Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Contemplating a DAC...
Get some really heavy stands (Target do some, say) and use blu-tac to stick the speakers to them. No way a kid's gonna tip that, safer than what you have. You'll improve the imaging much better this way than by playing with DACs, IMO. Adam -- adamslim Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others 'Last.fm group: people who don't listen to any of last.fm's top artists' (http://www.last.fm/group/People+who+don%27t+listen+to+any+of+last.fm%27s+top+artists) SB+, EAR V20, Heybrook Sextets plus some other stuff SB3, Shek d2, Ming-Da MC84-C, Harbeth HL-P3ES adamslim's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7355 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39855 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Volume regulation of transporter?
ted_b;239583 Wrote: So I have this modded Transporter, the Modwright Transporter (see pix on Transporter mods part 2 thread) that I'm beta-testing. It sounded compressed and harsh going though my preamp (dig volume at full 0.0db). When I switched to playing it straight-to-amp to set the same fairly loud listening level was -25.5 to -26.5db!! (and sounded glorious) I gotta assume that the harshness i was hearing is that it overdrives my preamp? There's a simple way to test that theory: turn the TP output down (say to -24dB) and feed it into the preamp. If it still sounds harsh, it's not due to overdriving the preamp. ted_b;239583 Wrote: but wondered what -26db would mean bit-wise, and what kind of resolution loss I'm getting playing redbook and 24/96 files. Playback at -24dB means about 4 bits lost, so the TP's 24 bit DAC is effectively being used as a 20 bit DAC. So no loss of resolution from Redbook sources. Of course, it's likely that the bottom couple of bits of the TP DAC aren't linear, so perhaps it should be regarded as a 22 bit DAC, in which case running it at -24dB effectively gives about 18 bits of resolution. -- cliveb Transporter - ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39611 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Volume regulation of transporter?
Very nice Clive. That would explain why the TP sounded somewhat harsh at -44db but didn't at -32db anymore. If it has 22 bits effective than well reducing the signal by 7 and a half ;) may start to influence signals from redbook sources. -- jaysung jaysung's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12375 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39611 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
I'm never quite sure how far AB demos get you: it's easy to get hung-up on listening for differences and I also think there's a natural bias towards the sound/presentation you're familiar with. You can eliminate the obvious, but IMO, you need to live with something for a couple of weeks or so to really evaluate it. When you're dealing with choices of kit that all sound excellent in isolation it is perhaps an exaggeration to say that one sounds mushy/grainy/lacking in timing/etc/etc compared to the other when in fact they are all very very good. IMHO adjusting to difference in sound is something the human ear and brain takes a while do. It's probably why we get so brand oriented as this keeps us in the same family of sound (generally). Vic, for the small difference in cost, I'd get the analogue SB+ and experiment both ways - analogue and digital. In the grand scheme of things it's very cheap compared to spending £2/3/4/5000 on a player. My guess is you'll be pleasantly surprised with the results if you've done your homework on ripping etc. Make sure you compare apples to apples...i.e. don't compare a 128mp3 to a CD on your player ;) -- ncpl ncpl's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=6305 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
ncpl;239642 Wrote: When you're dealing with choices of kit that all sound excellent in isolation it is perhaps an exaggeration to say that one sounds mushy/grainy/lacking in timing/etc/etc compared to the other when in fact they are all very very good. IMHO adjusting to difference in sound is something the human ear and brain takes a while do. Agreed - that's why I don't like A/B testing - you focus on the differences instead of the musical enjoyment. It's all good kit really - it's just what does it for you? The main reasons I bought my SB+ were as follows: - The SB3 (with or without my Shek DAC) wasn't good enough - I wanted the convenience of streaming over my CD player (which was good enough) - It was available on a 30-day trial I couldn't get a Transporter on the same trial terms, so went for the SB+. It is good enough (better than my CD player - as good at soundstaging and more punchy), so I kept it. The Transporter may be better or worse in my system; I don't know, but I'm happy right now, which is what matters :) Adam -- adamslim Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others 'Last.fm group: people who don't listen to any of last.fm's top artists' (http://www.last.fm/group/People+who+don%27t+listen+to+any+of+last.fm%27s+top+artists) SB+, EAR V20, Heybrook Sextets plus some other stuff SB3, Shek d2, Ming-Da MC84-C, Harbeth HL-P3ES adamslim's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7355 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Arcam A70 or Arcam AVR250?
The Arros can sound really good with the right supporting gear. I would go the integrated route, you'll end up with a better amp. The totems I've listened to sounded a bit laid back. For amps I'd look at used like a Plinius 9100, or 8200 mkII , Arcam A85, as examples. Try to stay away from amps that are also on the laid back side. And I'm sure I'll get slammed by the non-audiophiles but don't forget good cables and line conditioning. Once you have the basics including proper speaker placement, then look into outboard dac's.. Benchmark, Lavry, Ps Audio. -- ErikM ErikM's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7576 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39856 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Hi-Fi critric reveals their limited vision
ashmore;239447 Wrote: Thinking about how others in this thread have identified the ripping and delivery (PC to SB+) processes as the significant obstacles to digitised music reaching the mass market, is it not fair to conclude that on-demand services, rather than CD purchase and rip, is the way forward? For a start it is neater (requiring fewer user interventions), sound quality and tag accuracy can be regulated by the provider, and the user wont need to worry about backup. For a time, the former Slim Devices offered a CD ripping service. Not quite what you're getting at here though but it could be a solution for people with more money than time. -- Mark Lanctot 'Sean Adams' Response-O-Matic checklist, patent pending!' (http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=200910postcount=2) Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39438 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Hi-Fi critric reveals their limited vision
AndyC_772;239452 Wrote: I read on The Register the other week about how trials are beginning of selling music on USB sticks instead of CDs. In theory I think this could be great; freed from the constraints of the CD format we could have higher sample rate and bit depth, and no need to rip at all - the files, error-free and properly tagged, could just be dragged dropped straight onto a hard disc. Oh then I was going to answer something similar to the following: Of course, it won't be like that in practise. It'll be compressed music, in a proprietary format, crippled by DRM, and sold at a higher price because of the 'convenience'. Yes. CD quality! (128 kbps MP3.) Free player by We're not Evil Software Corp! (Which asks for your name and e-mail address, registering you over the Internet and enabling the files to only be played on 3 devices.) -- Mark Lanctot 'Sean Adams' Response-O-Matic checklist, patent pending!' (http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=200910postcount=2) Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39438 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Contemplating a DAC...
soupdragon;239685 Wrote: just another link - its from the predecessor of the sonance, and explains about the lack of reclocker http://www.net-audio.co.uk/microclone.html liam Hmmm...rather assumes that the transport is the only source of jitter...what about the cables? Also as we keep saying over and over on this forum, locking the transport to the DAC has to be the way forward. Clock recovery is inherently flawed it would seem... -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... ...SB3+TACT+Altmann+MF DACXV3/Linn tri-amped Aktiv 5.1 system and some very expensive cables ;o) Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39855 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Choices
There is some jitter embedded into the source recordings. This was an issue when CD first started. These days, (generally) we can ignore jitter in the recording. Anyway we can't do anything about it. Jitter in the replay chain is possible from a wide variety of sources/causes. Transport, cable and DAC all have a part to play to a greater or lesser extent. There is correlated jitter that tracks the music signal in some way (often a power supply related issue) or uncorrelated jitter (not as bad but still undesirable). Some people believe that jitter can be completely dealt with at the DAC using a variety of techniques. I think the jury is still out on this. Differences in transport sounds can only be one of three things: 1) bad bitstream - VERY VERY unlikely these days. 2) Jitter from the transport that is not being dealt with by the DAC 3) noise (RF/EMI) from the transport messing with the analogue stages of the DAC. Virtually impossible if using a toslink connection between transport and DAC and the units aren't within a metre or so of each other... -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... ...SB3+TACT+Altmann+MF DACXV3/Linn tri-amped Aktiv 5.1 system and some very expensive cables ;o) Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39810 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
yes to the last question...and wireless vs. wired sound identical (at least they do in a standard SB) -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... ...SB3+TACT+Altmann+MF DACXV3/Linn tri-amped Aktiv 5.1 system and some very expensive cables ;o) Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] A photo of your Squeezebox setup (please)
A poll associated with this post was created, to vote and see the results, please visit http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19817 Question: Should there be a new forum for photos? - yes - no - maybe This is my setup.Dynaudio BM6A MKII's, Lavry DA10, SB3 +---+ |Filename: ViewFromTheHelm.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3625| +---+ -- dynaudiorules dynaudiorules's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12568 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19817 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
I am really getting interested in this one. Just a couple of more question (including a stupid one): - what kind of inputs does it have? (I suppose just the one for the network, right?) - what outputs for the complete version and for the digital version? - Is it technically better to used it wired as opposed to wireless, as I have read a few times for the regular SB? - Are there any differences in setting it up compared to the regular SB? - *Warning: stupid question* Suppose I had the SB+ plus a regular SB in a different room. Would it be possible to listn to different files in two different locations at the same time? -- Vic Vic's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13795 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Contemplating a DAC...
just another link - its from the predecessor of the sonance, and explains about the lack of reclocker http://www.net-audio.co.uk/microclone.html liam -- soupdragon [SB3 + NET Audio Sonance DAC ] + [Cyrus CD6] + [JVC QL A75 DD TT + Decca Super Gold + Hadcock 242 SE + Graham Slee Era Gold V] - Cyrus Pre-X - Eclipse TD 502A - Eclipse TD 512 speakers soupdragon's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4958 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39855 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
Phil Leigh;239696 Wrote: yes to the last question...and wireless vs. wired sound identical (at least they do in a standard SB) Wow! that's magic -- Vic Vic's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13795 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Contemplating a DAC...
i sort of stumbled across it by accident on pink fish - had a look at the tnt review and it sort of makes sense, its half width and half length - just bigger than a CD case. Heres the TNT review - http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/sonance_e.html heres the manufacturer http://www.net-audio.co.uk/sonance.html theres NO reclocking module in it which i think is advantageous. i think he can offer discounts on the price. very fast and detailed. I cant comment on other DAC's but i can say its heaps better than the internal DAC on the SB3. i think hifi world did a review oct 2007 which was favourable as well. Liam -- soupdragon [SB3 + NET Audio Sonance DAC ] + [Cyrus CD6] + [JVC QL A75 DD TT + Decca Super Gold + Hadcock 242 SE + Graham Slee Era Gold V] - Cyrus Pre-X - Eclipse TD 502A - Eclipse TD 512 speakers soupdragon's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4958 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39855 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Contemplating a DAC...
ive just taken the plunge with a second hand NET Audio Sonance DAC (for SB3 money) - and a mighty fine synergy it has too with the sb3. Heartily recommended - but not at new prices .. Liam -- soupdragon [SB3 + NET Audio Sonance DAC ] + [Cyrus CD6] + [JVC QL A75 DD TT + Decca Super Gold + Hadcock 242 SE + Graham Slee Era Gold V] - Cyrus Pre-X - Eclipse TD 502A - Eclipse TD 512 speakers soupdragon's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4958 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39855 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Choices
Thanks Chinanico. Been doing some more research on audio Jitter verses because it appears the syntax in this discussion is different than the context in which I understand the term. In my world, Jitter refers to more of a timing/latency issue, normally created by clocking issues or within the transport media itself. Thus I could not understand the idea of jitter correction over an audio transport without having an error correction system working on both ends, thus creating more latency to the far processor. In reading other posts and links from here, I'm realizing you may be referring to a syntax where the clocking issue occurs prior to the ADC used for recording the master track. It is then, in a sense, built into the master recording and then all subsequent recordings. Not my definition of jitter, but no reason there can't be many. This is far different from what I was thinking of. However, it leads me to new questions. Since this 'jitter' is introduced in the signal prior to it being digitized, there is no inherent data to rebuild from. If you are indeed referring to this scenario, I'd be interested to understand how the Jitter Correction device rebuilds a corrected digital signal. I read some stuff about sampling and reclocking but I guess I'm just too 'data' oriented to understand how that can recreate the intended signal for all frequencies if the baseline is already incorrect. Hoping someone can help me work it out. I'm really just curious for some reason. -- Murph Murph's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10553 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39810 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC decode - server or SB?
Hi, What is the view on music quality from decoding FLAC files via Slimserver (dBPoweramp decoder) versus a hardware decode at the SB? Cheers. -- Countryman Countryman's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8458 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39867 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
opaqueice;239707 Wrote: A CD player sounds the same regardless of whether you carried the disk and loaded it in the tray using your left hand or your right. You must not have a very revealing system. -- seanadams seanadams's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
Vic;239700 Wrote: Wow! that's magic No it's not. A CD player sounds the same regardless of whether you carried the disk and loaded it in the tray using your left hand or your right. It makes no difference what kind of network carries the data to the SB. The data is identical and once it gets there it's processed in the same way. The only advantage of wired is that wireless networks go down more often, and you might have trouble getting a strong enough signal depending on your setup. -- opaqueice opaqueice's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4234 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
seanadams;239709 Wrote: You must not have a very revealing system. You secretly love feeding them don't you :) -- m1abrams m1abrams's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=850 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
opaqueice;239707 Wrote: No it's not. A CD player sounds the same regardless of whether you carried the disk and loaded it in the tray using your left hand or your right. It makes no difference what kind of network carries the data to the SB. The data is identical and once it gets there it's processed in the same way. The only advantage of wired is that wireless networks go down more often, and you might have trouble getting a strong enough signal depending on your setup. I meant is magic that you can play two different files in two different locations from the same device. Like a space machine -- Vic Vic's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13795 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC decode - server or SB?
The only difference it will make is the BW used on the network. .flac will use about 1/2 the BW that .wav will. That shouldn't matter unless you signal is weak and prone to drop-outs or if you have a bunch of SBs or other network traffic going on at the same time you're trying to listen to music. TD -- tyler_durden tyler_durden's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2701 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39867 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
