Gas
Supposedly Britons are already cueing for gas. What's happened? Price controls? Expected price controls? -- Prof. Bryan Caplan [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan "We may be dissatisfied with television for two quite different reasons: because our set does not work, or because we dislike the program we are receiving. Similarly, we may be dissatisfied with ourselves for two quite different reasons: because our body does not work (bodily illness), or because we dislike our conduct (mental illness)." --Thomas Szasz, *The Untamed Tongue*
GAS
Is the gas tax in Britain a per liter tax or a percentage of the price tax? Cyril Morong Department of Economics San Antonio College
RE: Gas
No, its more confusing than that. The government has raised taxes on fuel, this was sly when the oil price was falling, but now with oil above $30 a barrel, gas here costs 80p ($1.20) a litre. The British are copying the French, who have a long tradition of protesting when they disagree with government policy. French fishermen recently successfully forced a fuel price reduction. The British road hauliers looking at how action had been effective in France, blockaded the oil refineries in an attempt to force a similar climb down on the part of the UK government. PM Blair has told them to drop dead and says he will get the police to escort tanker trucks through the blockades if necessary. (it is now necessary) PM Blair is many things, but we have yet to see if he has the mettle to stare down a strongly held belief. So long as you do not need to travel anywhere by car, this whole thing has so far been quite entertaining. As to Brian's point of rationing, it never had time to be implemented, people rushed to gas stations, and drained them within a day or so. Now gas is almost impossible to find and limited to emergency vehicles, but we are promised ACTION! (So hold your breath). -Original Message- From: Bryan Caplan [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 6:54 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Gas Supposedly Britons are already cueing for gas. What's happened? Price controls? Expected price controls? -- Prof. Bryan Caplan [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan "We may be dissatisfied with television for two quite different reasons: because our set does not work, or because we dislike the program we are receiving. Similarly, we may be dissatisfied with ourselves for two quite different reasons: because our body does not work (bodily illness), or because we dislike our conduct (mental illness)." --Thomas Szasz, *The Untamed Tongue*
Re: Gas
The government here in Japan has a sly "solution" to this problem. Here the government maintains a stable gas price target by fluctuating the tax. As the price of oil changes, the government adjusts the tax to keep prices around US$4.50 a gallon. Since there's no price change, no one complains (well, I complain, but I'm definitely in the minority here in every way). Tom -Original Message- From: James Sproule <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 2:15 PM Subject: RE: Gas > > >> -- >> From: James Sproule[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 12:59:08 PM >> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' >> Subject: RE: Gas >> Auto forwarded by a Rule >> >No, its more confusing than that. > >The government has raised taxes on fuel, this was sly when the oil price >was falling, but now with oil above $30 a barrel, gas here costs 80p >($1.20) a litre. The British are copying the French, who have a long >tradition of protesting when they disagree with government policy. French >fishermen recently successfully forced a fuel price reduction. The British >road hauliers looking at how action had been effective in France, blockaded >the oil refineries in an attempt to force a similar climb down on the part >of the UK government. PM Blair has told them to drop dead and says he will >get the police to escort tanker trucks through the blockades if necessary. > (it is now necessary) > >PM Blair is many things, but we have yet to see if he has the mettle to >stare down a strongly held belief. So long as you do not need to travel >anywhere by car, this whole thing has so far been quite entertaining. > >As to Brian's point of rationing, it never had time to be implemented, >people rushed to gas stations, and drained them within a day or so. Now >gas is almost impossible to find and limited to emergency vehicles, but we >are promised ACTION! (So hold your breath). > >-Original Message- >From: Bryan Caplan [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 6:54 PM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Gas > > >Supposedly Britons are already cueing for gas. What's happened? Price >controls? Expected price controls? >-- >Prof. Bryan Caplan [EMAIL PROTECTED] >http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan > > "We may be dissatisfied with television for two quite different > reasons: because our set does not work, or because we dislike > the program we are receiving. Similarly, we may be dissatisfied > with ourselves for two quite different reasons: because our body > does not work (bodily illness), or because we dislike our > conduct (mental illness)." > --Thomas Szasz, *The Untamed Tongue* >
RE: Gas
>From today's National Post September 13, 2000 Tax revolt spreads as fuel runs dry Showdown in Britain: Blair calls on oil companies, police to break blockades Peter Goodspeed National Post Protests over surging gasoline prices have turned into a taxpayer revolt that is sweeping Europe like a wildfire. Last night, officials with the Royal Automobile Club in Britain were predicting London could run out of gasoline in a matter of hours as a loose coalition of angry farmers, truckers, taxi drivers, fishermen and ordinary motorists shut down Britain's entire fuel distribution system and triggered what may be the country's worst economic crisis in a quarter-century. With business on the verge of paralysis amid a wave of panic buying by consumers, two-thirds of the country's service stations ran out of gas yesterday. Tony Blair, the Prime Minister, abruptly cancelled a tour of northern England to rush back to London to discuss declaring a national emergency. On Monday, the Privy Council and the Queen had approved a series of special powers to enable the government to guarantee a flow of fuel to "priority users," such as hospitals, schools and public transport. But late last night, Mr. Blair's government still faced a taxpayers' revolt which, in sheer terms of disruption, rivals Margaret Thatcher's showdown with the coal miners in a national strike 15 years ago. At the core of this dispute is a growing public outrage over the amount of money governments take in tax from motorists every time they refuel their vehicles. Britain has the cheapest fuel in Europe, but the highest fuel taxes anywhere in the world, apart from Sweden. British taxes account for 76% of the pump price of gas, which sells for as much as $1.80 a litre of regular unleaded, up from $1.74 last month. In recent weeks, as rising international oil prices have driven up fuel costs, motorists throughout Europe have begun to clamour for financial relief and demanded governments roll back their share of fuel taxes. The rebellion began in France two weeks ago, when farmers and truckers successfully held their country to ransom by blockading oil refineries, ports and major highways in a bid to choke off oil supplies, while demanding a fuel tax reduction. Six days ago, when the French government agreed to a 15% fuel tax rollback, similar protests exploded across the continent. Yesterday, protesters continued to snarl traffic and blockade oil refineries in Britain, Belgium, the Netherlands, France and Germany. Truckers and motorists in Poland, Spain, Ireland and Italy threatened similar action against high oil prices and government fuel taxes in their countries. In the Netherlands, where protesters claim many small companies are on the verge of bankruptcy, the demonstrators halted all traffic between the port city of Rotterdam and the southern town of Breda. German truckers are threatening to disrupt their country's transport system tomorrow, while farmers joined taxi drivers in Hamburg yesterday to snarl traffic and demand cuts in diesel taxes and an end to a special ecological tax on fuel. In Belgium, truckers, who have been staging protests for four days, choked off key roads around the offices of the European Union in the centre of Brussels and blocked fuel depots and major highways. Irish truckers also vowed to start strike action on Friday, if their demands for a 20% reduction in fuel taxes is not met. In Italy, an oil refinery in Sicily was blockaded and truckers threatened to launch a national strike. Spanish farmers said they will begin protests next week, if talks with the government fail to secure a fuel price cut. The European Union has called a special meeting of EU transport ministers for Sept. 21 to discuss fuel taxes. In the meantime, the crisis in Britain deteriorated rapidly yesterday. Ambulance services in parts of Wales and northern England cancelled everything but emergency services, while supermarkets warned customers they could soon face serious food shortages. Meat packers in London said they may have to stop slaughtering animals today. Garbage went uncollected in some areas of the capital and hospitals across the country began cancelling non-emergency services. After an emergency cabinet meeting last night, Mr. Blair flatly rejected any change in his government's tax policies. Instead, he said he was calling on oil companies and police to break the blockades and begin delivering fuel. "We hope within the next 24 hours to have the situation on the way back to normal, though it will take longer than that to be fully back to normal," he told a news conference. "The oil companies are agreed they must move supplies, the police are agreed to do all that is necessary to give protection against intimidation." Mr. Blair stopped short of using his emergency powers to call out the army to enforce the movement of fuel, but not
RE: Gas
the japanese govt should take a look at what happened to the portuguese this year: they run the same kind of "floating tax" deal where they cushion the gas price by raising or lowering the tax chunk. this was great until oil prices rose above the level where they got ANY taxes and actually started SUBSIDIZING gas. to solve the revenue problem, the government in March decided to levy an 11% average increase in pump prices. you can imagine the outcry. next step was the Prime Minister vowing there would be no further pump price hikes in 2000, because the govt expected crude to remain around $25 a bbl. two weeks later we've got $30/bbl oil and there goes the revenue again, hung up on populist promises. note: the fluctuation method was initially designed to keep inflation down as portugal worked to join monetary union. govt could hold prices back at the expense of revenue, but it worked at the time. it's interesting about gas: everyone complains about higher prices, but no one complains about falling prices. they just complain about the traffic. etb > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of > Thomas TerBush > Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2000 1:20 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: Gas > > > The government here in Japan has a sly "solution" to this problem. Here > the government maintains a stable gas price target by fluctuating the tax. > As the price of oil changes, the government adjusts the tax to keep prices > around US$4.50 a gallon. Since there's no price change, no one complains > (well, I complain, but I'm definitely in the minority here in every way). > > Tom > > > -Original Message- > From: James Sproule <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 2:15 PM > Subject: RE: Gas > > > > > > > >> ------ > >> From: James Sproule[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > >> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 12:59:08 PM > >> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > >> Subject: RE: Gas > >> Auto forwarded by a Rule > >> > >No, its more confusing than that. > > > >The government has raised taxes on fuel, this was sly when the oil price > >was falling, but now with oil above $30 a barrel, gas here costs 80p > >($1.20) a litre. The British are copying the French, who have a long > >tradition of protesting when they disagree with government > policy. French > >fishermen recently successfully forced a fuel price reduction. > The British > >road hauliers looking at how action had been effective in > France, blockaded > >the oil refineries in an attempt to force a similar climb down > on the part > >of the UK government. PM Blair has told them to drop dead and > says he will > >get the police to escort tanker trucks through the blockades if > necessary. > > (it is now necessary) > > > >PM Blair is many things, but we have yet to see if he has the mettle to > >stare down a strongly held belief. So long as you do not need to travel > >anywhere by car, this whole thing has so far been quite entertaining. > > > >As to Brian's point of rationing, it never had time to be implemented, > >people rushed to gas stations, and drained them within a day or so. Now > >gas is almost impossible to find and limited to emergency > vehicles, but we > >are promised ACTION! (So hold your breath). > > > >-Original Message- > >From: Bryan Caplan [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > >Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 6:54 PM > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Subject: Gas > > > > > >Supposedly Britons are already cueing for gas. What's happened? Price > >controls? Expected price controls? > >-- > >Prof. Bryan Caplan [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan > > > > "We may be dissatisfied with television for two quite different > > reasons: because our set does not work, or because we dislike > > the program we are receiving. Similarly, we may be dissatisfied > > with ourselves for two quite different reasons: because our body > > does not work (bodily illness), or because we dislike our > > conduct (mental illness)." > > --Thomas Szasz, *The Untamed Tongue* > > >
Re: Gas
From: "Thomas TerBush" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > The government here in Japan has a sly "solution" to this problem. Here the government maintains a stable gas price target by fluctuating the tax. > As the price of oil changes, the government adjusts the tax to keep prices around US$4.50 a gallon. Since there's no price change, no one complains (well, I complain, but I'm definitely in the minority here in every way).< If the supply of oil is fixed in the short run, then a tax on the sales price of oil should not affect the price to the consumer and just affects the profits of the seller. So perhaps the government has not really provided a solution at all, but just fools the public into thinking so. Since Japan imports all its oil, even in the longer run, if the tax is reduced, the demand would not change, so would the price not be affected? Where would the supply-side effect come from? Fred Foldvary
Re: Gas
Fred Foldvary wrote: > > From: "Thomas TerBush" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > The government here in Japan has a sly "solution" to this > problem. Here the government maintains a stable gas price > target by fluctuating the tax. > > As the price of oil changes, the government adjusts the > tax to keep prices around US$4.50 a gallon. Since there's > no price change, no one complains (well, I complain, but > I'm definitely in the minority here in every way).< > > If the supply of oil is fixed in the short run, then a tax > on the sales price of oil should not affect the price to the > consumer and just affects the profits of the seller. So > perhaps the government has not really provided a solution at > all, but just fools the public into thinking so. Since > Japan imports all its oil, even in the longer run, if the > tax is reduced, the demand would not change, so would the > price not be affected? Where would the supply-side effect > come from? Just because the world supply is fixed, does not mean that one country can't reduce after-tax prices by cutting taxes. Inelastically supplied to the world, elastically supplied to individual countries. -- Prof. Bryan Caplan [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan "[W]hen we attempt to prove by direct argument, what is really self-evident, the reasoning will always be inconclusive; for it will either take for granted the thing to be proved, or something not more evident; and so, instead of giving strength to the conclusion, will rather tempt those to doubt of it, who never did so before." -- Thomas Reid, _Essays on the Active Powers of the Human Mind_
Re: Gas
On Sun, 17 Sep 2000, Bryan Caplan wrote: > > Where would the supply-side effect > > come from? > > Just because the world supply is fixed, does not mean that one country > can't reduce after-tax prices by cutting taxes. Inelastically supplied > to the world, elastically supplied to individual countries. > Prof. Bryan Caplan [EMAIL PROTECTED] If the product we are talking about is gasoline, it seems to me the oil is refined locally with imported oil. If gasoline itself is imported, then yes, the supply is elastic. But if the gasoline is all refined with Japan, then in the short run, if refineries are running at full capacity, it seems to me the supply of gasoline is inelastic, if not fixed. Fred Foldvary
Fw: True costs of oil and gas (3 articles)
"Higher energy prices are needed now to signal the real > scarcity to come. Without higher prices we will not invest in the > alternative energy technologies needed for a smooth transition to the > post-petroleum age. Without higher prices we will not conserve the > fossil energy needed to manufacture those alternative technologies. > Without higher prices, argues petroleum analyst Richard Duncan, the > remaining life expectancy of industrial society may well be less than > 40 years!" > > http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/981117/bbm.html > > Tuesday November 17, 3:23 pm Eastern Time, 1998 > > Real cost of U.S. gasoline is $15.14 per gallon, report says > > By Tom Doggett > > WASHINGTON, Nov 17 (Reuters) - So you think you're getting a good > deal on a tank of gasoline these days? Not so, if all the oil > industry tax subsidies received from the federal and state > governments and other costs that went into producing that gallon of > gasoline were included in the pump price. > > Such external costs push the price of gasoline as high as $15.14 a > gallon, according to a new report released Tuesday by the > International Center for Technology Assessment. > > ``In reality, the external costs of using our cars are much more > higher than we may realize,'' the Washington-based research group > said in its report. > > The report examined more than 40 separate cost factors the group said > it associated with gasoline production but aren't reflected by the > price of gasoline at the pump. > > These external costs total up to $1.69 trillion per year, according > to the report. > > The group points out that the federal government provides the oil > industry with tax breaks to help U.S. companies compete with > international producers, so gasoline remains cheap for American > consumers. > > The Department of Energy is forecasting that the national price for > regular unleaded gasoline will average $1.02 during the current > quarter, the lowest price on record for any three-month period when > adjusted for inflation. > > Tax subsidies don't end at the federal level, as the group said most > state income taxes are based on oil firms' lower federal tax bills, > which result in companies paying $123 million to $323 million less in > state taxes. > > In addition to tax breaks, the federal government provides up to > $114.6 billion in subsidies annually that support the extraction, > production and use of petroleum, such as research and development and > export financing. > > The federal government also spends up to $1.6 billion yearly on > regulatory oversight, pollution cleanup and liability costs connected > to the oil industry, the group said. > > In addition, U.S. Defense Department spending allocated to safeguard > the world's petroleum resources totals $55 billion to $96 billion a > year, according to the group. > > > Copyright © 1998 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved. Republication > or redistribution of Reuters content is expressly prohibited without > the prior written consent of Reuters. Reuters shall not be liable for > any errors or delays in the content, or for any actions taken in > reliance thereon. See our Important Disclaimers and Legal > Information. Questions or Comments? > > -- > > http://www.icta.org/projects/trans/rlprexsm.htm > > The International Center for Technology Assessment > > The Real Price Of Gas > > Executive Summary > > This report by the International Center for Technology Assessment > (CTA) identifies and quantifies the many external costs of using > motor vehicles and the internal combustion engine that are not > reflected in the retail price Americans pay for gasoline. These > are costs that consumers pay indirectly by way of increased taxes, > insurance costs, and retail prices in other sectors. > > The report divides the external costs of gasoline usage into five > primary areas: (1) Tax Subsidization of the Oil Industry; (2) > Government Program Subsidies; (3) Protection Costs Involved in Oil > Shipment and Motor Vehicle Services; (4) Environmental, Health, > and Social Costs of Gasoline Usage; and (5) Other Important > Externalities of Motor Vehicle Use. Together, these external costs > total $558.7 billion to $1.69 trillion per year, which, when added > to the retail price of gasoline, result in a per gallon price of > $5.60 to $15.14. > > TAX SUBSIDIES > > The federal government provides the oil industry with numerous tax > breaks designed to ensure that domestic companies can compete with > international producers and that gasoline remains cheap for > American cons
