DIS: Re: BUS: Doomsday

[Owen Jacobson]

I thought it mightn’t. Thanks for the comprehensive breakdown. Of course, I had 
to try - that clause is spectacularly awkward to parse, and I don’t _think_ the 
interpretation where destroying Agora is a possible action is completely 
unreasonable, but I’ll happily admit I didn’t expect it to work, and I’d accept 
the card without qualm if someone called for it.

As far as actually doing something constructive goes, how do you feel about 
this wording?

> Each asset has exactly one owner. If an asset would otherwise lack an owner, 
> it is owned by Agora. If an asset's backing document restricts its ownership 
> to a class of entities, then that asset CANNOT be gained by or transferred to 
> an entity outside that class, and is destroyed if it is owned by an entity 
> outside that class other than Agora. Assets owned by Agora, for which Agora 
> is not in the class of entities which may own that asset, may be destroyed or 
> transferred by any player, without objection. The restrictions in this 
> paragraph are subject to modification by its backing document.


-o

> On Aug 17, 2017, at 1:29 AM, Aris Merchant 
>  wrote:
> 
> This doesn't work, for several reasons. First, I object. Second, the
> text in question is "If an asset's backing document restricts its
> ownership to a class of entities, then that asset CANNOT be gained by
> or transferred to an entity outside that class, and is destroyed if it
> is owned by an entity outside that class (except for Agora, in which
> case any player CAN transfer or destroy it without objection)." I
> think it's fairly clear from context that the "except for" qualifies
> the "entity outside that class". If not, destroying Agora would
> probably require Agora to be an asset. The Rule 217 factors weigh
> pretty heavily for the first one, and I can't see a judge siding with
> your interpretation. Finally, and most importantly, this would "cause
> Agora to cease to exist", and thus Rule 1698 specifies that "it is
> cancelled and does not occur, rules to the contrary notwithstanding."
> I'd point my finger for the 2471 vio, but 1. it's an intent; and 2. a
> green card would be perfectly reasonable under the circumstances.
> 
> -Aris
> 
> 
> On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 10:11 PM, Josh T  wrote:
>> On one hand, nifty. On the other hand, I think that it would be rather
>> unfortunate if we destroyed Agora, whatever that might mean. Thus:
>> 
>> I object to any intention that does not immediately result in 天火狐 in earning
>> a Black ribbon.
>> 
>> 天火狐
>> 
>> PS: I would love to see an argument that destroying Agora results in me
>> earning a Black ribbon, thus making my objection not relevant.
>> 
>> On 17 August 2017 at 00:50, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>>> 
>>> This time, with spelling.
>>> 
 On Aug 17, 2017, at 12:48 AM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
 
 Per Rule 2166 (“Assets”), I indent, without objection, to destroy Agora,
 no sooner than August 20th 2017, 01:00, Eastern time.
 
 -o
 
 (I don’t think that rule should say what it does, obviously, but I’m not
 sure what it actually says, either.)
>>> 
>>> Per Rule 2166 (“Assets”), I *intend*, without objection, to destroy Agora,
>>> no sooner than August 20th 2017, 01:00, Eastern time.
>>> 
>>> -o
>>> 
>> 



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Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Secretary] Weekly Report

[Aris Merchant]

On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 10:24 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
> On Aug 17, 2017, at 1:20 AM, Aris Merchant 
>  wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 10:18 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>>>
 On Aug 17, 2017, at 1:17 AM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:

 Secretary's Weekly Report

 Balances:

 85 Shinies  Agora
>>>
>>> As Secretary, I flip the Floating Level to 85.
>>>
>>> -o
>>>
>> CoE: It's the floating value.
>>
>> -Aris
>
> That’s the second time I’ve done that.
>
> -o
>

Look at me. I publish drafts of every Promotor report, check
everything like twice, and still manage to make mistakes on a pretty
regular basis. :)

-Aris

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Secretary] Weekly Report

[Owen Jacobson]

On Aug 17, 2017, at 1:20 AM, Aris Merchant  
wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 10:18 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>> 
>>> On Aug 17, 2017, at 1:17 AM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Secretary's Weekly Report
>>> 
>>> Balances:
>>> 
>>> 85 Shinies  Agora
>> 
>> As Secretary, I flip the Floating Level to 85.
>> 
>> -o
>> 
> CoE: It's the floating value.
> 
> -Aris

That’s the second time I’ve done that.

-o



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DIS: Re: BUS: [AVM] Destruction

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Wed, 16 Aug 2017, Owen Jacobson wrote:


I flip my Balance switch with the Agoran Voting Market to zero.


I think you mean "Budget".

Greetings,
Ørjan.

DIS: Idea: Honesty

[Aris Merchant]

Things seem a tad slow at the moment, so I thought I'd try and shake
things up a bit. I suggest bringing back the old rule against lying in
public (they didn't apply to discussion fora). It seems like it might
lead to interesting gameplay. I wasting thinking something along the
lines of the implementation here [1], in Rule 2215 (perhaps even a
reenactment)  My major change would be to add something saying that
yellow cards can/should be issued even when otherwise inappropriate,
or alternatively that attempts to mislead are rarely inconsequential.
Thoughts?

[1] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2009-March/005892.html

-Aris

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Promotor] Distribution of Proposals 7869-7871

[Aris Merchant]

On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 6:20 PM Owen Jacobson  wrote:

>
> > On Aug 5, 2017, at 2:12 AM, Aris Merchant <
> thoughtsoflifeandligh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > I hereby distribute each listed proposal, initiating the Agoran
> > Decision of whether to adopt it, and removing it from the proposal
> > pool. For this decision, the vote collector is the Assessor, the
> > quorum is 2.0 and the valid options are FOR and AGAINST (PRESENT is
> > also a valid vote).
> >
> >
> > ID  Author(s) AI   Title   Pender  Pend
> fee
> >
> ---
> > 7869*   babelian  2.0  Agoraculture v. 2.0 babelian10 sh.
> > 7870*   V.J Rada  2.0  Cards are appealable 2.0V.J Rada10 sh.
> > 7871*   V.J Rada  3.0  Minor fixes (sans typos)V.J Rada10 sh.
>
> As this is far too late for a CoE, the following is informational only:
> the actual pend fee paid for these three proposals was 6 sh. apiece, not
> 10. Please, in the future, note the amount you are paying to avoid this
> kind of confusion.
>
> -o
>
> My error. Luckily, that information doesn't self ratify, so no real harm
done. I'm glad you caught it though.

-Aris

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Not dead

[Josh T]

Here is a proposed word list:

* Antegrian
* Borduria
* Catharsis
* Deteriorate
* Exemplify
* Fastidious
* Garner
* Heron
* Incorrigible
* Jambalaya

天火狐

On 16 August 2017 at 20:00, Owen Jacobson  wrote:

>
> > On Aug 16, 2017, at 7:55 PM, Josh T  wrote:
> >
> > Can I come up with a wordlist to card you for tardiness?
>
> I pledge that, if I give myself a Yellow Card within the next 72 hours,
> and if Josh T publishes a proposed word list before I do so, I will use
> Josh T’s word list as the required word list for the apology condition on
> the Yellow Card, exactly once.
>
> -o
>
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Not dead

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Wed, 16 Aug 2017, Owen Jacobson wrote:


For each of the following, I point the finger at myself:


Actually, only the first one works, see Rule 2478, last paragraph.

Greetings,
Ørjan.

DIS: Re: BUS: Not dead

[Josh T]

Can I come up with a wordlist to card you for tardiness?

天火狐

On 16 August 2017 at 19:48, Owen Jacobson  wrote:

> For each of the following, I point the finger at myself:
>
> * Failing to publish the Secretary’s monthly report for August 2017 in a
> timely fashion.
> * Failing to publish the Secretary’s weekly report in a timely fashion.
> * Failing to publish the Surveyor's weekly report in a timely fashion.
> * Failing to publish the Referee's weekly report in a timely fashion.
> * Failing to resolve the August estate auction in a timely fashion.
>
> I further waggle my finger reprimandingly at myself for:
>
> * Not vacating offices or arranging cover before disappearing for an
> extended period.
>
> I’m back. I’m catching up. Thanks for your patience - I’m mildly surprised
> nobody deputised for me to handle my offices, but I’m grateful for that, as
> well, as I do enjoy those responsibilities.
>
> -o
>
>