Re: DIS: Not dead

[Publius Scribonius Scholasticus]

I am working on it some, but you should totally go for it. I am not far along 
and this system sounds good to me.

Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
p.scribonius.scholasti...@gmail.com



> On Jun 10, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> On Jun 9, 2017, at 9:01 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Sorry about the extended absence at a bad moment. I’m catching up, but I’m 
>> about 550 messages behind - bids and estates are a priority. Then I plan to 
>> issue myself a Card for the offices I’ve neglected before stepping down as 
>> Referee. Anyone have a suggestion for an apology word list?
> 
> Actually, perhaps stepping down would be premature (though if someone else 
> wants the job, I won’t object to deputization). Personally, my problem is 
> somewhere between time management and workload. I think the workload 
> elements, at least, are addressible in ways that make the game more 
> interesting.
> 
> We’ve got a lot of projects in flight; would anyone be averse to one more, to 
> rework rules enforcement along criminal justice lines? This isn’t new. As I 
> understand it, the rules have modelled “criminal justice” systems before. 
> Here’s my goals and the spin I want to put on it:
> 
> 1. Replace the requirement for an omniscient, omnibenevolent Referee officer 
> who can be penalized for ever missing an infraction with a 
> complaint-investigation process.
> 
> This does two things: it lessens the burden of the Referee job itself by 
> removing the requirement that the Referee make an effort to catch every last 
> rule infraction, and it engages everyone else more directly in ensuring that 
> the rules are followed.
> 
> 2. Expand and clarify the nature of referee-imposed punishments.
> 
> Right now, we have, basically, four kinds of punishment: gentle rebuke, 
> penalties to voting strength, total loss of voting strength, and ejection 
> from offices. These date back quite a ways, and we’ve built out a number of 
> new systems. I’d like to impose at least fines, as well as organization- and 
> agency-related penalties. (Folding Bankruptcy into the Referee’s job is one 
> option on that front.)
> 
> 3. Trials and appeals.
> 
> I’m inclined to use the Canadian model for this, and treat most things as 
> “summary offences.” This means that the factual trial can be a bench trial 
> performed by the investigator directly (usually the Referee, sometimes the 
> Arbitor or Prime Minister). However, the accused should be able to appeal the 
> rules issues through a CFJ, with the imposed punishment held in abeyance 
> until the CFJ is resolved. I’d probably also want to enhance CFJs to allow 
> card decisions to be remanded back to the investigator for retrial if it’s 
> clear on appeal that there are serious defects in the factual analysis.
> 
> Thoughts? I’m happy to do the work of writing it up, and it’d be something I 
> care enough about to see through. The current Referee’s office, though, I 
> think might be unworkable.
> 
> -o
> 

Re: DIS: Not dead

[V.J Rada]

I think criminal justice is a thing people want but aren't working on, if
you write a proposal I'm totally for it, referee is such a strange position.

On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 2:35 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:

> On Jun 9, 2017, at 9:01 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>
> > Hi folks,
> >
> > Sorry about the extended absence at a bad moment. I’m catching up, but
> I’m about 550 messages behind - bids and estates are a priority. Then I
> plan to issue myself a Card for the offices I’ve neglected before stepping
> down as Referee. Anyone have a suggestion for an apology word list?
>
> Actually, perhaps stepping down would be premature (though if someone else
> wants the job, I won’t object to deputization). Personally, my problem is
> somewhere between time management and workload. I think the workload
> elements, at least, are addressible in ways that make the game more
> interesting.
>
> We’ve got a lot of projects in flight; would anyone be averse to one more,
> to rework rules enforcement along criminal justice lines? This isn’t new.
> As I understand it, the rules have modelled “criminal justice” systems
> before. Here’s my goals and the spin I want to put on it:
>
> 1. Replace the requirement for an omniscient, omnibenevolent Referee
> officer who can be penalized for ever missing an infraction with a
> complaint-investigation process.
>
> This does two things: it lessens the burden of the Referee job itself by
> removing the requirement that the Referee make an effort to catch every
> last rule infraction, and it engages everyone else more directly in
> ensuring that the rules are followed.
>
> 2. Expand and clarify the nature of referee-imposed punishments.
>
> Right now, we have, basically, four kinds of punishment: gentle rebuke,
> penalties to voting strength, total loss of voting strength, and ejection
> from offices. These date back quite a ways, and we’ve built out a number of
> new systems. I’d like to impose at least fines, as well as organization-
> and agency-related penalties. (Folding Bankruptcy into the Referee’s job is
> one option on that front.)
>
> 3. Trials and appeals.
>
> I’m inclined to use the Canadian model for this, and treat most things as
> “summary offences.” This means that the factual trial can be a bench trial
> performed by the investigator directly (usually the Referee, sometimes the
> Arbitor or Prime Minister). However, the accused should be able to appeal
> the rules issues through a CFJ, with the imposed punishment held in
> abeyance until the CFJ is resolved. I’d probably also want to enhance CFJs
> to allow card decisions to be remanded back to the investigator for retrial
> if it’s clear on appeal that there are serious defects in the factual
> analysis.
>
> Thoughts? I’m happy to do the work of writing it up, and it’d be something
> I care enough about to see through. The current Referee’s office, though, I
> think might be unworkable.
>
> -o
>
>

Re: DIS: Not dead

[Owen Jacobson]

On Jun 9, 2017, at 9:01 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:

> Hi folks,
> 
> Sorry about the extended absence at a bad moment. I’m catching up, but I’m 
> about 550 messages behind - bids and estates are a priority. Then I plan to 
> issue myself a Card for the offices I’ve neglected before stepping down as 
> Referee. Anyone have a suggestion for an apology word list?

Actually, perhaps stepping down would be premature (though if someone else 
wants the job, I won’t object to deputization). Personally, my problem is 
somewhere between time management and workload. I think the workload elements, 
at least, are addressible in ways that make the game more interesting.

We’ve got a lot of projects in flight; would anyone be averse to one more, to 
rework rules enforcement along criminal justice lines? This isn’t new. As I 
understand it, the rules have modelled “criminal justice” systems before. 
Here’s my goals and the spin I want to put on it:

1. Replace the requirement for an omniscient, omnibenevolent Referee officer 
who can be penalized for ever missing an infraction with a 
complaint-investigation process.

This does two things: it lessens the burden of the Referee job itself by 
removing the requirement that the Referee make an effort to catch every last 
rule infraction, and it engages everyone else more directly in ensuring that 
the rules are followed.

2. Expand and clarify the nature of referee-imposed punishments.

Right now, we have, basically, four kinds of punishment: gentle rebuke, 
penalties to voting strength, total loss of voting strength, and ejection from 
offices. These date back quite a ways, and we’ve built out a number of new 
systems. I’d like to impose at least fines, as well as organization- and 
agency-related penalties. (Folding Bankruptcy into the Referee’s job is one 
option on that front.)

3. Trials and appeals.

I’m inclined to use the Canadian model for this, and treat most things as 
“summary offences.” This means that the factual trial can be a bench trial 
performed by the investigator directly (usually the Referee, sometimes the 
Arbitor or Prime Minister). However, the accused should be able to appeal the 
rules issues through a CFJ, with the imposed punishment held in abeyance until 
the CFJ is resolved. I’d probably also want to enhance CFJs to allow card 
decisions to be remanded back to the investigator for retrial if it’s clear on 
appeal that there are serious defects in the factual analysis.

Thoughts? I’m happy to do the work of writing it up, and it’d be something I 
care enough about to see through. The current Referee’s office, though, I think 
might be unworkable.

-o



signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP

Re: DIS: Not dead

[Josh T]

Oh how nice of yourself. I was going to issue you a card for not responding
to my CoE [1] in a timely manner with the following apology list:

pagoda
palsy
parsimony
petrichor
petunia
picaresque
pigeon
piquant
praxsis
primeval

[1] http://www.mail-archive.com/agora-business@agoranomic.org/msg28516.html

天火狐

On 9 June 2017 at 21:31, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:

> On Fri, 9 Jun 2017, Owen Jacobson wrote:
>
> Hi folks,
>>
>> Sorry about the extended absence at a bad moment. I’m catching up, but
>> I’m about 550 messages behind - bids and estates are a priority. Then I
>> plan to issue myself a Card for the offices I’ve neglected before stepping
>> down as Referee. Anyone have a suggestion for an apology word list?
>>
>
> caffeine
> cumulonimbus
> frisk
> lackadaisical
> molasses
> prithee
> stultify
> Tanganyika
> three-toed
> trepans
>
> Hope this helps,
> Ørjan.

Re: DIS: Not dead

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Fri, 9 Jun 2017, Owen Jacobson wrote:


Hi folks,

Sorry about the extended absence at a bad moment. I’m catching up, but 
I’m about 550 messages behind - bids and estates are a priority. Then I 
plan to issue myself a Card for the offices I’ve neglected before 
stepping down as Referee. Anyone have a suggestion for an apology word 
list?


caffeine
cumulonimbus
frisk
lackadaisical
molasses
prithee
stultify
Tanganyika
three-toed
trepans

Hope this helps,
Ørjan.

DIS: Not dead

[Owen Jacobson]

Hi folks,

Sorry about the extended absence at a bad moment. I’m catching up, but I’m 
about 550 messages behind - bids and estates are a priority. Then I plan to 
issue myself a Card for the offices I’ve neglected before stepping down as 
Referee. Anyone have a suggestion for an apology word list?

-o



signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP