[android-developers] Re: service process priority: startService() vs bindService()
Still no anwsers/comments.. Not any specialist of Android Services?... On Mar 1, 8:06 pm, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: Hi there, I would need your help to clarify what is the priority of a process hosting a Service when the service is either started (startService() ) or bound (bindService()): When the Service is started, the Android doc is quite clear saying: If the service has been started, then its hosting process is considered to be less important than any processes that are currently visible to the user on-screen, but more important than any process not visible. = it means that the process is ranked as Service process level (Cf. Processes and Threads android doc) As far as i understand, this priority level should warrant us the process will only be killed in a very constraining RAM configuration, and makes it suitable for long time running background thread.. Is my understanding correct? My concern deals with the bound case.. Android doc says: If there are clients bound to the service, then the service's hosting process is never less important than the most important client. That is, if one of its clients is visible to the user, then the service itself is considered to be visible. So if my most important client gets stopped and goes in the background (or even worse, is destroyed), the Service process is then ranked in the same way?? It would then mean that it does not keep ranked as Service process level (started case) and will be about to be destroyed by the system at any time.. So what the point of launching a background thread in a bound Service?? What's the difference between a simple thread launching from an Activity? Am i missing a point? Any comments? Thanks.. Pedro -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: service process priority: startService() vs bindService()
(Great! An answer from the prestigious M.Murphy!! Great books!!) Thanks Mark for your answer.. But the Services in bound mode are still not clear for me.. Android Doc says: If there are clients bound to the service, then the service's hosting process is never less important than the most important client. That is, if one of its clients is visible to the user, then the service itself is considered to be visible. So if my most important client gets stopped and goes in the background (or even worse, is destroyed), the Service process is then ranked in the same way?? wich means most likely to be also destroyed.. That is my real concern.. Mark, do you confirm my understanding? On Mar 5, 3:40 pm, Mark Murphy mmur...@commonsware.com wrote: On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 2:06 PM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: When the Service is started, the Android doc is quite clear saying: If the service has been started, then its hosting process is considered to be less important than any processes that are currently visible to the user on-screen, but more important than any process not visible. = it means that the process is ranked as Service process level (Cf. Processes and Threads android doc) As far as i understand, this priority level should warrant us the process will only be killed in a very constraining RAM configuration, and makes it suitable for long time running background thread.. Is my understanding correct? Please do not have a long time running background thread except in extreme situations (e.g., VOIP client), and even then you will need to use startForeground() to keep the service around. Pure background services (i.e., those without an accompanying activity in the foreground) are designed to run for seconds or minutes, not hours or days. So what the point of launching a background thread in a bound Service?? What's the difference between a simple thread launching from an Activity? Activities undergo configuration changes, where they get destroyed and recreated (e.g., screen rotation). Services do not. Dealing with either background threads or bound services is annoying to deal with in an Activity. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy)http://commonsware.com|http://github.com/commonsguyhttp://commonsware.com/blog|http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books:http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: service process priority: startService() vs bindService()
On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 11:30 AM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: So if my most important client gets stopped and goes in the background (or even worse, is destroyed), the Service process is then ranked in the same way?? If your activity is no longer in the foreground (e.g., user presses HOME), then it and its service are not considered a high-priority process. If your activity is destroyed (e.g., user presses BACK, Android destroys the background activity to free up RAM), then your service will be destroyed, because you should have unbound from the service when your activity is destroyed. Please do not attempt to bind to services then leak them by never unbinding them. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy) http://commonsware.com | http://github.com/commonsguy http://commonsware.com/blog | http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books: http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: service process priority: startService() vs bindService()
The service will be at the level of the most important thing it is doing. If it has a service that is started, and an application that is in the foreground bound to it, then it will be in the foreground as long as any such bound application is foreground. When the application goes to the background, it will be lowered to the service level (unless there is some other component or something else going on more important than the service). This is very different than just making a long running thread in the processes, which the system then doesn't know about and never prioritizes the process based on the thread being there. (And anyway you can't bind to a thread from another processes, so functionally you just can't do the same things.) Also please realize that just having a service started doesn't mean your process won't get killed except under unusual situations. In fact the current implementation ensures that, for a service that remains started a long time, its process will eventually get killed (and the service then restarted). On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 8:30 AM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.comwrote: (Great! An answer from the prestigious M.Murphy!! Great books!!) Thanks Mark for your answer.. But the Services in bound mode are still not clear for me.. Android Doc says: If there are clients bound to the service, then the service's hosting process is never less important than the most important client. That is, if one of its clients is visible to the user, then the service itself is considered to be visible. So if my most important client gets stopped and goes in the background (or even worse, is destroyed), the Service process is then ranked in the same way?? wich means most likely to be also destroyed.. That is my real concern.. Mark, do you confirm my understanding? On Mar 5, 3:40 pm, Mark Murphy mmur...@commonsware.com wrote: On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 2:06 PM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: When the Service is started, the Android doc is quite clear saying: If the service has been started, then its hosting process is considered to be less important than any processes that are currently visible to the user on-screen, but more important than any process not visible. = it means that the process is ranked as Service process level (Cf. Processes and Threads android doc) As far as i understand, this priority level should warrant us the process will only be killed in a very constraining RAM configuration, and makes it suitable for long time running background thread.. Is my understanding correct? Please do not have a long time running background thread except in extreme situations (e.g., VOIP client), and even then you will need to use startForeground() to keep the service around. Pure background services (i.e., those without an accompanying activity in the foreground) are designed to run for seconds or minutes, not hours or days. So what the point of launching a background thread in a bound Service?? What's the difference between a simple thread launching from an Activity? Activities undergo configuration changes, where they get destroyed and recreated (e.g., screen rotation). Services do not. Dealing with either background threads or bound services is annoying to deal with in an Activity. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy)http://commonsware.com| http://github.com/commonsguyhttp://commonsware.com/blog|http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books:http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- Dianne Hackborn Android framework engineer hack...@android.com Note: please don't send private questions to me, as I don't have time to provide private support, and so won't reply to such e-mails. All such questions should be posted on public forums, where I and others can see and answer them. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: service process priority: startService() vs bindService()
Thanks Dianne for your answer.. I just compared the basic thread and a thread launched in a service process upon an AIDL request in the sense that if the client actvity was destroyed, then in both cases, the basic long time running thread and the service thread would also be destroyed... With your responses it's now more clear for me.. and by the way I realized it's make no sense in launching a thread upon an AIDL request from a component and expecting this thread keeps on running, after the component be destroyed. (Dianne, your Multitasking the Android Way paper is very very helpfull, keep on doing things in this way..) On Mar 5, 7:04 pm, Dianne Hackborn hack...@android.com wrote: The service will be at the level of the most important thing it is doing. If it has a service that is started, and an application that is in the foreground bound to it, then it will be in the foreground as long as any such bound application is foreground. When the application goes to the background, it will be lowered to the service level (unless there is some other component or something else going on more important than the service). This is very different than just making a long running thread in the processes, which the system then doesn't know about and never prioritizes the process based on the thread being there. (And anyway you can't bind to a thread from another processes, so functionally you just can't do the same things.) Also please realize that just having a service started doesn't mean your process won't get killed except under unusual situations. In fact the current implementation ensures that, for a service that remains started a long time, its process will eventually get killed (and the service then restarted). On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 8:30 AM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.comwrote: (Great! An answer from the prestigious M.Murphy!! Great books!!) Thanks Mark for your answer.. But the Services in bound mode are still not clear for me.. Android Doc says: If there are clients bound to the service, then the service's hosting process is never less important than the most important client. That is, if one of its clients is visible to the user, then the service itself is considered to be visible. So if my most important client gets stopped and goes in the background (or even worse, is destroyed), the Service process is then ranked in the same way?? wich means most likely to be also destroyed.. That is my real concern.. Mark, do you confirm my understanding? On Mar 5, 3:40 pm, Mark Murphy mmur...@commonsware.com wrote: On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 2:06 PM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: When the Service is started, the Android doc is quite clear saying: If the service has been started, then its hosting process is considered to be less important than any processes that are currently visible to the user on-screen, but more important than any process not visible. = it means that the process is ranked as Service process level (Cf. Processes and Threads android doc) As far as i understand, this priority level should warrant us the process will only be killed in a very constraining RAM configuration, and makes it suitable for long time running background thread.. Is my understanding correct? Please do not have a long time running background thread except in extreme situations (e.g., VOIP client), and even then you will need to use startForeground() to keep the service around. Pure background services (i.e., those without an accompanying activity in the foreground) are designed to run for seconds or minutes, not hours or days. So what the point of launching a background thread in a bound Service?? What's the difference between a simple thread launching from an Activity? Activities undergo configuration changes, where they get destroyed and recreated (e.g., screen rotation). Services do not. Dealing with either background threads or bound services is annoying to deal with in an Activity. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy)http://commonsware.com| http://github.com/commonsguyhttp://commonsware.com/blog|http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books:http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- Dianne Hackborn Android framework engineer hack...@android.com Note: please don't send private questions to me, as I don't have time to provide private support, and so won't reply to such e-mails. All such questions should be posted on public forums, where I and others can see
Re: [android-developers] Re: service process priority: startService() vs bindService()
Service.startForeground does increase the chances that the service will keep running (as this puts the service into foreground process class). You can use this independently of binding, it's orthogonal that way. Can be useful if the user requests some kind of update from the network (for example) and you'd like to be able to finish it even if the user leaves the controlling activity before it's done. 06.03.2011 2:09 пользователь pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com написал: Thanks Dianne for your answer.. I just compared the basic thread and a thread launched in a service process upon an AIDL request in the sense that if the client actvity was destroyed, then in both cases, the basic long time running thread and the service thread would also be destroyed... With your responses it's now more clear for me.. and by the way I realized it's make no sense in launching a thread upon an AIDL request from a component and expecting this thread keeps on running, after the component be destroyed. (Dianne, your Multitasking the Android Way paper is very very helpfull, keep on doing things in this way..) On Mar 5, 7:04 pm, Dianne Hackborn hack...@android.com wrote: The service will be at the level of the most important thing it is doing. If it has a service that is started, and an application that is in the foreground bound to it, then it will be in the foreground as long as any such bound application is foreground. When the application goes to the background, it will be lowered to the service level (unless there is some other component or something else going on more important than the service). This is very different than just making a long running thread in the processes, which the system then doesn't know about and never prioritizes the process based on the thread being there. (And anyway you can't bind to a thread from another processes, so functionally you just can't do the same things.) Also please realize that just having a service started doesn't mean your process won't get killed except under unusual situations. In fact the current implementation ensures that, for a service that remains started a long time, its process will eventually get killed (and the service then restarted). On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 8:30 AM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: (Great! An answer from the prestigious M.Murphy!! Great books!!) Thanks Mark for your answer.. But the Services in bound mode are still not clear for me.. Android Doc says: If there are clients bound to the service, then the service's hosting process is never less important than the most important client. That is, if one of its clients is visible to the user, then the service itself is considered to be visible. So if my most important client gets stopped and goes in the background (or even worse, is destroyed), the Service process is then ranked in the same way?? wich means most likely to be also destroyed.. That is my real concern.. Mark, do you confirm my understanding? On Mar 5, 3:40 pm, Mark Murphy mmur...@commonsware.com wrote: On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 2:06 PM, pedro242 pedro.contreir...@gmail.com wrote: When the Service is started, the Android doc is quite clear saying: If the service has been started, then its hosting process is considered to be less important than any processes that are currently visible to the user on-screen, but more important than any process not visible. = it means that the process is ranked as Service process level (Cf. Processes and Threads android doc) As far as i understand, this priority level should warrant us the process will only be killed in a very constraining RAM configuration, and makes it suitable for long time running background thread.. Is my understanding correct? Please do not have a long time running background thread except in extreme situations (e.g., VOIP client), and even then you will need to use startForeground() to keep the service around. Pure background services (i.e., those without an accompanying activity in the foreground) are designed to run for seconds or minutes, not hours or days. So what the point of launching a background thread in a bound Service?? What's the difference between a simple thread launching from an Activity? Activities undergo configuration changes, where they get destroyed and recreated (e.g., screen rotation). Services do not. Dealing with either background threads or bound services is annoying to deal with in an Activity. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy)http://commonsware.com| http://github.com/commonsguyhttp://commonsware.com/blog|http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books:http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to