Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @Blind angel 444That doesn't sound like the fault of JAWS at all, and I very much doubt that NVDA would have done any better in that situation.Blame the software publishers and their lack of caring about accessibility. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/484041/#p484041 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
2019-12-08
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : Blind angel 444 via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Thank you for the recommendation, I will keep it in mind. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/484031/#p484031 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hi.@Blind angel, vipre and the anti virus program that comes with windows 10 works fine with NVDA. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/484005/#p484005 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
2019-12-08
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : Blind angel 444 via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @46 jaws didn’t do anything, it froze and it didn’t give any warnings about the danger ahead. My anti virus software didn’t work with jaws. When jaws was half way working it would have alerted me about the virus but it didn’t work. I didn’t perches jaws or the computer, so I didn’t have a say in any of it. My mom would have to always help run the scans. I cannot afford jaws so that’s why I am going with N V D A from now on. My anti virus was, “web root” if you or someone else please tell me what anti virus is accessible for the blind and compadabil with a screen reader. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483997/#p483997 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I wasn't aware that page announcements slowed things down. Good to know! URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483989/#p483989 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hello,If you're using microsoft word, go to advanced settings and check Use UI Automation to access Microsoft Word document controls when available checkbox. It speeds up navigation a lot. Also turn off page announcements. You can see the current page you're on from the status bar anyway. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483988/#p483988 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS To be fair, JAWS has trouble in larger documents too, just when using tools like text analyzer and skim read with custom rules, so bad it often crashes, which is a big shame considering how powerful those features can be.But yes, navigation wise it does seem to do better with lag. I really hope this gets better with NVDA 20.1 though... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483961/#p483961 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hi.One gripe i have with NvDA is that when reading and navigating longer and bigger documents NVDA seams to get stuck and key presses take about half to one full second to be processed and passed to the speach synthesizer.I haven't had that with jaws, even in big documents navigation was always smooth.I tried this on multiple machines to make sure that my CPU or ram was working max, but nothing there, everything in normal parameters.Am I missing a setting in NVDA to improve that or is that a general habit of NVDA in it's current form?Greetigns Moritz. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483920/#p483920 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS i agree with mostly of defender's arguements.thou i m a Jaws user since 2000. Though i use Nvda over Jaws these days. The most important things i don't like on Nvda are, You need to install addons for each functioning setup while Jaws doesn't give You all these headakes, all simillar functions comes built in with Jaws, install it and You're good to go. If Nvda can get over this barier Freedomscientific will use many custommers.How ever i believe we still need to keep as mutch differant screenreaders as we can since they have advantages or disadvantages over one by the other. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483914/#p483914 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @Blind angel 444Excuse me? It didn't warn you that you were going to get a virus?I assume that you meant it didn't read the notifications from your anti virus program, and that you don't actually expect it to stop viruses on it's own...There is allot of difference between JAWS 13 and JAWS 2020, or even 18, so maybe you should try the newer version?If your happy with NVDA though, than why bother right? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483379/#p483379 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @Blind angel 444Excuse me? It didn't warn you that you were going to get a virus?I assume that you meant it didn't read the notifications from your anti virus program, and that you don't actually expect it to stop viruses on it's own... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483379/#p483379 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hi.I was just uninstalling jaws and wow! There's so much to uninstall!They can't make it easy can they? You must uninstall this, then that, then that, then this thing. So much work when an uninstaller that uninstalls all fredom scientific stuff at once would be so much better. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483373/#p483373 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
2019-12-06
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : Blind angel 444 via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I have used jaws for a few years and I will never get it again. Jaws failed me and when I needed it the most. Stupid jaws didn’t worn me that I was going to get a virus, I wonder if N V D A would have done that to me. Jaws13.0 is a major let down and left me with a blue screen on my laptop. Jaws would freeze and crash all the time. Will N V D A do that? Free over paid any day!!! URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483364/#p483364 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @Cool_turkOh, that's not good it's only available in the U.S. This is why NVDA is a game changer for so many people and I'd never say it isn't.@DefenderI've chabged a few of these settings, not all. Thing is, and I have no evidene for this other than "it just feels like it, ok?", but NVDA doesn't seem to handle changing web settings as consistently as well as JAWS. I've mucked about with online verbosity to make it read more like JAWS and, well, it just doesn't seem to always stick all of the time, especially on big web sites. Maybe that's just me? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483238/#p483238 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @Cool TurkActually, the annual price is identical to the SMA pricing for the same time period. I believe SMA renewal is every three years, and it costs 270USD.And yes, it's only available in the U.S. which sucks.@BradNVDA announces visited links as well... But JAWS does seem to remember them for allot longer than NVDA, as I think it has it's own cash separate from the browser, where as NVDA forgets which links you've visited every time your browser's cookies are deleted.Or at least I think that's what's going on... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483209/#p483209 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hi.One thin I do like about JAWS now that I've tried it out again is that JAWS says if the link is visited first. When you're on youtube this is quite useful. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483203/#p483203 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hi.Yeah, eloquence is still the default voice with JAWS. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483201/#p483201 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I think that $90 a year thing is only for US customers, but I could be wrong, I would have to check.If only they did that a few years back, it's certainly more afordable than the price they use to charge for a SMA renewal.That's one of the reasons I made the switch to NVDA, plus I found myself using Jaws less often.Is Eloquence still the default voice when you install the program?I know there are other voices that came with the product, but I've never really gotten use to the human sounding voices.I put up with them on the iPhone until Fred became available and never looked back.One thing I wish screen readers would do is not have a separate keyboard layout for desktop and laptop.System Access doesn't do it, and neither does Narrator.It just means more shortcuts to learn.Stick to one set of keystrokes and use them across the board.I can use jaws in a pinch if I had to, I doubt it changed that much in 6 or 7 years.Any new feature can easily be learned. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483184/#p483184 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Great post Audacity!It's just too bad that you have to pay yearly even if their are no useful updates, which is sadly allot more common now than it used to be, though 2020 wasn't so bad at least...And if you can't pay right on time for what ever reason, you'll be stuck with demo mode until you can, which could be a real issue in some situations.I forgot to mention the cursor thing. I actually like both styles of cursor in different situations, but as of newer JAWS versions, they have a new type of optional cursor which was essentially cloned from NVDA, though I can't remember it's name at the moment, so now it can use both styles anyway.I assume the answer is yes, but are you aware that you can toggle between screen layout and line by line display mode on webpages, hide tables used only for layout, turn off say all on page load, and enable automatically enable browse mode on page load in the browse mode settings?You can also suppress various elements such as clickables, lists, landmarks, or frames and turn off announcements of row and column numbers in tables in document formatting That may help you be on more of a parody with JAWS. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483145/#p483145 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I talked to VFO/freedom scientific sales yesterday and they now offer a Jaws license for the most current version for 90 dollars a year. That's about what microsoft office costs, I believe. Is it too late in the game for their motives to be anything other than making a profit however they can? Probably. Will I spend the money even though I really can't afford to and even though NVDA works about as well for most things and better for a few? Probably, unless I can get it payd for first. Here's why.1. Maybe this is personal preference, but the jaws and especially invisible cursor seems much more powerful than NVDA's object review and most power users, even those I've talked to who've ditched Jaws, tend to agree. If I'm opening a random app I've never seen before, I'd much rather have the flexibility of being able to route jaws cursor to PC, route PC to jaws, use my invisible cursor if none of those are working, etc. Maybe I don't understand NVDA's object review as well as I should, although it's been my primary screen reader for years, but in a pinch when I have a screen that normal navigation can't handle Jaws often works better.2. Jaws has more reliable Braille display support, and I'm fortunate enough to have access to a Braille display. NVDA frequently can't handle my Braille display and I have to do the disconnect/restart/maybe disable and reenable add-ons dance. It's worth it for me to have a stable program that won't make me do this every day, and perhaps more crucially has support that can help me fix bugs that do crop up. I've talked to NVDA contributors about my Braille Display issues and basically gotten a "We're sorry, best of luck because we can't replicate the issue," response. That's understandable given NVDA's open source model, but it's still annoying.3. Most importantly, it makes lots of professional work legitimately faster. I worked at a call center for a while with NVDA and the way it reads complicated tables is ever so slightly slower than JAWS, the way it lays out web pages is just a tad more cumbersome, not so much that I noticed in personal use... but when I switched over to JAWS, just on a whim, I was all of a sudden making 1-2 more calls per hour consistently. Verbosity settings for web browsing are just slightly more customizable, the way JAWS reads web content seems just a tad more efficient in a way I can't quite articulate...but I can tell you, as someone who's mostly used NVDA for years and knows both screen readers fairly well, people pretty much universally noticed I did my job faster with JAWS. Is that always going to be true in every situation? Of course not. Is it enough for me to make damn sure I have Jaws around for times when that extra boost might be critical? Most likely yes.In short, they both have their place and neither one's going anywhere. NVDA is robust, competitive, and able to do pretty much anything JAWS can do, sometimes better. I do, however, think it's very telling that pretty much all the schools, government agencies and companies I know of, at least in the states, still subsidize JAWS. At this point it's not just a matter of the good old boys club making sure all the right backs get scratched; people like saving money, and by now if NVDA really was capable of replacing JAWS JAWS would be gone. The two programs have been basically at parody for over five years, a lifetime in the software development world. If NVDA really made JAWS unnecessary don't you think VR and all the rest would've just stopped paying all those extra thousands of dollars to give their tight budgets some wiggle room? Companies especially are all about cutting costs as much as they can get away with and they're still mostly paying for JAWS. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483127/#p483127 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I talked to VFO/freedom scientific sales yesterday and they now offer a Jaws license for the most current version for 90 dollars a year. That's about what microsoft office costs, I believe. Is it too late? Probably. Will I spend the money even though I really can't afford to and even though NVDA works about as well for most things and better for a few? Probably. Here's why.1. Maybe this is personal preference, but the jaws and especially invisible cursor seems much more powerful than NVDA's object review and most power users, even those I've talked to who've ditched Jaws, tend to agree. If I'm opening a random app I've never seen before, I'd much rather have the flexibility of being able to route jaws cursor to PC, route PC to jaws, use my invisible cursor if none of those are working, etc. Maybe I don't understand NVDA's object review as well as I should, although it's been my primary screen reader for years, but in a pinch when I have a screen that normal navigation can't handle Jaws often works better.2. Jaws has more reliable Braille display support, and I'm fortunate enough to have access to a Braille display. NVDA frequently can't handle my Braille display and I have to do the disconnect/restart/maybe disable and reenable add-ons dance. It's worth it for me to have a stable program that won't make me do this every day.3. Most importantly, it makes lots of professional work legitimately faster. I worked at a call center for a while with NVDA and the way it reads complicated tables is ever so slightly slower than JAWS, the way it lays out web pages is just a tad more cumbersome, not so much that I noticed in personal use... but when I switched over to JAWS, just on a whim, I was all of a sudden making 1-2 more calls per hour consistently. Verbosity settings for web browsing are just slightly more customizable, the way JAWS reads web content seems just a tad more efficient in a way I can't quite articulate...but I can tell you, as someone who's mostly used NVDA for years and knows both screen readers fairly well, people pretty much universally noticed I did my job faster with JAWS. Is that always going to be true in every situation? Of course not. Is it enough for me to make damn sure I have Jaws around for situations when that extra boost might be critical? Most likely yes.In short, they both have their place and neither one's going anywhere. NVDA is robust, competitive, and able to do pretty much anything JAWS can do, sometimes better. I do, however, think it's very telling that pretty much all the schools, government agencies and companies I know of, at least in the states, still subsidize JAWS. At this point it's not just a matter of the good old boys club making sure all the right backs get scratched; people like saving money, and by now if NVDA really was capable of replacing JAWS JAWS would be gone. The two programs have been basically at parody for over five years, a lifetime in the software development world. If NVDA really made JAWS unnecessary don't you think VR and all the rest would've just stopped paying all those extra thousands of dollars to give their tight budgets some wiggle room? Companies especially are all about cutting costs as much as they can get away with and they're still mostly paying for JAWS. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483127/#p483127 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I talked to VFO/freedom scientific sales yesterday and they now offer a Jaws license for the most current version for 90 dollars a year. That's about what microsoft office costs, I believe. Is it too late? Probably. Will I spend the money even though I really can't afford to and even though NVDA works about as well for most things and better for a few? Probably. Here's why.1. Maybe this is personal preference, but the jaws and especially invisible cursor seems much more powerful than NVDA's object review and most power users, even those I've talked to who've ditched Jaws, tend to agree. If I'm opening a random app I've never seen before, I'd much rather have the flexibility of being able to route jaws cursor to PC, route PC to jaws, use my invisible cursor if none of those are working, etc. Maybe I don't understand NVDA's object review as well as I should, although it's been my primary screen reader for years, but in a pinch when I have a screen that normal navigation can't handle Jaws often works better.2. Jaws has more reliable Braille display support, and I'm fortunate enough to have access to a Braille display. NVDA frequently can't handle my Braille display and I have to do the disconnect/restart/maybe disable and reenable add-ons dance. It's worth it for me to have a stable program that won't make me do this every day.3. Most importantly, it makes lots of professional work legitimately faster. I worked at a call center for a while with NVDA and the way it reads complicated tables is ever so slightly slower than JAWS, the way it lays out web pages is just a tad more cumbersome, not so much that I noticed in casual use... but when I switched over to JAWS, just on a whim, I was all of a sudden making 1-2 more calls per hour consistently. Verbosity settings for web browsing are just slightly more customizable, the way JAWS reads web content seems just a tad more efficient in a way I can't quite articulate...but I can tell you, as someone who's mostly used NVDA for years and knows both screen readers fairly well, people pretty much universally noticed I did my job faster with JAWS. Is that always going to be true in every situation? Of course not. Is it enough for me to make damn sure I have Jaws around for situations when that extra boost might be critical? Most likely yes.In short, they both have their place and neither one's going anywhere. NVDA is robust, competitive, and able to do pretty much anything JAWS can do, sometimes better. I do, however, think it's very telling that pretty much all the schhols, government agencies and companies I know of, at least in the states, still subsidize JAWS. At this point it's not just a matter of the good old boys club making sure all the right backs get scratched; people like saving money, and by now if NVDA really was capable of replacing JAWS VFO would be gone. The two programs have been basically at parody for over five years, a lifetime in the software development world. If NVDA really made JAWS unnecessary don't you think VR and all the rest would've just stopped paying all those extra thousands of dollars to give their tight budgets some wiggle room? Companies especially are all about cutting costs as much as they can get away with and they're still paying for JAWS. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/483127/#p483127 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @EthinThat proprietary technology is plane better, at least with documents and Windows, maybe not streaming from Xbox.As long as you have your resolution set correctly, it blows Win 10 OCR out of the water, and I've done tests to prove this on the same laptop with the same documents and Windows as test material.If your experience conflicts with mine, than by all means use what works better for you, but I am pretty confident in my judgement. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482457/#p482457 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Heh, I feel you Exodus, but if you have Win 10 than JAWS would use Microsoft drivers by default now anyway, so no messing with video intercept, though it is still a fallback option.As for how it's better? It just grabs more text and tends to do a slightly better job with formatting it and not making quite as many mistakes.It's not so much better as to make Win 10 OCR useless in comparison, but it is nice. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482461/#p482461 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Citation needed: Seriously.How is this OCR better? What can it do that windows can't?I'd totally test this stuff out, but I do not want to inflict jaws on my GPU drivers as it'll probably break everything and I really don't want to have to piss about getting everything reinstalled.Windows in 16 color mode is really not cool. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482459/#p482459 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Citation needed: Seriously.How is this OCR better? What can it do that windows can't?I'd totally test this stuff out, but I do not want to inflict jaws on my GPU drivers as they'll probably break everything and I really don't want to have to piss about getting everything reinstalled.Windows in 16 color mode is really not cool. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482459/#p482459 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @EthinThat proprietary technology is plane better, at least with documents and Windows, maybe not streaming from Xbox.As long as you have your resolution set correctly, it blows Win 10 OCR out of the water, and I've done tests to prove this on the same laptop with the same documents and Windows as test material.If your experience conflicts with mine, than by all means use what works better for you, but I am confident in my judgement. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482457/#p482457 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Yep, Jaws has omni page by I believe Nuance, though could be wrong on this. I have no idea how many languages it supports, but Windows 10 OCR is way more international, so good OCR is not a fact. Yes, you require Windows 10, which not everybody uses, but it's the future and eventually everybody will indeed use it. With each update of Jaws, it's just the feeling of this screen reader is forced to develop because of already mentioned agencies, but the code base is so old that they can't do major updates to it, and each time they have to use hacky workarounds to fix bugs. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482456/#p482456 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @28, I must disagree on JAWS's supposedly great OCR features. JAWS and NVDA are pretty much equal on that front, though I don't know if JAWS has windows 10 OCR. (Sde note: if you go check out https://support.freedomscientific.com/d … WSWhatsNew, you'll notice that most of the "new features" that JAWS 2020 has accumulated are ones that either NVDA never had in the first place because they were entirely unnecessary (i.e. the off-screen model), or things that NVDA has had for years). If that document is accurate, then JAWS currently (and still) does not use the Window 10 OCR feature and still instead relies on a proprietary technology. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482449/#p482449 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS And...what I'm trying to tell you is that some people would be willing to work through that. I was for awhile. I would interrupt MSN convos, play sessions on MUDs and such in order to restart my machine. It was a known thing. My friends poked at me for it sometimes, but they knew what was happening and it didn't really bug them too much. You get used to it, like anything.However, as I said, there are lots of cases where it's not okay. If you're working, for instance, you shouldn't have to restart your computer every forty minutes. Also, if your computer has a deep-freeze-like setup, where it will reset everything when it restarts? That is an enormous headache. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482443/#p482443 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @ Jade, I get what your saying, but that the 40 minute is never-ending, you have to restart your machine after 40 minutes. Not worth it. I mean, there are times where you are working or playing online, where you cannot afford to restart. There are more, fixing a virus, scanning your pc for viruses... etc. Its just not worth it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482433/#p482433 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS YOU HAVE To UNDERSTAND THAT I'M NOT SAYING JAWS IS BAD BUT IN A LOT OF CASES, MAINLY OUTSIDE OF THE WORK PLACE, NVDA DOES JUST AS GOOD URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482427/#p482427 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkTotally agree with all you said, and I'd never call NVDA a pushbike, but I still can't just ignore those features, and not all of them are that niche either, such as the context sensitive help, OCR, office support, and virtual ribbons.@ignatriayThat version is for software and web developers, it's meant for testing their work to make sure it is compliant, and that's why they charge, because it's usually big companies using it.What I really don't like is that they even require that smaller businesses pay for that one to do any testing with it, though how the hell they would prove you didn't is beyond me... At least people can test with NVDA or narrator for free though. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482414/#p482414 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Forty minutes to test out a product, when you can trigger it indefinitely? That's actually pretty generous. As far as I'm aware, demo mode never ends. i.e., you can use it in forty-minute bursts basically forever. Not ideal though.What is not generous, however, is the overall pricing model. I think most of us are in agreement that it needs to change. Badly. Like yesterday. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482410/#p482410 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS i know that freedom scientific offers instead of a 40 minute demo of jaws, they offer a 90 day trial. Except that, you have to pay. Just what? I mean, that's steeling money from people. 40 minutes to test out a product is not enough. I mean, the nerve... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482402/#p482402 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS i kow that freedom scientific offers instead of a 40 minute demo of jaws, they offer a 90 day trial. Except that, you have to pay. Just what? I mean, that's steeling money from people. 40 minutes to test out a product is not enough. I mean, the nerve... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482402/#p482402 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS My problem with the Ferrari analogy, is that we're not here talking about a ferrari vs a pushbike, that is something ridiculously expensive with half a tonne of good features vs a no good free alternative. The fact that we're even having this conversation at all, indicates that Jaws's strengths, which as I said I don't doubt that it has, are not absolutely, and instantaneously apparent to most end users to the extent that Jaws' pricing structure would dictate, and if we're at the point when the difference between something free and something which costs a thousand dollars are so indefinite, something is seriously wrong.Note here, I'm not arguing "all screen readers should be free", just that Jaws' pricing structure is not realistic for the things it does given the alternatives.I will say I wasn't aware that the Jaws demo was permanently available, I thought it died entirely after fifteen days, though I confess the pricing still puts me off bothering to try the thing. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482312/#p482312 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Counter argument to the sportscar Yes. While a Ferari 812 superfast maybe a killer in power, its dead in practicality. Also the Tesla model 3 P80D has more usability and has simular performance for quarter the price. Hope you understand my analagy. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482271/#p482271 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkIt gives you allot of warnings actually (too many IMO) and it lasts for ever not 15 days. If what you said was the case I would totally agree with you though.As for depending on others to keep your software license up to date, I agree. That's partially why NVDA is my primary, but since nearly all jobs where I'd need JAWS would pay for it, the problem pretty much solves it's self. I understand this isn't an option in much of the world, which then of course means that NVDA is the best option, but that's also because it's the only true option, aside from narrator I guess.So saying JAWS is worse because you can't afford it is like saying Ferrari's are all useless piles of crap, without ever having truly been able to drive one. It's self defeating.@BradYou may be right about me making the tone worse, I was frustrated and didn't have to come off that way. The name calling may not have started yet but the ignorance and bias is well under way already, and this kind of bad info hurts everyone who is actually asking the question legitimately and with an open mind. That's what I'm mostly upset about, but I should have handled it better.As for you preferring NVDA; hey, that's great, if it works for you better I'm glad. I also use it as my primary and really like it.But JAWS (Job Access for Speech) is nearly always better in the workplace. Mostly because it keeps up with updates for business apps and supports more of them, like Turbotax and Quickbooks as well as some database management software.I think that people complaining about only being able to use JAWS at work either A. Don't know the more helpful advanced features and have only gotten more basic training B. Are only provided with an older and slower version of it or C. They believe that NVDA would work better with a specific program.So I agree that they should have the choice to use NVDA if they want and it does what they need, but I really don't agree that NVDA is better for the workplace overall.Also, powerpoint support on NVDA really isn't that great from what I know and JAWS just has allot more useful features in the context sensitive help, more obscure dialogues and lists read properly, virtual ribbons, announcement of more formatting info, the skim reading and text analyzer tools which help complement Word, and just over all generally less lag (though hopefully UIA will help NVDA catch up a bit)Speaking of catching up, if you read the NVDA changelogs, you will notice that they are still adding basic office support for things that JAWS was doing years ago as of 2019, so they still have catching up to do even if they are closing the gap.@rwbeardjrNVDA addons are not basically the same thing as JAWS scripts. Generally those writing scripts are more professional and include far more help documentation, and some scripts, like those for Skype and Zoom for instance, are almost like an entire reskin of the program, where as most NVDA addons just do the bare minimum.Also, though their are more addons over all, you will see that many of them don't work properly any more or do things in an insecure way which would make businesses not want to allow them on their network.Don't get me wrong, I love addons like golden cursor, clipspeak, JGT, Automatic Speech Output for IF interpreters, and the Winamp, and VLC addons, but there are many more broken, buggy, and limited ones than good ones.And the reason you have to pay at all to access your desktop? Well that's because other people are paying for you, and even that wasn't enough to keep NVDA going, so now they are selling training books and looking into support contracts for businesses and schools, as well as providing consultation for Microsoft on narrator.Well lets see here.1. Paying programmers is expensive (those guys can easily make 80K per year)2. Paying for office space, equipment, and utilities and support staff is also expensive.3. Licenses for various JAWS components need to be paid for, usually for every copy soled, such as the OCR engine and voices.4. Having a good customer support line and people to answer it costs money.5. Training materials and podcasts cost money to create.6. Advertisement space and hotel/food/wrentle cars in order to attend important conventions and exhibitions like the NFB and CSUN.Never forget that JAWS pioneered many of the concepts and features that we now take for granted in all modern screen readers (including NVDA) before we had a high quality free choice, it was either paying for JAWS, System Access, or Window Eyes. So really, it's very lucky that we have any good free choices, and we should all be glad for those who paved the way, even if they aren't deserving of allot of respect nowadays.As for assuming you aren't an advanced user... I was right wasn't I? I never said you couldn't use it at all.And I based that on what you did and did not say in your first post and nothing else.So take your talkback VS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS This point about Ferrari and all that is an excellent one.If someone came to me and asked me which screenreader they should use, I would probably point them at NVDA, particularly if they were going to have to pay for it and had no support out of the gate. This is because VFO's pricing model is pretty ugly, and while they do have to make back their costs, I think most of us agree that the way they're doing it has a lot of vulnerable people over a lot of barrels. Not cool.Now, if someone came to me and asked me which screenreader was -better? That's a different question, and requires a lot of different data to be evaluated. Price does not determine quality, it merely determines your accessibility to that product. If you can't afford the rental or purchase cost of an expensive sports car, then you're not going to be able to use it, but then you also aren't going to be able to evaluate its performance. However, numbers and data about its actual performance will be available, whether or not you can access them.In other words, when determining which is a better screenreader, we should take price out of it. I'd say this even if it were Jaws that were free and NVDA cost money, BTW.For the sake of context, I want to point out that in over two years of using current Jaws and Windows 10, I have had it crash three times, total. That's it. Three times. Unfortunately, I use NVDA less often, and it's crashed over a dozen times during that period. This doesn't make NVDA bad, but it does raise questions about its stability.Also, unless they changed things, forty-minute mode can be triggered over and over again, and you get like four warnings that it's going to conk out on you, so you've got plenty of time to fix up what you're doing and restart. Fun fact: back in 2009-2010 or so, I actually had a version of Jaws in demo mode for over a year. I just got really used to restarting my PC every forty minutes. Annoying? Hell yes. Doable? Also yes. Not ideal in many environments, mind you.NVDA has made incredible strides to catch up to Jaws, or to at least get close, which is saying something because Jaws had an enormous head start. It may not be long before Jaws is just straight-up overtaken by NVDA at this rate. At the present time, however, Jaws is a bit more robust than NVDA is, and does not have the same security issues NVDA has.My answer for which screenreader is better comes down to your criteria really. As far as power under the hood, overall performance across all programs, support, I'd give the nod to Jaws, but not by a ton. As far as customization options, portability and the like, and availability due to price, NVDA definitely gets my vote. I use both, and where possible I think other users who are able would do well to consider this. Obviously if you can't, then you can't, and that's fine. I'm not just a mindless Jaws fanboy over here. But if you have both, I'd not let one or the other stagnate, as both programs have many good things to offer a user who knows how to access them. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482249/#p482249 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkIt gives you allot of warnings actually (too many IMO) and it lasts for ever not 15 days. If what you said was the case I would totally agree with you though.As for depending on others to keep your software license up to date, I agree. That's partially why NVDA is my primary, but since nearly all jobs where I'd need JAWS would pay for it, the problem pretty much solves it's self. I understand this isn't an option in much of the world, which then of course means that NVDA is the best option, but that's also because it's the only true option, aside from narrator I guess.So saying JAWS is worse because you can't afford it is like saying Ferrari's are all useless piles of crap, without ever having truly been able to drive one. It's self defeating.@BradYou may be right about me making the tone worse, I was frustrated and didn't have to come off that way. The name calling may not have started yet but the ignorance and bias is well under way already, and this kind of bad info hurts everyone who is actually asking the question legitimately and with an open mind. That's what I'm mostly upset about, but I should have handled it better.As for you preferring NVDA; hey, that's great, if it works for you better I'm glad. I also use it as my primary and really like it.But JAWS (Job Access for Speech) is nearly always better in the workplace. Mostly because it keeps up with updates for business apps and supports more of them, like Turbotax and Quickbooks as well as some database management software.I think that people complaining about only being able to use JAWS at work either A. Don't know the more helpful advanced features and have only gotten more basic training B. Are only provided with an older and slower version of it or C. They believe that NVDA would work better with a specific program.So I agree that they should have the choice to use NVDA if they want and it does what they need, but I really don't agree that NVDA is better for the workplace overall.Also, powerpoint support on NVDA really isn't that great from what I know and JAWS just has allot more useful features in the context sensitive help, more obscure dialogues and lists read properly, virtual ribbons, announcement of more formatting info, the skim reading and text analyzer tools which help complement Word, and just over all generally less lag (though hopefully UIA will help NVDA catch up a bit)Speaking of catching up, if you read the NVDA changelogs, you will notice that they are still adding basic office support for things that JAWS was doing years ago as of 2019, so they still have catching up to do even if they are closing the gap.@rwbeardjrNVDA addons are not basically the same thing as JAWS scripts. Generally those writing scripts are more professional and include far more help documentation, and some scripts, like those for Skype and Zoom for instance, are almost like an entire reskin of the program, where as most NVDA addons just do the bare minimum.Also, though their are more addons over all, you will see that many of them don't work properly any more or do things in an insecure way which would make businesses not want to allow them on their network.Don't get me wrong, I love addons like golden cursor, clipspeak, JGT, Automatic Speech Output for IF interpreters, and the Winamp, and VLC addons, but there are many more broken, buggy, and limited ones than good ones.And the reason you have to pay at all to access your desktop? Well that's because other people are paying for you, and even that wasn't enough to keep NVDA going, so now they are selling training books and looking into support contracts for businesses and schools, as well as providing consultation for Microsoft on narrator.Well lets see here.1. Paying programmers is expensive (those guys can easily make 80K per year)2. Paying for office space, equipment, and utilities and support staff is also expensive.3. Licenses for various JAWS components need to be paid for, usually for every copy soled, such as the OCR engine and voices.4. Having a good customer support line and people to answer it costs money.5. Training materials and podcasts cost money to create.6. Advertisement space and hotel/food/wrentle cars in order to attend important conventions and exhibitions like the NFB and CSUN.Never forget that JAWS pioneered many of the concepts and features that we now take for granted in all modern screen readers (including NVDA) before we had a high quality free choice, it was either paying for JAWS, System Access, or Window Eyes. So really, it's very lucky that we have any good free choices, and we should all be glad for those who paved the way, even if they aren't deserving of allot of respect nowadays.As for assuming you aren't an advanced user... I was right wasn't I? I never said you couldn't use it at all.And I based that on what you did and did not say in your first post and nothing else.So take your talkback VS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkIt gives you allot of warnings actually (too many IMO) and it lasts for ever not 15 days. If what you said was the case I would totally agree with you though.As for depending on others to keep your software license up to date, I agree. That's partially why NVDA is my primary, but since nearly all jobs where I'd need JAWS would pay for it, the problem pretty much solves it's self. I understand this isn't an option in much of the world, which then of course means that NVDA is the best option, but that's also because it's the only true option, aside from narrator I guess.So saying JAWS is worse because you can't afford it is like saying Ferrari's are all useless piles of crap, without ever having truly been able to drive one. It's self defeating.@BradYou may be right about me making the tone worse, I was frustrated and didn't have to come off that way. The name calling may not have started yet but the ignorance and bias is well under way already, and this kind of bad info hurts everyone who is actually asking the question legitimately and with an open mind. That's what I'm mostly upset about, but I should have handled it better.As for you preferring NVDA; hey, that's great, if it works for you better I'm glad. I also use it as my primary and really like it.But JAWS (Job Access for Speech) is nearly always better in the workplace. Mostly because it keeps up with updates for business apps and supports more of them, like Turbotax and Quickbooks as well as some database management software.I think that people complaining about only being able to use JAWS at work either A. Don't know the more helpful advanced features and have only gotten more basic training B. Are only provided with an older and slower version of it or C. They believe that NVDA would work better with a specific program.So I agree that they should have the choice to use NVDA if they want and it does what they need, but I really don't agree that NVDA is better for the workplace overall.Also, powerpoint support on NVDA really isn't that great from what I know and JAWS just has allot more useful features in the context sensitive help, more obscure dialogues and lists read properly, virtual ribbons, announcement of more formatting info, the skim reading and text analyzer tools which help complement Word, and just over all generally less lag (though hopefully UIA will help NVDA catch up a bit)Speaking of catching up, if you read the NVDA changelogs, you will notice that they are still adding basic office support for things that JAWS was doing years ago as of 2019, so they still have catching up to do even if they are closing the gap.@rwbeardjrNVDA addons are not basically the same thing as JAWS scripts. Generally those writing scripts are more professional and include far more help documentation, and some scripts, like those for Skype and Zoom for instance, are almost like an entire reskin of the program, where as most NVDA addons just do the bare minimum.Also, though their are more addons over all, you will see that many of them don't work properly any more or do things in an insecure way which would make businesses not want to allow them on their network.Don't get me wrong, I love addons like golden cursor, clipspeak, JGT, Automatic Speech Output for IF interpreters, and the Winamp, and VLC addons, but there are many more broken, buggy, and limited ones than good ones.And the reason you have to pay at all to access your desktop?Well lets see here.1. Paying programmers is expensive (those guys can easily make 80K per year)2. Paying for office space, equipment, and utilities and support staff is also expensive.3. Licenses for various JAWS components need to be paid for, usually for every copy soled, such as the OCR engine and voices.4. Having a good customer support line and people to answer it costs money.5. Training materials and podcasts cost money to create.6. Advertisement space and hotel/food/wrentle cars in order to attend important conventions and exhibitions like the NFB and CSUN.Never forget that JAWS pioneered many of the concepts and features that we now take for granted in all modern screen readers (including NVDA) before we had a high quality free choice, it was either paying for JAWS, System Access, or Window Eyes. So really, it's very lucky that we have any good free choices, and we should all be glad for those who paved the way, even if they aren't deserving of allot of respect nowadays.As for assuming you aren't an advanced user... I was right wasn't I? I never said you couldn't use it at all.And I based that on what you did and did not say in your first post and nothing else.So take your talkback VS Voiceover analogy, and instead make it so that the reason I claimed Talkback was better than Voiceover is because it could custom label controls (voiceover can too) and because Voiceover has worse braille support (not true).Obviously, I would say you haven't used Voiceover
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkIt gives you allot of warnings actually (too many IMO) and it lasts for ever not 15 days. If what you said was the case I would totally agree with you though.As for depending on others to keep your software license up to date, I agree. That's partially why NVDA is my primary, but since nearly all jobs where I'd need JAWS would pay for it, the problem pretty much solves it's self. I understand this isn't an option in much of the world, which then of course means that NVDA is the best option, but that's also because it's the only true option, aside from narrator I guess.So saying JAWS is worse because you can't afford it is like saying Ferrari's are all useless piles of crap, without ever having truly been able to drive one. It's self defeating.@BradYou may be right about me making the tone worse, I was frustrated and didn't have to come off that way. The name calling may not have started yet but the ignorance and bias is well under way already, and this kind of bad info hurts everyone who is actually asking the question legitimately and with an open mind. That's what I'm mostly upset about, but I should have handled it better.As for you preferring NVDA; hey, that's great, if it works for you better I'm glad. I also use it as my primary and really like it.But JAWS (Job Access for Speech) is nearly always better in the workplace. Mostly because it keeps up with updates for business apps and supports more of them, like Turbotax and Quickbooks as well as some database management software.I think that people complaining about only being able to use JAWS at work either A. Don't know the more helpful advanced features and have only gotten more basic training B. Are only provided with an older and slower version of it or C. They believe that NVDA would work better with a specific program.So I agree that they should have the choice to use NVDA if they want and it does what they need, but I really don't agree that NVDA is better for the workplace overall.Also, powerpoint support on NVDA really isn't that great from what I know and JAWS just has allot more useful features in the context sensitive help, more obscure dialogues and lists read properly, virtual ribbons, announcement of more formatting info, the skim reading and text analyzer tools which help complement Word, and just over all generally less lag (though hopefully UIA will help NVDA catch up a bit)Speaking of catching up, if you read the NVDA changelogs, you will notice that they are still adding basic office support for things that JAWS was doing years ago as of 2019, so they still have catching up to do even if they are closing the gap.@rwbeardjrNVDA addons are not basically the same thing as JAWS scripts. Generally those writing scripts are more professional and include far more help documentation, and some scripts, like those for Skype and Zoom for instance, are almost like an entire reskin of the program, where as most NVDA addons just do the bare minimum.Also, though their are more addons over all, you will see that many of them don't work properly any more or do things in an insecure way which would make businesses not want to allow them on their network.Don't get me wrong, I love addons like golden cursor, clipspeak, JGT, Automatic Speech Output for IF interpreters, and the Winamp, and VLC addons, but there are many more broken, buggy, and limited ones than good ones.As for assuming you aren't an advanced user... I was right wasn't I? I never said you couldn't use it at all.And I based that on what you did and did not say in your first post and nothing else.So take your talkback VS Voiceover analogy, and instead make it so that the reason I claimed Talkback was better than Voiceover is because it could custom label controls (voiceover can too) and because Voiceover has worse braille support (not true).Obviously, I would say you haven't used Voiceover enough to know yet, because actually that's not true, and somaking a judgement without important info is bad and gives people the wrong idea that don't know better.Like you admitted your self: "Do I know it as in depth as I know NVDA? No."I'm not asking you to be an expert before having any opinion (I'm not one either) but you neglected to mention some important things, and I decided that instead of assuming you were just trying to make JAWS look worse do to anger at VFO's prices, you just didn't know better.Should I have assumed the opposite then? Maybe so, considering off topic jabs at JAWS like this one here and your strong opinions without supporting arguments on other programs like VIP Mud VS Mush.Frankly, I think you just got frustrated and started venting before thinking it through properly. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482232/#p482232 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I don't understand URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482220/#p482220 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS rwbeardjr wrote:defender, please never tell me what I understand and what I don't understand. Thanks. That's like if you made a topic about why TalkBack is better than Voiceover, and I tell you, "You don't understand Voiceover". Who am I to tell you that? I do not know your strengths and weaknesses.That's not true. You do get a slight understanding of how much he knows and if he's doing it as an advanced user or just a typical one. You see, there's this Persian proverb that says, unless a man speaks, his defects and perfection not known. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482165/#p482165 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Nvda is really laggy in xl. I decided to use memory cuz it was taking too much time. However, in other stuff nvda is a better all rounderJFW maybe a better sr, but nvda is a more rounded offering in price, usability etc URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482136/#p482136 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @8 JAWS scripts are still not worth it. NVDA add ons are basically the same thing. And @defender, I actually do understand JAWS. I use it because my school pays for everyone who needs the license. Do I know it as in depth as I know NVDA? No. However, I do know how to use it and navigate a computer that's running it. And @17, there are things I like about both programs, and I am not denying that JAWS is good software. But why should I have to pay for something to read the icons on my desktop? And yes, I have seen JAWS without a license, and it will last Forty minutes, you restart, and you can do this as much as you'd like. But defender, please never tell me what I understand and what I don't understand. Thanks. That's like if you made a topic about why TalkBack is better than Voiceover, and I tell you, "You don't understand Voiceover". Who am I to tell you that? I do not know your strengths and weaknesses. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482119/#p482119 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS thing is, posts such as these die quickly and over, because we as of a couple of years until now pretty much agree that fs is just going downhill fast, with bad business practices and so on. But I do see some flaws int he original post:point 5 is just too vague. Its like saying that I really like vanilla ice cream because its much better. But it does not explain the how, or even why of that preference. Point seven, the last one is also very confusing. it goes on to talk about the advantages of the object nav mode, but then it excuses itself onto that it might be just trickier. So which one is it?was this, mmm probably an essay for some kind of work?note that I am not trying to attack the post or the person, its just that its got me curious because it does sort of have an introduction, a development and then some form of summary. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482063/#p482063 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hi.@dark, really? I've not used JAWS in a long time but I thought it was a 40 minute mode and you could use it for as long as you were willing to restart your computer?Personally I think JAWS should have a 30 day trile thing that way you don't have to restart your computer.@defender, no one was fighting until you made your post that comes across as attacking the OP.No one was calling anyone names or anything like that.I'm an NVDA user and find it does all I need it to do. I too moved from JAWS to NVDA when I found out NVDA was free.People who get jobs have peple paying for JAWS because they've heard it's the best and won't listen to those of us who actually use the thing.I don't have a job, this is just what I've heard.@defender, I've not used many office products but from what I understand, NVDA works great with XL, Office and powerpoint so that's the 3 biggest office products made usable by NVDA. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482058/#p482058 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I'm afraid defender, I don't agree with you as far as "keep a demo on your computer and get someone else to pay for it" idea, firstly because government grants are not as easy to come by for many people (especially after your first degree), and anyway do you really want to be reliant upon someone else for what software your allowed?As to the demo, last I checked the jaws demo would only run for about half an hour then conk out with no warning, which could be bad if in the middle of a task, plus, it would also stop running entirely after 15 days, making it inconvenient in the extreme. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482053/#p482053 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkI was taking the price into account when I said that. I was suggesting either the demo (which is super annoying but does almost everything the full version does and restarting is fast on new hardware) or having it paid for by school/work/vocational rehabilitation.@francipvbAgain, you don't really seem to be an advanced JAWS user, which is fine but it also doesn't qualify you to compare these properly. Or maybe the last version of JAWS you used was really old, but let me point some things out that you didn't mention.JAWS has much more comprehensive ways of getting help, significantly better support for commonly used business oriented apps, noticeably higher quality and more versatile OCR, better support for native Windows 10 apps, virtual ribbons, powerful features such as Skim reading and Text Analyzer that NVDA lacks, better reading of mathematical equations, many more options for customizing controls in inaccessible programs out of the box, extreme customization of what JAWS reads and when, a few more supported braille display models, a far more secure way of controlling a remote computer, customer support, and high quality voices that aren't a separate purchase, among many more things I'm sure I've missed.It also has plenty of high quality scripts from people like Dug Lee, where as most NVDA addons are honestly pretty crap when it comes down to it and have security issues that would make a business hesitate to allow them, even if they are allot easier to create.And it's really not that laggy any more compared to NVDA either, especially on Windows 8 or higher. In fact I actually find it less laggy with Firefox for instance... And it crashes less when doing basic things on Win 10.It's got plenty wrong with it too, and I'd be happy to list those things, but in general, I've always said that if your in school or have a job where it's extra features could be helpful (which is essentially any) and someone is paying for it (they usually do) than as long as you know what your doing it's almost always going to serve you better than NVDA would in the same situation.Basically, JAWS costs money for a good reason, and weather it's too much or not has no impact on how good it is at being a screen reader. VFO's business practices and the quality of JAWS it's self are two separate issues and way too many people combine them with out ever even really getting good enough with JAWS to understand what it has to offer. It's like using a friend's MacBook for three days a couple years ago and then saying you hate everything about Mac OS including the updated version. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482048/#p482048 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkI was taking the price into account when I said that. I was suggesting either the demo (which is super annoying but does almost everything the full version does and restarting is fast on new hardware) or having it paid for by school/work/vocational rehabilitation.@francipvbAgain, you don't really seem to be an advanced JAWS user, which is fine but it also doesn't qualify you to compare these properly. Or maybe the last version of JAWS you used was really old, but let me point some things out that you didn't mention.JAWS has much more comprehensive ways of getting help, significantly better support for commonly used business oriented apps, noticeably higher quality and more versatile OCR, better support for native Windows 10 apps, virtual ribbons, powerful features such as Skim reading and Text Analyzer that NVDA lacks, better reading of mathematical equations, many more options for customizing controls in inaccessible programs out of the box, extreme customization of what JAWS reads and when, a few more supported braille display models, a far more secure way of controlling a remote computer, customer support, and high quality voices that aren't a separate purchase, among many more things I'm sure I've missed.It also has plenty of high quality scripts from people like Dug Lee, where as most NVDA addons are honestly pretty crap when it comes down to it and have security issues that would make a business hesitate to allow them, even if they are allot easier to create.And it's really not that laggy any more compared to NVDA either, especially on Windows 8 or higher. In fact I actually find it less laggy with Firefox for instance... And it crashes less when doing basic things on Win 10.It's got plenty wrong with it too, and I'd be happy to list those things, but in general, I've always said that if your in school or have a job where it's extra features could be helpful (which is essentially any) and someone is paying for it (they usually do) than as long as you know what your doing it's almost always going to serve you better than NVDA would in the same situation.Basically, JAWS costs money for a good reason, and weather it's too much or not has no impact on how good it is at being a screen reader. VFO's business practices and the quality of JAWS it's self are two separate issues and way too many people combine them with out ever even really getting good enough with JAWS to understand what it has to offer. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482048/#p482048 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS @DarkI was taking the price into account when I said that. I was suggesting either the demo (which is super annoying but does almost everything the full version does and restarting is fast on new hardware) or having it paid for by school/work/vocational rehabilitation.@francipvbAgain, you don't really seem to be an advanced JAWS user, which is fine but it also doesn't qualify you to compare these properly. Or maybe the last version of JAWS you used was really old, but let me point some things out that you didn't mention.JAWS has much more comprehensive ways of getting help, significantly better support for commonly used business oriented apps, noticeably higher quality and more versatile OCR, better support for native Windows 10 apps, virtual ribbons, powerful features such as Skim reading and Text Analyzer that NVDA lacks, better reading of mathematical equations, many more options for customizing controls in inaccessible programs out of the box, extreme customization of what JAWS reads and when, a few more supported braille display models, a far more secure way of controlling a remote computer, customer support, and high quality voices that aren't a separate purchase, among many more things I'm sure I've missed.It also has plenty of high quality scripts from people like Dug Lee, where as most NVDA addons are honestly pretty crap when it comes down to it and have security issues that would make a business hesitate to allow them, even if they are allot easier to create.And it's really not that laggy any more compared to NVDA either, especially on Windows 8 or higher. In fact I actually find it less laggy with Firefox for instance... And it crashes less when doing basic things on Win 10.It's got plenty wrong with it too, and I'd be happy to list those things, but in general, I've always said that if your in school or have a job where it's extra features could be helpful (which is essentially any) and someone is paying for it (they usually do) than as long as you know what your doing it's almost always going to serve you better than NVDA would in the same situation.Basically, JAWS costs money for a good reason, and weather it's too much or not has no impact on how good it is at being a screen reader. VFO's business practices and the quality of JAWS it's self are two separate issues and way too many people combine them with out ever even really getting good with JAWS. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482048/#p482048 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS See, the issue is that FS/VFO/whatever know that should companies and orgs wise up to the fact that the price model they use is unrealistic and never works in reality without what they have in place, they'll collapse and cease to exist. So they do their best to blind companies into thinking that JAWS is the best screen reader in existence when it really isn't. Hell, now its just copying from NVDA and narrator because FS/VFO/... don't have any kind of originality to add save a few things here and there. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482035/#p482035 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS See, the issue is that FS/VFO/whatever know that should companies and orgs wise up to the fact that the price model they use is unrealistic and never works in reality without what they have in place, they'll collapse and cease to exist. So they do their best to blind companies into thinking that JAWS is the best screen reader in existence when it really isn't. Hell, now its just copying from NVDA and narrator now. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482035/#p482035 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Defender wrote:I strongly believe that all of us should have both screen readers on our computer if at all possible and be at least decent with both of them, as well as Narrator if on Windows 8 or above. I'm afraid defender, the problem is even before you get to discussing the strengths/weaknesses of Jaws, you have to discuss the price. when I moved to windows 10 in 2017 (yes I was late), and discovered supernova's windows 10 support was severely limited, there was absolutely no question of using Jaws since there was no way in hell of me being able to afford it. Heck, I didn't even bother looking at the demo. Were Jaws priced as most software is priced, or even with the moderately more expensive pricing of something like microsoft office's yearly subscription, I'd have been glad to try it out, but the plane fact is however good something might or might not be, if you can't afford it, it makes sense to look elsewhere.I don't doubt that Jaws has strengths of it's own, and that were someone to suddenly buy me a Jaws license I'd find things I liked about the program, heck Supernova does a few things better than NVdA but those hypothetical benefits just don't justify the price tag. I'd personally love to see the pricing of Jaws, and heck Supernova for that matter come down to something similar to most pieces of software, so that would be viable commercial alternatives, and so that we would actually have some competition. As it is though, it just seems freedom Scientific, and to a lesser extent dolphin have been making way too much of customer loyalty and governmental contracts to sustain an unrealistic price model with a captive user base, and the sooner people and institutions swise up to the fact that there are alternatives out there that don't cost this much, the better for all concerned. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482019/#p482019 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
2019-12-02
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : vaibhavbhandari via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I do think that sometimes it depends on the preferences but for me, I'd always choose NVDA over JAWS. I did use JAWS earlier but around 3 to 4 years ago I switched to NVDA and have rarely ever used thta screen reader. Personally, I don't feel like paying so much money and that too every year. I am better off with NVDA. I know JAWS is very advanced and all, but NVDA is also being developed and very soon it might have some of the features that JAWS does and it does not. The spelling feature, as far as I remember, was not in JAWS and has been added recently. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482017/#p482017 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Hello,defender wrote:TL: DR: This type of post has been done a thousand times and always causes stupid arguments. It's pointless because the OP doesn't know enough to make a proper judgement, and it always comes down to personal preference anyway.Dammit rwbeardjr, why did you think it was a good idea to bring this up again!You may as well have asked what was better Windows or Mac, or maybe PS4 or Xbox1 or Iphone or Android, or BGT VS Python.There are just some things which are so down to personal preferences, familiarity, and use case that making a topic like this is always going to be controversial and pretty much useless do to all the bias, willful ignorance, and defensiveness.I can't imagine how you couldn't possibly have not known that before posting... It's not like you just joined the community yesterday or something.I strongly believe that all of us should have both screen readers on our computer if at all possible and be at least decent with both of them, as well as Narrator if on Windows 8 or above.They all have strengths and weaknesses and none of them is clearly better in all situations. It's what you personally need them for that counts and that changes depending on what you do with your computer.It's also pretty clear to me that you are not an advanced JAWS user, so you really can't compare the two properly anyway. Your missing allot of info that you would need to make an educated opinion.In a normal situation I could agree to all of your argument, but about this, think that a screen reader needs to be updated every time, and in the case of JAWS you cannot have it updated without a big pay every ... year?In case of NVDA, if you have the knowledge you can contribute to the core and help NVDA to be updated to support latest windows technologies such UIA patterns and IA2 solutions implemented by application vendors. This is a thing you cannot do with JAWS.I've paid 1k dollars for my notebook and I cannot pay other 1k dollars for a screen reader, it is a absurd thing to do.I have a demo of JAWS installed on my laptop, but sincerely I don't know why I have this crap on my disk.Cheers, URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/482009/#p482009 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS TL: DR: This type of post has been done a thousand times and always causes stupid arguments. It's pointless because the OP doesn't know enough to make a proper judgement, and it always comes down to personal preference anyway.Dammit rwbeardjr, why did you think it was a good idea to bring this up again!You may as well have asked what was better Windows or Mac, or maybe PS4 or Xbox1 or Iphone or Android, or BGT VS Python.There are just some things which are so down to personal preferences, familiarity, and use case that making a topic like this is always going to be controversial and pretty much useless do to all the bias, willful ignorance, and defensiveness.I can't imagine how you couldn't possibly have not known that before posting... It's not like you just joined the community yesterday or something.I strongly believe that all of us should have both screen readers on our computer if at all possible and be at least decent with both of them, as well as Narrator if on Windows 8 or above.They all have strengths and weaknesses and none of them is clearly better in all situations. It's what you personally need them for that counts and that changes depending on what you do with your computer.It's also pretty clear to me that you are not an advanced JAWS user, so you really can't compare the two properly anyway. Your missing allot of info that you would need to make an educated opinion. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481986/#p481986 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I don't agree with what Freedom Scientific, or VFO, or whatever they choose to call themselves on any particular day is doing. Their business practices and overall philosophy makes me sick, and they don't really seem to care about the average user, just big organizations that hapily continue paying for JAWS when in most cases NVDA can perform the same task.Narrator is becoming quite a viable screen reader. I hope this trend continues, because it's beyond wonderful. We finally have a built-in screen reader in Windows that is very capable of performing most daily tasks a person would want to do. I've said this before, and I'll say it again, but the only reasons I can justify JAWS anymore is either you're used to it and it works for you, or the use of custom scripts for an application. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481983/#p481983 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I don't agree with what Freedom Scientific, or VFO, or whatever they choose to call themselves on any particular day is doing. Their business practices and overall philosophy makes me sick, and they don't really seem to care about the average user, just big organizations that hapily continue paying for JAWS when in most cases NVDA can perform the same task.Narrator is becoming quite a viable screen reader. I hope this trend continues, because it's beyond wonderful. We finally have a built-in screen reader in Windows that is very capable of performing most daily tasks a person would want to do. I've said this before, and I'll say it again, but the only reason I can justify JAWS anymore is the use of custom scripts for an application. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481983/#p481983 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I don't agree with what Freedom Scientific, or VFO, or whatever they choose to call themselves on any particular day is doing. Their business practices and overall philosophy make me sick, and they don't really seem to care about the average user, just big organizations that hapily continue paying for JAWS when in most cases NVDA can perform the same task.Narrator is becoming quite a viable screen reader. I hope this trend continues, because it's beyond wonderful. We finally have a built-in screen reader in Windows that is very capable of performing most daily tasks a person would want to do. I've said this before, and I'll say it again, but the only reason I can justify JAWS anymore is the use of custom scripts for an application. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481983/#p481983 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I don't agree with what Freedom Scientific, or VFO, or whatever they choose to call themselves on any particular day is doing. Their business practices and overall philosophy makes me sick, and they don't really seem to care about the average user, just big organizations that hapily continue paying for JAWS when in most cases NVDA can perform the same task.Narrator is becoming quite a viable screen reader. I hope this trend continues, because it's beyond wonderful. We finally have a built-in screen reader in Windows that is very capable of performing most daily tasks a person would want to do. I've said this before, and I'll say it again, but the only reason I can justify JAWS anymore is the use of custom scripts for an application. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481983/#p481983 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS hiI'm using windows 7 with Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 1000M @ 1.80GHz and 2GB ram. When I try jaws, it takes like 3 minutes just for it to start while NVDA only takes like 5 seconds to start. So even if I want it to, I can't use jaws well URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481980/#p481980 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS Jaws has a lot of support for commonly used programs, and it had support for some of these programs long before NVDA even existed.Jaws tends to be more robust and has more overall features. Now, I'm not saying all these features are useful or cutting-edge, but they're there. I don't use a lot of them.I also tend to greatly prefer Jaws on the internet, given the way NVDA reacts to webpages and lays things out. I'm much happier using a combination of Jaws and IE, or Jaws and Chrome, for web-browsing.That said, I do have NVDA installed and I use it pretty regularly. I'm able to see the good in it. It is an excellent screenreader and ultimately what it will come down to for a lot of users is preference. It's also free to use, so that's enormous. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481961/#p481961 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS well, I suppose FS says they're helping people, and that's true for some. But countries with less money or just people who are less fortunate, nope. Forget it. And honistly, even though i have both, I still prefer nvda because of mostly 1 reason: jaws is laggy. I did a speech test between nvda eloq and jaws eloq, and nvda won almost all of the time. But I prefer espeak anyway, and that is suuper fast. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481948/#p481948 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I, as a JAWS user from 2005? to 2011 and as an NVDA user since 2011 (I've used other screen readers like Super Nova (at the time Access Suite (now called Mag Reader)), the defunct thunder and other which I don't know the name of), I will stay with NVDA for ever. Plus, it has now the first place of used screen readers according to a blind servey I was responding? 2 months ago, but I forgot the name of it. It is kinda historical at best since many people were using expensive apps for visualy impaired / low vision people and I sincerely go with NVDA at best. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481945/#p481945 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS I agree with you there. And also, why can't Microsoft just make Narrator a full functioning screen reader? That would end the wars and solve everyone's problem URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481941/#p481941 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS
Re: Why I prefer NVDA over JAWS good post, i agree. Although, freedom scientific have tried to make plans for jaws not as expensive, e.g: i believe they have a 90 day trial and a monthly or yearly subscription to avoid paying all up front. Just my opinion? its too little; too late at this point. A lot of users are making the switch to nvda if they haven't already. Is jaws bad? no. But for a company that limes that their goal is to help people, etc, etc? For years having to pay over $1000 up front or get screwed; speaks out very; very loudly about freedom Scientific. Given their price range, there's a lot of people who cant afford it. And yet they claime to help people? I don't buy it. Just my opinion on the matter. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/481938/#p481938 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
