Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
> >One was killed in army custody, while the other was killed by >assilaints in the crowd seeking justice for Mahanta. >I am not sure if the family of Ojha feel any better or worse because >of that subtle difference. *** And that is why for the rest of us--it is NOT the same! At 8:29 AM -0600 2/13/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote: >C'da, > >Yes, ALL deaths carry grief. But the CAUSES are NOT all the same.. > >Top attempt to make them out be the same is either >profoundly >ignorant--not a persuasive condition , or is >disingenuous. > >No one has attempted to equate the 'causes' of the deaths of Mahanta >or Ojha (the CRPF). > >One was killed in army custody, while the other was killed by >assilaints in the crowd seeking justice for Mahanta. >I am not sure if the family of Ojha feel any better or worse because >of that subtle difference. > >--Ram > ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
C'da, >Yes, ALL deaths carry grief. But the CAUSES are NOT all the same.. >Top attempt to make them out be the same is either profoundly >ignorant--not a persuasive condition , or is disingenuous. No one has attempted to equate the 'causes' of the deaths of Mahanta or Ojha (the CRPF). One was killed in army custody, while the other was killed by assilaints in the crowd seeking justice for Mahanta. I am not sure if the family of Ojha feel any better or worse because of that subtle difference. --Ram On 2/13/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Yes, ALL deaths carry grief. But the CAUSES are NOT all the same. A victim of an auto accident is not the same as a death from a fatal illness is not the same from a death from a fight over passion is not the same as a death of a soldier in a declared war is not the same as a death caused in custody by those entrusted with upholding the laws of a supposedly democratic land that supposedly believes in due process while frothing in the mouth professing fealty to democratic processes. Top attempt to make them out be the same is either profoundly ignorant--not a persuasive condition , or is disingenuous. At 11:17 PM -0600 2/12/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote: Priyankoo, There is only one quirk here. The army jawan that was killed was a kharkhowa Assamese (a Gohain, if I recollect). Now, would that make any difference? Priyankoo, all killing is deplorable, but sadly there is usually no outpouring grief if it happens to be an army personnel. To me all the deaths (of Mahanta, others, and the jawan) are deplorable and sad. Gohain's death is equally painful to his family as is that of Mahanta. Gohain too may have just joined the army to provide for his family. --Ram da On 13 Feb 2006 03:58:55 -, priyankoo sarma <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: >>Nobody really cares if an army jawan was killed or how many are killed. It doesn't matter if he was NOT the one involved in the killing of Mahanta. All that matters is that he is in the Indian army. It was his own damn fault for joining the Indian army and getting imbroiled in the mess. Exactly! Ramda! The Indian Army also does not care about who they killed or not. It does not matter to them if the people in the demonstration were involved in any killing or not. All that matters is that the people are Assamese...gotike mar kukur mekurir dore guliyay...be in Kokrajhar train station or Kamakhya...It is their own damn fault that they are born Assamese... And it does not matter whether the regiment is Gorkha, or Assam or Jath, or whatever fancy names they have. The point is that the triggers are not drawn by the brain behind the gun, they simply follow orders. Otherwise Assam Police had not been the first to open fire, which intiated the Kakopothar mayhem and then Army jawans chased 15-16 year old teenagers on paddy field and killed them point blank! Please read: http://pratidinassam.com/feb1206/ap03.html Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari...The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___assam mailing listassam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
Title: Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy Yes, ALL deaths carry grief. But the CAUSES are NOT all the same. A victim of an auto accident is not the same as a death from a fatal illness is not the same from a death from a fight over passion is not the same as a death of a soldier in a declared war is not the same as a death caused in custody by those entrusted with upholding the laws of a supposedly democratic land that supposedly believes in due process while frothing in the mouth professing fealty to democratic processes. Top attempt to make them out be the same is either profoundly ignorant--not a persuasive condition , or is disingenuous. At 11:17 PM -0600 2/12/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote: Priyankoo, There is only one quirk here. The army jawan that was killed was a kharkhowa Assamese (a Gohain, if I recollect). Now, would that make any difference? Priyankoo, all killing is deplorable, but sadly there is usually no outpouring grief if it happens to be an army personnel. To me all the deaths (of Mahanta, others, and the jawan) are deplorable and sad. Gohain's death is equally painful to his family as is that of Mahanta. Gohain too may have just joined the army to provide for his family. --Ram da On 13 Feb 2006 03:58:55 -, priyankoo sarma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>Nobody really cares if an army jawan was killed or how many are killed. It doesn't matter if he was NOT the one involved in the killing of Mahanta. All that matters is that he is in the Indian army. It was his own damn fault for joining the Indian army and getting imbroiled in the mess. Exactly! Ramda! The Indian Army also does not care about who they killed or not. It does not matter to them if the people in the demonstration were involved in any killing or not. All that matters is that the people are Assamese...gotike mar kukur mekurir dore guliyay...be in Kokrajhar train station or Kamakhya...It is their own damn fault that they are born Assamese... And it does not matter whether the regiment is Gorkha, or Assam or Jath, or whatever fancy names they have. The point is that the triggers are not drawn by the brain behind the gun, they simply follow orders. Otherwise Assam Police had not been the first to open fire, which intiated the Kakopothar mayhem and then Army jawans chased 15-16 year old teenagers on paddy field and killed them point blank! Please read: http://pratidinassam.com/feb1206/ap03.html Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari... The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
Priyankoo, >2. Any killing is condemnable be it in the hands of ULFA or Army. Whats important is the >message behind the killings. I can readily agree with you here. But what is the message that you refer to behind the killings? I am not sure I get that. --Ram da On 13 Feb 2006 05:28:06 -, priyankoo sarma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Ramda,I think the CRPF man was some Ojha. However it does not make any difference as you said all killings are equally deplorable.Again, the point I am trying to raise here is that: 1. There is no military solution to the Assam problem2. Any killing is condemnable be it in the hands of ULFA or Army. Whats important is the message behind the killings. Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari... The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
Ramda, I think the CRPF man was some Ojha. However it does not make any difference as you said all killings are equally deplorable. Again, the point I am trying to raise here is that: 1. There is no ilitary solution to the Assam problem 2. Any killing is condemnable be it in the hands of ULFA or Army. Whats important is the message behind the killings. Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari... The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
Ramda, I think the CRPF man was some Ojha. However it does not make any difference as you said all killings are equally deplorable. Again, the point I am trying to raise here is that: 1. There is no military solution to the Assam problem 2. Any killing is condemnable be it in the hands of ULFA or Army. Whats important is the message behind the killings. Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari... The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
Priyankoo, There is only one quirk here. The army jawan that was killed was a kharkhowa Assamese (a Gohain, if I recollect). Now, would that make any difference? Priyankoo, all killing is deplorable, but sadly there is usually no outpouring grief if it happens to be an army personnel. To me all the deaths (of Mahanta, others, and the jawan) are deplorable and sad. Gohain's death is equally painful to his family as is that of Mahanta. Gohain too may have just joined the army to provide for his family. --Ram da On 13 Feb 2006 03:58:55 -, priyankoo sarma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>Nobody really cares if an army jawan was killed or how many are killed. It doesn't matter if he was NOT the one involved in the killing of Mahanta. All that matters is that he is in the Indian army. It was his own damn fault for joining the Indian army and getting imbroiled in the mess. Exactly! Ramda! The Indian Army also does not care about who they killed or not. It does not matter to them if the people in the demonstration were involved in any killing or not. All that matters is that the people are Assamese...gotike mar kukur mekurir dore guliyay...be in Kokrajhar train station or Kamakhya...It is their own damn fault that they are born Assamese... And it does not matter whether the regiment is Gorkha, or Assam or Jath, or whatever fancy names they have. The point is that the triggers are not drawn by the brain behind the gun, they simply follow orders. Otherwise Assam Police had not been the first to open fire, which intiated the Kakopothar mayhem and then Army jawans chased 15-16 year old teenagers on paddy field and killed them point blank! Please read: http://pratidinassam.com/feb1206/ap03.html Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari... The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
[Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
>>Nobody really cares if an army jawan was killed or how many are killed. It doesn't matter if he was NOT the one involved in the killing of Mahanta. All that matters is that he is in the Indian army. It was his own damn fault for joining the Indian army and getting imbroiled in the mess. Exactly! Ramda! The Indian Army also does not care about who they killed or not. It does not matter to them if the people in the demonstration were involved in any killing or not. All that matters is that the people are Assamese...gotike mar kukur mekurir dore guliyay...be in Kokrajhar train station or Kamakhya...It is their own damn fault that they are born Assamese... And it does not matter whether the regiment is Gorkha, or Assam or Jath, or whatever fancy names they have. The point is that the triggers are not drawn by the brain behind the gun, they simply follow orders. Otherwise Assam Police had not been the first to open fire, which intiated the Kakopothar mayhem and then Army jawans chased 15-16 year old teenagers on paddy field and killed them point blank! Please read: http://pratidinassam.com/feb1206/ap03.html Dex matho eta dharona, thikonar xex xari... The most important thing in life is never to forget who you are... http://plaza.ufl.edu/priyanku ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
Umesh, >However, it seems from the newsmedia that in the rallies that followed Mahanta's death -- >innocents were puished towards the army bullets while ULFA cadre killed and injured the CRPF >soldiers etc in the melee . Nobody really cares if an army jawan was killed or how many are killed. It doesn't matter if he was NOT the one involved in the killing of Mahanta. All that matters is that he is in the Indian army. It was his own damn fault for joining the Indian army and getting imbroiled in the mess. -:) -:) --Ram da On 2/12/06, umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I would say that it was good that so many people raised the issue of Ajit Mahanta's unfortunate death -even if he had been guilty he should have been subjected to a proper trial. It is under pressure only that so many Army officials are not able to sleep at night and doing something to pacify. This is the role of the civil society - without which democracies can turn inot dictatorships --thru army generals --see Pakistan currently and earlier or Chile under Pinochet or many others. Hopefully, civil society will keep up the pressure. However, it seems from the newsmedia that in the rallies that followed Mahanta's death -- innocents were puished towards the army bullets while ULFA cadre killed and injured the CRPF soldiers etc in the melee. Umeshmc mahant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: It is just a gesture, a gesture nevertheless in the right direction. Ram saw compassion in Indian Army,s handing over a cheque. Should we see it that way--or as ""Bungling,Bunling we shall proceed to become a super power"" mm ___assam mailing list assam@assamnet.orghttp://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org Umesh Sharma5121 Lackawanna STCollege Park, MD 207401-202-215-4328 [Cell Phone]Ed.M. - International Education PolicyHarvard Graduate School of Education,Harvard University, Class of 2005 To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. ___assam mailing listassam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org ___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
Re: [Assam] Compassionate?! army and democracy
I would say that it was good that so many people raised the issue of Ajit Mahanta's unfortunate death -even if he had been guilty he should have been subjected to a proper trial. It is under pressure only that so many Army officials are not able to sleep at night and doing something to pacify. This is the role of the civil society - without which democracies can turn inot dictatorships --thru army generals --see Pakistan currently and earlier or Chile under Pinochet or many others. Hopefully, civil society will keep up the pressure. However, it seems from the newsmedia that in the rallies that followed Mahanta's death -- innocents were puished towards the army bullets while ULFA cadre killed and injured the CRPF soldiers etc in the melee. Umeshmc mahant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:It is just a gesture, a gesture nevertheless in the right direction. Ram saw compassion in Indian Army,s handing over a cheque. Should we see it that way--or as ""Bungling,Bunling we shall proceed to become a super power"" mm ___assam mailing listassam@assamnet.orghttp://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.orgUmesh Sharma5121 Lackawanna STCollege Park, MD 20740 1-202-215-4328 [Cell Phone]Ed.M. - International Education PolicyHarvard Graduate School of Education,Harvard University,Class of 2005 To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre.___ assam mailing list assam@assamnet.org http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
