Re: [apple-crop] Can Organic Agriculture Feed the World?
Bill I thought the article Dave posted explained a pretty well documented and unbiased approach to understanding what a very comprehensive set of data said about American organic agriculture's ability to compete in terms of yield with their conventional counterparts. It may be strech to extrapolate it to a global lesson, but since American agriculture is such a major component of global agriculture, I think its a fair warning. I was happy to see it posted, not because I favor conventional ag. I just want folks to do fair and honest work when they make comparisons. That seems pretty rare these days. Bill Original message Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2011 15:56:50 -0500 From: Bill Sciarappa sciara...@njaes.rutgers.edu Subject: Re: [apple-crop] Can Organic Agriculture Feed the World? To: 'Dave Schmitt' schm...@aesop.rutgers.edu, 'Apple-crop discussion list' apple-crop@virtualorchard.net, agst...@aesop.rutgers.edu, agfacu...@aesop.rutgers.edu Thanks for the article Dave. The main fallacy in it's undocumented and biased assertion (same as Rodale's political advocacy approach) is extrapolating apples to oranges. Comparing US certified production to anything gives a false impression. Our American organic effort lags far behind Australia, China, South America and most parts of Europe. Some certification in these countries is more stringent than US and some is not certified at all yet better in quality than US. Incorporating global organic uncertified would paint a very different and more equitable picture. Regardless, if unlimited human population growth occurs, there will be even more food scarcity and food riots but largely because of a distribution chain problem in less accessible places and human populations that cannot economically afford to pay. The average cost of 20 years of organic food production in Italy remains less than conventional fruits and vegetables with 55,000 certified growers who feed all the school systems. That's existing real world evidence that is gaining in European ag every year. USA policy and economic development funding has done all it can to retard such sustainable growth. Bill Sciarappa From: Dave Schmitt [mailto:schm...@aesop.rutgers.edu] Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 2:54 PM To: Apple-crop discussion list; agst...@aesop.rutgers.edu; agfacu...@aesop.rutgers.edu Subject: Can Organic Agriculture Feed the World? Interesting piece in Slate: http://www.slate.com/id/2287746/ -- ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop William H Shoemaker, UI-Crop Sciences Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254; FAX-584-4610 ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Manually dropping fruit from young trees
Rye Its common for many commercial growers to do just that. Rather than hand thinning though, they use chemical thinners, such as NAA and Sevin. Depending on weather conditions, rates and bloom load, it will take out a percentage of the flowers. Bill Original message Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2011 20:29:54 -0500 (EST) From: Rye ducn...@aol.com Subject: [apple-crop] Manually dropping fruit from young trees To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Why is it customary to allow fruit to form and then drop it when it is small, rather than removing flowers so the tree doesn't waste energy forming any fruit at all? Curious if tree growth can be increased without harmful effects by removing flowers before they form fruit. Thanks, Rye Hefley Future Farmers Marketer So. Cal. ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop William H Shoemaker, UI-Crop Sciences Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254; FAX-584-4610 ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too!
I recently heard life is terminal. I think someone should do something about that. Who's in charge here! Bill Original message Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 18:31:11 -0400 From: Ken Hall edsorch...@aol.com Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too! To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Is anyone familiar with work on human exposure to kaolin clay in an orchard setting? A pulmonary disease referred to as kaolinosis has been identified in people who had high exposure to clay dust. What about lower levels of exposure, year after year, to orchard workers or pick-your-own apple customers? Not sure we can even say that kaolin is beyond suspicion. Ken Hall Edwards Apple Orchard, Inc. 7061 Centerville Road Poplar Grove, IL 61065 Ph: 815-765-2234 Fx: 815-765-1072 Cl: 815-520-5764 Email: edsorch...@aol.com -Original Message- From: Fleming, William w...@montana.edu To: Apple-Crop apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Sent: Fri, Jul 23, 2010 4:31 pm Subject: RE: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too! I wouldn’t say organic pesticides more toxic to the environment but the fact that most are so broad spectrum that they kill beneficials as well as pests. That makes them unecological. as compared to many of the modern pesticides that are very specific in their targets. Plus many times when you kill the beneficials you cause a whole new set of problems that have to be addressed. You end up having to spray even more. Just the fact that organic pesticides are short lived also makes them unecological in increased fuel usage when several sprays may be needed to take the place of one conventional material. Bill Fleming Montana State University Western Ag Research Center 580 Quast Ln Corvallis, Montana From: apple-c...@virtualorchard..net [mailto:apple-c...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of Robert kuljis Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 10:46 AM To: Apple-Crop Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: RE:...and causes you to be fat too! I agree to buy local , but how can you say that organic pesticides are more toxic to the enviornment? Lets see, kaolin clay, entrust(soil organism), pyrethreum(breaks down VERY fast, as opposed to synthetic version which last longer). How are these more toxic then man made chemicals which do not break down? they break down into compounds that still have no analog in nature.. On Jul 23, 2010, at 8:18 AM, moore5...@msn.com wrote: It is more important to know where your food is grown! We have seen salmonella from melons and scallions from Mexico and Asia. The USA has the Food Drug Administration that tightly regulates pesticides and their application. Foreign foods do not! Some pesticides are not applied to the food at all but on small plastic tabs that are clipped on branches to act as a deterrent to the bug. Organic food growers use pesticides also, just more often because the product does not last as long. Many organic pesticides are more toxic to the environment than the standard commercial grower uses. I know because I am a commercial grower of apples. Pesticides in the run off stream water from the home gardener is one of the biggest offenders of pollution. Consumers should use common sense and wash everything raw before eating it. don't deprive children of good nutrition because of a sensational hit article that may be designed to garner contributions to their non-profit cause. We grow the safest food in the world. Support your local farmer's market and buy American! To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net From: david_d...@mac..com Subject: Apple-Crop: ...and causes you to be fat too! Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 09:47:28 -0400 the current lead story on Yahoo - http://shine..yahoo.com/event/loveyourbody/why-you-cant-lose-those-last-10-pounds-1964849/ ...See, an apple a day may have kept the doctor away 250 years ago when Benjamin Franklin included the phrase in his almanac. But if that apple comes loaded with obesity-promoting chemicals — nine of the ten most commonly used pesticides are obesogens, and apples are one of the most pesticide-laden foods out there — then Ben’s advice is way out of date I look forward to market saturday - David Doud - grower - indiana The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. Get started. William H Shoemaker, UI-Crop Sciences Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254;
Re: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too!
I agree. I wasn't really arguing with Ken. I just wonder when we will get to live risk-free. Bill Original message Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2010 11:49:50 -0700 From: Robert kuljis rjkul...@peak.org Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too! To: Apple-Crop apple-crop@virtualorchard.net I think that is a good point about the kaolin,,, I know the non ag formulations for pottery have all kinds of warnings for cancer, inhalation threat, etc.. A simple particle mask would probably take care of most of it. Not that it is that much fun to wear a mask all the time while working in the trees.Of course there are lots of unknowns with chemicals as well. The problem we have is that the chemicals are extremely lucrative for giant companies who control much of the university funding, so much less research and development goes into non chemical methods. These methods could be much much cheaper. Considering that conventional ag is responsible for at least 40% of greenhouse gas emissions, mostly due to petroleum based fertilizer, conversion to an ecological organic ag system seems to be not only healthier, but a prerequisite for survival at this stage.. Some things that can help with the application of either organic or chem materials would be monitoring, understanding the disease/pest life cycle,, implementing and enhancing biological controls. These have come a long way, but the scale of the efforts is much higher on the end of the paradigm that wants growers to keep putting out chemicals whose ultimate cost is much more then the $ amount paid. Robert Kuljis Thomas Paine Farms On Jul 24, 2010, at 5:48 AM, Bill Shoemaker wrote: I recently heard life is terminal. I think someone should do something about that. Who's in charge here! Bill Original message Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 18:31:11 -0400 From: Ken Hall edsorch...@aol.com Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too! To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Is anyone familiar with work on human exposure to kaolin clay in an orchard setting? A pulmonary disease referred to as kaolinosis has been identified in people who had high exposure to clay dust. What about lower levels of exposure, year after year, to orchard workers or pick-your-own apple customers? Not sure we can even say that kaolin is beyond suspicion. Ken Hall Edwards Apple Orchard, Inc. 7061 Centerville Road Poplar Grove, IL 61065 Ph: 815-765-2234 Fx: 815-765-1072 Cl: 815-520-5764 Email: edsorch...@aol.com -Original Message- From: Fleming, William w...@montana.edu To: Apple-Crop apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Sent: Fri, Jul 23, 2010 4:31 pm Subject: RE: Apple-Crop: RE:..and causes you to be fat too! I wouldn’t say organic pesticides more toxic to the environment but the fact that most are so broad spectrum that they kill beneficials as well as pests. That makes them unecological. as compared to many of the modern pesticides that are very specific in their targets. Plus many times when you kill the beneficials you cause a whole new set of problems that have to be addressed. You end up having to spray even more. Just the fact that organic pesticides are short lived also makes them unecological in increased fuel usage when several sprays may be needed to take the place of one conventional material. Bill Fleming Montana State University Western Ag Research Center 580 Quast Ln Corvallis, Montana From: apple-c...@virtualorchard..net [mailto:apple-c...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of Robert kuljis Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 10:46 AM To: Apple-Crop Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: RE:...and causes you to be fat too! I agree to buy local , but how can you say that organic pesticides are more toxic to the enviornment? Lets see, kaolin clay, entrust(soil organism), pyrethreum(breaks down VERY fast, as opposed to synthetic version which last longer). How are these more toxic then man made chemicals which do not break down? they break down into compounds that still have no analog in nature.. On Jul 23, 2010, at 8:18 AM, moore5...@msn.com wrote: It is more important to know where your food is grown! We have seen salmonella from melons and scallions from Mexico and Asia. The USA has the Food Drug Administration that tightly regulates pesticides and their application. Foreign foods do not! Some pesticides are not applied to the food at all but on small plastic tabs that are clipped on branches to act as a deterrent to the bug. Organic food growers use pesticides also, just more often because the product does not last as long. Many organic pesticides are more toxic to the environment than the standard commercial grower uses. I know
Re: Apple-Crop: Apples in Afghanistan
I have a colleague who just returned from Afganistan. He was very happy with his service there. He feels he's contributing to the effort to build a stable society. They may make more money with drug crops but they have neigbors who need to eat. Bill Happy New Year to all, I read an interesting piece on Reuters News yesterday. I see that some more US agricultural advisors will be sent to Afghanistan, though I wonder if it is realistic to suggest to farmers there that nuts and apples will give higher returns than opium. I'm sure that I am preaching to the converted here when I suggest that apple growing is hardly a highly profitable venture. Con Traas http://in.reuters.com/article/southAsiaNews/idINIndia-45331820100112 KABUL (Reuters) - Interrupted by the occasional whirring of military helicopters overhead, the U.S. agriculture chief sipped pomegranate juice with Afghan farmers, who told him not enough international aid was getting through. Wrapping up a three-day visit to Afghanistan on Tuesday, Tom Vilsack met the farmers -- representing pomegranate and apple growers -- at an fruit juice export plant in Kabul, part funded by the United States which has made agriculture the biggest non-security priority in the country. Seated outside, the farmers complained of lack of credit facilities -- something Vilsack is looking into -- and problems in the entire farming chain, from acquiring seeds to a lack of refrigeration and getting goods to market during a war. We hear of pledges of funding but we have not seen anything yet, said Haji Ghulam Dastageen, an apple and apricot farmer from Paktia province. We are looking forward to getting assistance from the international community and from the (agriculture) ministry, he added via a translator. Vilsack, who pointed to the U.S.-funded juice factory behind him as proof of U.S. commitment, later announced an additional $20 million in aid to help improve Afghanistan's agriculture ministry deliver services to farmers. After decades of conflict, Afghanistan lacks many of the personnel and knowledge resources needed to deliver much-needed services to its people, more than 80 percent of whom rely on agriculture for wages and sustenance, he said at a news conference announcing the funds. Last year, the United States spent about $300 million on agriculture projects in Afghanistan and projected spending this year is more than $400 million. Vilsack also promised to send more U.S. agricultural advisors. The hope is that funds spent bolstering Afghanistan's agriculture ministry will improve delivery of services to the country's farmers and thus boost confidence in central government and draw support away from the Taliban. FARMER-TO-FARMER A farm owner himself, Vilsack peppered the Afghan farmers with questions from how they got their water to what they needed in terms of credit facilities and packaging to protect goods currently bruised en route to market. The United States and other allies are looking at a range of credit options for farmers in the hope they can wean many from growing opium poppy, which fuels the Taliban insurgency. The goal is to provide up-front funds for wheat but also higher-value products such as table grapes, nuts and apples in the hope they will get better returns than opium. Afghanistan produces nearly all of the world's opium, used to make heroin. We are looking forward to receiving loans ... we also want low interest, said Haji Yaseen, another apple grower from Paktia province. Farmers everywhere want that, laughed Vilsack, a former governor from the U.S. farming state of Iowa. The Obama administration has promised to present a list of credit options to the Afghan agriculture ministry by March. The plan is to offer credit facilities like those given to farmers in the United States, who get low-interest loans. How do you pay for your imports? Would you use a banking system?, Vilsack asked the farmers, who all nodded. When U.S. President Barack Obama announced his new strategy to send in 30,000 more troops to Afghanistan, he also promised a civilian surge, including additional agricultural advisors to overhaul an industry devastated by decades of war. President Obama ... understands that the future of your country is on this table, said Vilsack, pointing to a table laden with nuts, apples and pomegranates, many of which he sampled. I look forward to going back to Washington with your messages and to give as much help as we possibly can, Vilsack told the farmers. I can assure you that I'm going to be a consumer of pomegranates from now on. (Editing by Peter Graff and Sanjeev Miglani) (c) Thomson Reuters 2010 All rights
Re: Apple-Crop: deer
Sounds interesting. Could you describe what it is and how you think it works? Bill I am aware that large orchards and geology of where they are planted would play into it but has anyone tried flat fencing? We used it this year and it has kept out deer and raccoons. We used a combination of chicken wire and the plastic snow fencing. Seem they do not like stepping on it. At least it might be less expensive than an electric fence or could possibly be used in combination to reduce costs. Just a thought. T. Curl Fichthorn-Curl Farms Ohio, USA William H Shoemaker, UI-NRES Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254; FAX-584-4610 -- The 'Apple-Crop' LISTSERV is sponsored by the Virtual Orchard http://www.virtualorchard.net and managed by Win Cowgill and Jon Clements webmas...@virtualorchard.net. Apple-Crop is not moderated. Therefore, the statements do not represent official opinions and the Virtual Orchard takes no responsibility for the content.
Re: Apple-Crop: deer
Looks like the stout may not be a good IPM strategy Mo. Bill I'll be looking for the stout on the 15th Mo. Art Kelly Kelly Orchards Acton, ME - Original Message - From: Mo Tougas To: Apple-Crop Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 5:23 PM Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: deer We have found that Irish Spring works best in combination with dryer sheets, and Guinness Stout. You need to hang both the sheets and the soap on the perimeter of the orchard, and place bottles of stout about every fifty feet or so. Lebricons will smell the Irish Spring and see the white dryer sheets, and think they are at a football (soccer) game. They will naturally drink the stout, while hanging around in the trees around the perimeter of the orchard. While they enjoy the stout they will make such a scene that no self respecting deer will be found near the orchard. Mo Tougas Tougas Family Farm Northborough,MA 01532 On Jul 7, 2009, at 2:49 PM, jerry sietsema wrote: Howard, how do you make that solution? What rates??? Thanks!!! - Original Message - From: Howard Claussen To: 'Apple-Crop' Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 7:35 AM Subject: RE: Apple-Crop: deer I have a small (150 tree) family orchard. I spray my trees with a solution of Irish Spring soap. Have not lost a tree in 15 years to deer or rabbits. I also hang each year A 1/4 bar of soap from each tree so William H Shoemaker, UI-NRES Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254; FAX-584-4610 -- The 'Apple-Crop' LISTSERV is sponsored by the Virtual Orchard http://www.virtualorchard.net and managed by Win Cowgill and Jon Clements webmas...@virtualorchard.net. Apple-Crop is not moderated. Therefore, the statements do not represent official opinions and the Virtual Orchard takes no responsibility for the content.
Re: Apple-Crop: Fireblight on Ernst Bosch
The question is, what happens to the bacteria when it gets warmer? Does it just go dormant in the tree? My understanding is that moisture availability drives secondary cycles of the population. Warmer weather won't help unless it leads to drier weather. When dry weather begins to prevail, the bacterium will cease to spread but remain systemic in the tree. Thats why its such a difficult disease to manage. Lets just hope it gets drier. For us it's the wettest Spring I can remember around Chicago. We entered June about 10 ahead of normal for the year. We have had 5 in June so far. Its raining now with rain forecasted 3 of the next 5 days. Bill William H Shoemaker, UI-NRES Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254; FAX-584-4610 -- The 'Apple-Crop' LISTSERV is sponsored by the Virtual Orchard http://www.virtualorchard.net and managed by Win Cowgill and Jon Clements webmas...@virtualorchard.net. Apple-Crop is not moderated. Therefore, the statements do not represent official opinions and the Virtual Orchard takes no responsibility for the content.
Re: Apple-Crop: Fireblight on Ernst Bosch
Axel You're in a tough place Alex. Bacterial diseases are generally tough, and in woody plants like apples, incredibly persistent. If you're cutting out infected material, I hope you're cutting back at least 6 from the infection. Any pest control material you use right now may be futile until conditions cease favoring disease. Just hold in there until warmer, drier weather prevails, then re-assess. I'm not familiar with the variety, but perhaps its not a good match for your climate. Good luck. Bill William H Shoemaker, UI-NRES Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center 535 Randall Road St Charles, IL 60174 630-584-7254; FAX-584-4610 -- The 'Apple-Crop' LISTSERV is sponsored by the Virtual Orchard http://www.virtualorchard.net and managed by Win Cowgill and Jon Clements webmas...@virtualorchard.net. Apple-Crop is not moderated. Therefore, the statements do not represent official opinions and the Virtual Orchard takes no responsibility for the content.
Re: FW: Apple-Crop: copper fungicides for organic apples?
That sounds like a great project Dave. If you have success implementing it, could you share the results with us? Bill Shoemaker, University of Illinois Thanks to all of you who responded to my query about copper. I was actually looking for an OMRI approved product that specifically was labeled for summer diseases on apples, or that at least allowed such applications. Most coppers labeled for apples specify a green tip spray for fire blight, blossom sprays for fire blight, and then sprays before fall rains for anthracnose and other diseases. I suppose that a July application could be construed as being before fall rains, but our NY regulators might not buy that. (Yes, it's true that NY regulators found banking was too difficult to understand, but they still think that they can understand and regulate pesticides more effectively than the US EPA!) Anyway, my objective is to test a combination of a low rate of Liquid Lime Sulfur (1 qt/100 gal of dilute spray) combined with a low rate of copper to see if we can get reasonable control of both summer fruit rots (mostly black rot, Botryosphaeria obtusa, in our area) and the sooty blotch and flyspeck complex. I have tested the low rate of Liquid Lime Sulfur (LLS) several times in previous years and it seems to work quite well for flyspeck and sooty blotch. However, LLS did not control fruit rots and at higher rates it may have even stimulated fruit rots, perhaps by injuring cells that can then be invaded by Botryosphaeria. I've tested the LLS/copper combination before using a non-OMRI-approved copper and it did not cause any more harm to the fruit that one might expect from copper sprays. However, we did not have good disease pressure in that trial, so I'm hoping to repeat it this summer. From: Yoder, Keith Sent: Wed 2009-05-13 06:39 To: Apple-Crop Subject: RE: Apple-Crop: copper fungicides for organic apples? Dave, Here is a possibility with summer labeling: Agri Star® Basic Copper 53 (Albaugh, Inc./Agri Star) http://www.cdms.net/LDat/ld0BO001.pdf http://www.cdms.net/LDat/ld0BO001.pdf It is registered for summer use on apples and is also listed with OMRI. OMRI says: Basic Copper 53, Classification: When used for plant disease control must be used in a manner that minimizes accumulation of copper in the soil. May be used as an algicide, insecticide, or disease control if the requirements of 205.206(e) are met, which requires the use of preventative, mechanical, physical, and other pest, weed, and disease management practices. The contact listed with OMRI is: Albaugh, Inc.: Mark Blume, Ph: 515-964-9444. Summer diseases on the CDMS-posted Basic Copper 53 label include Brooks spot, sooty blotch and bitter rot. The label warns about copper injury and calls for different rates and different amounts of lime to be added to the mix at different times of the season. We tested a product with the same name and similar label wording but from a different distributor in 1995. The reference for that report is Fungicide and Nematicide Tests, Vol. 51:31-32 (1996). Summer disease control by copper formulations and fungicide mixtures on Nittany apple, 1995. Our interest in testing this was for summer disease control on processing apples, where russet isn't as much of a concern as for fresh market. We used Basic Copper 53 2 lb/A from greentip- petal fall, then Basic Copper 53 4 lb/A + Hydrated Lime 12 lb/A (first-fourth covers) followed by Basic Copper 53 4 lb/A + Hydrated Lime 8 lb/A (fifth and sixth covers). Treatments were applied airblast to large trees at 100 gal/A. That year we had one of the heaviest bitter rot tests we've ever had. We got decent bitter rot control, better than a schedule involving Polyram 80DF 3 lb/A + Ziram 3 lb/A through second cover then Captan 50W 3 lb + Ziram 76DF 3 lb/A, third to sixth covers. The copper schedule was weak on flyspeck (which has been true with other coppers in other tests). In our test, 19 wetting periods at 70 F or warmer occurred from mid-May to mid-August contributed to the heavy summer disease pressure. Cumulative wetting hours recorded starting 10 days after petal fall reached 250 on 26 Jun at the beginning of an 84-hr wetting period, then six inches of rain and 142 more wetting hours between 22 and 30 June. We got a lot of fruit russet from the full season copper schedule: only 7% of the fruit made the USDA Extra Fancy / Fancy grades due to russetting. I can send label and report files to anyone who requests them at my e-mail address: ksyo...@vt.edu mailto:ksyo...@vt.edu Keith Keith S. Yoder, Research and Extension Tree Fruit Pathologist Virginia Tech AREC, 595 Laurel Grove Rd., Winchester, VA 22602 Tel: 540-869-2560 Ext. 21 From: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net on behalf of Dave Rosenberger Sent: Tue 2009-05-12 22
Re: Apple-Crop: Damage in Washington California
I'm getting feedback on damage to vineyards but nothing on orchards yet. Bill Shoemaker, Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops University of Illinois - St Charles Horticulture Research Center www.nres.uiuc.edu/faculty/directory/shoemaker_wh.html - Original Message - From: Annette and Randy Bjorge Fruit Acres Farms To: Apple-Crop Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 9:22 AM Subject: Apple-Crop: Damage in Washington California Hi Apple Croppers, There are rumors in Michigan about there being damage in Washington State and California. Does anybody know anything? Annette Bjorge Fruit Acres Farms Coloma, MI
Re: Apple-Crop: Fruit Research Job in Ireland
At the current exchange rate, about $55,000 US dollars. I hear the lifestyle is pretty nice Con. I think you'll have some lookers, hopefully a keeper of two. Bill Shoemaker, Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops University of Illinois - St Charles Horticulture Research Center www.nres.uiuc.edu/faculty/directory/shoemaker_wh.html if you have a salary of 50,000 euros in Ireland, the social insurance for the worker costs about 4,000 euros, and the tax about 13,000 euros, leaving 33,000 euros.
Re: Apple-Crop: Electronic Shears
Re: Apple-Crop: Electronic ShearsI appreciate your effort to prepare these observations Sandy. As I get older, I find the knuckles in my hand less resilient the day after pruning, so I find your comments very worthwhile. Could you offer any observations on your shopping experience? Were there serious disparities in prices from vendors? Bill Shoemaker, Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops University of Illinois - St Charles Horticulture Research Center www.nres.uiuc.edu/faculty/directory/shoemaker_wh.html After nearly 2 years of use, we thought it appropriate to offer a few observations on the use of an electronic shears. In October of 2006, I initiated a brief thread; the responses (of which I was most grateful) are copied below under OCTOBER, 2006 for reference. Possibly others may wish to share current experiences again. A Campagniola battery-powered electronic hand shears (Tronic Star) has been used to prune 12 foot trees for two winters (total 12 months, 30-35 hours/week) in a Vermont apple orchard. It was originally acquired to mitigate tendonitis experienced from hand pruning by a long-term employee. Observations: a.. About 12 hours of actual use can be expected before battery recharging required. b.. Comfortable in hand. c.. Up to 1 inch cuts can be made in frozen wood; slightly more if limb leveraged with other hand. d.. Less use of hand saw. e.. Generally more trees pruned per day compared to hand shears/saw alone. f.. Battery pack (on back) not burdensome. Climbing beyond first tier scaffolds not recommended. g.. Supplementary elastics around arm help prevent power cord from snagging wayward branches. h.. Daily blade sharpening recommended. i.. Discipline to control potential urge to over prune (it's now so much fun!) j.. A well-made unit. k.. Warranty covered repair of power cord, trigger safety and indicator light, the only failures for first 7 months use. l.. A negative: trigger guard can be too small for an insulated glove. m.. NO tendonitis experienced: purchase more than justified. We are generally very pleased with the unit and recommend it (or a comparable quality electronic shears) for increased pruning speed and, especially, for minimizing repetitive motion injury such as strained muscles and tendonitis which, besides being painful, can result in increased general fatigue and poorer employee performance. Sandy Witherell Shoreham, Vermont USA
Re: Apple-Crop: Re: BEES COLONY COLLAPSE DISORDER
pOur lone honeybee hive at the Research Center died during the winter (We did use imidacloprid last Fall on grapes that the honeybees seemed to forage for sugar in). We do not have many fruit trees, probably less than 50, but pollination was excellent in our apples with few honeybees present. There were a few bumblebees (or carpenter bees), but mostly we saw small bees that were about 1/2quot; long and about 1/8quot; wide. They were very active in the apple blossoms. The population seemed significant. They seemed to look a lot like hoverflies but did not hover as much. I wish I had captured a few but was too busy and didn't think of it. But what impresses me is that we had sufficient pollination that we need to thin on several varieties, including Jonathon and Imperial Gala./ppBill Shoemaker/ppUniv of Illinois/pp /p /pgt; gt; gt; It would be unusual to have sufficient bumblebees to pollinate any kind gt; of apple acreage that early in the season. At m! ost you've have a few gt; queens, because the colonies haven't really gotten started yet. gt; gt; Most likely you have carpenter bees, which are often mistaken for gt; bumblebees. These early spring bees are excellent pollinators for gt; apples but are dependent on good home sites, often old buildings nearby. gt; gt; Dave Green gt; gt; gt; gt; - Original Message - gt; From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] gt; Date: Monday, May 28, 2007 1:32 pm gt; Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: Re: BEES amp; COLONY COLLAPSE DISORDER gt; To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net gt; gt; gt; Frankenbees, why not bumblebees? almost no bees except for the gt; gt; bumble var gt; gt; here, with spectacular bloom period. over croped elstars taking a gt; gt; year off. gt; gt; spigold , ashy bearer here, had huge bloom and good set. keepsake gt; gt; overcropped last gt; gt; year and shy this year. trees still getting pollenated somehow! gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; ***! *** See what's free at gt; gt; http://www.ao l.com. gt; gt; gt; --- gt; gt; gt; The 'Apple-Crop' LISTSERV is sponsored by the Virtual Orchard gt; http: /and managed by Win Cowgill and Jon gt; Clements [EMAIL PROTECTED] /. gt; gt; Apple-Crop is not moderated. Therefore, the statements do not represent gt; quot;officialquot; opinions and the Virtual Orchard takes no responsibility for gt; the content. gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; /p William H. Shoemaker Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign -- CoreComm Webmail. http://home.core.com
RE: Apple-Crop: Re: BEES COLONY COLLAPSE DISORDER
p, and for a human to believe he can think gt; like a bee is probably somewhat shortsighted gt; gt; /pp /pGood Point!/pp /pBill/p William H. Shoemaker Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign -- CoreComm Webmail. http://home.core.com
Re: Apple-Crop: Strains of Red Delicious
pgt; gt; gt; Hello everyone, gt; I am going to plant more Red Delicious in 2008. gt; gt; gt; David Barclay /pp /pI'm glad to hear you say this David. I've never stopped liking Red Delicious apple, I just won't buy them in mass retail outlets. Frankly, every variety seems to be abused by the distribution system so much they develop bad reputations, Red Delicioud being the worst case scenario. When New Zealand introduced Gala I told my wife it's a matter of time before the marketing system ruins them. The last few years we've had more disappointments with Gala than satisfaction. These varieties are redeemable. I'm not sure our system of distribution and mass-marketing of apples is. We have an old-strain non-spur Red Delicious tree at the Research Center. I look forward to the crops every year. I actually let them ripen before we pick them!/pp /pBill/p William H. Shoemaker Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign -- CoreComm Webmail. http://home.core.com
Re: Apple-Crop: Time article (More on same)
Good comments Con. I think that true sustainability will be more akin to IPM than to the set of rules developed for organic. It will probably involve the use of pesticides that are not organically approved, particularly some of the new generation materials. It will probably involve genetic engineering, but with more careful oversight. It will, by necessity, involve careful accountancy. If a grower cannot make a profit, he cannot be sustainable. But most importantly, as you imply, it will need to involve a energy budget. The world really only has one energy source. We have lots of stored energy (e.g. petroleum) we are wasting as fast as we can profit from it. But it is limited. Once we regain our senses and begin to account for energy useage as the fundamental component of sustainability, we will begin to have a better sense of how we can develop sustainable systems, which by definition will be economic models. Bill Shoemaker, Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops University of Illinois - St Charles Horticulture Research Center www.nres.uiuc.edu/faculty/directory/shoemaker_wh.html Hello again Chris and all contributors, I hope that I did not come across as too negative about the potential of scab (or other pest or disease) resistant varieties. What I hoped to get across is that nature is not static, and that it is virtually inevitable that resistance will be broken down by the pathogen, sooner or later. As was outlined by Jean-Marc, this has already been documented for Vf scab resistance. So resistance is not a solution in itself, and once it is broken down, it is too late, so it needs to be preserved by thoughtful orchard practice. I think the reality is that we need to consider using whatever we can to control pests and diseases. That may include forecasting models, sanitation, trapping systems, resistance, chemical control, and all the other mechanisms that many growers are already familiar with, and I am sure, some that have not been thought of yet. I agree with Chris about the potential benefit of fire-blight resistance; it would be revolutionary. However, if that resistance is to come via genetic modification, then we need to be very careful to assess if there will be any potential negative consequences, and if there are, to make sure that the cure is not worse than the disease. Con PS. Just to get back to the sustainability question. If a kg of apples gives the consumer 2300 kJ of energy, then it is no longer sustainable to eat these apples if it takes more than 2300kJ to produce the apples. If the apples are grown in your back yard, then clearly it does not take as much energy to go out and pick and eat one as the energy you will get from it. If you had to walk 1000 miles to get it, then you would probably starve on the way, so this is not a good proposition. If a truck has to drive 1000 miles to get them, the situation becomes less clear, especially when you consider the energy that had to be put into growing the fruits, spraying them, picking them, and so forth. By rough calculation, if an apple has to travel more than 3000 road miles in a fully-laden truck to get to market, it is costing more energy to make its journey, than the final consumer is getting by eating it. -Original Message- From: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 28 March 2007 16:05 To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: Time article (More on same) Bill: Do you have a spray program controlling scab on other varieties? And my addition to many previous comments of recent weeks. Reistance to apple scab offers considerable help to growers that can market those varieties. Consider the potential benefit(s) of fire blight resistance in apple and pear, whether it is natural of GMO. Chris Doll -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net Sent: Wed, 28 Mar 2007 8:57 AM Subject: Re: Apple-Crop: Time article (More on same) Gary I'm not aware of apple scab resistance having developed against Vf the Vf gene, specifically the PRI varieties. I have had Pristine, Enterprise, Dayton, Liberty, Redfree and Goldrush planted here for 10 years and they are very clean. Perhaps others can correct me. Bill Shoemaker, Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops University of Illinois - St Charles Horticulture Research Center www.nres.uiuc.edu/faculty/directory/shoemaker_wh.html There have been several postings about Vf resistant scab being a possibility since most resistant varieties share this gene. However, these varieties have been around for quite a while now--is there any information about resistance showing up anywhere? Is there something different about Vf resistance that would save it from what happened to Baldwin or Bramley
Re: Apple-Crop: Medical question
pCon/ppI should tell you about my friend who had a genetic respiratory disease, cystic fibrosis. As he became an adult he developed fungal infections in his lung, including aflatoxin. It was very difficult to address and contributed to his eventual decline and death. These infections can be difficult to diagnose and just as difficult to address. I'd suggest searching for information on treatment of cystic fibrosis patients for fungal infections. The reason they become infected is much the same as your friend. Best wishes for a positive outcome Con./ppBill/ppgt; gt; gt; RE: Apple-Crop: Biennial Bearing gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; Hello all, gt; I have the unfortunate task of asking you what might turn out to be a life and death question. any help at all would be better than nothing. gt; Best wishes, gt; Con Traas gt; The Apple Farm gt; Ireland gt; ++353-52-41459 gt; gt; gt; gt; /p William H. Shoemaker Sr Research Specialist, Food Crops St Charles Horticulture Research Center University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign -- CoreComm Webmail. http://home.core.com
