Re: Full Backup Configuration
Thats the generally accepted practice, with amanda supposedly compensating for the case of dumpcycle = 1 week, and runsperdumpcycle = 5. I think this is general target area of the current discussion. But then I'm not an real expert, I just play one here, sometimes pretty foolishly... :-) Actually though, the situation being discussed here is: dumpcycle = 3 backup MTWRF not SSu Why does a full always come due on M rather than rotating through the week? For what its (belatedly) work, I use amanda with: dumpcycle 7 days runspercycle 5 tapecycle 10 tapes And this gives me 1 full dump of each filesystem once each week. This leaves me with the current set, plus last week's set. (I recall this was right out of the Unix Backup Recovery book..) My backups run monday AM through friday AM. I'm not sure what the original poster was actually looking to achieve though... david --- david raistrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.expita.com/nomime.html
Re: Full Backup Configuration
DK Smith wrote: Do most amanda configs (with changers) run amdump every weekday (M-F) and skip running amdump on weekends? I see this sort of idiom stated as the way for Amanda, however I am not so sure this well-documented idiom is actually used in practice. Or is it? Well, I use AMANDA mostly during the week, but *I reserve the right* (and I do use it occasionally) to use it also on weekends. I think trying to get AMANDA to ignore Saturdays and Sundays in its time calculations is outside the way it currently functions and would require extra programming and configuration parameters (perhaps a whole calender function to click off the days that should not count as such...) which, in the end of ends, will make life more complicated instead of easier (as it is now, as far as backups are concerned ;-)). My experience is that there is absolutely no meaning in trying to mess with AMANDA and interfere in the way she does the backups - she does it so optimally, that every other effort will be suboptimal! So let her do the work and go home! Next day, or Monday, you'll have this or that on your tapes - 0 levels, 1 levels and so on. So what? You wanted that 0 level to be on Tuesday? Why? This thinking will only bring you trouble. The AMANDA philosophy is you press the button, AMANDA decides for you. -- Regards Chris Karakas http://www.karakas-online.de
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Sat, Jan 18, 2003 at 03:16:24PM +0100, Chris Karakas wrote: DK Smith wrote: Do most amanda configs (with changers) run amdump every weekday (M-F) and skip running amdump on weekends? I see this sort of idiom stated as the way for Amanda, however I am not so sure this well-documented idiom is actually used in practice. Or is it? Well, I use AMANDA mostly during the week, but *I reserve the right* (and I do use it occasionally) to use it also on weekends. I think trying to get AMANDA to ignore Saturdays and Sundays in its time calculations is outside the way it currently functions and would require extra programming and configuration parameters (perhaps a whole calender function to click off the days that should not count as such...) which, in the end of ends, will make life more complicated instead of easier (as it is now, as far as backups are concerned ;-)). My experience is that there is absolutely no meaning in trying to mess with AMANDA and interfere in the way she does the backups - she does it so optimally, that every other effort will be suboptimal! So let her do the work and go home! Next day, or Monday, you'll have this or that on your tapes - 0 levels, 1 levels and so on. So what? You wanted that 0 level to be on Tuesday? Why? This thinking will only bring you trouble. The AMANDA philosophy is you press the button, AMANDA decides for you. While I agree basically with you there can be cases where the scheduler fights a specific situation. Suppose my Level 0's are 9-10 GB total and I'm using a DDS2 tape with 4GB capacity with a dumpcycle of 3 days. Works well for a single tape/dump usage with the Level 0's spread out. Further suppose I'm a small business with activity and operators available M-F only. Thus I want to do 5 dumps a week. However, every Monday, after missing dumps on 2 days, amanda will believe it is time for Level 0's for everything. No spreading of Level 0's at all. Its not that a specific DLE should get Level 0 on Tuesday, it that they are not scheduled for various days. Because amanda considers the non-dumping days in the dumpcycle, it will fight what the hypothetical business would like. -- Jon H. LaBadie [EMAIL PROTECTED] JG Computing 4455 Province Line Road(609) 252-0159 Princeton, NJ 08540-4322 (609) 683-7220 (fax)
Re: Full Backup Configuration
Jon LaBadie wrote: While I agree basically with you there can be cases where the scheduler fights a specific situation. Suppose my Level 0's are 9-10 GB total and I'm using a DDS2 tape with 4GB capacity with a dumpcycle of 3 days. Works well for a single tape/dump usage with the Level 0's spread out. Further suppose I'm a small business with activity and operators available M-F only. Thus I want to do 5 dumps a week. However, every Monday, after missing dumps on 2 days, amanda will believe it is time for Level 0's for everything. Indeed, it is! :-) No spreading of Level 0's at all. Why do you say this? The 0's are *due* on Monday, in your example above. Some of them will not make it to the tape, because the tape is smaller than all the full backups, that's clear. AMANDA will find out the ones that fit on the tape, under the restriction that there will be enough space to also copy the incrementals (at least those that are very important). So, ideally, some of the full backups will be on the tape, as well as all incrementals. The rest of the fulls will be delayed and the planner will tell me this and I will know why this is so, but I will not worry. The next day, some of the delayed fulls will make it to the tape, along with the incrementals of that day and so on. If my dumpcycle is long enough, I will have all full backups by the end of it on *some* tape, just not only on that of any specific day, but evely scattered on all tapes. If not, either my dumpcycle is too small, or runspercycle is too small, or both, or my tapes are hopelessly underdimensioned for the task. It's as simple as that. -- Regards Chris Karakas http://www.karakas-online.de
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Sat, Jan 18, 2003 at 07:25:50PM +0100, Chris Karakas wrote: Jon LaBadie wrote: While I agree basically with you there can be cases where the scheduler fights a specific situation. Suppose my Level 0's are 9-10 GB total and I'm using a DDS2 tape with 4GB capacity with a dumpcycle of 3 days. Works well for a single tape/dump usage with the Level 0's spread out. Further suppose I'm a small business with activity and operators available M-F only. Thus I want to do 5 dumps a week. However, every Monday, after missing dumps on 2 days, amanda will believe it is time for Level 0's for everything. Indeed, it is! :-) No spreading of Level 0's at all. Why do you say this? The 0's are *due* on Monday, in your example above. It is when you go with amanda's scheduling yes. But if I would like only work days/weekdays/??? to be considered, it is just the next dump day after Friday, not 3 days after Friday. Some of them will not make it to the tape, because the tape is smaller than all the full backups, that's clear. AMANDA will find out the ones that fit on the tape, under the restriction that there will be enough space to also copy the incrementals (at least those that are very important). So, ideally, some of the full backups will be on the tape, as well as all incrementals. The rest of the fulls will be delayed and Forgot to mention, my hypothetical config also has sufficient unreserved holding disk, so all the fulls are done on Monday. Which is not the behavior I want. I know this is not normal behavior, but it is not totally unreasonable and it is what Jeremy was asking about. His idea about a long dumpcycle and runspercycle of 3 sounds like it may have a chance of working. -- Jon H. LaBadie [EMAIL PROTECTED] JG Computing 4455 Province Line Road(609) 252-0159 Princeton, NJ 08540-4322 (609) 683-7220 (fax)
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, 17 Jan 2003 at 8:01am, Keith Nasman wrote What are the amanda.conf settings (dumpcycle, runspercycle, tapecycle) for getting a full backup each night, five days a week, with a four weeks worth of tapes (20)? dumpcycle=0,runspercycle=1 (doesn't really matter), tapecycle=20 -- Joshua Baker-LePain Department of Biomedical Engineering Duke University
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, Jan 17, 2003 at 08:01:17AM -0800, Keith Nasman wrote: What are the amanda.conf settings (dumpcycle, runspercycle, tapecycle) for getting a full backup each night, five days a week, with a four weeks worth of tapes (20)? dumpcycle is how often you want a full. runspercycle is the number of backup runs in each dumpcycle. tapecycle is the number of tapes you have. Therefore: dumpcycle 1 day runspercycle 1 tapecycle 20 tapes
RE: Full Backup Configuration
Okaywhat are the settings for getting a full once every 3 days with backups 5 nights a week and 16 tapes? I tried dumpcycle 3 days runspercycle 3 tapecycle 16 tapes but that gives me fulls of everyone on Monday and what I want Tues thru Friday. I think the problem is when it fires up on Monday it thinks it is 2 days behind. How can I tell it to discount Saturday and Sunday? My cron file runs amdump Mon-Fri. Would dumpcycle 1 week runspercycle 3 tapecycle 16 tapes work better? JLm Jeremy Mordkoff Tatara Systems 978-206-0808 (direct) 978-206-0888 (fax) -Original Message- From: Keith Nasman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 11:01 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Full Backup Configuration What are the amanda.conf settings (dumpcycle, runspercycle, tapecycle) for getting a full backup each night, five days a week, with a four weeks worth of tapes (20)? thanks, Keith
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, 17 Jan 2003 at 8:01am, Keith Nasman wrote What are the amanda.conf settings (dumpcycle, runspercycle, tapecycle) for getting a full backup each night, five days a week, with a four weeks worth of tapes (20)? dumpcycle=0,runspercycle=1 (doesn't really matter), tapecycle=20 -- Joshua Baker-LePain Department of Biomedical Engineering Duke University OK, so I have 20 tapes that amanda has backed up to(DailySet[100-119]). I changed my amanda.conf to dumpcycle=0 and when I run amadmin set tape it says then next tape should be a new one. All the tapes in tapelist have backup dates and are marked reuse. Is there something else I need to do to get amanda to start rotating, IOW asking for tape 100? Thanks, Keith
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, Jan 17, 2003 at 01:15:17PM -0500, Jeremy L. Mordkoff wrote: Would dumpcycle 1 week runspercycle 3 tapecycle 16 tapes work better? Interesting question... I assume that amanda would make a point of getting a full on each filesystem at least once every runspercycle runs as well as getting one every dumpcycle days, but I can't say for sure. It would probably mess with scheduling a bit either way, but, if my assumption is correct, it should work for you, even if it doesn't work as efficiently as is normally the case.
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, 17 Jan 2003 at 8:01am, Keith Nasman wrote What are the amanda.conf settings (dumpcycle, runspercycle, tapecycle) for getting a full backup each night, five days a week, with a four weeks worth of tapes (20)? dumpcycle=0,runspercycle=1 (doesn't really matter), tapecycle=20 -- Joshua Baker-LePain Department of Biomedical Engineering Duke University OK, so I have 20 tapes that amanda has backed up to(DailySet[100-119]). I changed my amanda.conf to dumpcycle=0 and when I run amadmin set tape it says then next tape should be a new one. All the tapes in tapelist have backup dates and are marked reuse. Is there something else I need to do to get amanda to start rotating, IOW asking for tape 100? Thanks, Keith It was brought to my attention to double check that there are indeed 20 tapes and somehow one got physically labeled but not amlabeled. Keith
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Friday 17 January 2003 16:04, DK Smith wrote: In this discussion, talking about discounting days of of the week etc... is there an inherent assumption here that the amdump is invoked once per day? Or is that not a factor in the behavior of the system? Thats the generally accepted practice, with amanda supposedly compensating for the case of dumpcycle = 1 week, and runsperdumpcycle = 5. I think this is general target area of the current discussion. But then I'm not an real expert, I just play one here, sometimes pretty foolishly... :-) -- Cheers, Gene AMD K6-III@500mhz 320M Athlon1600XP@1400mhz 512M 99.22% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Re: Full Backup Configuration
At 05:26 PM 1/17/2003 -0500, you wrote: On Friday 17 January 2003 16:04, DK Smith wrote: In this discussion, talking about discounting days of of the week etc... is there an inherent assumption here that the amdump is invoked once per day? Or is that not a factor in the behavior of the system? Thats the generally accepted practice, with amanda supposedly compensating for the case of dumpcycle = 1 week, and runsperdumpcycle = 5. I think this is general target area of the current discussion. But then I'm not an real expert, I just play one here, sometimes pretty foolishly... :-) Actually though, the situation being discussed here is: dumpcycle = 3 backup MTWRF not SSu Why does a full always come due on M rather than rotating through the week? There is an inherent assumption that Saturday and Sunday really exist ... so when you say dumpcycle of ... well, any number, amanda continues to count Saturday and Sunday.The question here is can we ask amanda to bend reality and ignore Sat and Sun entirely. We're asking to define a work week rather than a real time week. Apparently the lady (amanda) only knows real time, just because *she* is willing to work any day of the week! Deb Baddorf -- Cheers, Gene AMD K6-III@500mhz 320M Athlon1600XP@1400mhz 512M 99.22% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly --- Deb Baddorf [EMAIL PROTECTED] 840-2289 You can't help getting older, but you don't have to get old. - George Burns IXOYE
Re: Full Backup Configuration
There is an inherent assumption that Saturday and Sunday really exist ... so when you say dumpcycle of ... well, any number, amanda continues to count Saturday and Sunday.The question here is can we ask amanda to bend reality and ignore Sat and Sun entirely. We're asking to define a work week rather than a real time week. Apparently the lady (amanda) only knows real time, just because *she* is willing to work any day of the week! Deb Baddorf What if a User comes in during the weekend and make Nobel-prize-winning modification to their source code? Does that give you reason to relax your constraint? What is the justification/motivation for running amdump on Sat or Sun? In case the tape changer jams, you can address the issue before leaving work that day? thx
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, Jan 17, 2003 at 01:15:17PM -0500, Jeremy L. Mordkoff wrote: Okaywhat are the settings for getting a full once every 3 days with backups 5 nights a week and 16 tapes? I tried dumpcycle 3 days runspercycle 3 tapecycle 16 tapes but that gives me fulls of everyone on Monday and what I want Tues thru Friday. I think the problem is when it fires up on Monday it thinks it is 2 days behind. How can I tell it to discount Saturday and Sunday? My cron file runs amdump Mon-Fri. Do most amanda configs (with changers) run amdump every weekday (M-F) and skip running amdump on weekends? I see this sort of idiom stated as the way for Amanda, however I am not so sure this well-documented idiom is actually used in practice. Or is it? thx
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, Jan 17, 2003 at 04:06:09PM -0800, DK Smith wrote: Do most amanda configs (with changers) run amdump every weekday (M-F) and skip running amdump on weekends? I see this sort of idiom stated as the way for Amanda, however I am not so sure this well-documented idiom is actually used in practice. Sure it is. - Not everybody has a changer. - Many people do something else on the weekend (like a forced-full). I haven't followed this thread closely (and am not sure why the OP is having problems), but I've used 5-out-of-7, 6-out-of-7 and 7-out-of-7 configurations configurations with Amanda. My current config is 6-out-of-7. On the 7th day, a seperate forced-full config runs. 5-week tapecycle, 1-week dumpcycle, 6 dumps/week: dumpcycle 7 days # at least 1 full dump/week. runspercycle6 # run 6 days/week. tapecycle 30 tapes# 5 weeks worth # Run daily0 on sun/mon/tue/wed/thu/fri nights (0=sunday) 01 23 * * 0-5 /home/amanda/bin/daily0 # Run archive0 on sat nights 01 23 * * 6 /home/amanda/bin/archive0 My understanding was that the OP just wanted to run 3-out-of-7, and I have *no* idea why that should be any problem at all. -- Jay Lessert [EMAIL PROTECTED] Accelerant Networks Inc. (voice)1.503.439.3461 Beaverton OR, USA(fax)1.503.466.9472
Re: Full Backup Configuration
My understanding was that the OP just wanted to run 3-out-of-7, and I have *no* idea why that should be any problem at all. -- Jay Lessert [EMAIL PROTECTED] Accelerant Networks Inc. (voice)1.503.439.3461 Beaverton OR, USA(fax)1.503.466.9472 I wasn't the one raising the question. I was just trying to provide an explanation so that people understood his question. He wanted to run backups MTWRF , and have a 3 day dumpcycle. I.E. Full dumps every 3 days. And he couldn't understand why his ignoring Sat Sun caused amanda to always be due for a full dump on Monday. I think he wanted FULL tues wed FULL fri [sat, sun skipped] mon FULL tues wed FULL [ sat, sun skipped] mon tues FULL thur fri [sat, sun skipped] FULL tues wed FULL fri [sat, sun skipped] thinking that he'd get a full backup every third day that he said amdump and that Sat, Sun would be ignored if he didn't call amdump those days. But since amanda knows about a 7 day week . she wouldn't forget them. And I'm not sure if a config can be made, that will to do what he wanted. (Sorry orig user --- I've forgotten your name!) Deb Baddorf
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, Jan 17, 2003 at 04:53:12PM -0800, Jay Lessert wrote: I haven't followed this thread closely (and am not sure why the OP is having problems), but I've used 5-out-of-7, 6-out-of-7 and 7-out-of-7 configurations configurations with Amanda. My current config is 6-out-of-7. On the 7th day, a seperate forced-full config runs. My understanding was that the OP just wanted to run 3-out-of-7, and I have *no* idea why that should be any problem at all. No, the OP wanted a 3 day dumpcycle but only running dumps 5 days a week, weekdays. Problem was that Fri - Mon was an entire dumpcycle so Monday always gave level 0 of everything, no spreading of levels. -- Jon H. LaBadie [EMAIL PROTECTED] JG Computing 4455 Province Line Road(609) 252-0159 Princeton, NJ 08540-4322 (609) 683-7220 (fax)
Re: Full Backup Configuration
On Fri, Jan 17, 2003 at 10:15:19PM -0600, Deb Baddorf wrote: My understanding was that the OP just wanted to run 3-out-of-7, and I have *no* idea why that should be any problem at all. -- Jay Lessert [EMAIL PROTECTED] I wasn't the one raising the question. I was just trying to provide an explanation so that people understood his question. He wanted to run backups MTWRF , and have a 3 day dumpcycle. I.E. Full dumps every 3 days. And he couldn't understand why his ignoring Sat Sun caused amanda to always be due for a full dump on Monday. I think he wanted FULL tues wed FULL fri [sat, sun skipped] mon FULL tues wed FULL [ sat, sun skipped] mon tues FULL thur fri [sat, sun skipped] FULL tues wed FULL fri [sat, sun skipped] thinking that he'd get a full backup every third day that he said amdump and that Sat, Sun would be ignored if he didn't call amdump those days. But since amanda knows about a 7 day week . she wouldn't forget them. And I'm not sure if a config can be made, that will to do what he wanted. (Sorry orig user --- I've forgotten your name!) I think Jeremy (Jeremy L. Mordkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED]) understood what was happening, just was looking for a way around amanda's behavior. Deb Baddorf End of included message -- Jon H. LaBadie [EMAIL PROTECTED] JG Computing 4455 Province Line Road(609) 252-0159 Princeton, NJ 08540-4322 (609) 683-7220 (fax)
