:55:06 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space? 


Redline makes a product that is both very real and performs. Not as expensive 
as those others, but ubnt guys don't even apply, LTE and Cambium 450 guys 
should be able to swallow that pill but it's bazillion times past anything 
carlson or airspan have made yet and it's real company that answers the damn 
phone! It's been a regulatory nightmare, but 900mhz does. not. come. close. to 
going where this goes. 



Y'all need to be fighting for this and not giving up so easily because it 
CANNOT sit dead on the vine like this, and unfortunately for me, I'm not in FCC 
land so all I can do is flail my arms and tell you to push. Get the TV guys 
kicked out so you can have the channel sizes (via bonding) and this stuff will 
be amazing. 


Our test deployment has been fantastic and we have dozens of places I wish we 
could just start slapping it up. 


-Steve D 


On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 7:53 AM, Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > wrote: 



We have one 5MHz channel available in our area, the rest was all claimed by 
wireless microphones - I am guessing by the University. 




On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 6:40 AM, Mark Radabaugh < m...@amplex.net > wrote: 



Too little, too late. 5Mhz (usable) channels. Even with bonding multiple 
channels together it’s not much bandwidth. NAB successfully killed it by 
insisting on way too strict OOB filtering. Carlson didn’t help it any with 
vaporware. And now we have NAB running around saying shared spectrum is a bad 
model because it didn’t work in whitespace. Sometime you can’t win. 


Mark 





On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout < t...@voltbb.com > wrote: 


The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of the poor rules 
and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want to do IOT type of stuff, isn't 
really qualified for broadband when your AP can only do 3-20mbps in 2018 


On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones < thatoneguyst...@gmail.com > 
wrote: 



This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went 
silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something happenning? 

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Steve D]

Redline makes a product that is both very real and performs.  Not as
expensive as those others, but  ubnt guys don't even apply, LTE and Cambium
450 guys should be able to swallow that pill but it's bazillion times past
anything carlson or airspan have made yet and it's real company that
answers the damn phone!  It's been a regulatory nightmare, but 900mhz does.
not. come. close. to going where this goes.

Y'all need to be fighting for this and not giving up so easily because it
CANNOT sit dead on the vine like this, and unfortunately for me, I'm not in
FCC land so all I can do is flail my arms and tell you to push.  Get the TV
guys kicked out so you can have the channel sizes (via bonding) and this
stuff will be amazing.

Our test deployment has been fantastic and we have dozens of places I wish
we could just start slapping it up.

-Steve D

On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 7:53 AM, Jeremy  wrote:

> We have one 5MHz channel available in our area, the rest was all claimed
> by wireless microphones - I am guessing by the University.
>
> On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 6:40 AM, Mark Radabaugh  wrote:
>
>> Too little, too late.  5Mhz (usable) channels.  Even with bonding
>> multiple channels together it’s not much bandwidth.   NAB successfully
>> killed it by insisting on way too strict OOB filtering.  Carlson didn’t
>> help it any with vaporware.  And now we have NAB running around saying
>> shared spectrum is a bad model because it didn’t work in whitespace.
>> Sometime you can’t win.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
>>
>> The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of the poor
>> rules and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want to do IOT type of
>> stuff, isn't really qualified for broadband when your AP can only do
>> 3-20mbps in 2018
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went
>>> silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
>>> happenning?
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Mark - Myakka Technologies]

Jay,

Wow,  wish  the vendor that sold me mine was that nice.  We lost about
$6K on our deal.

-- 
Best regards,
 Markmailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.MyakkaTech.com

--

Friday, March 2, 2018, 11:48:43 AM, you wrote:

JW> Being sandwiched between two medium sized cities left us with few 
JW> channels as well.  One of the few vendors that sell white space 
JW> equipment even was nice enough to tell me don't even bother with his 
JW> product line.

JW> Jeremy wrote:
>> We have one 5MHz channel available in our area, the rest was all 
>> claimed by wireless microphones - I am guessing by the University.
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 6:40 AM, Mark Radabaugh > > wrote:
>>
>> Too little, too late.  5Mhz (usable) channels.  Even with bonding
>> multiple channels together it’s not much bandwidth.   NAB
>> successfully killed it by insisting on way too strict OOB
>> filtering.  Carlson didn’t help it any with vaporware.  And now we
>> have NAB running around saying shared spectrum is a bad model
>> because it didn’t work in whitespace.  Sometime you can’t win.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>> On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of
>>> the poor rules and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want
>>> to do IOT type of stuff, isn't really qualified for broadband
>>> when your AP can only do 3-20mbps in 2018
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but
>>> then it went silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is
>>> there still something happenning?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>  
>>   Virus-free. www.avg.com 
>> 
>>  
>>
>>
>> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Jay Weekley]

Being sandwiched between two medium sized cities left us with few 
channels as well.  One of the few vendors that sell white space 
equipment even was nice enough to tell me don't even bother with his 
product line.


Jeremy wrote:
We have one 5MHz channel available in our area, the rest was all 
claimed by wireless microphones - I am guessing by the University.


On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 6:40 AM, Mark Radabaugh > wrote:


Too little, too late.  5Mhz (usable) channels.  Even with bonding
multiple channels together it’s not much bandwidth.   NAB
successfully killed it by insisting on way too strict OOB
filtering.  Carlson didn’t help it any with vaporware.  And now we
have NAB running around saying shared spectrum is a bad model
because it didn’t work in whitespace.  Sometime you can’t win.

Mark


On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout > wrote:

The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of
the poor rules and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want
to do IOT type of stuff, isn't really qualified for broadband
when your AP can only do 3-20mbps in 2018

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones
> wrote:

This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but
then it went silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is
there still something happenning?






 
	Virus-free. www.avg.com 
 



<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Mike Hammett]

It does change, though, so check back to Google's page every now and then. 

https://www.google.com/get/spectrumdatabase/channel/ 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Jeremy" <jeremysmi...@gmail.com> 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, March 2, 2018 9:53:14 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space? 


We have one 5MHz channel available in our area, the rest was all claimed by 
wireless microphones - I am guessing by the University. 


On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 6:40 AM, Mark Radabaugh < m...@amplex.net > wrote: 



Too little, too late. 5Mhz (usable) channels. Even with bonding multiple 
channels together it’s not much bandwidth. NAB successfully killed it by 
insisting on way too strict OOB filtering. Carlson didn’t help it any with 
vaporware. And now we have NAB running around saying shared spectrum is a bad 
model because it didn’t work in whitespace. Sometime you can’t win. 


Mark 





On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout < t...@voltbb.com > wrote: 


The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of the poor rules 
and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want to do IOT type of stuff, isn't 
really qualified for broadband when your AP can only do 3-20mbps in 2018 


On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones < thatoneguyst...@gmail.com > 
wrote: 



This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went 
silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something happenning? 

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Jeremy]

We have one 5MHz channel available in our area, the rest was all claimed by
wireless microphones - I am guessing by the University.

On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 6:40 AM, Mark Radabaugh  wrote:

> Too little, too late.  5Mhz (usable) channels.  Even with bonding multiple
> channels together it’s not much bandwidth.   NAB successfully killed it by
> insisting on way too strict OOB filtering.  Carlson didn’t help it any with
> vaporware.  And now we have NAB running around saying shared spectrum is a
> bad model because it didn’t work in whitespace.  Sometime you can’t win.
>
> Mark
>
> On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of the poor
> rules and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want to do IOT type of
> stuff, isn't really qualified for broadband when your AP can only do
> 3-20mbps in 2018
>
> On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went
>> silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
>> happenning?
>>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Mark Radabaugh]

Too little, too late.  5Mhz (usable) channels.  Even with bonding multiple 
channels together it’s not much bandwidth.   NAB successfully killed it by 
insisting on way too strict OOB filtering.  Carlson didn’t help it any with 
vaporware.  And now we have NAB running around saying shared spectrum is a bad 
model because it didn’t work in whitespace.  Sometime you can’t win.

Mark

> On Mar 1, 2018, at 11:57 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
> 
> The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of the poor 
> rules and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want to do IOT type of 
> stuff, isn't really qualified for broadband when your AP can only do 3-20mbps 
> in 2018
> 
> On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones  > wrote:
> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went 
> silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something happenning?
> 

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Sean Heskett]

it's available as part15 spectrum and there is equipment from a few
manufacturers.  BUT the TV broadcasters fought the rules so vigorously that
it isn't very viable for consumer internet needs.  the channel sizes are
6MHz (there might be channel bonding now to get  it to 12MHz but i stopped
paying attention long ago) and the mask on the channels are really tight so
it's difficult to use more than 4MHz, so basically throughput is really
low.  probably only good for IoT stuff nowadays.

oh there's also the goofy height above average terrain HAAT rules to
contend with.  and everything has to talk back to a SaS server to authorize
use.

pretty much a cluster f*ck of rules and regs that makes it unusable for
netflix type of interwebs.

-sean


On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 7:34 PM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went
> silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
> happenning?
>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[TJ Trout]

The equipment never really made it to market, I think because of the poor
rules and the jack of spectrum... dead unless you want to do IOT type of
stuff, isn't really qualified for broadband when your AP can only do
3-20mbps in 2018

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went
> silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
> happenning?
>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Eric Kuhnke]

Never saw a product that was priced anywhere near a reasonable figure for
AP and CPEs. For the money the typical WISP would be better off investing
in some sort of series of micro-POP relays and cambium 900 MHz in select
areas.

The Carlson product pricing was *really* nuts.

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 6:34 PM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went
> silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
> happenning?
>

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Bill Prince]

Spectrum is too limited, there are too many places where you can't get 
the guard bands you need. Restrictions on antenna height, equipment is 
too expensive, throughput never matched the hype, etc. etc. etc.



bp


On 3/1/2018 6:34 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it 
went silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something 
happenning?

Re: [AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Keefe John]

Microsoft and Connect Americans Now are pushing it hard. Right now there's not 
many equipment manufacturers and the equipment is very expensive. None of the 
big guys want to put money into developing new hardware due to regulatory 
uncertainty.

Keefe

On March 1, 2018 8:34:21 PM CST, Steve Jones  wrote:
>This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it
>went
>silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
>happenning?

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

[AFMUG] what happenned to white space?

[Steve Jones]

This was supposed to be like putting a monkey in shoes, but then it went
silent, is it essentially a dead duck or is there still something
happenning?