[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery
Hi all, what about the following link? http://www.nrel.gov/features/20100708_battery.html 73s Fabio IW8QKU/5 *Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 battery From: g0mrf@xxx Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 08:50:45 -0400 (EDT) Hi all. The ARISSat team seem to have reached the conclusion that the Silver Zinc battery technology is not really suited for an orbiting satellite with a 55 / 35 minute charge and discharge cycle. I wonder if a couple of small Lithium polymer battery packs would be a suitable replacement for ARISSat-2 ? I note that there are safety issues with Li-ion technology, but there are some small battery packs of 10Whr / 20Whr 30Whr modules which have NASA approval for manned space flight. From the odd snippet of information on the power required during eclipse (is it 7 Watts for 35 minutes) it looks like 20-25% depth of discharge for the 20Whr battery pack. That's probably OK for a 9 month mission ?? Thanks David G0MRF http://www.clyde-space.com/documents/1902* ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery
Hi, here is another interesting link: http://www.nrel.gov/vehiclesandfuels/energystorage/news/2011/1482.html could it be an interesting opportunity for our birds ? 73s Fabio IW8QKU/5 On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 3:09 PM, Fabio Azzarello iw8...@amsat.org wrote: Hi all, what about the following link? http://www.nrel.gov/features/20100708_battery.html 73s Fabio IW8QKU/5 *Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 battery From: g0mrf@xxx Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 08:50:45 -0400 (EDT) Hi all. The ARISSat team seem to have reached the conclusion that the Silver Zinc battery technology is not really suited for an orbiting satellite with a 55 / 35 minute charge and discharge cycle. I wonder if a couple of small Lithium polymer battery packs would be a suitable replacement for ARISSat-2 ? I note that there are safety issues with Li-ion technology, but there are some small battery packs of 10Whr / 20Whr 30Whr modules which have NASA approval for manned space flight. From the odd snippet of information on the power required during eclipse (is it 7 Watts for 35 minutes) it looks like 20-25% depth of discharge for the 20Whr battery pack. That's probably OK for a 9 month mission ?? Thanks David G0MRF http://www.clyde-space.com/documents/1902* ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 Battery
Kind of a 2011 version of AO-7, but without the stable orbit! 73, Jim KQ6EA On 08/14/2011 10:18 PM, Anthony Monteiro wrote: Dear Friends, This is speculation but it looks to me like we have had a bit of good luck regarding the battery. Looking at the battery voltage from deployment on... Up until Aug 11, the battery seems to be deteriorating normally with a slight downtrend in the max voltage as expected. But on Aug 11, the battery voltage suddenly rises up to 36 V max and the satellite has started resetting in eclipse. I think the explanation is that the battery experienced a significant event on Aug 11 where it lost the electrolyte in one or more cells. If this is true, the bad news is that it will no longer hold a charge and will not operate in eclipse any more. But the good news is that without electrolyte, it would also stop dendrite growth that causes the eventual battery short circuit. In our ground testing, our test battery failed in the usual way with the battery load increasing until the solar panels could not drive the power bus high enough to run the satellite. But interestingly, several cells also cracked and dumped their electrolyte during this testing. If a cell on the flight battery cracked and dumped its electrolyte BEFORE the shorts were formed, it should stay that way and the satellite may very well continue to operate in the sun until it starts to re-enter. We just need some luck to avoid a bad solar angle that would cause a reset in sunlight. Keep your fingers crossed! :) 73, Tony AA2TX ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery eclipse voltage decreasing
On 8/11/11 8:46 PM, Gould Smith wrote: Kenneth Ransom, N5VHO has plotted the battery min/max for the last 8 days. We see that the battery voltage is decreasing at a faster rate than expected. Kenneth's graph can be found on the arissat1.org site under FAQ http://www.arissat1.org/v3/index.php?option=com_contentview=sectionlayout=blogid=13Itemid=134 Disclaimer: what follows is entirely my own personal opinion, not necessarily that of the ARISSat-1 team or anyone else. I might be missing information that would affect my analysis. Ken's plot is extremely valuable. It strongly suggests battery failure, not a negative power budget as Tony, AA2TX suggests. Note the sharp and consistent *increase* in daylight battery voltage that occurred late on Aug 11, roughly coincident with sharp *decreases* of voltage during eclipse and reports of computer resets and extended low power operation. This is inconsistent with a negative orbit-average power budget. If that were the case, the battery would never reach full charge and the voltage would never rise so high. This plot suggests that one or more cells in the battery have lost significant capacity. The cell with the lessened capacity reaches full charge very quickly and then goes into overcharge, allowing the overall voltage of the string to rise. Then of course the voltage falls very quickly in eclipse as the impaired cell(s) rapidly discharge. As Luc Leblanc points out, silver-zinc (Ag/Zn) batteries have long been the battery of choice in the aerospace industry where their high energy density (almost comparable to li-ion), long shelf life and reliability outweighs the obviously high cost. The Apollo/Saturn program apparently used Ag/Zn batteries exclusively, powering everything from the guidance system in the Saturn V to the lunar module to the portable life support systems the astronauts used on the lunar surface. But these features are associated with Ag/Zn as a *primary* battery, one that is never recharged. Only the three entry batteries in the command module were ever recharged, and then only a few times during a mission after moderate discharges. Those Ag/Zn batteries had rated cycle lives measured in the single digits; Luc's figures show only modest improvements since then. Another unusual feature of Ag/Zn batteries is a two-stage discharge process. When the battery is fully charged, the positive plate contains AgO, silver oxide with the silver in the +2 valence. As the battery discharges, the silver is first reduced to Ag2O, with silver in the +1 valence, and then eventually to metallic silver, Ag, with valence 0. This two-stage conversion of silver means that fairly high voltages are needed to fully charge the battery. During the Apollo 7 mission, the shakedown flight of the Apollo command module in 1968, the entry batteries could not be fully recharged because the battery charger could not lift the battery terminal voltage high enough through the line resistance. Over 39V is needed to fully charge a nominal 28V battery. According to Ken's graph the voltage has never been this high, and we don't know its initial state of charge. This suggests another possible failure mechanism besides exceeding the battery's cycle life: despite a positive power budget, the battery was never fully recharged, and overdischarge of one or more cells caused cell reversal and damage. -Phil ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery eclipse voltage decreasing
Disclaimer: what follows is entirely my own personal opinion, not necessarily that of the ARISSat-1 team or anyone else. I might be missing information that would affect my analysis. Ken's plot is extremely valuable. It strongly suggests battery failure, not a negative power budget as Tony, AA2TX suggests. Note the sharp and consistent *increase* in daylight battery voltage that occurred late on Aug 11, roughly coincident with sharp *decreases* of voltage during eclipse and reports of computer resets and extended low power operation. This is inconsistent with a negative orbit-average power budget. If that were the case, the battery would never reach full charge and the voltage would never rise so high. Phil, How about you designing circuitry/program to charge cells individually rather than the battery. Or has that been tried?? 73 Dave 73, Dave, WB6LLO dguim...@san.rr.com Disagree: I learn Pulling for P3E... ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery eclipse voltage decreasing
On 8/13/11 6:11 PM, Dave Guimont wrote: How about you designing circuitry/program to charge cells individually rather than the battery. Or has that been tried?? That's a great idea; I wish I thought of it first, but it was Lou McFadden W5DID who published a paper at the AMSAT Symposium a few years ago on a new modular power system. His idea was to turn each cell into an intelligent energy storage module and to connect those modules in parallel to a power bus. There'd be a DC-DC converter between the cell and the bus so they could operate at different voltages. If the cell in one module failed, it would disconnect itself from the bus instead of dragging it down. He found it a challenge to achieve high efficiency in the DC-DC converter with low voltage batteries. For the lower voltage chemistries (e.g., NiMH at 1.2 V) it might be necessary to compromise by using two or maybe three cells in series per module. A lithium ion module would need only one cell since they operate at a much higher voltage of 3.6V. The beauty of his scheme is that not only would this be far more robust against individual cell failures than a single series string, you could fly several kinds of batteries to see which functions best. With the proper command to a module controller you could perform a controlled discharge of its cell for a capacity test. That's kinda neat. Some modules could use supercaps. They have very high cycle lives (~500,000) but low energy density (0.35 watt-hour for a D-cell sized cap). You'd always discharge them first, or perhaps keep one in reserve to keep a computer going. Since they're capacitors you'd need the DC-DC regulator to produce a constant voltage as they discharge. Thinking more about his scheme, you could program each module with a command like Keep the power bus at +12V by pumping up to 2A into it until you're 50% depleted or charge at 1A max unless the bus voltage falls to 11.5V. The computer could issue a new command at any time, such as one to stop all charging when the satellite enters eclipse. One module might contain just a load resistor to act as a shunt regulator to keep the bus voltage from going too high. And one or two modules might contain high-density (e.g., lithium) primary batteries as emergency fallbacks to keep things going long enough for the command stations to figure out what's going on. -Phil ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery eclipse voltage decreasing
Dave, A simple switching inverter connected to the solar cells with multiple windings would prevent over charging as the voltage output would be regulated to the voltage of a single cell and the windings providing isolation between cells. This would insure an equal charge to each cell preventing early battery failure. Using FET switches for rectification can boost efficiencies to over 90% even using input voltages as low as 2 Volts D.C. Art, KC6UQH -Original Message- From: amsat-bb-boun...@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-boun...@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Dave Guimont Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2011 6:11 PM To: Phil Karn Cc: amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery eclipse voltage decreasing Disclaimer: what follows is entirely my own personal opinion, not necessarily that of the ARISSat-1 team or anyone else. I might be missing information that would affect my analysis. Ken's plot is extremely valuable. It strongly suggests battery failure, not a negative power budget as Tony, AA2TX suggests. Note the sharp and consistent *increase* in daylight battery voltage that occurred late on Aug 11, roughly coincident with sharp *decreases* of voltage during eclipse and reports of computer resets and extended low power operation. This is inconsistent with a negative orbit-average power budget. If that were the case, the battery would never reach full charge and the voltage would never rise so high. Phil, How about you designing circuitry/program to charge cells individually rather than the battery. Or has that been tried?? 73 Dave 73, Dave, WB6LLO dguim...@san.rr.com Disagree: I learn Pulling for P3E... ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 6374 (20110813) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 6375 (20110813) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery eclipse voltage decreasing
Dear Gould / ARISSat-1 team, Thanks for sharing this ! When the battery would go dead (or has very long charge times), to what extend would that also impact the low power mode ? Better phrazed: what are the requirements to go/stay in low power mode ? Is there a (no power) mode, where there is not enough power to go even into low power mode ? A kind of test/emergency mode, where the uplink/xponder and even FM is off but only the CW beacon is still on ? ... another question: Which type of command capabilities are available to the team, only a bare minimum (satellite TX on/off) or more ? Best regards, Henk, PA3GUO The ARISSat-1 Battery voltage is decreasing each eclipse period. It therefore is taking longer for the Battery to charge up to 32.5V to allow the switch from Low Power to High Power when the satellite enters an illumination period. ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 Battery
Hi Clint, The battery can run ARISSat-1 for about 6 days on the ISS so it will still be almost fully charged if they run it for just 1 day. Once it is deployed, the solar panels will charge the battery. 73, Tony AA2TX --- On 7/25/2011 6:39 PM, Clint Bradford wrote: OK - Charging of the ARISSat-1's battery is scheduled for July 27. And a test this weekend. Will the battery be charged a second time - before EVA-29 on August 3? What is the expected/anticipated battery charge state to be after the July 30 test? Good enough for deployment without another charge? Clint Bradford, K6LCS ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
On 16 Apr 2011 10:47:57, John P. Toscano, W0JT wrote: Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure One small consolation is that if the ISS crew can't get it working before tossing it into space, it could (possibly) be brought back to Earth on a future return trip to be diagnosed and repaired on the ground. But let's hope it is something simple to fix up on the ISS and that someone on the crew can take a little time to fix it. But I also understand that none of those 3 scenarios are guaranteed (easy to fix, time to fix it, or return it to Earth). John P. Toscano, W0JT I can think of a somewhat darker scenario... On April 14, 2011, Clint K6LCS posted: Message-ID: b4798e98-0a8b-4b39-918c-f8ec70ffe...@mac.com Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII RadioSkaf's Alexander, RA3WOK, just wrote me that they do, indeed, suspect battery failure of the ARISSat-1. Investigation and plans for deployment continue. According to preliminary information the problem is a failure of the battery ... In the near future, batteries will be on Earth. It cannot be kept on the ISS. The situation will improve in June and July, when scheduled launching of ARISSat-1. If the batteries cannot be kept on the ISS, there are three opportunities to return them (intact) to earth before the Russian EVA #29 now scheduled for July 27, 2011: -On STS-134 returning to earth May 12(?), 2011 -On Soyuz TMA-20 returning to earth May 16, 2011 -On STS-135 returning to earth July 12, 2011 Someone will have to remove the battery from ARISSat, and place it on one these vehicles... assuming the time and down mass capacity to this can be found. Replacing the battery with another becomes the next issue. Is there a spare on board? If that cannot be done then the option is to launch ARISSat as is and let it run off the solar panels. If the desire is to get the battery off the ISS as quickly as possible, then it goes on the Progress M-09M, which is to be de-orbited April 26, 2011. If time cannot be found to remove the battery from ARISSat, then the simplest thing to do is to put ARISSat, battery and all, on the Progress and de-orbit it. Of course, we could all be surprised and it could be deployed by the STS-134 crew, but they are going to be plenty busy as it is. This is just idle speculation on my part... It's a gloomy rain day in Michigan. :-) 73 Armando, N8IGJ ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
If that cannot be done then the option is to launch ARISSat as is and let it run off the solar panels. pleased to be wrong here but I dont think that is an option. I THINK (and you know that really could be wrong) that the battery is essential for the 15 minute silent period on launch Robert WB5MZO From: am25...@triton.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2011 02:47:09 -0400 Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure On 16 Apr 2011 10:47:57, John P. Toscano, W0JT wrote: Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure One small consolation is that if the ISS crew can't get it working before tossing it into space, it could (possibly) be brought back to Earth on a future return trip to be diagnosed and repaired on the ground. But let's hope it is something simple to fix up on the ISS and that someone on the crew can take a little time to fix it. But I also understand that none of those 3 scenarios are guaranteed (easy to fix, time to fix it, or return it to Earth). John P. Toscano, W0JT I can think of a somewhat darker scenario... On April 14, 2011, Clint K6LCS posted: Message-ID: b4798e98-0a8b-4b39-918c-f8ec70ffe...@mac.com Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII RadioSkaf's Alexander, RA3WOK, just wrote me that they do, indeed, suspect battery failure of the ARISSat-1. Investigation and plans for deployment continue. According to preliminary information the problem is a failure of the battery ... In the near future, batteries will be on Earth. It cannot be kept on the ISS. The situation will improve in June and July, when scheduled launching of ARISSat-1. If the batteries cannot be kept on the ISS, there are three opportunities to return them (intact) to earth before the Russian EVA #29 now scheduled for July 27, 2011: -On STS-134 returning to earth May 12(?), 2011 -On Soyuz TMA-20 returning to earth May 16, 2011 -On STS-135 returning to earth July 12, 2011 Someone will have to remove the battery from ARISSat, and place it on one these vehicles... assuming the time and down mass capacity to this can be found. Replacing the battery with another becomes the next issue. Is there a spare on board? If that cannot be done then the option is to launch ARISSat as is and let it run off the solar panels. If the desire is to get the battery off the ISS as quickly as possible, then it goes on the Progress M-09M, which is to be de-orbited April 26, 2011. If time cannot be found to remove the battery from ARISSat, then the simplest thing to do is to put ARISSat, battery and all, on the Progress and de-orbit it. Of course, we could all be surprised and it could be deployed by the STS-134 crew, but they are going to be plenty busy as it is. This is just idle speculation on my part... It's a gloomy rain day in Michigan. :-) 73 Armando, N8IGJ ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
On Apr 15 2011, R Oler wrote: There are LOTS of reasons that the bird could have failed, in my viewpoint the BEST one is that the battery has some issues. Operating the vehicle in a thermal environment that it was not designed for would be a first guess, followed by some sort of crib death issue, and next comes parts connected wrong. In any event the failure does not bode well for a successful sat deployment. See if this makes it on the board. Robert G. Oler WB5MZO ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb One small consolation is that if the ISS crew can't get it working before tossing it into space, it could (possibly) be brought back to Earth on a future return trip to be diagnosed and repaired on the ground. But let's hope it is something simple to fix up on the ISS and that someone on the crew can take a little time to fix it. But I also understand that none of those 3 scenarios are guaranteed (easy to fix, time to fix it, or return it to Earth). John P. Toscano, W0JT ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
Or we could put Gould on the the next trip to the ISS and fix it! Comon laugh--it's the weekend. 73 Bob W7LRD - Original Message - From: tosca...@umn.edu To: R Oler orbit...@hotmail.com Cc: Amsat BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Saturday, April 16, 2011 8:47:57 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure On Apr 15 2011, R Oler wrote: There are LOTS of reasons that the bird could have failed, in my viewpoint the BEST one is that the battery has some issues. Operating the vehicle in a thermal environment that it was not designed for would be a first guess, followed by some sort of crib death issue, and next comes parts connected wrong. In any event the failure does not bode well for a successful sat deployment. See if this makes it on the board. Robert G. Oler WB5MZO ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb One small consolation is that if the ISS crew can't get it working before tossing it into space, it could (possibly) be brought back to Earth on a future return trip to be diagnosed and repaired on the ground. But let's hope it is something simple to fix up on the ISS and that someone on the crew can take a little time to fix it. But I also understand that none of those 3 scenarios are guaranteed (easy to fix, time to fix it, or return it to Earth). John P. Toscano, W0JT ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
There are LOTS of reasons that the bird could have failed, in my viewpoint the BEST one is that the battery has some issues. Operating the vehicle in a thermal environment that it was not designed for would be a first guess, followed by some sort of crib death issue, and next comes parts connected wrong. In any event the failure does not bode well for a successful sat deployment. See if this makes it on the board. Robert G. Oler WB5MZO ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery
gt; on 2m and we were in the wrong place. -- Message: 10 Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 23:11:32 -0500 From: quot;Tom Schuesslerquot; lt;tjschuess...@verizon.netgt; Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery To: lt;amsat-bb@amsat.orggt; Message-ID: lt;003601cbfa5a$09915070$1cb3f150$@netgt; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII All I have to say here is quot;Pollyanna is alive and wellquot;. The spin machine goes into action. See below. Tom Schuessler, N5HYP __-- Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 battery. From: G0MRF@xxx Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 10:11:21 EDT Hi Nitin / Vince. Although the non appearance of ARISSat-1 has been a little disappointing, in the overall scheme of things we are still looking at a major AMSAT achievement here. There is after all a satellite awaiting 'launch' on the ISS. We know it's a success because so many people have named it and want it to be identified as belonging to them. We even have some working telemetry decoding software 3 months ahead of launch. - Yipee. I'm really not sure what all the confusion over the last few days tells us. Prepared press releases full of mistakes, a complete lack of preperation following the long period of testing which left the battery delpleted. No plan B to charge it during the sleep period - One wonders if the switches were even returned to the correct positions when it was last turned off. Despite a turbulent last few days, the main event is yet to come and as long as the designers have anticipated it being deployed with a completely flat battery, then we can all sit back and wait for July more prepared from this rehearsal than we would have been. Regards David G0MRF As well as Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat Deactivation From: Bruce lt;kk5do@gt; Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 18:27:26 -0500 this is why we did not hear itthey had the 430mhz transmitter turned on... was anyone listening to the 70cm frequency? all the preparations on 2m and we were in the wrong place. Afterwards, Dmitri performed hardware deactivation amp; close-out activities on the TEKh-43 Radioskaf-B quot;Kedrquot; test microsatellite in the MRM2 Poisk module which had been connected to an 825M3 Orlan battery and operated its 430 MHz transmitter yesterday. 73...bruce -- Message: 11 Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:39:05 +0200 From: quot;Mateuszquot; lt;sq7...@poczta.onet.plgt; Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery. To: lt;amsat-bb@amsat.orggt; Message-ID: lt;664102E1D5C243308CF2B8A8B0EE91B4@win7Komputergt; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=quot;ISO-8859-1quot; http://www.federalspace.ru/main.php?id=2amp;nid=11374amp;lang=en From: g0...@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 11:31 PM To: sq7...@poczta.onet.pl ; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery. Well found Matt Looks like the contents of page 9 highlight some potentially critical issues. Time will tell. David In a message dated 13/04/2011 20:11:43 GMT Daylight Time, sq7...@poczta.onet.pl writes: http://arissat1.org/media/pdf/ARISSat-1%20CDR%20Battery.pdf very interesting document ... any professional comment? Matt SQ7DQX -- Message: 12 Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 23:10:00 -0700 From: quot;Nitin Muttin [VU3TYG]quot; lt;vu3...@amsatindia.orggt; Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: AMSAT-BB ARISSat Deactivation To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Message-ID: lt;50fd8409df3b589e1b4433c5192d992e@134.134.139.74gt; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=quot;iso-8859-1quot; I was monitoring the 437.550 downlink on all passes from April 11th until April 13th but nothing heard. -- Regards Nitin [VU3TYG] - Original Message From: amsat-bb@amsat.org To: amsat-bb@amsat.org lt;amsat-bb@amsat.orggt; Subject: AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 6, Issue 215 Date: 13/04/11 04:38 gt; Send AMSAT-BB mailing list submissions to gt; amsat-bb@amsat.org gt; gt; To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit gt; http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb gt; or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to gt; amsat-bb-requ...@amsat.org gt; gt; You can reach the person managing the list at gt; amsat-bb-ow...@amsat.org gt; gt; When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific gt; than amp;quot;Re: Contents of AMSAT-BB digest...amp;quot; gt; gt; gt; Today's Topics: gt; gt;1. Re: Space-track downloads working? (Richard John K7MDH) gt;2. Re: AO-51 apparently down (Zachary Beougher) gt;3. Re: ISS Heard in CHILE!!! (Andrew Rich
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
can it default to solar cells? aka AO-7 73 Bob W7LRD - Original Message - From: Clint Bradford clintbradf...@mac.com To: AMSAT BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 8:33:40 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure RadioSkaf's Alexander, RA3WOK, just wrote me that they do, indeed, suspect battery failure of the ARISSat-1. Investigation and plans for deployment continue. According to preliminary information the problem is a failure of the battery ... In the near future, batteries will be on Earth. It cannot be kept on the ISS. The situation will improve in June and July, when scheduled launching of ARISSat-1. Clint, K6LCS http://www.work-sat.com ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
I think I remember the answer is yes. Mark N8MH On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:38 PM, Bob- W7LRD w7...@comcast.net wrote: can it default to solar cells? aka AO-7 73 Bob W7LRD - Original Message - From: Clint Bradford clintbradf...@mac.com To: AMSAT BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 8:33:40 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure RadioSkaf's Alexander, RA3WOK, just wrote me that they do, indeed, suspect battery failure of the ARISSat-1. Investigation and plans for deployment continue. According to preliminary information the problem is a failure of the battery ... In the near future, batteries will be on Earth. It cannot be kept on the ISS. The situation will improve in June and July, when scheduled launching of ARISSat-1. Clint, K6LCS http://www.work-sat.com ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb -- Mark L. Hammond [N8MH] ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
According to Anthony AA2TX's presentation/research ... -The battery must be initially charged to power up ARISSat-1 -The battery must have a charge for the initial 15 minutes of activation -ARISSat-1 will power down during eclipse if battery fails -ARISSat-1 can operate without battery in sunlight ... can it default to solar cells? aka AO-7 Don't know if my answer is on target, Bob. But that's all I have at my fingertips ... Clint ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
Hi Bob all.. As far as I can see, the main reason it needs power is to allow the transmitter to stay in the OFF state during deployment and for 15 minutes after release, once it switches ON the battery can be depleted without any adverse effects. This was talked about here on -bb a few weeks back. 73 Pete 2i0VAX On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 5:38 PM, Bob- W7LRD w7...@comcast.net wrote: can it default to solar cells? aka AO-7 73 Bob W7LRD - Original Message - From: Clint Bradford clintbradf...@mac.com To: AMSAT BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 8:33:40 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure RadioSkaf's Alexander, RA3WOK, just wrote me that they do, indeed, suspect battery failure of the ARISSat-1. Investigation and plans for deployment continue. According to preliminary information the problem is a failure of the battery ... In the near future, batteries will be on Earth. It cannot be kept on the ISS. The situation will improve in June and July, when scheduled launching of ARISSat-1. Clint, K6LCS http://www.work-sat.com ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
Can't we just call AAA for a battery jump he he he 73 de Angelo - Original Message - From: Mark L. Hammond marklhamm...@gmail.com To: Bob- W7LRD w7...@comcast.net Cc: Clint Bradford clintbradf...@mac.com; AMSAT BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 11:53 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure I think I remember the answer is yes. Mark N8MH On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:38 PM, Bob- W7LRD w7...@comcast.net wrote: can it default to solar cells? aka AO-7 73 Bob W7LRD - Original Message - From: Clint Bradford clintbradf...@mac.com To: AMSAT BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 8:33:40 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure RadioSkaf's Alexander, RA3WOK, just wrote me that they do, indeed, suspect battery failure of the ARISSat-1. Investigation and plans for deployment continue. According to preliminary information the problem is a failure of the battery ... In the near future, batteries will be on Earth. It cannot be kept on the ISS. The situation will improve in June and July, when scheduled launching of ARISSat-1. Clint, K6LCS http://www.work-sat.com ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb -- Mark L. Hammond [N8MH] ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
Dear Friends, There has been a great deal of speculation on the amsat-bb about the Russian battery on ARISSat-1 having failed. Be aware that this is nothing other than idle speculation. There has been no information from RSC-Energia to support this. I believe the mis-information comes from a report on the ARISSat-1 power system that was written by me and sent to RSC-Energia. One of the sections included a prediction of the battery life in orbit. The 825M3 is a Russian space suit battery and its life was not specified or characterized for operation of a satellite. The most recent AMSAT Journal includes an article that covers this material. The article in the AMSAT journal predicts that the 825M3 battery should last for about 2 months in orbit. That means that if the satellite was deployed in February as originally planned, it might be too weak to run the satellite reliably by the time the Yuri celebration commenced on April 12th. This fact was stated on the (Russian) Roscosmos web site but is being misinterpreted as the battery is weak. For the record, the battery in ARISSat-1 was a brand new 825M3 space suit battery and was charged on the ISS prior to the February test. After charging, the battery can run ARISSat-1 for at least 100 hours so it should have had more than enough remaining charge to operate through the Yuri Gagarin event. It is of course possible that the battery did indeed fail but any information propagated on amsat-bb to that effect at this time is not based on facts. AMSAT is working with RSC-Energia and NASA to identify the actual reason that the satellite was not heard. 73, Tony AA2TX ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure
- Original Message - From: Anthony Monteiro aa...@comcast.net To: AMSAT BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 9:42 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 - Battery Failure Dear Friends, There has been a great deal of speculation on the amsat-bb about the Russian battery on ARISSat-1 having failed. Be aware that this is nothing other than idle speculation. There has been no information from RSC-Energia to support this. I believe the mis-information comes from a report on the ARISSat-1 power system that was written by me and sent to RSC-Energia. One of the sections included a prediction of the battery life in orbit. The 825M3 is a Russian space suit battery and its life was not specified or characterized for operation of a satellite. The most recent AMSAT Journal includes an article that covers this material. The article in the AMSAT journal predicts that the 825M3 battery should last for about 2 months in orbit. That means that if the satellite was deployed in February as originally planned, it might be too weak to run the satellite reliably by the time the Yuri celebration commenced on April 12th. This fact was stated on the (Russian) Roscosmos web site but is being misinterpreted as the battery is weak. For the record, the battery in ARISSat-1 was a brand new 825M3 space suit battery and was charged on the ISS prior to the February test. After charging, the battery can run ARISSat-1 for at least 100 hours so it should have had more than enough remaining charge to operate through the Yuri Gagarin event. It is of course possible that the battery did indeed fail but any information propagated on amsat-bb to that effect at this time is not based on facts. AMSAT is working with RSC-Energia and NASA to identify the actual reason that the satellite was not heard. 73, Tony AA2TX Hi Tony, AA2TX I know that you did a great work for ARISSsat-1,congratulations, but after reading the Gould Smith report AMSAT NEWS SERVICE ANS-104 ANS Special Bulletin - ARISSat-1 Not Heard During Gagarin Commemoration everyone understand that there was a poor connection between NASA, AMSAT and RSC-Energia. I hope AMSAT will be able to identify the actual technical reason that the satellite was not heard. To be honest with you the actual situation of a unknow technical reason for ARISSsat-1 is spiritually similar to when someone forgot to remove the famous red cap over a valve of AO40 before to fly and once again we are all concerned for the future ! Best 73 de i8CVS Domenico ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery.
Hi, If we is the hams arournd the world I think most of us we ready to rock and roll then some. Im not sure what did or didn't happen. I just hope they do somthing before July a re run of the test is a thought. 73 kc9pxz Jimmy - Original Message - From: g0...@aol.com To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 9:11 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 battery. Hi Nitin / Vince. Although the non appearance of ARISSat-1 has been a little disappointing, in the overall scheme of things we are still looking at a major AMSAT achievement here. There is after all a satellite awaiting 'launch' on the ISS. We know it's a success because so many people have named it and want it to be identified as belonging to them. We even have some working telemetry decoding software 3 months ahead of launch. - Yipee. I'm really not sure what all the confusion over the last few days tells us. Prepared press releases full of mistakes, a complete lack of preperation following the long period of testing which left the battery delpleted. No plan B to charge it during the sleep period - One wonders if the switches were even returned to the correct positions when it was last turned off. Despite a turbulent last few days, the main event is yet to come and as long as the designers have anticipated it being deployed with a completely flat battery, then we can all sit back and wait for July more prepared from this rehearsal than we would have been. Regards David G0MRF In a message dated 12/04/2011 21:13:19 GMT Standard Time, vlfis...@mcn.net writes: At 10:49 PM 4/11/2011 +0530, vu3...@amsatindia.org wrote: Nothing heard on the 16.20 UTC pass, watch the live feed from ISS from http://spaceflight.nasa.gov looks like the crew is working on addressing the issue, the last comment I heard is recharging the batteries ( Please excuse if I am wrong J ). 73's Nitin [VU3TYG] That's what I was thinking because someone should have heard it by now. Maybe in two months pass the time since it should launched, even though it was off there might have been a small drain on the batteries and now they're in a discharge state. KB7ADL ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery.
Well found Matt Looks like the contents of page 9 highlight some potentially critical issues. Time will tell. David In a message dated 13/04/2011 20:11:43 GMT Daylight Time, sq7...@poczta.onet.pl writes: http://arissat1.org/media/pdf/ARISSat-1%20CDR%20Battery.pdf very interesting document ... any professional comment? Matt SQ7DQX ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery
All I have to say here is Pollyanna is alive and well. The spin machine goes into action. See below. Tom Schuessler, N5HYP __-- Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 battery. From: G0MRF@xxx Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 10:11:21 EDT Hi Nitin / Vince. Although the non appearance of ARISSat-1 has been a little disappointing, in the overall scheme of things we are still looking at a major AMSAT achievement here. There is after all a satellite awaiting 'launch' on the ISS. We know it's a success because so many people have named it and want it to be identified as belonging to them. We even have some working telemetry decoding software 3 months ahead of launch. - Yipee. I'm really not sure what all the confusion over the last few days tells us. Prepared press releases full of mistakes, a complete lack of preperation following the long period of testing which left the battery delpleted. No plan B to charge it during the sleep period - One wonders if the switches were even returned to the correct positions when it was last turned off. Despite a turbulent last few days, the main event is yet to come and as long as the designers have anticipated it being deployed with a completely flat battery, then we can all sit back and wait for July more prepared from this rehearsal than we would have been. Regards David G0MRF As well as Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat Deactivation From: Bruce kk5do@ Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 18:27:26 -0500 this is why we did not hear itthey had the 430mhz transmitter turned on... was anyone listening to the 70cm frequency? all the preparations on 2m and we were in the wrong place. Afterwards, Dmitri performed hardware deactivation close-out activities on the TEKh-43 Radioskaf-B Kedr test microsatellite in the MRM2 Poisk module which had been connected to an 825M3 Orlan battery and operated its 430 MHz transmitter yesterday. 73...bruce ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery.
http://www.federalspace.ru/main.php?id=2nid=11374lang=en From: g0...@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 11:31 PM To: sq7...@poczta.onet.pl ; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat-1 battery. Well found Matt Looks like the contents of page 9 highlight some potentially critical issues. Time will tell. David In a message dated 13/04/2011 20:11:43 GMT Daylight Time, sq7...@poczta.onet.pl writes: http://arissat1.org/media/pdf/ARISSat-1%20CDR%20Battery.pdf very interesting document ... any professional comment? Matt SQ7DQX ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
