Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs
Mark, what you are saying is you could be killed easier and much more quickly with a well grounded chassis. It is sorta like a 220 volt circuit, If one fuse is blown the 110 comes in and all the way through and back to the fuse, there is 110 volts on everything but nothing is lit up, the chassis well grounded makes it more deadly. You will note just the opposite regarding 12 volt dc, they always say fuse the cold side since the ground is on the equipment and should the regular ground connection to the battery be lost the equipment is part of the circuit anf fried equipment is the result,not fried operator! If I turn on equipment and nothing lights up, I don't want the entire primary circuit including the COLD side hot with killing power juice.. Mike - Original Message - From: Mark Foltarz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 12:59 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs Mike, You are absolutely correct about those fused line plugs. But I got to thinking about the philosophy behind those things. Way back when, proper installation of radio gear was specified as including a ground - both RF and electrical. If the operator made the installation correctly, the chassis was always cold. I think the engineers of that time believed that the operator was going to be responsible and install that chassis connection to a real electrical ground. Just a thought. Was operator forethought and responsibility part of correctly using those plugs or were they just plain dangerous? Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Mike Dorworth K4XM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks, just a little about the fused line plugs. You don't see them anymore because of their killing ability, which is very good. All you need is the fuse in the cold side of the line blown and of course the hot stuff goes in through and all the way back to the open fuse meaning the entire thing is full of juice waiting for a finger, might have been alright if they were polarized which there were not and of course the sockets were not either.. RIP with those literally.. 73 Mike K4XM - Original Message - From: Mark Foltarz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 3:57 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors Wayne, The other oddity of that period was of course the fused plugs that Heathkit, Johnson and other manufacturers used. Come to think of it, do you suppose the cord on that particular AT-1 is not original? I forgot if you described the schematic as specifically not having a fuse anywhere including the line cord. Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Sara Wayne Steiner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark The AT-1 manual says 450v, however mine runs about 460v. So , yes you are right, the series combo has a rating of 700v which is substantially more than what it sees. As I mentioned earlier, the AT-1 has no fuse (mine will soon have one ). My AT-1 was a $5.00 flea market item which came without the power xfmr. The corner of the chassis where the xfmr was mounted was covered with black crap where the xfmr obviously had a melt down probably due to a failed filter caps and no fuse protection! 73 Wayne, N0TE ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 02/13/2003 ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 02/13/2003
RE: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs
Since they didn't have polarized outlets in the old days, the plug could go in either way. They had to fuse both sides for safety, and mandate the chassis to be grounded. Of course these days, the polarized three pronger guy is the best replacement ac line cord, with a fuse in the hot line only mounted on the rear chassis. George AB2KC -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mark Foltarz Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 12:59 PM To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs Mike, You are absolutely correct about those fused line plugs. But I got to thinking about the philosophy behind those things. Way back when, proper installation of radio gear was specified as including a ground - both RF and electrical. If the operator made the installation correctly, the chassis was always cold. I think the engineers of that time believed that the operator was going to be responsible and install that chassis connection to a real electrical ground. Just a thought. Was operator forethought and responsibility part of correctly using those plugs or were they just plain dangerous? Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Mike Dorworth K4XM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks, just a little about the fused line plugs. You don't see them anymore because of their killing ability, which is very good. All you need is the fuse in the cold side of the line blown and of course the hot stuff goes in through and all the way back to the open fuse meaning the entire thing is full of juice waiting for a finger, might have been alright if they were polarized which there were not and of course the sockets were not either.. RIP with those literally.. 73 Mike K4XM - Original Message - From: Mark Foltarz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 3:57 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors Wayne, The other oddity of that period was of course the fused plugs that Heathkit, Johnson and other manufacturers used. Come to think of it, do you suppose the cord on that particular AT-1 is not original? I forgot if you described the schematic as specifically not having a fuse anywhere including the line cord. Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Sara Wayne Steiner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark The AT-1 manual says 450v, however mine runs about 460v. So , yes you are right, the series combo has a rating of 700v which is substantially more than what it sees. As I mentioned earlier, the AT-1 has no fuse (mine will soon have one ). My AT-1 was a $5.00 flea market item which came without the power xfmr. The corner of the chassis where the xfmr was mounted was covered with black crap where the xfmr obviously had a melt down probably due to a failed filter caps and no fuse protection! 73 Wayne, N0TE ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 02/13/2003 ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio
Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs
The problem still was that if plugged into the hot side of the line with the remaining good fuse, the primary, switch etc was HOT to ground all the way back to the wall plug, Lot of good chances to get stung, a well grounded chassis the opposite of what you would want.. Remember the old isolation trainsformers?, Really old radio books called for a SINGLE pronged plug for AC-DC stuff, relying on the chassis ground to make it work, which has a set of pitfalls all of it's own, your ground has 110 volts potential to the power company ground, hopfully the sub surface ground was connected to the power ground or Curtains again! Mike - Original Message - From: George Pritchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 1:16 PM Subject: RE: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs Since they didn't have polarized outlets in the old days, the plug could go in either way. They had to fuse both sides for safety, and mandate the chassis to be grounded. Of course these days, the polarized three pronger guy is the best replacement ac line cord, with a fuse in the hot line only mounted on the rear chassis. George AB2KC -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mark Foltarz Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 12:59 PM To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs Mike, You are absolutely correct about those fused line plugs. But I got to thinking about the philosophy behind those things. Way back when, proper installation of radio gear was specified as including a ground - both RF and electrical. If the operator made the installation correctly, the chassis was always cold. I think the engineers of that time believed that the operator was going to be responsible and install that chassis connection to a real electrical ground. Just a thought. Was operator forethought and responsibility part of correctly using those plugs or were they just plain dangerous? Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Mike Dorworth K4XM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks, just a little about the fused line plugs. You don't see them anymore because of their killing ability, which is very good. All you need is the fuse in the cold side of the line blown and of course the hot stuff goes in through and all the way back to the open fuse meaning the entire thing is full of juice waiting for a finger, might have been alright if they were polarized which there were not and of course the sockets were not either.. RIP with those literally.. 73 Mike K4XM - Original Message - From: Mark Foltarz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 3:57 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors Wayne, The other oddity of that period was of course the fused plugs that Heathkit, Johnson and other manufacturers used. Come to think of it, do you suppose the cord on that particular AT-1 is not original? I forgot if you described the schematic as specifically not having a fuse anywhere including the line cord. Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Sara Wayne Steiner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark The AT-1 manual says 450v, however mine runs about 460v. So , yes you are right, the series combo has a rating of 700v which is substantially more than what it sees. As I mentioned earlier, the AT-1 has no fuse (mine will soon have one ). My AT-1 was a $5.00 flea market item which came without the power xfmr. The corner of the chassis where the xfmr was mounted was covered with black crap where the xfmr obviously had a melt down probably due to a failed filter caps and no fuse protection! 73 Wayne, N0TE ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 02/13/2003 ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net
Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs
Yup! I've seen those odd one pronged plugs. Heck, there is a conversion for the ARC-1 circa 1963 by Lee Pfafenberg (SP?) and it is a voltage quadrupler / doubler arrangement with no isolation. Somewhat intimidating. Even this WWII Espey morale radio I have is built with a hot chassis. They went to great efforts to keep everything above chassis. What's really weird is that ground binding post on a big fiber washer and the phone jack all electically above the case. 73 de KA4JVY Mark --- Mike Dorworth K4XM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The problem still was that if plugged into the hot side of the line with the remaining good fuse, the primary, switch etc was HOT to ground all the way back to the wall plug, Lot of good chances to get stung, a well grounded chassis the opposite of what you would want.. Remember the old isolation trainsformers?, Really old radio books called for a SINGLE pronged plug for AC-DC stuff, relying on the chassis ground to make it work, which has a set of pitfalls all of it's own, your ground has 110 volts potential to the power company ground, hopfully the sub surface ground was connected to the power ground or Curtains again! Mike - Original Message - From: George Pritchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 1:16 PM Subject: RE: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs Since they didn't have polarized outlets in the old days, the plug could go in either way. They had to fuse both sides for safety, and mandate the chassis to be grounded. Of course these days, the polarized three pronger guy is the best replacement ac line cord, with a fuse in the hot line only mounted on the rear chassis. George AB2KC -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mark Foltarz Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 12:59 PM To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors - now Johnson Power Plugs Mike, You are absolutely correct about those fused line plugs. But I got to thinking about the philosophy behind those things. Way back when, proper installation of radio gear was specified as including a ground - both RF and electrical. If the operator made the installation correctly, the chassis was always cold. I think the engineers of that time believed that the operator was going to be responsible and install that chassis connection to a real electrical ground. Just a thought. Was operator forethought and responsibility part of correctly using those plugs or were they just plain dangerous? Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Mike Dorworth K4XM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks, just a little about the fused line plugs. You don't see them anymore because of their killing ability, which is very good. All you need is the fuse in the cold side of the line blown and of course the hot stuff goes in through and all the way back to the open fuse meaning the entire thing is full of juice waiting for a finger, might have been alright if they were polarized which there were not and of course the sockets were not either.. RIP with those literally.. 73 Mike K4XM - Original Message - From: Mark Foltarz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 3:57 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Series capacitor equalizing resistors Wayne, The other oddity of that period was of course the fused plugs that Heathkit, Johnson and other manufacturers used. Come to think of it, do you suppose the cord on that particular AT-1 is not original? I forgot if you described the schematic as specifically not having a fuse anywhere including the line cord. Yours, de KA4JVY Mark --- Sara Wayne Steiner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark The AT-1 manual says 450v, however mine runs about 460v. So , yes you are right, the series combo has a rating of 700v which is substantially more than what it sees. As I mentioned earlier, the AT-1 has no fuse (mine will soon have one ). My AT-1 was a $5.00 flea market item which came without the power xfmr. The corner of the chassis where the xfmr was mounted was covered with black crap where the xfmr obviously had a melt down probably due to a failed filter caps and no fuse protection! 73 Wayne, N0TE ___ AMRadio mailing list AMRadio@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___
