Re: Re: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ?
Hi Dorai Swamy, I don't agree with you. The fact that you didn't find RDB that good when compared to Alaipayuthey or Kandokondain Kandokondain was may be because at that time the kind of music that ARR composed was new and fresh when compared to music composed at those times. But now this kind of music has become common with all other music director's copying AR Rahman's music or using similar beats. But you must be proud that ARR is still trying do something new and innovative. In due course of time I am sure that you and all other listener's will find RDB exciting. Bye, -SUNIL On Mon, 09 Jan 2006 Doraiswamy S. wrote : >I am an ARR fan but I dont find RDB all that good .. its ok in parts and he >shows his briliance at some places .. but not very consistent though .. >atleast to novice listeners like me. I think I have listened to Bluffmaster >and Zinda more than RDB. I havent heard Kalyug. > >I dont find in RDB the kind of value I found in Alaipayuthey, Dil Se or >Kandukodein. ARR himself is to blame for the high standards he set for >himself in his intial years. Sadly I think he is not able to do that now. >His golden period where everything he touched turned gold ..seemed to end >after AlaiPayuthey and KK, 2 magnificient albums that released so close to >each other. After that he did produce gems like Bose, Meenaxi .. but he >couldnt strike chord with the general public. And that matters a lot. > >On 1/8/06, dsuday <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > From what I understand from some of the posts which have been put across > > by members, it seems that RDB Music is not a sales success which was a > > shock to me as this seems to be one of the Best Music of 2000's > > > > We do not have the Nielson soundscans or NPD surverys type thing in > > India, hence it would be premature to assume that this hasnt sold well > > till information confirming this is made available. > > > > That there is currently a kind of Bias or a movement with sole purpose > > of undermining ARR's effort and ignore the variety of his creativity > > with misinformation, half truths and pure ignorance. > > > > At one end we have the Music professionals who make comments which > > strive to undermine his musical genius, while during his hey days > > heaped praise on his abilities, ofcourse there were Old timers who had > > criticised him from his early days but I am talking about the current > > crop who are doing their best to discredit him now. > > > > At other end we have "music lovers" if you call them so (I know it > > sound s pretty condescending as if I am being very biased...but it is > > not so), who say that "his music is repetiive" "his creativity is > > limited" "okay some songs were good but that doesnt mean he is great" > > "he is not versatle...look at RD burman etc. The music loving > > public who used to buy the album just by seeing his name in the late > > 90's are not opening up and buying his music as they used to do so and > > therby contributing to the decline. > > > > From what I understand from my experience and I am not any > > professional just a layman who can feel and experience good music, and > > judge what is a creation of greatness, what is mediocre, what is > > ephemeral. Just like other members I just believe in my instincts to > > judge music. Indian public has been fed on similar kind of popular > > music since the LP records started selling here. All the songs confirm > > to some Basic rules, have a defined structure and were inspired by > > the Classical musics of different era...modified and downgraded so > > that the general public can enjoy them. That is the only bit of > > innovation they did, they made music in such a way that it appeals to > > the common man and he came to expect all the songs to follow similar > > standards, and in this limited setup many great music pieces have come > > which have been of great artistic and commercial success. The only > > musicians who tried to do some sort of innovation to this setup was RD > > Burman and OP Nayyar and probably few others. Their music was hit and > > apprecaited but nobody would have called them great musicians. From > > what I have seen RD Burman's became recognized as a great Music > > director since his death, as the industry found his output was of > > remixable quality which can appeal to the current generations. This > > infact grew his popularity and made people like me end up buying all > > the available collection of his original song currently existing in > > market. In this kind of setup ARR had set in and brought in an > > entirely different musical experience to the music loving public. He > > defined and created something called Individual style in which the > > musician is recognized just by listening to the music. Though this > > would be a bare minimum in other places as just by listening to a > > small sample people were able to judge whether the song was by The > > WHo, Pink Floyd, Queen, Led Zeppelin etc
Re: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ?
Hi, This is very certain that some ppl always criticise. Its their hobby u can say.long back when RDBurman created some historic tunes, many criticised him, and also told that he will not be remembered...bla bla blabut now ppl admire him, the same is happening with ARR. When thiruda thiruda came many told that this is not at all good music, but now they realise the power of it---it takes long 7-8 yrs..general listeners are not good enough to assimilate ARR's music, the same persion can not appreciate Bluffmaster (with some bad voice of Avishek) and piya ho at the same time.. Arijit On 09/01/06, Vijay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: While it is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion, I am sick of this "ARR losing his magic" phrase… ARR delivered many wonderful tunes after alaipayudhey and KK some of which you had already mentioned. Even during the socalled golden period, not every song in every album is magic. If every song is a magic, the word itself would be redundant right? I have not seen a more consistent composer than ARR in these modern days. I personally feel ARRs music has matured with time a lot and is lot more different than during the middle years. Cheers Vijay From: arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com [mailto:arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Doraiswamy S.Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2006 10:52 PMTo: arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ? I am an ARR fan but I dont find RDB all that good .. its ok in parts and he shows his briliance at some places .. but not very consistent though .. atleast to novice listeners like me. I think I have listened to Bluffmaster and Zinda more than RDB. I havent heard Kalyug. I dont find in RDB the kind of value I found in Alaipayuthey, Dil Se or Kandukodein. ARR himself is to blame for the high standards he set for himself in his intial years. Sadly I think he is not able to do that now. His golden period where everything he touched turned gold ..seemed to end after AlaiPayuthey and KK, 2 magnificient albums that released so close to each other. After that he did produce gems like Bose, Meenaxi .. but he couldnt strike chord with the general public. And that matters a lot. On 1/8/06, dsuday < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: From what I understand from some of the posts which have been put acrossby members, it seems that RDB Music is not a sales success which was a shock to me as this seems to be one of the Best Music of 2000'sWe do not have the Nielson soundscans or NPD surverys type thing inIndia, hence it would be premature to assume that this hasnt sold well till information confirming this is made available.That there is currently a kind of Bias or a movement with sole purpose of undermining ARR's effort and ignore the variety of his creativitywith misinformation, half truths and pure ignorance. At one end we have the Music professionals who make comments whichstrive to undermine his musical genius, while during his hey days heaped praise on his abilities, ofcourse there were Old timers who had criticised him from his early days but I am talking about the currentcrop who are doing their best to discredit him now.At other end we have "music lovers" if you call them so (I know it sound s pretty condescending as if I am being very biased...but it is not so), who say that "his music is repetiive" "his creativity islimited" "okay some songs were good but that doesnt mean he is great" "he is not versatle...look at RD burman etc. The music loving public who used to buy the album just by seeing his name in the late90's are not opening up and buying his music as they used to do so andtherby contributing to the decline. From what I understand from my experience and I am not any professional just a layman who can feel and experience good music, andjudge what is a creation of greatness, what is mediocre, what isephemeral. Just like other members I just believe in my instincts to judge music. Indian public has been fed on similar kind of popular music since the LP records started selling here. All the songs confirmto some Basic rules, have a defined structure and were inspired bythe Classical musics of different era...modified and downgraded so that the general public can enjoy them. That is the only bit of innovation they did, they made music in such a way that it appeals tothe common man and he came to expect all the songs to follow similarstandards, and in this limited setup many great music pieces have come which have been of great artistic and commercial success. The onlymusicians who tried to do some sort of innovation to this setup was RDBurman and OP Nayyar and probably few others. Their music was hit andapprecaited but nobody would have called them great musicians. From what I have seen RD Burman's became recognized as a great Music
RE: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ?
While it is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion, I am sick of this “ARR losing his magic” phrase… ARR delivered many wonderful tunes after alaipayudhey and KK some of which you had already mentioned. Even during the socalled golden period, not every song in every album is magic. If every song is a magic, the word itself would be redundant right? I have not seen a more consistent composer than ARR in these modern days. I personally feel ARRs music has matured with time a lot and is lot more different than during the middle years. Cheers Vijay From: arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com [mailto:arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Doraiswamy S. Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2006 10:52 PM To: arrahmanfans@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ? I am an ARR fan but I dont find RDB all that good .. its ok in parts and he shows his briliance at some places .. but not very consistent though .. atleast to novice listeners like me. I think I have listened to Bluffmaster and Zinda more than RDB. I havent heard Kalyug. I dont find in RDB the kind of value I found in Alaipayuthey, Dil Se or Kandukodein. ARR himself is to blame for the high standards he set for himself in his intial years. Sadly I think he is not able to do that now. His golden period where everything he touched turned gold ..seemed to end after AlaiPayuthey and KK, 2 magnificient albums that released so close to each other. After that he did produce gems like Bose, Meenaxi .. but he couldnt strike chord with the general public. And that matters a lot. On 1/8/06, dsuday <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: From what I understand from some of the posts which have been put across by members, it seems that RDB Music is not a sales success which was a shock to me as this seems to be one of the Best Music of 2000's We do not have the Nielson soundscans or NPD surverys type thing in India, hence it would be premature to assume that this hasnt sold well till information confirming this is made available. That there is currently a kind of Bias or a movement with sole purpose of undermining ARR's effort and ignore the variety of his creativity with misinformation, half truths and pure ignorance. At one end we have the Music professionals who make comments which strive to undermine his musical genius, while during his hey days heaped praise on his abilities, ofcourse there were Old timers who had criticised him from his early days but I am talking about the current crop who are doing their best to discredit him now. At other end we have "music lovers" if you call them so (I know it sound s pretty condescending as if I am being very biased...but it is not so), who say that "his music is repetiive" "his creativity is limited" "okay some songs were good but that doesnt mean he is great" "he is not versatle...look at RD burman etc. The music loving public who used to buy the album just by seeing his name in the late 90's are not opening up and buying his music as they used to do so and therby contributing to the decline. >From what I understand from my experience and I am not any professional just a layman who can feel and experience good music, and judge what is a creation of greatness, what is mediocre, what is ephemeral. Just like other members I just believe in my instincts to judge music. Indian public has been fed on similar kind of popular music since the LP records started selling here. All the songs confirm to some Basic rules, have a defined structure and were inspired by the Classical musics of different era...modified and downgraded so that the general public can enjoy them. That is the only bit of innovation they did, they made music in such a way that it appeals to the common man and he came to expect all the songs to follow similar standards, and in this limited setup many great music pieces have come which have been of great artistic and commercial success. The only musicians who tried to do some sort of innovation to this setup was RD Burman and OP Nayyar and probably few others. Their music was hit and apprecaited but nobody would have called them great musicians. From what I have seen RD Burman's became recognized as a great Music director since his death, as the industry found his output was of remixable quality which can appeal to the current generations. This infact grew his popularity and made people like me end up buying all the available collection of his original song currently existing in market. In this kind of setup ARR had set in and brought in an entirely different musical experience to the music loving public. He defined and created something called Individual style in which the musician is recognized just by listening to the music. Though this would be a bare minimum in other places as just by listening to a small sample people were able to judge
Re: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ?
I just think that people are not ready for the kind of music he gives these days. I don't have a musical knowledge to comment on technicalities. But my personal opinion is that every other album is a Bluffmaster or Kalyug. One never lets go of a winning formula. I like RDB. I think it's a wonderful album. But this happens to be one of those debates that could go on forever and we would never reach a conclusion. But then I don't think that one should just conclude that ARR has lost his magic. That is not true. --- "Doraiswamy S." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I am an ARR fan but I dont find RDB all that good .. > its ok in parts and he > shows his briliance at some places .. but not very > consistent though .. > atleast to novice listeners like me. I think I have > listened to Bluffmaster > and Zinda more than RDB. I havent heard Kalyug. > > I dont find in RDB the kind of value I found in > Alaipayuthey, Dil Se or > Kandukodein. ARR himself is to blame for the high > standards he set for > himself in his intial years. Sadly I think he is not > able to do that now. > His golden period where everything he touched turned > gold ..seemed to end > after AlaiPayuthey and KK, 2 magnificient albums > that released so close to > each other. After that he did produce gems like > Bose, Meenaxi .. but he > couldnt strike chord with the general public. And > that matters a lot. > > On 1/8/06, dsuday <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > From what I understand from some of the posts > which have been put across > > by members, it seems that RDB Music is not a sales > success which was a > > shock to me as this seems to be one of the Best > Music of 2000's > > > > We do not have the Nielson soundscans or NPD > surverys type thing in > > India, hence it would be premature to assume that > this hasnt sold well > > till information confirming this is made > available. > > > > That there is currently a kind of Bias or a > movement with sole purpose > > of undermining ARR's effort and ignore the variety > of his creativity > > with misinformation, half truths and pure > ignorance. > > > > At one end we have the Music professionals who > make comments which > > strive to undermine his musical genius, while > during his hey days > > heaped praise on his abilities, ofcourse there > were Old timers who had > > criticised him from his early days but I am > talking about the current > > crop who are doing their best to discredit him > now. > > > > At other end we have "music lovers" if you call > them so (I know it > > sound s pretty condescending as if I am being very > biased...but it is > > not so), who say that "his music is repetiive" > "his creativity is > > limited" "okay some songs were good but that > doesnt mean he is great" > > "he is not versatle...look at RD burman etc. The > music loving > > public who used to buy the album just by seeing > his name in the late > > 90's are not opening up and buying his music as > they used to do so and > > therby contributing to the decline. > > > > From what I understand from my experience and I am > not any > > professional just a layman who can feel and > experience good music, and > > judge what is a creation of greatness, what is > mediocre, what is > > ephemeral. Just like other members I just believe > in my instincts to > > judge music. Indian public has been fed on similar > kind of popular > > music since the LP records started selling here. > All the songs confirm > > to some Basic rules, have a defined structure and > were inspired by > > the Classical musics of different era...modified > and downgraded so > > that the general public can enjoy them. That is > the only bit of > > innovation they did, they made music in such a way > that it appeals to > > the common man and he came to expect all the songs > to follow similar > > standards, and in this limited setup many great > music pieces have come > > which have been of great artistic and commercial > success. The only > > musicians who tried to do some sort of innovation > to this setup was RD > > Burman and OP Nayyar and probably few others. > Their music was hit and > > apprecaited but nobody would have called them > great musicians. From > > what I have seen RD Burman's became recognized as > a great Music > > director since his death, as the industry found > his output was of > > remixable quality which can appeal to the current > generations. This > > infact grew his popularity and made people like me > end up buying all > > the available collection of his original song > currently existing in > > market. In this kind of setup ARR had set in and > brought in an > > entirely different musical experience to the music > loving public. He > > defined and created something called Individual > style in which the > > musician is recognized just by listening to the > music. Though this > > would be a bare minimum in other places as just by > listening to a > > small sample people were able to judge whether the > song w
Re: [arr] What does the weak exposure of music of Rang De Basanti prove ?
I am an ARR fan but I dont find RDB all that good .. its ok in parts and he shows his briliance at some places .. but not very consistent though .. atleast to novice listeners like me. I think I have listened to Bluffmaster and Zinda more than RDB. I havent heard Kalyug. I dont find in RDB the kind of value I found in Alaipayuthey, Dil Se or Kandukodein. ARR himself is to blame for the high standards he set for himself in his intial years. Sadly I think he is not able to do that now. His golden period where everything he touched turned gold ..seemed to end after AlaiPayuthey and KK, 2 magnificient albums that released so close to each other. After that he did produce gems like Bose, Meenaxi .. but he couldnt strike chord with the general public. And that matters a lot. On 1/8/06, dsuday <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >From what I understand from some of the posts which have been put acrossby members, it seems that RDB Music is not a sales success which was ashock to me as this seems to be one of the Best Music of 2000's We do not have the Nielson soundscans or NPD surverys type thing inIndia, hence it would be premature to assume that this hasnt sold welltill information confirming this is made available.That there is currently a kind of Bias or a movement with sole purpose of undermining ARR's effort and ignore the variety of his creativitywith misinformation, half truths and pure ignorance.At one end we have the Music professionals who make comments whichstrive to undermine his musical genius, while during his hey days heaped praise on his abilities, ofcourse there were Old timers who hadcriticised him from his early days but I am talking about the currentcrop who are doing their best to discredit him now.At other end we have "music lovers" if you call them so (I know it sound s pretty condescending as if I am being very biased...but it isnot so), who say that "his music is repetiive" "his creativity islimited" "okay some songs were good but that doesnt mean he is great" "he is not versatle...look at RD burman etc. The music lovingpublic who used to buy the album just by seeing his name in the late90's are not opening up and buying his music as they used to do so andtherby contributing to the decline. From what I understand from my experience and I am not anyprofessional just a layman who can feel and experience good music, andjudge what is a creation of greatness, what is mediocre, what isephemeral. Just like other members I just believe in my instincts to judge music. Indian public has been fed on similar kind of popularmusic since the LP records started selling here. All the songs confirm to some Basic rules, have a defined structure and were inspired bythe Classical musics of different era...modified and downgraded so that the general public can enjoy them. That is the only bit ofinnovation they did, they made music in such a way that it appeals tothe common man and he came to expect all the songs to follow similarstandards, and in this limited setup many great music pieces have come which have been of great artistic and commercial success. The onlymusicians who tried to do some sort of innovation to this setup was RDBurman and OP Nayyar and probably few others. Their music was hit and apprecaited but nobody would have called them great musicians. Fromwhat I have seen RD Burman's became recognized as a great Musicdirector since his death, as the industry found his output was ofremixable quality which can appeal to the current generations. This infact grew his popularity and made people like me end up buying allthe available collection of his original song currently existing inmarket. In this kind of setup ARR had set in and brought in anentirely different musical experience to the music loving public. He defined and created something called Individual style in which themusician is recognized just by listening to the music. Though thiswould be a bare minimum in other places as just by listening to asmall sample people were able to judge whether the song was by The WHo, Pink Floyd, Queen, Led Zeppelin etc else, this ability becamesomething special here.ARR's popularity and his musical successes grew and he seemed togarner all major awards and had excellent sales to show. He was by far the greatest Music Director in India and had a star power no musicianever enjoyed in India.And then came the "Going International" phase, during the time whichmost of his Indian releases tanked. In the end it all turned to success for his music which we of Blockbuster quality and the lastmajor hits turned out ot be Lagaan and Saathiya. His musicallysuperior albums which were released subsequently did not do as well asthey might have deserved, many of the movies didnt have the star power and incase they had star power (Swades, Mangal Pandey) the music wasso true to the subject that it was not possible for them to beimmediately appeable in the current scenario of bubblegum remixes andsongs. Infact these have been state
