Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
Wow, thanks for all the help, very active forum!! thought a question about iTunes v open standards might provoke some debate! I have downloaded dbpoweramp and am very impressed, seen enough to decide this is the way to go, and rip to FLAC and also MP3 for iPod. Just need to figure out how I get the MP3's into iTunes, I assume this is straight forward? Anyone got any views as to the suitability of the TranquilPC T2-WHS-A3i? Any better alternative at a similar price point? Thanks again for all your input. -- david_a_woodward david_a_woodward's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=18576 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] What DAC to use?
There is nothing so fierce as an audiophile rattled. I bought got an SB3 15 months ago, and after 2 months of excitement and ripping cd's I started to realise that there was something missing in the output compared to my CD player (Musical Fidelity A3). Of course, the functionality of the SB3 wins hands down, my partner had a bad habit of hitting repeat rather than going into the library to fetch a new CD, and this was getting on my nerves (in that silent way!). Given that I wanted my Sb3 to sound 'more like' the A3, I went for an external DAC (as this would also allow me to use headphones as well - and save the planet by leaving my amp off!). I was surprised to see that there were a bunch of DACs in the $1,000 range that everyone liked, but it did seem odd to stump u 3x the cost of the Sb3 for the DAC. Instead I went the Beresford DAC route - simple enough, if I didn't like it I could send it back and I'd only be out of pocket the postage, couldn't argue really (and home demo is the only way to chose gear). The DAC arrived, and after a week of playing I did a blind test wth my partner versus the A3. Yes the A3 was still better, but the gap between the Sb3/DAC was much closer - much more to my liking. So I kept the DAC. 11 months fly by, and there was talk around the campfire of the new Mk6/3 DAC being much improved over the original one, and a much better headphone stage too, so after a cheeky e-mail I wrangled selling my old DAC back to Stanley and buying the new Mk6/3. After a week this new DAC is awesome (dudes!) much much better than the old version, and now it really is giving my A3 a run for its money. Its everything I would want for, lots of detail, nice soundstage, good bass response, and a good headphone stage. Compared to the SB3 on its own that just sounds 'flat' and lifeless. Of course I'm no audiophile, I stopped that after 1 to many Hawkwind concerts in the 80's, I actually listed to my music and appreciate it, rather than tweak my gear all night :-) so the combination of the Sb3 and Beresford DAC works brilliantly. I know that I could spend 10x what I have spent on my gear to get 'ultimate sound' but then I'd need to spend 100x to get 'ultimate ears' as mine have aged somewhat. Like most people, life is a compromise, my gear has to work for DVD's, BluRay, TV, Radio etc, and not take a PhD to switch on. Unfortunately, I stumbled upon SACD (just as the format died!) and now I'm lusting after streaming SACD rather than having to chnage discs, but SACD is 'Sunday best' like my vinyl, taking only 10% of the listening time. I seem to have rambled ... BT -- BigTony We're Only In It For The Music! www.zappateers.com BigTony's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10638 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49316 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] What DAC to use?
I can only repeat myself, but now i ve actual prices. An Old Audio Analogue (1.1, 1.2 DDE) can be buy from 110-130 USD. Real bargain, so if you would like to upgrade but haven't much money, hear one of these old stuffs. Improvement will be signifcant if D/A was the bottleneck of system. -- Saughassy Saughassy's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=18489 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49316 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Question for Sean
Thanks all for the replies, I think SuperQ's idea makes good sense. That's what I'll do--use both. George -- gsawdy gsawdy's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14330 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49460 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] What DAC to use?
Robin Bowes;317207 Wrote: Conversely, hifi speakers wouldn't be all that good at a stadium gig [3]. Notwithstanding the audience would probably not appreciate Martin Logan's spoiling their sight ... :D -- sebp System : Mac Mini for ripping to FLAC (Max) SqueezeCenter 7.0.1 running on a ReadyNAS NV+ Living room : Squeezebox 3 Sony STR DE-875 Celestion F30 Bedroom : Squeezebox 3 Beresford DAC NAD C315BEE KEF iQ3 Kitchen : SB Receiver Logitech SoundMan X1 'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/sebp) sebp's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11768 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49316 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] What DAC to use?
Robin Bowes;317136 Wrote: Pascal, These are PA speakers, designed for high-volume sound-reinforcement. Sure, yours will be great for a party in a big room, but I'll be extremely surprised if they can reproduce sound as accurately as a pair of hifi speakers. R. One of the big misconceptions in the audio world is just that. A speaker capable of handling let#8217;s say 100 watts doesn#8217;t (or shouldn#8217;t) need 100 watts to produce its #8220;best sound#8221;. A speaker#8217;s band pass curve is measured at very low power ratings (1 watt or so). A good constructed speaker will not have a huge difference in its band pass curve at low or high power levels. If it does, then it is a bad speaker. Many people tend to look first at the #8220;Power Handling#8221; spec of a speaker; and this is actually not the important parameter. The two most important specifications are the nominal impedance and sensitivity. These specifications are in most cases least understood. The MP-Audio speakers produce the same sound quality at low power ratings as it does on high power ratings. I use them in my living room at normal listening levels. As you look closely at those speakers you will notice that they don#8217;t use horns in the high frequency part. Most, if not all, PA speakers today use horns in the high frequency range. These horn tend to be very aggressive and you#8217;ll easily get a headache listing to them, even when used outside. Again this not the case with MP-Audio. This brand is different in many ways. It is not a high volume manufacturer. Most parts are handcrafted; the wood of the cabinets is 13 layers Finish Pine (carpenters hate this because this wood is quite hard). As I mentioned before, I have listened to a lot of HiFi speakers. Until today I haven#8217;t found any speaker that produces a better sound then my MP-Audio speakers. Keep in mind that music is an emotion; not everyone will like the same sound color. This is one of the reasons why there are so many speakers out there. sebp;317167 Wrote: Audiophiles really have no mercy. Hope you enjoyed the trip, Pascal. ;-) Yes I do enjoy this trip. I like to know what people views are on topics such as these even if I do not agree with all of them. It#8217;s great to see what kind of response is generated on a simple question such as #8220;what DAC to use#8221; :-) -- Pascal Hibon Pascal Hibon's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7969 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49316 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
Phil Leigh;317064 Wrote: There are some discs with flawed copy protection schemas that need many many sector re-reads to get the data off acurately... For example, I have The Beatles Let it Be Naked that takes 2 hours to rip with EAC and the disc is in physically mint condition! Well I did say IME. :) Perhaps I'm spoiled with cdparanoia on Linux...the following sums up my views. http://folk.uio.no/hpv/linuxtoons/dilbert-unix.png Darren -- darrenyeats SB3 / Inguz - Krell KAV-300i (pre bypass) - PMC AB-1 Dell laptop - JVC UX-C30 mini system darrenyeats's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10799 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
david_a_woodward;317191 Wrote: Wow, thanks for all the help, very active forum!! thought a question about iTunes v open standards might provoke some debate! Ah now see you posted in the Audiophile forums. If you wanted some debate you should ask if a $10,000 power cord for your refrigerator will improve the sound of your Transporter. -- m1abrams m1abrams's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=850 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
darrenyeats;317288 Wrote: Well I did say IME. :) Perhaps I'm spoiled with cdparanoia on Linux...the following sums up my view. http://folk.uio.no/hpv/linuxtoons/dilbert-unix.png Darren That made me laugh - thanks Darren! -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal...SB3+Stontronics PSU - Altmann JISCO/UPCI - TACT RCS 2.2X with Good Vibrations S/W - MF X-DAC V3/X-PSU/X-10 buffer (Audiocomm full mods)- Linn 5103 - Linn Aktiv 5.1 system (6x LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Townsend Supertweeters, Kimber Chord cables Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
sc53;317065 Wrote: But if it takes 20 mins per disc (Apple Lossless takes about 5 mins per disk) or requires tons of initial setup etc. I'd use iTunes and not worry about that one track out of thousands that may contain an audible error. There are two separate processes here - ripping and encoding. Apple Lossless doesn't rip, iTunes does. iTunes then encodes the resulting rip into Apple Lossless or MP3. Programs other than iTunes (dBpowerAMP for example) can also encode into ALAC. The speed of ripping doesn't influence the speed of encoding. In terms of encoding speed, there aren't huge advantages in any one format. For example, when FLAC was slower than ALAC it was changed and now is at least as fast. Personally, I don't really care how long ripping takes as long as it's as correct as possible. You can leave your computer and go do other things. Often those protected CDs take ~24 hours to rip... ps Phil Leigh--I have Let It Be Naked too and had no problems ripping it with iTunes! These protected CDs usually contain purposeful errors every 2-5 seconds. This shows that iTunes will happily rip such errors and not tell you. A secure ripper will have a problem with this because it will detect the errors and attempt to correct them, that's the point of this protection mechanism - to frustrate the user and discourage ripping. These errors are not necessarily audible, but they are there. -- Mark Lanctot Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
I'm not sure I follow the reasoning here. If iTunes and other less secure rippers popular with the general public do not get hung up on such purposeful errors - where is the deterrent value in their inclusion? Or are the record companies trying to deter the admittedly small percentage of people in the marketplace who are concerned about their rips not being bit-perfect? Shouldn't their efforts be focused on deterring the common user? Ted -- esbrewer esbrewer's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12409 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
esbrewer;317310 Wrote: I'm not sure I follow the reasoning here. If iTunes and other less secure rippers popular with the general public do not get hung up on such purposeful errors - where is the deterrent value in their inclusion? Well, record companies aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer, are they? :-) It was a hairbrained scheme that was in use from 2003 to about 2005. The idea was that these errors (probably only a few bits) would be inaudible in a regular CD player but that a ripper would stumble on them. Rippers who don't do any error correction won't stumble on them because they just play straight through like a regular CD player does, errors and all. Or are the record companies trying to deter the admittedly small percentage of people in the marketplace who are concerned about their rips not being bit-perfect? Shouldn't their efforts be focused on deterring the common user? They've abandoned such schemes now, but it culminated in the infamous Sony rootkit debacle. That's as far as they went and they definitely crossed the line. -- Mark Lanctot Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
esbrewer;317310 Wrote: I'm not sure I follow the reasoning here. If iTunes and other less secure rippers popular with the general public do not get hung up on such purposeful errors - where is the deterrent value in their inclusion? Or are the record companies trying to deter the admittedly small percentage of people in the marketplace who are concerned about their rips not being bit-perfect? Shouldn't their efforts be focused on deterring the common user? Ted Well I not sure about insecure rippers handling those CDs well. I have a CD that has this attempt at DRM in place and I did rip it with iTunes and it ripped very quickly however when I played it back it was full of pops and clicks. Ran it through EAC and it took almost a day to rip, but was clean when it finished. -- m1abrams m1abrams's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=850 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
m1abrams;317316 Wrote: Well I not sure about insecure rippers handling those CDs well. I have a CD that has this attempt at DRM in place and I did rip it with iTunes and it ripped very quickly however when I played it back it was full of pops and clicks. Ran it through EAC and it took almost a day to rip, but was clean when it finished. There were multiple schemes from different companies and they got better at what they were trying to do as time went on. Googling finds this list: SafeDisc, SafeDisc v2, SecuROM, DiscGuard, CD-Cops, LaserLock, Cactus Data Shield, Lock Blocks, ProtectCD, PSX/Lybcrypt, CD-Check, Dummy Files, Oversize Illegal TOC There once was a software tool out there that could identify what type of protection was on a disc. Couldn't do anything about it though. -- Mark Lanctot Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] FLAC or ALAC that is the question!?
m1abrams;317316 Wrote: Well I not sure about insecure rippers handling those CDs well. I have a CD that has this attempt at DRM in place and I did rip it with iTunes and it ripped very quickly however when I played it back it was full of pops and clicks. Ran it through EAC and it took almost a day to rip, but was clean when it finished. Different drives always used to make a difference. I bought loads of CDs from cdwow.com before I realised they had copy protection - the best thing to rip them with back then (that I found) was CDex, set to full paranoia, autorun off and an old NEC drive. Normal speed rips, and only 2-3 clicks in the last track. Now I'm another dBpoweramp convert, I've found that secure mode doesn't work so well with these - whereas Burst mode rips them fine with no audible artifacts. I used to take the rips are rips view and used iTunes. But dBpoweramp is easier, and the fact that you can verify it's 100% bit-perfect is a nice bonus. Before I was ripping to ALAC in iTunes, deleting the files from iTunes, tagging them with mp3tag (embedding artwork at the same time), adding them back to iTunes, using iTunes to convert them to AAC for my iPod (dual library). Argh! Now dBpoweramp lets me do all of that securely in one go with one mouse-click with artwork and whatever file/folder structure I like, and ALAC and mp3 at the same time and did I mention the artwork? Then all I do is drag the folder into iTunes. Done. Seriously, dBpoweramp is really, -really- good - and Spoon (the man behind it) is on his forums all the time, he listens and actions requests/problems etc, and best of all you can download it and try it for free for about 2 weeks! I'm not affiliated to Illustrate at all, btw, but it's amazing how much time I've saved using dBpoweramp. -- moley6knipe 2 x SqueezeBox 3 | 1 x SqueezeCenter 7 | 1 x Win XP Pro SP2 | 1 x Happy listener :-) moley6knipe's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10014 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=49492 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Apple Lossless a compromise?
jgs;316821 Wrote: What were your settings before (that weren't so good)? ALAC - FLAC -- GuyDebord Verity Audio Tamino X2 wired with v/d Hul Inspiration, REL Strata5. AMPS: Pathos Classic One MKIII's in mono config. ANALOGUE: Clearaudio Ambient CMB, Satisfy Carbon Lyra Helikon SL, ASR Basis Exclusive phono preamp, link: AcousticZen Silver Reference2 XLRs. DIGITAL: SlimDevices Transporter, link: WireWorld SilverEclipse 5.2. POWER: Isotek MiniSub GII, Isotek Elite cables (MiniSub, Rel), ASR Magic Cord (ASR), Siltech SPX30 MKII's (Pathos) v/d Hul Mainserver (Transporter). GuyDebord's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14587 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=34122 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
