[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-07-18 Thread kla
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User kla changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  Status|VERIFIED  |CLOSED





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Jul 18 12:31:30 + 
2008 ---
Seen ok in current master - closed

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-05-23 Thread argelgastelum
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User argelgastelum changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  CC|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,iha,j|',argelgastelum,cloph,dcar
|bfaure,jeongkyu,joergwarte|rera,ec4,iha,jbfaure,jeong
|nberg,michelar,mmp,pagalme|kyu,joergwartenberg,michel
|s,tonygalmiche'   |ar,mmp,pagalmes,tonygalmic
|  |he'





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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-05-20 Thread mfigrs
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tue May 20 20:24:27 + 
2008 ---
I have just read he comment from davidbl on RLPLOT and checked that out. It is
EXCELLENT! It's so much work already done!

Why not incorporate it into OO, either as a component, or as an add-on?

That would be marvellous!

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-05-14 Thread phyrexicaid
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed May 14 18:56:20 + 
2008 ---
Sorry to post another comment to this bug, but since this bug is now closed
and it still has 131 votes, please consider moving your votes to ISSUE #42946
(error bars for x values) 

It is both an interoperability issue (as MSOffice has this functionality) and a
usability issue (as it limits the usefulness of OpenOffice for science 
students).

/soapbox

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-05-08 Thread phyrexicaid
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu May  8 15:19:21 + 
2008 ---
I wish to thank all the people that worked on this. 
I hope all my fellow scientist in this thread now 
follow up to their promises here and pollute all 
lab computers with OO.org 3.0. 

Nice thought, but not until ISSUE #42946 gets implemented:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=42946

Still a deal breaker for many scientists.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-05-07 Thread moondrake
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu May  8 04:22:39 + 
2008 ---
Bug 366. When I first reported it, a bit over 7 years ago, I thought I would 
soon switch to OO.org after this was fixed. Much has happened since then. I 
became so much involved in free software that I switched to openoffice.org 
anyway. Even although I did my graphs with other programs (gnumeric, for all 
has fallacies, had lately become the most easy tool for quick graphs though).

Actually, spreadsheets are not that suitable for publication quality graphs, 
but it is nice to have something for quick and easy data inspection or the 
weekly talk.

I wish to thank all the people that worked on this. I hope all my fellow 
scientist in this thread now follow up to their promises here and pollute all 
lab computers with OO.org 3.0. 

Cheers,

Danny


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-29 Thread kla
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 29 11:25:36 + 
2008 ---
Created an attachment (id=51811)
Testcasespec for Y Error Bars


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-29 Thread kla
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User kla changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  Status|RESOLVED  |VERIFIED





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 29 12:15:17 + 
2008 ---
Seen ok in CWS chart20 - verified

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-29 Thread meuge
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 29 14:43:18 + 
2008 ---
Can we get an idea of when this change will make it into the binaries? Is this
going to be a September '08, OpenOffice 3.0 thing, or will it be available
beforehand.

Thanks in advance, and thanks for your hard work. When this change goes through,
I will finally be rid of my need for Gnumeric to do data analysis. 

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-26 Thread bm
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User bm changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

 Assigned to|bm|kla





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tue Feb 26 10:07:06 + 
2008 ---
-TK: Please verify in CWS chart20.

As this fix required some profound changes in the XML filter for charts with own
data, it is important to test load/save of charts with own data and clipboard
from Calc (charts taking data from sheets) to Impress thoroughly.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-22 Thread bm
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User bm changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  Status|STARTED   |RESOLVED

  Resolution|  |FIXED





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 22 16:07:19 + 
2008 ---
Fixed in CWS chart20.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-22 Thread pagalmes
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 22 16:09:24 + 
2008 ---
Is there a spec about how this was implemented?

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-22 Thread bm
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User bm changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

 URL|  |http://specs.openoffice.or
|  |g/chart/ErrorBars.odt





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 22 16:14:41 + 
2008 ---
Setting URL to Spec.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2008-02-22 Thread pagalmes
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Feb 22 16:35:48 + 
2008 ---
Thanks Björn !

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-11-21 Thread jbfaure
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User jbfaure changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  CC|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,iha,j|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,iha,j
|eongkyu,joergwartenberg,mi|bfaure,jeongkyu,joergwarte
|chelar,mmp,pagalmes,tonyga|nberg,michelar,mmp,pagalme
|lmiche'   |s,tonygalmiche'





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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-09-19 Thread davidbl
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Sep 19 07:22:17 + 
2007 ---
Why not use RLPLOT as an add-on for scientific/statistical graphs?It would be
great if RLPLOT could be included in future versions of OOo.
There is a great scientific and academic community out there that is spending a
lot of money in MSExcel, why not helping them now:

Can anyone code an extension for using RLPLOT in combination with OOo 2.X? (Im
sure the rlplot people would be delighted to help with that)

http://rlplot.sourceforge.net/index.html
http://rlplot.sourceforge.net/Examples/index.html


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-09-12 Thread iha
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User iha changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

Target milestone|OOo 2.x   |OOo 3.0





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Sep 12 09:26:51 + 
2007 ---
setting target

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-13 Thread ap78
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Apr 13 13:32:16 + 
2007 ---
@enmane: I downloaded and tested the new chart, and I'm disappointed. But I also
gave up with calc anf I go on using Excel, which still is far superior in many
fields.

It's impossible after such a long time not to have basic (yes, they are basic
and not advanced as someone think) functionalies like non-linear regressions.
I'm not interested in seeing a plot of the regression, but in obtaining an
equation in some click without using a different application.

This and other features are postponed without a clear reason, and help from
users is not accepted if not in terms of an already ready solution.

It's really sad to say, but in this way OOo is going nowhere.

Regards

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-13 Thread harlan879
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Apr 13 13:41:06 + 
2007 ---
Developers, just to be clear, we users are well aware of the complexity of the
OOo codebase and the amount of work that it will take to implement this and
other essential features. We don't expect miracles.

We do expect an apology for not recognizing the seriousness of this problem, and
for not making it a higher priority earlier on. An acknowledgment that serious
mistakes have been made in the past would make a lot of scientific users much
more willing to support you in the future. Defensiveness does not breed the
things you need the most: evangelism and contributions.

Thank you for your work on this project. I use OOo for simple data analysis, and
supplement it with Matlab and statistical packages for more complex work, and
Grace for graphs. I look forward to being able to use Impress for scientific
presentations without having to import external images for graphs with error 
bars.


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-13 Thread pagalmes
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Apr 13 14:06:02 + 
2007 ---
Please, stop flames !

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-13 Thread ap78
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Apr 13 14:14:51 + 
2007 ---
@pagalmes

Sorry, I didn't mean to flame. I was just commenting and explaining my point of
view. 
I also recognize the good work done on other parts of OOo like writer, which is
superior to Word in my opinion, and thanks to Novell efforts now is more
compatible with the MS formats too.

Regards

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-12 Thread karl_kashofer
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 12 18:08:44 + 
2007 ---
This is the single issue which stops me from being happy with my linux system. 
I am a scientist and as many of my colleagues have already noted, Openoffice 
Calc is USELESS without this feature.

Please, its been more than 6 years since this was first reported.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-12 Thread mrv
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 12 19:05:48 + 
2007 ---
Adding noise and pleas in this bug report only delays possible development, if
anything. Please keep silent (and just use the Vote for this issue -feature)
unless you have some real contribution to make, probably some code patch or
other thing that has taken you countless hours to develop and aids the real
development work in a significant way, while at the same time being aware all
the development that has been done in so far, ie. having read mailing lists for
some months etc. and being comfortable with the OOo code base.

Anyway, the content of this particular noise message is to re-iterate that
Chart2 has been under construction for a long time now, which may or may not
include all the Chart features people want, and may be possibly included in
OpenOffice.org 2.3, coming out in September. If you want to help in developing
to make sure your feature will be there, you join the mailing lists, get the
source code and develop. Adding comments in bug reports when the bug has been
already described does not help, quite the opposite.

Thanks. Hopefully this will be the end of noise. (unfortunately I've a feeling
it's not...)


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-12 Thread enmane
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 12 19:50:20 + 
2007 ---
mrv, 
many of us are not coders and can't help in this fashion.  I understand your
frustration but understand mine - I've offered to help a coder with the math
involved in regression analysis and haven't been taken up on my offer and that
says something about the team.

To the rest of you,
  Download a copy of the currently-being-developed Chart 2 and try it out.  I've
already created 3 bug reports on it.  If you don't voice your opinions now then
it will most likely be another 6 yrs before you get your feature included.  In
summary, do the following:
1) VOTE - use your points to vote for the issues that are important to you
2) Stop beating this dead horse-they are working on Chart 2 so focus your
energies on fixing Chart 2
3) If you aren't happy with the current implementations and want to try your
luck on something being developed then work with Chart 2 which should have
some of the features your looking for and vote for the features that are 
missing!

Turn your frustrations into positive actions.  Play the game properly!

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-04-03 Thread iha
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User iha changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  CC|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,jeong|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,iha,j
|kyu,joergwartenberg,michel|eongkyu,joergwartenberg,mi
|ar,mmp,pagalmes,tonygalmic|chelar,mmp,pagalmes,tonyga
|he'   |lmiche'

Target milestone|OOo Later |OOo 2.x





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tue Apr  3 16:45:22 + 
2007 ---
changed target to 2.x

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-03-22 Thread lunarcab
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Mar 22 09:26:27 + 
2007 ---
- pagalmes: May be I got it wrong, but it comes out that for the issue tracker 
the first post should be the only one, and anyone (excluding the initiator) 
shouldn't make noise and has to just vote if he/she agrees with it. What 
about discussing all pros and cons for the issue? Should it be held separately 
somewhere?

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-03-05 Thread pagalmes
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Mar  5 09:03:09 + 
2007 ---
- lunacarb: please avoid making noise. Consider posting on the issue only if
you add real value to it. What coud be better, is ask how you could help to make
things faster. As enmane said, testing the new version is a way to help. 

- enmane: thanks for your reply ;-)

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-03-04 Thread lunarcab
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sun Mar  4 17:11:38 + 
2007 ---
Hi guys!
It's really strange that custom error bars feature still has not been 
implemented in OO. I am a system administrator in a big scientific institution 
and I can say that for now absence of this feature for us seems to be THE ONLY 
major factor hindering transfer from MS Office to OO. Using Calc without this 
feature in a scientific setting isn't worth using Calc at all, because, as 
opposed to common office tasks, research calculations almost always should 
result in barred charts with custom error bars (by the way, most scientific 
journals just will not accept an article if your chart doesn't have them). As 
it's been stated here already, scientific society is one of the most useful and 
perspective fields for spreading and implementation of OO. Well, I understand 
that the current list of wishes for Calc's improvements is quite big, but the 
discussed feature should be, of course, placed to the beginning of it.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-03-04 Thread lunarcab
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sun Mar  4 17:21:15 + 
2007 ---
3

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-02-18 Thread icefischer
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sun Feb 18 22:42:18 + 
2007 ---
I must agree that selecting a range for errorbars is the most important feature
I am missing in OOcalc. I do not want to repeat the arguments which are already
listed above.

Unfortunately I have no real programming skills to contribute to this issue. But
perhaps it is helpful to point out, that this errorbar feature is already
implemented in gnumeric. The source code of gnumeric is free. I do not know if
it is possible, but it might be easier to transfer this code from gnumeric to OO
instead of reinventing the wheel.


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2007-01-02 Thread pagalmes
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User pagalmes changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  CC|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,jeong|',cloph,dcarrera,ec4,jeong
|kyu,joergwartenberg,michel|kyu,joergwartenberg,michel
|ar,mmp,tonygalmiche'  |ar,mmp,pagalmes,tonygalmic
|  |he'





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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-12-06 Thread ace_dent
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Dec  6 09:39:59 -0800 
2006 ---
*** Issue 72322 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-11-27 Thread kla
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Nov 27 05:11:55 -0800 
2006 ---
*** Issue 71948 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-10-08 Thread derekhtodd
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sun Oct  8 16:07:09 -0700 
2006 ---
**ALL MEMBERS ADDING COMMENTS PLEASE READ** Thank you

**It would be useful if future commenters could please reread the initial
Summary and Description at the top of the page, as you could be wasting your
time and that of the OOo team by putting your comments on the wrong issue. It
could also risk invalidating the original issue by diluting it with material
irrelvant to this issue, making it difficult to interpret, which would be a
great shame.**

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-10-05 Thread discoleo
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Oct  5 11:23:28 -0700 
2006 ---
A MORE COMPREHENSIVE APPROACH
=

Many issues were discussed in this thread (beyond the original posting). Please
note however, that there is a more general approach to all the issues listed.

WE DO NOT NEED TO REINVENT THE WHEEL!

See also the wiki page on statistical methods
(http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Statistical_Data_Analysis_Tool ,
especially the paragraph 6 - Task Breakdown - Third Party Library Integration).
and the issue http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=66589 (R
Statistical Software, which aims at integrating R with OOo Calc).

Implementing all this issues directly into OOo Calc will be difficult.

DISADVANTAGES
-
 - many resources (coders, even financial constraints)
 - code becomes more and more complex, more difficult to understand by new
developers, more testing time needed
 - experienced coders work already on other open source projects; less
availability for a new project

ALTERNATIVE
---
 - a very good alternative is to do all these advanced things with dedicated
external software, when such free alternatives exist:
  -- I have read something about gnuplot on this thread.
  -- There are other softwares as well, e.g. R (with over 500 packages), octave
and many more, each suitable for some specific task.

ADVANTAGE
-
 - one can easily implement many more features from the specific program with
minimal effort (once the external program is embedded within OOo)
 - dedicated programs offer more advanced solutions than anything that would be
implemented in OOo (or some competitive software)
 - less resources needed:
  -- programs are developed by their own groups,
  -- tested by appropriate folks and therefore
  -- NO major delays, less propensity for bugs
  -- new features are implemented more easily (we at OOo need only make a new
Menu/Gui and paste the correct syntax to the external program)
 - smaller code, smaller program
  -- should also run faster, not so many resources loaded
  -- only users that need that option will run it (see also the note below)


A special note:
 - because some licenses may not be compatible with OOo (although they are still
open source), I DO NOT MEAN including the code in OOo
 - what I mean is a general mechanism in place that allows OOo to communicate
(bidirectioanly) with the external software
 - instruct users what external programs (extensions) do exist and where to find
them (url)
 - allow users to easily acces the functionality of that programs through OOo
Menus (or functions):
  -- e.g. R is a state-of-the-art statistical software, but it is NOT
menu-driven and most users will find it difficult to use, so implement handy
menus in OOo that paste the correct syntax into R (R can be embedded in other
implications, see paragraph 7 - Links, on the wiki page).


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-10-05 Thread discoleo
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Oct  5 11:31:21 -0700 
2006 ---
There is a previous comment that fits very well to my post on external software
integration. (Sorry for the double post)

 I'm beginning to wonder that WHEN these features
 do appear whether or not they'll actually be worth using
 based on a technical standpoint.  If the coders aren't working
 with people that know how to do numerical methods then what are
 the odds that it'll even come out correctly ...

This is another strong reason why external software are a better alternative!

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-10-05 Thread ap78
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Oct  5 14:09:50 -0700 
2006 ---
I can only partially agree with discoleo. Using external applications for
advanced statistical analysis is probably the best choice from a technical point
of view.

However there's no doubt that the absence of statistical tools in OpenOffice
represents a serious limitation for users and, as consequence, for the adoption
of OpenOffice in many work places such as labs, schools, universties.

I think more factors should be considered.
Using external applications requires the user to install and learn how to use
them, which is usually more difficult than working with a spreadsheet. For
example, doing a regression in Excel is just some click.

Also, another important factor is that many applications used to manage analysis
instruments in labs save data in a spreadsheet format (usually xls). So it's
immediate to manipulate data in Excel or Calc, while it would require
conversions to use external software.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-09-25 Thread bm
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Sep 25 01:04:20 -0700 
2006 ---
-thfil, enmane: Reading all the comments in this issue it should be clear for
everyone what the situation is. Repeating the same stuff again and again doesn't
help anyone, it only increases the number of comments thus renders this issue
more and more useless. Please note again that this is not a discussion forum.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-09-23 Thread thfil
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sat Sep 23 08:43:30 -0700 
2006 ---
The barrage of comments over the past 3 or more years says it all.  If Calc is
to be suitable for serious scientific work, it must have error bar capabilities
at least equal to those of Excel, and must display error bars from an Excel
file. Is the continuing lack of this feature evidence of a disconnect between
the OOo team and scientists? 

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-09-23 Thread enmane
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sat Sep 23 11:18:25 -0700 
2006 ---
It's more fundamental than that and has always been the problem when CS people
lose touch with what the clients are looking for.  

I've made myself available on numerous occassions as a numerical methods person
(not a coder) and I haven't heard a single thing from a single coder asking for
any input.  At this point, I don't care anymore.

I'm beginning to wonder that WHEN these features do appear whether or not
they'll actually be worth using based on a technical standpoint.  If the coders
aren't working with people that know how to do numerical methods then what are
the odds that it'll even come out correctly - this is a SERIOUS problem with MS
Excel and very few scientists use the results from Excel in technical journals
because of it's deficiencies.  A simple google search will show this.


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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-09-19 Thread iha
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tue Sep 19 02:20:05 -0700 
2006 ---
*** Issue 69423 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-09-18 Thread iha
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Sep 18 05:29:47 -0700 
2006 ---
*** Issue 69423 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-08-24 Thread bm
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366


User bm changed the following:

What|Old value |New value

  Status|NEW   |STARTED





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Aug 24 01:25:15 -0700 
2006 ---
-enmane: What do you think will you achieve by your rant here? Of course we
know the difference between regression analysis and error bars. If would take a
look at the product you are talking about you would see that these are different
things and that they are, apart from some missing features (e.g. this one), the
same as in MS Excel.

I won't explain why we haven't implemented this feature as I think I have done
this often enough. We can start new features only when the basis for this has
been done, so you have to be patient. Ranting doesn't help. Helping in
development would. We are two people re-implementing the chart. So far in all
this years we just got one developer who just started some small 
implementations.

So may be I am allowed to rant, too. Why do you guys think when you get a
software for FREE and do NOTHING for it apart from ranting, that we should
listen to you. We will implement this feature, when we finished chart2 and have
the time for it. Period.

So, if anybody has some constructive advice, a specification for how to
implement this feature, you are welcome to help. If you think this issue is
important, you can vote for it, but as you can see a high vote count does not
mean that this is implemented immediately, because in the current chart
implementation it is impossible to implement this feature, so we all have to
wait until the re-implementation is finished before we can care about this 
issue.

And if you think we are stupid then either tell us what we misunderstood or shut
up, as this kind of rant doesn't help anybody. (It just takes time again to
write this comment, that could have been used for doing real work)

And what do you mean by what we are looking for? I think the summary is very
clear: this issue is about Select 'Range' for error bars and nothing else.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-08-24 Thread drojo1
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Aug 24 08:56:03 -0700 
2006 ---
First of all, thank you bm and the OO team for your efforts in doing the
programming for the charting in OO. In regards to this issue, I think that there
is a high level of frustration among OO users due to the fact that this feature
is critical for serious use of OO in some fields, including scientific research.
This prevents me and many others to use and/or promote OO among colleages and
force us to go back to use MS Office, in spite of our preference for OO or
Staroffice. 
I understand that it is heavy work and I whish I could help, but I am not a
programmer. I concluded that the best way for someone like me to help is
topromote OO use, and that is why frustration is high, because I cannot until
issues like this are resolved.

Daniel





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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-08-24 Thread enmane
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Aug 24 09:56:01 -0700 
2006 ---
sorry if I've made you upset but there is no reason that my post on

Tue Feb 10 11:00:30 -0700 2004

should be in the same Issue 366.  That post was about regression analysis and
curve fitting and not error bars.  The fact that they were lumped together
implies that they are the same thing when they are, in fact, not.

Please see that post again and re-read it as I DID offer to help.  I am not a
great coder although I have coded in C, C++, Fortran, Pascal, and Basic but it
has been a while.  I do know regression analysis and statistics.  You let me
know what it is that you guys are lacking and if I can contribute then I will.

I agree 100% with Daniel - I've STOPPED promoting this package because it really
doesn't compare w/MS Office at all.  Sure it has a few features that are really
great and even better than MS Office but as a whole, it is still a decade
behind.  Now that 2007 is coming out, it'll fall even further behind.  

I still believe that the original implementation was vastly superior - 1 desktop
that handles everything - and Sun made a mistake in wasting all those resources
in splitting up the packages and beautification when it could have gone to added
real features that were lacking.  This clearly shows why Sun, as a company,
hasn't done well in decades.  Having 2 people working on this is ridiculous.

to clarify your post on 
So may be I am allowed to rant, too. Why do you guys think when you get a
software for FREE and do NOTHING for it apart from ranting, that we should
listen to you. We will implement this feature, when we finished chart2 and have
the time for it. Period.

--  Well, I know that I feel that my time is very valuable and I want to
promote OO but when I waste considerable time on features that don't exist then
it costs me money, if time=money.  The money that is spent isn't only the money
that is laid down for a package.  I feel lied to when the promotions come out
talking about how great OO is and I waste my time to download it and promote it
only to find out little significant (to me) progress has been made.  The fact
remains that people value their time and wasting it upsets me.  My reputation is
on the line when I promote this package only to find out that there are still
missing features.  I want to help and promote it but I won't do that anymore
because of the history of development and lack of features.  So YEAH, I feel
justified in bitching about it because OO has cost me considerable time,
resources, and has affected my reputation with regards to this package.  Not all
things are measured in greenbacks that have been pulled from one's wallet and
one could argue that the really important things aren't measured with greenbacks
at all.

BM, your efforts and the other person are greatly appreciated.  My issue isn't
with you but the fact that Sun isn't allocating their resources effectively on
the issues that are critical.

Sun should take this example into consideration,
Buy MS OFfice for $100 (very easy to find price)- all features included and 
provided
Person pays nothing for OO - cost $0 but spends at least 5 hours over the course
of 4 yrs finding ways to do things such as,
* creating good looking templates that already exist in MSO
* doing proper plotting
* productivity losses due to speed differences
* exporting filtering issues
* getting multimedia to play correctly in OOImpress (windows AND linux)
* figuring out how to get things done in OO vs MSO
At a cost of $20/hr (cheap, if you ask me) then the person would be better off
with MSO because they would have saved time and NOT been frustrated.  Now,
consider that a 5 hr loss over 4 yrs is very conservative, I know that I've
wasted that in a few months on OOImpress.  Consider that $20/hr is pretty cheap
her in the US and you'll see that OO has a very tough battle ahead of it.  If
there is any wonder why people aren't using it, just point the Sun executives to
this example.  
  I would be better off using MSOffice both for reasons of frustration and lost
time/money.  Based on this example, the only ones that would use OO are those
that just cannot afford to lay out MSO or those that want to promote it at the
expense of wasting their time (for whatever reason such as dislike of MSO and
wanting to see a true competitor); well, I know I fall into the latter camp
along with many of the posters here and we are walking away one after another
because eventually we realize that the shine on OO has lost its luster.
  So unless Sun makes some changes real quickly then the ones that are using it
but can afford it are going to walk away if they haven't already.  It just isn't
worth our time.  Heck, I know that I'd even offer $$ if the package was anywhere
near MSO but it isn't and I'm not about to give money to a 

[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-08-24 Thread derekhtodd
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Aug 24 16:31:08 -0700 
2006 ---
Please, everyone, any comments not of direct relevance to the techical aspects
of implementing this issue should be mailed directly, or taken to the mailing
lists, where they belong.

Issuezilla is not a discussion forum, and this is wasting everyones time and
benefiting nobody. If anyone feels that they absolutely must respond to this
(and I'd very much rather they didn't), please mail directly and not add more
unhelpful noise. And yes, I do realise that I've added to it, but hopefully to a
constructive end.

Thank you.

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-08-23 Thread enmane
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Aug 23 11:09:38 -0700 
2006 ---
Earth to OOCalc developers!

Please pick up a statistics book and look into the difference between regression
analysis and error bars - they are NOT THE SAME!

This has gone on long enough - 5 yrs and there still isn't someone at OO that
knows what the heck we're talking about.  Please pick up a book and read up on
what it is we're looking for or to make life easier then go find a scientist
that uses MS Excel and just ask them to show you what it is we're talking about.

And I thought MS was slow...

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[graphics-issues] [Issue 366] Select 'Range' for error bar s

2006-08-22 Thread smith_cc
To comment on the following update, log in, then open the issue:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=366





--- Additional comments from [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tue Aug 22 12:48:13 -0700 
2006 ---
As a biologist, I heartily agree with the comments above. Any scientist will
tell you that adding custom error bars is absolutely critical for presenting
data. Any  presentation of data without this feature would be immediately
rejected from publication and laughed out of a symposium. I can't use OOCALC's
chart feature for teaching purposes or for my own research for this reason. It
should be implemented immediately.  

Sincerely,
Chad Smith
University of Texas at Austin

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