Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
I had no idea that Agora was so indecisive :). I honestly think I would prefer the last one - but it sounds like it might make the Assessor's life not super fun. Jason Cobb On 7/7/19 3:21 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: On 7/7/2019 12:15 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: It's actually "evaluated continuously", in that it's whatever value it has when the actual voting is assessed. (the text is R955's "the voting strength is... the voting strength of the voter" which is whatever it is at a particular moment). Yes it allows for some after-the-voting-period manipulations! Just some random history - we've used *all* of the following at different times: - voting strength set at the beginning of voting period. - voting strength set at the end of voting period. - voting strength set when the ballot is cast. - voting strength set when decision is assessed (current method). - voting strength set at the beginning of the week in which the proposal is distributed. - each unit of voting strength is a separate ballot, you have to specify how many you cast and can do some at different times during the voting period, or split voting options.
Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
On 7/7/2019 12:15 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: It's actually "evaluated continuously", in that it's whatever value it has when the actual voting is assessed. (the text is R955's "the voting strength is... the voting strength of the voter" which is whatever it is at a particular moment). Yes it allows for some after-the-voting-period manipulations! Just some random history - we've used *all* of the following at different times: - voting strength set at the beginning of voting period. - voting strength set at the end of voting period. - voting strength set when the ballot is cast. - voting strength set when decision is assessed (current method). - voting strength set at the beginning of the week in which the proposal is distributed. - each unit of voting strength is a separate ballot, you have to specify how many you cast and can do some at different times during the voting period, or split voting options.
Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
On 7/7/2019 12:09 PM, Jason Cobb wrote: - Is the voting strength of the ballot evaluated when the decision is resolved or when the voting period ended? (I operated under the assumption that you had strength 3 because you weren't PM when the voting period closed (or if you were, I have got my memory of history very wrong)). It's actually "evaluated continuously", in that it's whatever value it has when the actual voting is assessed. (the text is R955's "the voting strength is... the voting strength of the voter" which is whatever it is at a particular moment). Yes it allows for some after-the-voting-period manipulations!
Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
On 7/7/2019 10:23 AM, Jason Cobb wrote: I deputise for Assessor to perform the following actions: Thanks for doing this! Couple things I noted: - in P8184 you use "accepted" instead of "adopted". - My voting strength is 4 due to being PM. - by my count, these proposals were distributed June 12 05:58:59 UTC, voting period ended June 19, and the assessor was first "late" (time limit for assessing expired) a week later on June 26. It won't be 14 days late until July 10, and D. Margaux still holds the office. So by R2160(4), you have to either give two days notice or wait until Jul 10 05:58:59 UTC before deputising (not much difference between the two options at this point!) -G.
Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
[Intentionally NTTPF. This is a draft assessment of Proposals 8180-8187. I'm posting this to agora-discussion first so that (a) someone else can steal this if they want to be Assessor, and (b) to get any errors caught before this gets submitted. I recognize that Assessor is probably not the best first office for a new player; but if nobody else wants the post, I'm okay with taking it for a little while] I deputise for Assessor to perform the following actions: I hereby resolve the Agoran decisions to adopt the below proposals. Each player has voting strength 3 unless otherwise noted. This is the latest Referee's report: https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2019-June/012933.html. This is presumed to be accurate, because, as the report notes, nothing can actually happen with Blots right now. Revisions from D. Margaux's attempted resolution: - Pursuant to H. Judge Falisfian's informal comments on CFJ 3751, Murphy and omd are counted as voters on all decisions. This is expected to become precedent soon. - CoE 0 is accepted; the decision on 8185 is amended to reflect this. - CoE 1 is accepted; all decisions are amended to reflect this. - twg's inextricable votes are changed to PRESENT, pursuant to Rule 2127/11: A conditional vote on an Agoran decision is a vote which indicates a vote based on some condition(s). A conditional vote is evaluated at the end of the voting period and, rules to the contrary notwithstanding, is clearly specified if and only if the value of the condition(s) is/are determinate at the end of the voting period. If the conditional is clearly specified, and evaluates to a valid vote, it is counted as that vote; otherwise, it is counted as PRESENT. CoE 0: https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2019-June/040667.html CoE 1: https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2019-June/040655.html PROPOSAL 8180 (Paying our Assessor) FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G., Telnaior, Murphy, omd AGAINST: PRESENT: twg*+ AI (F/A): 35/0 (AI=1) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: ADOPTED PROPOSAL 8181 (Referee CAN Impose Fines (v1.1)) FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, G., Telnaior, twg+, Murphy AGAINST: Walker PRESENT: Owen, omd AI (F/A): 27/3 (AI=1.7) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: ADOPTED PROPOSAL 8182 (Add value to zombies) FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, twg+, Murphy, omd AGAINST: Walker PRESENT: G., Telnaior AI (F/A): 27/3 (AI=3.0) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: ADOPTED PROPOSAL 8183 (Regulated Actions Reform) FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris AGAINST: Owen, Falsifian, Walker, G., Telnaior, twg+ PRESENT: Jason Cobb, Murphy, omd AI (F/A): 11/16 (AI=3.0) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: REJECTED PROPOSAL 8184 (power-limit precedence) FOR: Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Walker, G., Telnaior, twg+, Murphy, omd AGAINST: D. Margaux, L PRESENT: R. Lee#, Jason Cobb AI (F/A): 25/6 (AI=3.0) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: ACCEPTED PROPOSAL 8185 (OUGHT we?) FOR: Aris, Jason Cobb, G., Telnaior, omd, Falsifian AGAINST: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Owen, Walker PRESENT: Murphy, twg*+ AI (F/A): 18/14 (AI=3.0) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: REJECTED PROPOSAL 8186 (Minor currency fixes) FOR: D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G., Telnaior, twg+, omd AGAINST: PRESENT: R. Lee#, Murphy AI (F/A): 31/0 (AI=3.0) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: ADOPTED PROPOSAL 8187 (Not so indestructible now, eh?) FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G., Telnaior, twg+, omd AGAINST: PRESENT: Murphy AI (F/A): 33/0 (AI=3.0) BALLOTS: 13 (quorum 9) OUTCOME: ADOPTED --- * Vote is inextricable because it ENDORSED a non-voter, therefore it is counted as PRESENT. # Voting strength is 2 + Voting strength is 1 [Note to future self: include text of adopted proposals; not included here to reduce wall of text.] Jason Cobb On 7/7/19 6:27 AM, Rebecca wrote: Can someone deputise for the assessor? I'm too busy but it needs to be done more than any other job. On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 12:44 PM James Cook wrote: I don't think so. On Tue, 2 Jul 2019 at 06:08, Kerim Aydin wrote: Did the below proposals ever get resolved? -G. On 6/22/2019 4:37 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: CoE: This leaves out my votes on Telnaior's behalf, which change the outcome of at least one proposal I think (8184). On 6/22/2019 11:43 AM, D. Margaux wrote: I hereby resolve the Agoran decisions to adopt the below proposals. Each player has voting strength 3 unless otherwise noted. Murphy and omd sent messages that contained what appeared to be votes, but did not state that they did in fact cast those votes, so I have not counted them. PROPOSAL 8180 (Paying our Assessor) FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb,
Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
I don't think so. On Tue, 2 Jul 2019 at 06:08, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > Did the below proposals ever get resolved? -G. > > On 6/22/2019 4:37 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > CoE: This leaves out my votes on Telnaior's behalf, which change the > > outcome of at least one proposal I think (8184). > > > > On 6/22/2019 11:43 AM, D. Margaux wrote: > >> I hereby resolve the Agoran decisions to adopt the below proposals. Each > >> player has voting strength 3 unless otherwise noted. Murphy and omd sent > >> messages that contained what appeared to be votes, but did not state that > >> they did in fact cast those votes, so I have not counted them. > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8180 (Paying our Assessor) > >> > >> FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G. > >> > >> AGAINST: > >> > >> PRESENT: > >> > >> INEXTRICABLE: twg*+ > >> > >> AI (F/A): 26/0 (AI=1) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 9 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: ADOPTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8181 (Referee CAN Impose Fines (v1.1)) > >> > >> FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, G., twg+ > >> > >> AGAINST: Walker > >> > >> PRESENT: Owen > >> > >> AI (F/A): 21/3 (AI=1.7) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: ADOPTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8182 (Add value to zombies) > >> > >> FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, twg+ > >> > >> AGAINST: Walker > >> > >> PRESENT: G. > >> > >> AI (F/A): 21/3 (AI=3.0) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: ADOPTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8183 (Regulated Actions Reform) > >> > >> FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris > >> > >> AGAINST: Owen, Falsifian, Walker, G., twg+ > >> > >> PRESENT: Jason Cobb > >> > >> AI (F/A): 11/13 (AI=3.0) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: REJECTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8184 (power-limit precedence) > >> > >> FOR: Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Walker, G., twg+ > >> > >> AGAINST: D. Margaux, L > >> > >> PRESENT: R. Lee#, Jason Cobb > >> > >> AI (F/A): 16/6 (AI=3.0) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: REJECTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8185 (OUGHT we?) > >> > >> FOR: Aris, Jason Cobb, G. > >> > >> AGAINST: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Owen, Falsifian, Walker > >> > >> PRESENT: > >> > >> INEXTRICABLE: twg*+ > >> > >> AI (F/A): 9/16 (AI=3.0) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 9 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: REJECTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8186 (Minor currency fixes) > >> > >> FOR: D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G., twg+ > >> > >> AGAINST: > >> > >> PRESENT: R. Lee# > >> > >> AI (F/A): 25/0 (AI=3.0) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: ADOPTED > >> > >> > >> PROPOSAL 8187 (Not so indestructible now, eh?) > >> > >> FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G., > >> twg+ > >> > >> AGAINST: > >> > >> PRESENT: > >> > >> AI (F/A): 27/0 (AI=3.0) > >> > >> BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9) > >> > >> OUTCOME: ADOPTED > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> * Vote is inextricable because it ENDORSED a non-voter. > >> > >> # Voting strength is 2 > >> > >> + Voting strength is 1 > >> > >> > >> > >> The full text of the ADOPTED proposals are included below. > >> > >> > >> // > >> > >> ID: 8180 > >> > >> Title: Paying our Assessor > >> > >> Adoption index: 1.0 > >> > >> Author: Trigon > >> > >> Co-authors: D Margaux > >> > >> > >> > >> [ Comment: This is something I didn't include from the version of > >> > >> Rule 2496 that I didn't include for whatever reason. ] > >> > >> > >> To Rule 2496 "Rewards" add the following bullet point after the third > >> > >> one: > >> > >>"Resolving an Agoran Decision on whether to adopt a proposal, > >> > >>provided that no other Agoran Decision on whether to adopt that or any > >> > >>other proposal had been resolved earlier in that Agoran week: 5 coins." > >> > >> > >> // > >> > >> ID: 8181 > >> > >> Title: Referee CAN Impose Fines (v1.1) > >> > >> Adoption index: 1.7 > >> > >> Author: D Margaux > >> > >> Co-authors: Falsifian, twg > >> > >> > >> > >> Amend Rule 2478 to replace this text: > >> > >> > >>“When a player Points a Finger, the investigator SHALL investigate the > >> > >>allegation and, in a timely fashion, SHALL conclude the investigation > >> by:” > >> > >> > >> With this text: > >> > >> > >>“When a player Points a Finger, the investigator SHALL investigate the > >> > >>allegation and CAN, and in a timely fashion SHALL, conclude the > >> investigation > >> > >>by:” > >> > >> > >> // > >> > >> ID: 8182 > >> > >> Title: Add value to zombies > >> > >> Adoption index: 3.0 > >> > >> Author: Jason Cobb > >> > >> Co-authors: > >> > >> > >> > >> Amend Rule 2574 as follows: > >> > >> > >>Replace the text > >> > >> "Resale is a secured natural switch for zombies" > >> > >>with the text >
DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8180-8187
Did the below proposals ever get resolved? -G.
On 6/22/2019 4:37 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote:
CoE: This leaves out my votes on Telnaior's behalf, which change the
outcome of at least one proposal I think (8184).
On 6/22/2019 11:43 AM, D. Margaux wrote:
I hereby resolve the Agoran decisions to adopt the below proposals. Each
player has voting strength 3 unless otherwise noted. Murphy and omd sent
messages that contained what appeared to be votes, but did not state that
they did in fact cast those votes, so I have not counted them.
PROPOSAL 8180 (Paying our Assessor)
FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G.
AGAINST:
PRESENT:
INEXTRICABLE: twg*+
AI (F/A): 26/0 (AI=1)
BALLOTS: 9 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: ADOPTED
PROPOSAL 8181 (Referee CAN Impose Fines (v1.1))
FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, G., twg+
AGAINST: Walker
PRESENT: Owen
AI (F/A): 21/3 (AI=1.7)
BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: ADOPTED
PROPOSAL 8182 (Add value to zombies)
FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, twg+
AGAINST: Walker
PRESENT: G.
AI (F/A): 21/3 (AI=3.0)
BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: ADOPTED
PROPOSAL 8183 (Regulated Actions Reform)
FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris
AGAINST: Owen, Falsifian, Walker, G., twg+
PRESENT: Jason Cobb
AI (F/A): 11/13 (AI=3.0)
BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: REJECTED
PROPOSAL 8184 (power-limit precedence)
FOR: Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Walker, G., twg+
AGAINST: D. Margaux, L
PRESENT: R. Lee#, Jason Cobb
AI (F/A): 16/6 (AI=3.0)
BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: REJECTED
PROPOSAL 8185 (OUGHT we?)
FOR: Aris, Jason Cobb, G.
AGAINST: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Owen, Falsifian, Walker
PRESENT:
INEXTRICABLE: twg*+
AI (F/A): 9/16 (AI=3.0)
BALLOTS: 9 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: REJECTED
PROPOSAL 8186 (Minor currency fixes)
FOR: D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G., twg+
AGAINST:
PRESENT: R. Lee#
AI (F/A): 25/0 (AI=3.0)
BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: ADOPTED
PROPOSAL 8187 (Not so indestructible now, eh?)
FOR: R. Lee#, D. Margaux, L, Aris, Owen, Falsifian, Jason Cobb, Walker, G.,
twg+
AGAINST:
PRESENT:
AI (F/A): 27/0 (AI=3.0)
BALLOTS: 10 (quorum 9)
OUTCOME: ADOPTED
* Vote is inextricable because it ENDORSED a non-voter.
# Voting strength is 2
+ Voting strength is 1
The full text of the ADOPTED proposals are included below.
//
ID: 8180
Title: Paying our Assessor
Adoption index: 1.0
Author: Trigon
Co-authors: D Margaux
[ Comment: This is something I didn't include from the version of
Rule 2496 that I didn't include for whatever reason. ]
To Rule 2496 "Rewards" add the following bullet point after the third
one:
"Resolving an Agoran Decision on whether to adopt a proposal,
provided that no other Agoran Decision on whether to adopt that or any
other proposal had been resolved earlier in that Agoran week: 5 coins."
//
ID: 8181
Title: Referee CAN Impose Fines (v1.1)
Adoption index: 1.7
Author: D Margaux
Co-authors: Falsifian, twg
Amend Rule 2478 to replace this text:
“When a player Points a Finger, the investigator SHALL investigate the
allegation and, in a timely fashion, SHALL conclude the investigation by:”
With this text:
“When a player Points a Finger, the investigator SHALL investigate the
allegation and CAN, and in a timely fashion SHALL, conclude the
investigation
by:”
//
ID: 8182
Title: Add value to zombies
Adoption index: 3.0
Author: Jason Cobb
Co-authors:
Amend Rule 2574 as follows:
Replace the text
"Resale is a secured natural switch for zombies"
with the text
"Resale value is a secured natural switch for zombies".
Replace the text "Resale value" in the third item of the only list
with the text "resale value".
//
ID: 8186
Title: Minor currency fixes
Adoption index: 3.0
Author: Jason Cobb
Co-authors:
Amend Rule 2578 ("Currencies") as follows:
Replace all instances of the text '"Agora's official currency"' with
the text "the official currency of Agora". [Note: this strikes the
quotation marks]
Amend Rule 2549 ("Auction Initiation") as follows:
Replace all instances of the text "Agora's official currency" with
the text "the official currency of Agora".
Amend Rule 2483 ("Economics") as follows:
Replace the text "Coins are the official currency of Agora tracked
by the Treasuror." with the text "Coins are the official currency of
Agora and are tracked by the Treasuror."
//
ID: 8187
Title: Not so indestructible now, eh?
Adoption index: 3.0
Author: Jason
