[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Hi, On Aug 17, 9:38 pm, Katie Smith ka...@grayfinstudios.com wrote: Advice on how to respond -http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/cost-efficient-way-for-app-de... Google the author of this blog. Even if you ignore the somewhat shaky reputation that he has in the open source community (there have been accusations that he is a Microsoft shill, although you'll have to judge for yourself), the one thing that should be noted is that he is not a lawyer and has no legal expertise on which to base his advice. This can't be stressed enough. Be very careful about taking legal advice from someone who is not a lawyer (and generally speaking, never take legal advice from the internet). One source that anyone who has come under attack in this case should read: http://www.groklaw.net - They are following the case closely and in detail. Your one-stop shop for the filings and counter-filings in the case going on in the various cases. They have also collected lots of data (such as prior art) that may be useful. Their suggestions on what to do: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20110614184205441 http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20110615111436917 Though again, the most important suggestion (as Groklaw also stress): do not take legal advice from the Internet. Each case is individual, and what applies in one situation may not apply in another (particularly relevant for Europeans - national laws will vary a lot). A very important opportunity for app developers who have received a letter (and for others as well): Patent Trolls and You: EFF Virtual Boot Camp for App Developers http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/08/join-us-patent-trolls-and-you-eff-virtual-boot The EFF will hot a live panel of actual patent attorneys and law professors who will discuss the basics of patent litigation on live stream and take questions via Twitter and E-mail on September 9 at 12:00 pm PST. -- micax -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Hi All, We just got our Lodsys notice as well. This is ridiculous and a direct obstacle to innovation in the US. Any other advice on how to handle this? Would it be possible for all of us developers to join together in a class-action lawsuit? -Chad On Aug 28, 9:56 am, Russell DuRoss r2s...@gmail.com wrote: Their site suggests they are interested in engaging in a discussion about an appropriate licensing amount. So maybe respond to them indicating that you are willing to negotiate and in the same response include enough info so they can see that you are a small developer. When they see your response there is maybe a chance that they will decide it's not worth their effort to pursue it. If so, you may then never hear from them again. Are there any small developers out there that have done this? On Aug 27, 10:23 am, Andy m...@tekx.de wrote: I'm only accused for 7,222,078 (the in app billing) beside my app has no in-app purchase or upgrade. It's simply a http link to the android market.I think they are sure that their patent covers the process behind this?!?!. But if so, this would ment, that even web-Applications are not allowed to link to a amazon store or something similar. This patent is so common sense / so widely interpretable that I think this will not last that long. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
On Sep 1, 2:13 pm, Sheado chad...@gmail.com wrote: Hi All, We just got our Lodsys notice as well. This is ridiculous and a direct obstacle to innovation in the US. Any other advice on how to handle this? Would it be possible for all of us developers to join together in a class-action lawsuit? -Chad On Aug 28, 9:56 am, Russell DuRoss r2s...@gmail.com wrote: Their site suggests they are interested in engaging in a discussion about an appropriate licensing amount. So maybe respond to them indicating that you are willing to negotiate and in the same response include enough info so they can see that you are a small developer. When they see your response there is maybe a chance that they will decide it's not worth their effort to pursue it. If so, you may then never hear from them again. Are there any small developers out there that have done this? On Aug 27, 10:23 am, Andy m...@tekx.de wrote: I'm only accused for 7,222,078 (the in app billing) beside my app has no in-app purchase or upgrade. It's simply a http link to the android market.I think they are sure that their patent covers the process behind this?!?!. But if so, this would ment, that even web-Applications are not allowed to link to a amazon store or something similar. This patent is so common sense / so widely interpretable that I think this will not last that long.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'd have to see it myself, but I imagine, I would ignore the letter If I were in your shoes. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Their site suggests they are interested in engaging in a discussion about an appropriate licensing amount. So maybe respond to them indicating that you are willing to negotiate and in the same response include enough info so they can see that you are a small developer. When they see your response there is maybe a chance that they will decide it's not worth their effort to pursue it. If so, you may then never hear from them again. Are there any small developers out there that have done this? On Aug 27, 10:23 am, Andy m...@tekx.de wrote: I'm only accused for 7,222,078 (the in app billing) beside my app has no in-app purchase or upgrade. It's simply a http link to the android market.I think they are sure that their patent covers the process behind this?!?!. But if so, this would ment, that even web-Applications are not allowed to link to a amazon store or something similar. This patent is so common sense / so widely interpretable that I think this will not last that long. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Question would be as super small developer whats the easiest Exit Strategy. A Patent Lawer in the US easily costs serveral hundert $/hour. Their strategy might be that this effort is too big for most of us. (Especially from Europe / laguage barrier) So after reading http://www.lodsys.com/1/post/2011/05/q-what-are-you-charging.html i was thinking if the easiest way to sleep better ist, ask them what you have to paid for the past and future use. In case you removed the Button it would be the question how to the know how many apps you have sold in the US. If you sold you app like 500 times for 2 $ this might be a very small amount of money you have to spend. The Question remains it this is legit because their claim that even a link to the Market violates one of their patents is kind of odd, because than you can claim that exact case for every website linking to a Commercial Item like Amazon links oder whatsover. Same Mechanism. The Button in you game is only a HTTP Link to a Android Market website. No Strings attached. Next question qould be hwo to contact them, and how fast do they respond. Anybody experienced a solution that was heading for a licening ? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
They want 0.575% of your gross, past, present and future. On 8/27/2011 6:58 PM, Andy wrote: Question would be as super small developer whats the easiest Exit Strategy. A Patent Lawer in the US easily costs serveral hundert $/hour. Their strategy might be that this effort is too big for most of us. (Especially from Europe / laguage barrier) So after reading http://www.lodsys.com/1/post/2011/05/q-what-are-you-charging.html i was thinking if the easiest way to sleep better ist, ask them what you have to paid for the past and future use. In case you removed the Button it would be the question how to the know how many apps you have sold in the US. If you sold you app like 500 times for 2 $ this might be a very small amount of money you have to spend. The Question remains it this is legit because their claim that even a link to the Market violates one of their patents is kind of odd, because than you can claim that exact case for every website linking to a Commercial Item like Amazon links oder whatsover. Same Mechanism. The Button in you game is only a HTTP Link to a Android Market website. No Strings attached. Next question qould be hwo to contact them, and how fast do they respond. Anybody experienced a solution that was heading for a licening ? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
What is the patent number they refer to? On Sat, Aug 27, 2011 at 3:25 PM, Christopher Van Kirk christopher.vank...@gmail.com wrote: They want 0.575% of your gross, past, present and future. On 8/27/2011 6:58 PM, Andy wrote: Question would be as super small developer whats the easiest Exit Strategy. A Patent Lawer in the US easily costs serveral hundert $/hour. Their strategy might be that this effort is too big for most of us. (Especially from Europe / laguage barrier) So after reading http://www.lodsys.com/1/post/2011/05/q-what-are-you-charging.html i was thinking if the easiest way to sleep better ist, ask them what you have to paid for the past and future use. In case you removed the Button it would be the question how to the know how many apps you have sold in the US. If you sold you app like 500 times for 2 $ this might be a very small amount of money you have to spend. The Question remains it this is legit because their claim that even a link to the Market violates one of their patents is kind of odd, because than you can claim that exact case for every website linking to a Commercial Item like Amazon links oder whatsover. Same Mechanism. The Button in you game is only a HTTP Link to a Android Market website. No Strings attached. Next question qould be hwo to contact them, and how fast do they respond. Anybody experienced a solution that was heading for a licening ? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- Michael Banzon http://michaelbanzon.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
I'm only accused for 7,222,078 (the in app billing) beside my app has no in-app purchase or upgrade. It's simply a http link to the android market.I think they are sure that their patent covers the process behind this?!?!. But if so, this would ment, that even web-Applications are not allowed to link to a amazon store or something similar. This patent is so common sense / so widely interpretable that I think this will not last that long. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
I'm not a patent lawyer either so this isn't advice - it's just my understanding of what your options might be. Sounds like you just got an official notice explaining why you can't write your software the way you have. It's their case. You can, of course prove Lodsys wrong if you do have rights. You really need a patent attorney to know what those rights are. You have to respond to this, at least by talking to them to explain why you don't violate their patent. If you do in fact violate their patent they'll make you change your software and then make you promise to never do that again. And only rely on things in writing: e-mail or by letter. Relying on verbal conversations would be a mistake. If that doesn't work, talk to your attorney. I do know this: if you can show you actually have rights to your invention (your lawyer can tell you that), then this may force Lodsys to pay YOU royalties. And, if they go to court, and the court finds that you actually own the rights to your invention, the court can actually invalidate the Lodsys' patent. An attorney is worth their weight in gold in these circumstances ... literally. Just my $0.02. Richard Schilling -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
They are known to have attacked IPhone developers in the past. Maybe they are having a go at Android?? On Aug 17, 1:56 pm, David Erosa García soul...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 2:48 PM, TreKing treking...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 6:52 AM, David Erosa García soul...@gmail.com wrote: They have attached a screenshot of my webpage in which there are two links, one for the lite version and another one for the full version... Wait, they are basing their claim on your having *links* for your app on your *website* ? Not having a link *in your free app* to the paid one? The Claim Chart shows an screenshot of my app menu, followed by a screenshot of my webpage (http://www.forgotten-systems.com/collage/) pointing to the Market links. Of course there's a link to my web page from my app... The other sshots are from the Market ,concretely the Buy button and the OK button of the Purchase and allow access dialog (¿?) This last one is related to Collecting the results of the interaction from usersin a central location to allow for an upgrade to occur in the product. --- -- TreKing - Chicago transit tracking app for Android-powered devices -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Yeah, I am expecting my letter anytime soon like everyone. Frankly, I'd ignore them until they file legal procedure and actually manage to remove your app from sale. They just don't have funds to start a real legal action against every small dev. For now they only paid to print their shit. At this point they've only succeeded in killing trees. If that legal bullshit is valid, Google will have to remove your app, if they do it they'll have to do it for *everyone* which is basically half the apps on the market. I just wouldn't worry too much. They're just attacking small devs to get what they want from Google and Apple. In the meantime they're just trying to extort money from small people because they know they don't have a lawyer. Also the guys at appsterdam are organizing a defense against these parasites, you might want to talk to them: http://mur.mu.rs/?p=303 I can't believe we're even talking about people actually pretending they invented bloody links between apps. Anyway the american market isn't the biggest one for me so I'll just replace the more apps page in my apps for American users with a message explaining to my users why I am not allowed to link to my own apps. If anyone has an address and phone number or e-mail I'd gladly put an e-mail form in my apps to contact them. PS: Y sobre todo que se vayan a comer mierda :-P On 17 août, 10:34, Christopher Van Kirk christopher.vank...@gmail.com wrote: I for one hope that they (Lodsys) carry on behaving like extortionist gangsters. It's the surest path to patent reform as it relates to software. Thanks Lodsys! On 8/17/2011 8:48 PM, TreKing wrote: On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 6:52 AM, David Erosa Garc�a soul...@gmail.com mailto:soul...@gmail.com wrote: They have attached a screenshot of my webpage in which there are two links, one for the lite version and another one for the full version... Wait, they are basing their claim on your having *links* for your app on your *website* ? Not having a link *in your free app* to the paid one? --- -- TreKing http://sites.google.com/site/rezmobileapps/treking - Chicago transit tracking app for Android-powered devices -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 06:41:29AM -0700, Albert wrote: They are known to have attacked IPhone developers in the past. Maybe they are having a go at Android?? It's been going on for a while, now. And based on some of the gripes I've read about, anything with a CPU, RAM, any method of communication with other devices, etc., all fits into their fscked up distorted vision of their patents. Soon they'll be sending letters to all computer manufacturers in the world, all pocket calculator manufacturers, cell phone makers, telcos, and anyone else using anything that relates to computers. Of course, I am not a lawyer (Thank God!) I know that if I get one of their BS-filled letters, I'll be contacting the CLRC (Cancer Legal Resource Center) for assistance. Later, --jim -- 73 DE N5IAL (/4)| This 'telephone' has too many spooky1...@gmail.com| shortcomings to be seriously considered Running FreeBSD 7.0 | as a means of communication. The device ICBM / Hurricane: | is inherently of no value to us. 30.44406N 86.59909W | (Western Union internal memo, 1876) Android Apps Listing at http://www.jstrack.org/barcodes.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Google's finally stepped in to help, with the intention of hopefully invalidating Lodsys's patents: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2391070,00.asp Cheers, - C -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
They are playing a numbers game. I believe their real target is impressionable indies who cow at the prospect of conflict. If they get one in a hundred app developers to pay them off, they will end up with a decent chunk of change. The actual lawsuits are probably just facades to try to prove they have deep pockets so that people will get scared and pay instead of doing the rational thing and fighting. If what people say is true, pursuing just one patent violator in court could cost into the millions of dollars. Why would anyone pursue an app developer who probably only ever made hundreds of dollars, if anything at all, and spend millions to do it? The truth is they aren't. They're hoping you get scared and pay them $1000 or $100 or whatever to leave you alone. Florian Mueller, the so called 'patent guru' feeds this fear by advocating settling early and often. I think it's just legalized extortion. If you're in the U.S., though, you ought to be very careful about how you execute your transactions in the market. If you aren't incorporated then you won't have any liability limitations, so these jackasses will be able to pursue your assets (house, car, wages, etc) far beyond whatever your sales might have been. I would advise anyone selling apps to incorporate early and often, considering all the sharks in the waters. On 8/17/2011 9:41 PM, Albert wrote: They are known to have attacked IPhone developers in the past. Maybe they are having a go at Android?? On Aug 17, 1:56 pm, David Erosa Garcíasoul...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 2:48 PM, TreKingtreking...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 6:52 AM, David Erosa Garcíasoul...@gmail.com wrote: They have attached a screenshot of my webpage in which there are two links, one for the lite version and another one for the full version... Wait, they are basing their claim on your having *links* for your app on your *website* ? Not having a link *in your free app* to the paid one? The Claim Chart shows an screenshot of my app menu, followed by a screenshot of my webpage (http://www.forgotten-systems.com/collage/) pointing to the Market links. Of course there's a link to my web page from my app... The other sshots are from the Market ,concretely the Buy button and the OK button of the Purchase and allow access dialog (¿?) This last one is related to Collecting the results of the interaction from usersin a central location to allow for an upgrade to occur in the product. --- -- TreKing - Chicago transit tracking app for Android-powered devices -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
David, I'm sorry you are going through this. I put together a list of resources for those of you that have received letters from Lodsys. I will add to it as I find out more information. If you have the contact information for a developer advocate at Google, I suggest talking to them as well. Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) - Julie Samuels (ju...@eff.org) She is helping to coordinate contacts between app developers. She might also be able to help you find a lawyer. (Not sure if you're out of the U.S. though.) Mike Lee's Appsterdam Alliance - http://mur.mu.rs/?p=303 (b...@le.mu.rs) As you can see in this article, he is hoping to get developers together to defend themselves. If you contact him, he can get you in touch with his lawyer. Advice on how to respond - http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/cost-efficient-way-for-app-developers.html As for comments like I for one hope that they (Lodsys) carry on behaving like extortionist gangsters. It's the surest path to patent reform as it relates to software. Thanks Lodsys! (Christopher Van Kirk)... Maybe think a bit before you post something like that. It's really not helpful to anyone and you will be thinking differently when a FedEx from Lodsys shows up on your doorstep and you face a real risk of losing your business and more. -- Katie On Aug 17, 4:17 am, David Erosa García soul...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all. I'm a solo developer from Spain and just received a letter fromlodsysclaiming infringment for 4 US patents... I've been in shock since I received it an hour ago and just wanted to know if any of you has any kind of advise for this situation... I do understand almost nothing of the lawyer-style language of the letter :( Regards. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 9:38 PM, Katie Smith ka...@grayfinstudios.com wrote: David, I'm sorry you are going through this. Thanks, this is something I wish for noone... I put together a list of resources for those of you that have received letters from Lodsys. I will add to it as I find out more information. If you have the contact information for a developer advocate at Google, I suggest talking to them as well. Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) - Julie Samuels (ju...@eff.org) She is helping to coordinate contacts between app developers. She might also be able to help you find a lawyer. (Not sure if you're out of the U.S. though.) Thanks, I had already emailed the EFF and waiting for a response. To be out of the USA will be a very different situation, I guess... Mike Lee's Appsterdam Alliance - http://mur.mu.rs/?p=303 (b...@le.mu.rs) As you can see in this article, he is hoping to get developers together to defend themselves. If you contact him, he can get you in touch with his lawyer. I'll mail him right now! Advice on how to respond - http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/cost-efficient-way-for-app-developers.html As for comments like I for one hope that they (Lodsys) carry on behaving like extortionist gangsters. It's the surest path to patent reform as it relates to software. Thanks Lodsys! (Christopher Van Kirk)... Maybe think a bit before you post something like that. It's really not helpful to anyone and you will be thinking differently when a FedEx from Lodsys shows up on your doorstep and you face a real risk of losing your business and more. That's right. I've received many advices like that one and I can only think those people would not be giving such advices if they were the ones receiving the dammit Fedex package... -- Katie Thank you, Katie. On Aug 17, 4:17 am, David Erosa García soul...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all. I'm a solo developer from Spain and just received a letter fromlodsysclaiming infringment for 4 US patents... I've been in shock since I received it an hour ago and just wanted to know if any of you has any kind of advise for this situation... I do understand almost nothing of the lawyer-style language of the letter :( Regards. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Fear is what these guys want you to have. It makes their bank for them. On 8/18/2011 3:38 AM, Katie Smith wrote: David, I'm sorry you are going through this. I put together a list of resources for those of you that have received letters from Lodsys. I will add to it as I find out more information. If you have the contact information for a developer advocate at Google, I suggest talking to them as well. Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) - Julie Samuels (ju...@eff.org) She is helping to coordinate contacts between app developers. She might also be able to help you find a lawyer. (Not sure if you're out of the U.S. though.) Mike Lee's Appsterdam Alliance - http://mur.mu.rs/?p=303 (b...@le.mu.rs) As you can see in this article, he is hoping to get developers together to defend themselves. If you contact him, he can get you in touch with his lawyer. Advice on how to respond - http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/cost-efficient-way-for-app-developers.html As for comments like I for one hope that they (Lodsys) carry on behaving like extortionist gangsters. It's the surest path to patent reform as it relates to software. Thanks Lodsys! (Christopher Van Kirk)... Maybe think a bit before you post something like that. It's really not helpful to anyone and you will be thinking differently when a FedEx from Lodsys shows up on your doorstep and you face a real risk of losing your business and more. -- Katie On Aug 17, 4:17 am, David Erosa Garcíasoul...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all. I'm a solo developer from Spain and just received a letter fromlodsysclaiming infringment for 4 US patents... I've been in shock since I received it an hour ago and just wanted to know if any of you has any kind of advise for this situation... I do understand almost nothing of the lawyer-style language of the letter :( Regards. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 1:15 AM, Christopher Van Kirk christopher.vank...@gmail.com wrote: Fear is what these guys want you to have. It makes their bank for them. I do really understand your point of view, but if I can barely pay my bills... how in hell could I get into legal actions against this guys??? Regards. On 8/18/2011 3:38 AM, Katie Smith wrote: David, I'm sorry you are going through this. I put together a list of resources for those of you that have received letters from Lodsys. I will add to it as I find out more information. If you have the contact information for a developer advocate at Google, I suggest talking to them as well. Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) - Julie Samuels (ju...@eff.org) She is helping to coordinate contacts between app developers. She might also be able to help you find a lawyer. (Not sure if you're out of the U.S. though.) Mike Lee's Appsterdam Alliance - http://mur.mu.rs/?p=303 (b...@le.mu.rs) As you can see in this article, he is hoping to get developers together to defend themselves. If you contact him, he can get you in touch with his lawyer. Advice on how to respond - http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/cost-efficient-way-for-app-developers.html As for comments like I for one hope that they (Lodsys) carry on behaving like extortionist gangsters. It's the surest path to patent reform as it relates to software. Thanks Lodsys! (Christopher Van Kirk)... Maybe think a bit before you post something like that. It's really not helpful to anyone and you will be thinking differently when a FedEx from Lodsys shows up on your doorstep and you face a real risk of losing your business and more. -- Katie On Aug 17, 4:17 am, David Erosa Garcíasoul...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all. I'm a solo developer from Spain and just received a letter fromlodsysclaiming infringment for 4 US patents... I've been in shock since I received it an hour ago and just wanted to know if any of you has any kind of advise for this situation... I do understand almost nothing of the lawyer-style language of the letter :( Regards. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Turn it around for a second. Why the hell are they pursuing you when their expected return if you go to court is negative? These guys don't make any products. They have no business other than shaking down indie app developers with that patent of theirs, so it's not like they're trying to chase your product out of the market. The answer is that they expect you to send them a check without asking any questions. They are probably getting a lot of checks from frightened developers just like you, and every check they get makes the problem worse for everyone because oils their engine. What I would do if I were you is nothing. Just wait and let them make the first move. Don't be antagonistic, just be non-responsive. If they take you to court, get a lawyer and stall. Time is your friend on this one, I think. Their window of opportunity is closing fast. With both Apple and Google and nearly every other major fighting these guys it's not going to be long before they're either a) engaged with much more attractive fish than you, b) their patent is rendered null and void or c) Google gives them a big check to license everyone that sells in their market. If we're really lucky d) will happen, which is that software patents will be abolished. I'm not a lawyer, so take my opinion as just that, an opinion. The only other thing I'd say is make sure you're incorporated so that they can't pursue your personal assets. On 8/18/2011 7:32 AM, David Erosa García wrote: On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 1:15 AM, Christopher Van Kirk christopher.vank...@gmail.com wrote: Fear is what these guys want you to have. It makes their bank for them. I do really understand your point of view, but if I can barely pay my bills... how in hell could I get into legal actions against this guys??? Regards. On 8/18/2011 3:38 AM, Katie Smith wrote: David, I'm sorry you are going through this. I put together a list of resources for those of you that have received letters from Lodsys. I will add to it as I find out more information. If you have the contact information for a developer advocate at Google, I suggest talking to them as well. Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) - Julie Samuels (ju...@eff.org) She is helping to coordinate contacts between app developers. She might also be able to help you find a lawyer. (Not sure if you're out of the U.S. though.) Mike Lee's Appsterdam Alliance - http://mur.mu.rs/?p=303 (b...@le.mu.rs) As you can see in this article, he is hoping to get developers together to defend themselves. If you contact him, he can get you in touch with his lawyer. Advice on how to respond - http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/cost-efficient-way-for-app-developers.html As for comments like I for one hope that they (Lodsys) carry on behaving like extortionist gangsters. It's the surest path to patent reform as it relates to software. Thanks Lodsys! (Christopher Van Kirk)... Maybe think a bit before you post something like that. It's really not helpful to anyone and you will be thinking differently when a FedEx from Lodsys shows up on your doorstep and you face a real risk of losing your business and more. -- Katie On Aug 17, 4:17 am, David Erosa Garcíasoul...@gmail.comwrote: Hi all. I'm a solo developer from Spain and just received a letter fromlodsysclaiming infringment for 4 US patents... I've been in shock since I received it an hour ago and just wanted to know if any of you has any kind of advise for this situation... I do understand almost nothing of the lawyer-style language of the letter :( Regards. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
Speaking as someone who, thankfully, is NOT a lawyer, I have to wonder Has anyone filed a countersuit against Lodsys? It would make sense, to me, at least File for all legal and court fees, any travel/expenses fees I racked up, plus about $30 million in punitive damages (knowing that it would be reduced, but why not START high, anyways?) If their so-called business starts COSTING them money Later, --jim -- 73 DE N5IAL (/4)MiSTie #49997 Running FreeBSD 7.0 spooky1...@gmail.com ICBM/Hurricane: 30.44406N 86.59909W Do not look into waveguide with remaining eye! Android Apps Listing at http://www.jstrack.org/barcodes.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20070645-264/lodsys-patent-attack-now-targets-best-buy-adidas/ Apparently getting sued by Lodsys is the new black. Kris On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 8:32 PM, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote: Speaking as someone who, thankfully, is NOT a lawyer, I have to wonder Has anyone filed a countersuit against Lodsys? It would make sense, to me, at least File for all legal and court fees, any travel/expenses fees I racked up, plus about $30 million in punitive damages (knowing that it would be reduced, but why not START high, anyways?) If their so-called business starts COSTING them money Later, --jim -- 73 DE N5IAL (/4) MiSTie #49997 Running FreeBSD 7.0 spooky1...@gmail.com ICBM/Hurricane: 30.44406N 86.59909W Do not look into waveguide with remaining eye! Android Apps Listing at http://www.jstrack.org/barcodes.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 08:42:33PM -0400, Kristopher Micinski wrote: http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20070645-264/lodsys-patent-attack-now-targets-best-buy-adidas/ Apparently getting sued by Lodsys is the new black. Please translate into English. Thanks, --jim -- 73 DE N5IAL (/4)MiSTie #49997 Running FreeBSD 7.0 spooky1...@gmail.com ICBM/Hurricane: 30.44406N 86.59909W Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back! --Mal (Firefly, 1x03, Our Mrs. Reynolds) Android Apps Listing at http://www.jstrack.org/barcodes.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 8:46 PM, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 08:42:33PM -0400, Kristopher Micinski wrote: http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20070645-264/lodsys-patent-attack-now-targets-best-buy-adidas/ Apparently getting sued by Lodsys is the new black. Please translate into English. Thanks, --jim Apparently getting sued by Lodsys is becoming fairly common these days. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Just received Lodsys letter...
No, and nobody is really going to file a counter suit against them. They have been very careful to setup their Business so that there is nothing to go after. After all, they had time to prepare, and they knew someone would try to come after them if they gave them an opportunity. Sincerely, Brad Gies --- MaxHOMEValue.com Kelowna, British Columbia, Canada email: bg...@maxhomevalue.com http://maxhomevalue.com http://bgies.com --- On 17/08/2011 5:32 PM, Jim Graham wrote: Speaking as someone who, thankfully, is NOT a lawyer, I have to wonder Has anyone filed a countersuit against Lodsys? It would make sense, to me, at least File for all legal and court fees, any travel/expenses fees I racked up, plus about $30 million in punitive damages (knowing that it would be reduced, but why not START high, anyways?) If their so-called business starts COSTING them money Later, --jim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
