[amsat-bb] Re: LEO to HEO
Hi all, For those interested in how to get from LEO to HEO - well at least to MEO, here is a link to some slides produced by David G0MRF back in 2009 that explains quite a lot about the subject. http://mstl.atl.calpoly.edu/~bklofas/Presentations/AMSATUK2009/2c_Bowman-MEO.pdf As it happens I am presently on a very early train going to Glasgow to deliver the Flight Model hardware for the FUNcube sub-system for integration into the UKube 3U spacecraft. This is being assembled at Clyde Space Ltd and is scheduled to be launched in March next year. The FUNcube subsystem on this spacecraft is intended to provide a linear U/V transponder for amateur use and telemetry for school students. AMSAT-UK is delighted to have been given the opportunity to join in this project and is grateful to those who made this happen, to all their volunteers who have worked so hard to turn the idea into a reality, and to the many supporters who have donated towards the costs. As well as our FUNcube subsystem, there is also a U/V transceiver from ISIS BV on board and this also has AO16 FMtoDSB functionality as well. The next couple of weeks should also see us finish the testing and integration of FUNcube-1 which is another, separate, complete, 1U spacecraft, and which is presently expected to launch in April. more news later 73 Graham G3VZV ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: LEO to HEO
On 2012.10.19 08:19, Gus 8P6SM wrote: On 10/18/2012 06:16 PM, STeve Andre' wrote: It absolutely could be done -- with the right amount of money. I'm not sure that a kick motor would ultimately be cheaper than a flight designed to get something into HEO, nor as safe. I think the problem with traditional kick motors is that they're big and heavy. Pretty much mandating a Fridge-Sat, not a Rubik-Sat. Other propulsion systems may be better suited to a small format. I wonder what would happen if you electrically detonated a large firearms cartridge in a small satellite. I mean, exactly how much of a 'kick' do you need to get a small satellite up to a reasonable height? Perhaps this is an experiment some university should conduct. Here's also interesting concept and figures: http://nextbigfuture.com/2012/02/electrolysis-propulsion-for-cubesat.html 73! Zilvis LY2SS ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: LEO to HEO
On 10/18/2012 06:16 PM, STeve Andre' wrote: > It absolutely could be done -- with the right amount of money. > I'm not sure that a kick motor would ultimately be cheaper > than a flight designed to get something into HEO, nor as safe. I think the problem with traditional kick motors is that they're big and heavy. Pretty much mandating a Fridge-Sat, not a Rubik-Sat. Other propulsion systems may be better suited to a small format. I wonder what would happen if you electrically detonated a large firearms cartridge in a small satellite. I mean, exactly how much of a 'kick' do you need to get a small satellite up to a reasonable height? Perhaps this is an experiment some university should conduct. -- 73, de Gus 8P6SM The Easternmost Isle ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: LEO to HEO
On 10/18/12 08:44, Joshua wrote: Morning folks, I'm a relatively new ham and started following amsat only a few months so forgive something of a novice question. The biggest trouble I see the community hitching a ride to a high orbit although low orbits seem to be easy to get. So my question is this, who says we can't launch a sat in LEO and design it to move itself up to a higher orbit? I mean if NASA can build probes capable of reaching mars, it stands to reason we can build a bird to move only a few thousand miles. Thanks, Joshua Abraham, KJ4VYR It absolutely could be done -- with the right amount of money. I'm not sure that a kick motor would ultimately be cheaper than a flight designed to get something into HEO, nor as safe. It's really all about money, several millions of little dollarettes... --STeve Andre' wb8wsf en72 ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
[amsat-bb] Re: LEO to HEO
You make an excellent point, but I think you are assuming that the sat would be equipped with a solid fuel or other form of combustible/volatile propulsion. A cold-gas microthruster along with some sort of variable magnetic stabilization could in theory work around any liability concerns as liquid nitrogen, helium, etc can't explode under most conditions. I'm not sure about size requirements/ restrictions however. I'm far from an expert but I would guess if something like this could make it into orbit, the thruster would provide enough power to nudge the sat up and then use the planets gravity to acelerate it out to at least a MEO. It might even be able to do something like this in something as small as a 3U cubesat. Josh, KJ4VYR On Oct 18, 2012, at 10:39 AM, Bruce wrote: > good question and of course pondered and explored in the past. in order to > move a satellite, you have to have some sort of propulsion for it. weather a > kick start motor or plasma ejector or something. all of these require some > type of 'fuel'. now, that being said, 'fuel' takes up a lot of space, > requires special storage containers that are heavy and... no one will let you > put fuel on their rocket and when your fuel goes bang by accident their > entire mission is gone. if we were to pay for a launch the price of having > the fuel would be included in the launch company's quote. we would also have > to have insurance to cover a catastrophic event for them, mucho expensive. > > all said and done, yes, you can launch into an orbit and with the correct > size motor/propulsion device, you could move it to where you want it. just > not feasible. just like buying a grand piano, living on the 10th floor. can't > go up stairs, can't go up elevator, if you want to get a crane or helicopter, > you can get it there but then you have to bust out the side of the building. > was the $100,000 trip to get that piano into your apartment worth the $5,000 > cost of the piano? > > 73...bruce > > On 10/18/2012 7:44 AM, Joshua wrote: >> Morning folks, >> I'm a relatively new ham and started following amsat only a few months so >> forgive something of a novice question. >> >> The biggest trouble I see the community hitching a ride to a high orbit >> although low orbits seem to be easy to get. So my question is this, who says >> we can't launch a sat in LEO and design it to move itself up to a higher >> orbit? I mean if NASA can build probes capable of reaching mars, it stands >> to reason we can build a bird to move only a few thousand miles. >> >> Thanks, >> Joshua Abraham, KJ4VYR >> ___ >> Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. >> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! >> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb >> > > > -- > > Bruce Paige, KK5DO > AMSAT Director Contests and Awards > ARRL Awards Manager (WAS, 5BWAS, VUCC), VE > Houston AMSAT Net - Wed 0100z on Echolink - Conference *AMSAT* > Also live streaming MP3 at http://www.amsatnet.com > Podcast at http://www.amsatnet.com/podcast.xml or iTunes > Latest satellite news on the ARRL Audio News > http://www.arrl.org > > AMSAT on Twitter http://www.twitter.com/amsat > ___ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
