[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Yes Phil, you are correct. Communications and earth observation in orbit are great examples of space applications that have succeeded. But, they are also things that we've already done. I admit that there is probably more to explore and learn here, near to us, but I was really thinking about more distant space exploration. Our planet is pretty boring from the perspective that we are here, and get get around on it to see what's on the surface. Subsurface exploration in the Ocean (I'd like to know a lot more about those now underwater cities that appear to have been buried by catastrophic floods from ICE age ice dams breaking), and other deep earth observations would be a good thing to learn more about what is going on without planet and how we are affecting. Higher orbit or distant communications systems are exciting. A repeater or two on the moon for example would be something that we might try and be ready to provide should a moon mission come up on the horizon. Gregg Wonderly On 8/13/2011 4:46 PM, Phil Karn wrote: On 8/9/11 4:47 PM, Gregg Wonderly wrote: But, if no one who has the money wants to fund space flight, then it won't ever happen privately. I.e. why hasn't the privetization already happened? I think it's because it doesn't make money. There's nothing known to generate value out of space flight. Actually, there's one space application that has proved quite commercially viable: communications. Commercial earth resources satellites are a distant second. I can't think of anything else. Exploration for its own sake is never going to be commercially viable. There has to be some short-term economic payoff. There's a long history of those who have become rich in some other industry funding an earth expedition out of personal interest, but the cost of space flight is still far too high for this to extend to space. It means that the funding of space exploration will have to remain the province of governments for the time being. There's just no payoff for commercial investment, at least not yet. -Phil ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Greg. well all I can say is that anyone who says that the US has virtually abandoned crewed spaceflight is not up on current events. What we are doing is transitioning from a program of the military industrial complex to one which centers on private enterprise...and that will open space access for a lot of things. And that will include amateur radio payloads. In my view the association between amateur radio and human spaceflight has hurt amateur radio more then it has helped. Go read The Revolution in Military Affairs...and you will get the drift Robert G. Oler WB5MZO Life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2011 10:08:01 -0500 From: w5...@cox.net To: orbit...@hotmail.com CC: m5...@yahoo.co.uk; amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose When these kinds of comments come up, I often wonder how many people actually understand how the US economy works. I spend some time to put together some view points of how the FED is affecting what's happening and how the basis of the FED as a mechanism is not really working to manage the complexities of our economy. There are things all over youtube.com which are records of senate and congressional committee sessions, historical videos, documentaries etc. If you are not really sure how the FED works and what all the troubles of the economy in the U.S. and the world (because many countries chose to tie themselves to our currency system), visible my Google+ post that I've put up and look around at some of the videos I've linked to. https://plus.google.com/110612293771822302429/posts/eG6QC13kgv8 Gregg Wonderly W5GGW On 8/5/2011 5:39 PM, R Oler wrote: Trevor...there is not a chance that is going to happen. The US is on the verge of a revolution in space affairs (to mimic Admiral Bill Owens) and we are about to leave a technowelfare program and go into something truly free enterprise. Watch Robert G. Oler WB5MZO life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2011 23:04:09 +0100 From: m5...@yahoo.co.uk To: amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose Bob, Politicians are the same the world over. I note that some of your Politicians seem paranoid about the USA's biggest trading partner, Beijing. I don't mind betting that in a few years time your Politicians will be falling over themselves to vote billions of tax dollars to the Space program to prevent the US falling into 3rd place behind the Russian Federation and Beijing. 73 Trevor M5AKA --- On Fri, 5/8/11, Bob Bruningabruni...@usna.edu wrote: ,,,it now lists keps for 'Radioscaf-B'. (no ARRISat-1' listing). Will that eventually change? I chuckle. We in the USA have virtually abandoned manned space. We have no manned space flight vehicles because all we do is squabble with the attention span of 2 year olds in our politics and long term outlooks. All our politicians do is worry about their re-election in the next 2 years. They cannot face the really big issues that need to be solved without jeopardizing their re-election by the me-first, screw-them electorate. The voters only have the attention span from one radio talk show to the next. So since the Russians are now the only manned space program that can provide the ride, I guess they get to call it whatever they want. Our guys worked VERY HARD to build it and deliver it against unbelieveable pressures and bureaucratic issues, but the only way to get it to ISS was to give it to the Russians. Sigh... Bob, WB4APR ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
With all due respect Robert, I think this is a pipe dream. The current global economy is in serious, serious shape. 'Private Enterprise' may indeed get into the field but even private enterprise operates on cash. Playing around in space is way down on the food chain in these conditions. NASA has always been heavily funded by the government and the current administration has zero interest in participating further. The Russians have the upper hand and their gov't seems willing to spend...for now. I'll bet you dinner it will be years before you see another amateur satellite overhead. Ted, K7TRK -Original Message- From: amsat-bb-boun...@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-boun...@amsat.org] On Behalf Of R Oler Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2011 9:09 AM To: w5...@wonderly.org Cc: Amsat BB Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose Greg. well all I can say is that anyone who says that the US has virtually abandoned crewed spaceflight is not up on current events. What we are doing is transitioning from a program of the military industrial complex to one which centers on private enterprise...and that will open space access for a lot of things. And that will include amateur radio payloads. In my view the association between amateur radio and human spaceflight has hurt amateur radio more then it has helped. Go read The Revolution in Military Affairs...and you will get the drift Robert G. Oler WB5MZO Life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2011 10:08:01 -0500 From: w5...@cox.net To: orbit...@hotmail.com CC: m5...@yahoo.co.uk; amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose When these kinds of comments come up, I often wonder how many people actually understand how the US economy works. I spend some time to put together some view points of how the FED is affecting what's happening and how the basis of the FED as a mechanism is not really working to manage the complexities of our economy. There are things all over youtube.com which are records of senate and congressional committee sessions, historical videos, documentaries etc. If you are not really sure how the FED works and what all the troubles of the economy in the U.S. and the world (because many countries chose to tie themselves to our currency system), visible my Google+ post that I've put up and look around at some of the videos I've linked to. https://plus.google.com/110612293771822302429/posts/eG6QC13kgv8 Gregg Wonderly W5GGW On 8/5/2011 5:39 PM, R Oler wrote: Trevor...there is not a chance that is going to happen. The US is on the verge of a revolution in space affairs (to mimic Admiral Bill Owens) and we are about to leave a technowelfare program and go into something truly free enterprise. Watch Robert G. Oler WB5MZO life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2011 23:04:09 +0100 From: m5...@yahoo.co.uk To: amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose Bob, Politicians are the same the world over. I note that some of your Politicians seem paranoid about the USA's biggest trading partner, Beijing. I don't mind betting that in a few years time your Politicians will be falling over themselves to vote billions of tax dollars to the Space program to prevent the US falling into 3rd place behind the Russian Federation and Beijing. 73 Trevor M5AKA --- On Fri, 5/8/11, Bob Bruningabruni...@usna.edu wrote: ,,,it now lists keps for 'Radioscaf-B'. (no ARRISat-1' listing). Will that eventually change? I chuckle. We in the USA have virtually abandoned manned space. We have no manned space flight vehicles because all we do is squabble with the attention span of 2 year olds in our politics and long term outlooks. All our politicians do is worry about their re-election in the next 2 years. They cannot face the really big issues that need to be solved without jeopardizing their re-election by the me-first, screw-them electorate. The voters only have the attention span from one radio talk show to the next. So since the Russians are now the only manned space program that can provide the ride, I guess they get to call it whatever they want. Our guys worked VERY HARD to build it and deliver it against unbelieveable pressures and bureaucratic issues, but the only way to get it to ISS was to give it to the Russians. Sigh... Bob, WB4APR ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
that the new person can be paid some money. If more value is created in the economy with new products, then the price of other items have to decline for that other value to be accessible for purchase. If you have to plan your business to continuously reduce prices, how far can you go before you can't? What does that do to initial prices and who can purchase? The Fed controls available money, hoping to manage this appropriately so that printing only should happen when new economic value exists. Getting more of the resource such as mining gold/silver, would be like printing money because once you add it to the economy, there will be more available and the worth of the existing will likely decline unless there is additional value added to the economy to make the gold harder to get. This is why some people believe the Fed is okay as long as it's managed appropriately. It is cheaper to print money then it is to mine gold, and gold and silver are useful resources, where as paper is manufactured from renewable resources. With the Fed in operation, the annual cost of living increase in your pay check was about equalizing your money with the Fed printing rate so that you didn't have to take an effective cut in pay because of the inflation being created. The Fed prints enough new money to take growth into account, based on what it can track. The problem was that too much money was being loaned out and the banks had stacked their own debt at more than 10-to-1 against cash on hand with loans because of lack of regulation. Thus the economy was larger than the Fed could perceive and we didn't have enough cash to cover such risky behavior. And yes, the risky behavior should not of been happening either. It's important to learn how it all works so that we understand that privetization is possible, but there are countless circumstances that don't always make it economically possible. Money, today, is a vehicle that can be used for a lot of things, and the misuse of it, as we've seen, can destroy the economy or damage it severely. The X-Prize, for example had very view participants because there wasn't any real prize except recognition, and ultimately the knowledge gained from participation. Where are all the interests at really? I think there should be lots of interest, but I sure don't see anything that would suggest that there would be 10 space flight companies making regular trips into space by 2020. This is way off topic for this group... Gregg Wonderly W5GGW On 8/9/2011 11:08 AM, R Oler wrote: Greg. well all I can say is that anyone who says that the US has virtually abandoned crewed spaceflight is not up on current events. What we are doing is transitioning from a program of the military industrial complex to one which centers on private enterprise...and that will open space access for a lot of things. And that will include amateur radio payloads. In my view the association between amateur radio and human spaceflight has hurt amateur radio more then it has helped. Go read The Revolution in Military Affairs...and you will get the drift Robert G. Oler WB5MZO Life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2011 10:08:01 -0500 From: w5...@cox.net To: orbit...@hotmail.com CC: m5...@yahoo.co.uk; amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose When these kinds of comments come up, I often wonder how many people actually understand how the US economy works. I spend some time to put together some view points of how the FED is affecting what's happening and how the basis of the FED as a mechanism is not really working to manage the complexities of our economy. There are things all over youtube.com which are records of senate and congressional committee sessions, historical videos, documentaries etc. If you are not really sure how the FED works and what all the troubles of the economy in the U.S. and the world (because many countries chose to tie themselves to our currency system), visible my Google+ post that I've put up and look around at some of the videos I've linked to. https://plus.google.com/110612293771822302429/posts/eG6QC13kgv8 Gregg Wonderly W5GGW On 8/5/2011 5:39 PM, R Oler wrote: Trevor...there is not a chance that is going to happen. The US is on the verge of a revolution in space affairs (to mimic Admiral Bill Owens) and we are about to leave a technowelfare program and go into something truly free enterprise. Watch Robert G. Oler WB5MZO life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2011 23:04:09 +0100 From: m5...@yahoo.co.uk To: amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose Bob, Politicians are the same the world over. I note that some of your Politicians seem paranoid about the USA's biggest trading partner, Beijing
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Dan, Yes, we shall continue to explore and give ourselves (AMSAT) every opportunity to do these things. Garage and home built with love from our community. Thanks for your thoughts. A bystander, Dee, NB2F Let's consider what we got from the Russians: they gave us a FREE 26 kilogram launch to low Earth orbit, with 20 times the mass and 75 times the volume of a 1U Cubesat, which is currently the only type of satellite that Amsat can hope to pay full market price for launching. NASA donated the six solar arrays and gave us a ton of help with export paperwork which would have been a bear if we had to export the satellite to Russia by ourselves. For this fact alone, we should be grateful to both agencies, because nobody else has offered us a 26 kilogram launch in the past decade. In spite of this, we still need to conduct an Anomaly Review Board to examine the reasons why the satellite was launched in a state of less than 100 percent readiness. This is not to assign blame but to see how we and our launch partners can improve the procedure for the next launch. The fundamental difference between educational satellites and amateur satellites is that educational satellites can be considered successful if they deliver a working satellite to the launch pad, it does not need to work on orbit and the students who built it have probably graduated by the time it gets launched. Amateur satellites are supposed to perform a useful communications function for some amount of years in a hostile environment. The best thing that Amsat can contribute to the student built satellites is to teach them to think about designing for reliability and long life, not to consider the mission successful if they collect a few weeks of telemetry from their beep-sat once it is in orbit. I agree with Phil Karn on most of his points, but the hams who are out there collecting countries and grid squares are also testing our communications infrastructure under real life conditions, without them we would only be doing a laboratory experiment. Hopefully some hams are bringing the kids along on their grid square expeditions to show them how we communicate under adverse conditions. I have often compared Amateur Radio to fishing: if you just want to eat fish it is certainly more cost effective to buy your fish at the market instead of wasting all that time trying to catch your own fish. Yet many people still enjoy fishing just for the challenge of testing their abilities under sometimes adverse conditions. In my case I still plant little tomato seedlings in the ground in spring time, waste lots of time watering and weeding them, waste lots of money on fertilizer and bug spray, and hope I can get a few tomatoes before the deer and rabbits get them, it certainly would be cheaper and easier to buy tomatoes at the supermarket. That is why we do Amateur Radio, we want to communicate in the least cost-effective way possible because we seek the challenge of doing it ourselves instead of using equipment that any dummy with a credit card can buy at the mall. As for why Amsat did not receive credit for building the satellite by either NASA or the Russians, journalists are a lazy bunch who like to copy from press releases and from each other. Universities and Government agencies have full time public affairs offices with people who know how to get their stories into print and on the air in a way that best serves the interests of their organizations. We at Amsat don't know how to play this game and don't have the connections to do so. Students building little satellites in school is a cute story that practically writes itself, but journalists don't know how to explain amateurs building satellites in their garages and using them to collect QSL cards and grid squares. In the aerospace industry, Educational Satellites are good, they are training students who the industry can hire cheap (while getting rid of the older engineers who earn too much money), but Amateur Satellites are bad, because if a bunch of amateurs can build long lived, useful satellites in a garage, then why is industry charging 100's of millions of bucks for a satellite? Jan King gave a talk at a professional meeting years ago and reported that certain business officials and military officers walked out of the room because they did not want to hear any more of his talk about our garage satellites. It is too much of a threat to their established way of doing business. Anyone who has tried to find an engineering job recently knows that there is no shortage of engineers, but lazy journalists keep reporting about a crisis in STEM education and how we need to inspire the next generation to study science and engineering. The universities who need a steady stream of incoming freshmen, the industry which needs a steady stream of fresh inexpensive young blood, and government agencies who need to justify their existence love to play the STEM education card, even though most of it is not true. It
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Let's consider what we got from the Russians: they gave us a FREE 26 kilogram launch to low Earth orbit, with 20 times the mass and 75 times the volume of a 1U Cubesat, which is currently the only type of satellite that Amsat can hope to pay full market price for launching. NASA donated the six solar arrays and gave us a ton of help with export paperwork which would have been a bear if we had to export the satellite to Russia by ourselves. For this fact alone, we should be grateful to both agencies, because nobody else has offered us a 26 kilogram launch in the past decade. In spite of this, we still need to conduct an Anomaly Review Board to examine the reasons why the satellite was launched in a state of less than 100 percent readiness. This is not to assign blame but to see how we and our launch partners can improve the procedure for the next launch. The fundamental difference between educational satellites and amateur satellites is that educational satellites can be considered successful if they deliver a working satellite to the launch pad, it does not need to work on orbit and the students who built it have probably graduated by the time it gets launched. Amateur satellites are supposed to perform a useful communications function for some amount of years in a hostile environment. The best thing that Amsat can contribute to the student built satellites is to teach them to think about designing for reliability and long life, not to consider the mission successful if they collect a few weeks of telemetry from their beep-sat once it is in orbit. I agree with Phil Karn on most of his points, but the hams who are out there collecting countries and grid squares are also testing our communications infrastructure under real life conditions, without them we would only be doing a laboratory experiment. Hopefully some hams are bringing the kids along on their grid square expeditions to show them how we communicate under adverse conditions. I have often compared Amateur Radio to fishing: if you just want to eat fish it is certainly more cost effective to buy your fish at the market instead of wasting all that time trying to catch your own fish. Yet many people still enjoy fishing just for the challenge of testing their abilities under sometimes adverse conditions. In my case I still plant little tomato seedlings in the ground in spring time, waste lots of time watering and weeding them, waste lots of money on fertilizer and bug spray, and hope I can get a few tomatoes before the deer and rabbits get them, it certainly would be cheaper and easier to buy tomatoes at the supermarket. That is why we do Amateur Radio, we want to communicate in the least cost-effective way possible because we seek the challenge of doing it ourselves instead of using equipment that any dummy with a credit card can buy at the mall. As for why Amsat did not receive credit for building the satellite by either NASA or the Russians, journalists are a lazy bunch who like to copy from press releases and from each other. Universities and Government agencies have full time public affairs offices with people who know how to get their stories into print and on the air in a way that best serves the interests of their organizations. We at Amsat don't know how to play this game and don't have the connections to do so. Students building little satellites in school is a cute story that practically writes itself, but journalists don't know how to explain amateurs building satellites in their garages and using them to collect QSL cards and grid squares. In the aerospace industry, Educational Satellites are good, they are training students who the industry can hire cheap (while getting rid of the older engineers who earn too much money), but Amateur Satellites are bad, because if a bunch of amateurs can build long lived, useful satellites in a garage, then why is industry charging 100's of millions of bucks for a satellite? Jan King gave a talk at a professional meeting years ago and reported that certain business officials and military officers walked out of the room because they did not want to hear any more of his talk about our garage satellites. It is too much of a threat to their established way of doing business. Anyone who has tried to find an engineering job recently knows that there is no shortage of engineers, but lazy journalists keep reporting about a crisis in STEM education and how we need to inspire the next generation to study science and engineering. The universities who need a steady stream of incoming freshmen, the industry which needs a steady stream of fresh inexpensive young blood, and government agencies who need to justify their existence love to play the STEM education card, even though most of it is not true. It seems that every university in the world is building satellites but I doubt that even five percent of those students will find jobs in that field, and those that do will find that they have much less design
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
On 8/7/11 7:07 PM, Daniel Schultz wrote: Anyone who has tried to find an engineering job recently knows that there is no shortage of engineers, but lazy journalists keep reporting about a crisis in STEM education and how we need to inspire the next generation to study science and engineering. I can't agree with this. While there's certainly a nasty economic slump right now, over the past 10-15 years there's been a huge influx of non-US-citizen engineers where I work because there weren't enough US engineers to fill all the positions. Given all the visa hassles and roadblocks erected by the US government, no American company is going to hire lots of non-American employees to fill positions in the US unless it absolutely has to. ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Bob, Politicians are the same the world over. I note that some of your Politicians seem paranoid about the USA's biggest trading partner, Beijing. I don't mind betting that in a few years time your Politicians will be falling over themselves to vote billions of tax dollars to the Space program to prevent the US falling into 3rd place behind the Russian Federation and Beijing. Fortunately few ever see the name that's allocated to keps. Gould's TV interview, http://www.wbir.com/news/article/178784/2/STEM-education-reaches-new-heights , showed how amateurs can use the media to promote the great acheivement of the ARISSat team. 73 Trevor M5AKA --- On Fri, 5/8/11, Bob Bruninga bruni...@usna.edu wrote: ,,,it now lists keps for 'Radioscaf-B'. (no ARRISat-1' listing). Will that eventually change? I chuckle. We in the USA have virtually abandoned manned space. We have no manned space flight vehicles because all we do is squabble with the attention span of 2 year olds in our politics and long term outlooks. All our politicians do is worry about their re-election in the next 2 years. They cannot face the really big issues that need to be solved without jeopardizing their re-election by the me-first, screw-them electorate. The voters only have the attention span from one radio talk show to the next. So since the Russians are now the only manned space program that can provide the ride, I guess they get to call it whatever they want. Our guys worked VERY HARD to build it and deliver it against unbelieveable pressures and bureaucratic issues, but the only way to get it to ISS was to give it to the Russians. Sigh... Bob, WB4APR ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Congrats to Gould- Looks like a great spot for AMSAT. Hopefully we can pass all this STEM info to many in the teaching profession and make them aware of this great science item and tool... 73, Dee, NB2F Bob, Politicians are the same the world over. I note that some of your Politicians seem paranoid about the USA's biggest trading partner, Beijing. I don't mind betting that in a few years time your Politicians will be falling over themselves to vote billions of tax dollars to the Space program to prevent the US falling into 3rd place behind the Russian Federation and Beijing. Fortunately few ever see the name that's allocated to keps. Gould's TV interview, http://www.wbir.com/news/article/178784/2/STEM-education-reaches-new-h eights , showed how amateurs can use the media to promote the great acheivement of the ARISSat team. 73 Trevor M5AKA --- On Fri, 5/8/11, Bob Bruninga bruni...@usna.edu wrote: ,,,it now lists keps for 'Radioscaf-B'. (no ARRISat-1' listing). Will that eventually change? I chuckle. We in the USA have virtually abandoned manned space. We have no manned space flight vehicles because all we do is squabble with the attention span of 2 year olds in our politics and long term outlooks. All our politicians do is worry about their re-election in the next 2 years. They cannot face the really big issues that need to be solved without jeopardizing their re-election by the me-first, screw-them electorate. The voters only have the attention span from one radio talk show to the next. So since the Russians are now the only manned space program that can provide the ride, I guess they get to call it whatever they want. Our guys worked VERY HARD to build it and deliver it against unbelieveable pressures and bureaucratic issues, but the only way to get it to ISS was to give it to the Russians. Sigh... Bob, WB4APR ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose
Trevor...there is not a chance that is going to happen. The US is on the verge of a revolution in space affairs (to mimic Admiral Bill Owens) and we are about to leave a technowelfare program and go into something truly free enterprise. Watch Robert G. Oler WB5MZO life member AMSAT ARRL NARS Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2011 23:04:09 +0100 From: m5...@yahoo.co.uk To: amsat-bb@amsat.org; bruni...@usna.edu Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: A rose is a rose... is a rose Bob, Politicians are the same the world over. I note that some of your Politicians seem paranoid about the USA's biggest trading partner, Beijing. I don't mind betting that in a few years time your Politicians will be falling over themselves to vote billions of tax dollars to the Space program to prevent the US falling into 3rd place behind the Russian Federation and Beijing. 73 Trevor M5AKA --- On Fri, 5/8/11, Bob Bruninga bruni...@usna.edu wrote: ,,,it now lists keps for 'Radioscaf-B'. (no ARRISat-1' listing). Will that eventually change? I chuckle. We in the USA have virtually abandoned manned space. We have no manned space flight vehicles because all we do is squabble with the attention span of 2 year olds in our politics and long term outlooks. All our politicians do is worry about their re-election in the next 2 years. They cannot face the really big issues that need to be solved without jeopardizing their re-election by the me-first, screw-them electorate. The voters only have the attention span from one radio talk show to the next. So since the Russians are now the only manned space program that can provide the ride, I guess they get to call it whatever they want. Our guys worked VERY HARD to build it and deliver it against unbelieveable pressures and bureaucratic issues, but the only way to get it to ISS was to give it to the Russians. Sigh... Bob, WB4APR ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
