RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
Lisa, Glad you were able to get a copy, mine is always within arm’s reach when I am working with records. Rick Richard Francis Pimentel Epping, NH Researching, Riberia Grande, Riberinha, Achada Grande, Bretanha, and Ponta Delgada, Sao Miguel, Acores From: themom8682 via Azores Genealogy [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 11:01 PM To: azores@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature I was lucky and found it in a library not too far from where I live (California). So I want to get as much info as I can out of it while I have it checked out. I found it online starting around $120 but wanted to see the book before deciding to spend the money; I did that (bought sight unseen) with another book that I thought would be a gold mine of information about Portuguese immigrants and it turned out to be of little value to me. Thank you so much for recommending the book, responding to my query, and ALL the assistance you provide via this group. Lisa -Original Message- From: Richard Francis Pimentel <rfrancispimen...@comcast.net> To: azores <azores@googlegroups.com> Sent: Mon, Aug 21, 2017 7:28 pm Subject: RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature Hi Lisa, Yes that is the section. I have found it very useful over the years. The other section I use quite frequently starts on page 465 in my copy and lists the churches and Freguesia they are in. Just curious did you by the copy and where did you get it and how much. It is very hard to find and the last time I saw one listed it was around $300. Rick Richard Francis Pimentel Epping, NH Researching, Riberia Grande, Riberinha, Achada Grande, Bretanha, and Ponta Delgada, Sao Miguel, Acores From: themom8682 via Azores Genealogy [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com <mailto:azores@googlegroups.com?> ] Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 7:06 PM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature Rick, I was able to get a copy of the book you reference, Azores Islands A History, and I'm wondering if the "standardized last name spellings" that you refer to is the list of names covering about 70 pages that is in a table format giving the Family Name, Name Derivation, Family Origin, and Family Armorial information. That is the only lengthy list of names I see that refers to families/general population. Thank you, Lisa Vierra Turrentine (and as you can see my family does not use the standardized spelling ;) ) On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:59:33 AM UTC-7, Richard Francis Pimentel wrote: I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways and he can be found. There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was spelled in the record. Rick From: azo...@googlegroups.com [mailto:azo...@googlegroups.com ] On Behalf Of Azores Genealogy group Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature G'day folks, Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean descendant how do I determine what's modern? Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple official documents where even in same document names have been spelt differently. Suggestions?. Tony -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+un...@googlegroups.com . Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at
Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
I was lucky and found it in a library not too far from where I live (California). So I want to get as much info as I can out of it while I have it checked out. I found it online starting around $120 but wanted to see the book before deciding to spend the money; I did that (bought sight unseen) with another book that I thought would be a gold mine of information about Portuguese immigrants and it turned out to be of little value to me. Thank you so much for recommending the book, responding to my query, and ALL the assistance you provide via this group. Lisa -Original Message- From: Richard Francis Pimentel <rfrancispimen...@comcast.net> To: azores <azores@googlegroups.com> Sent: Mon, Aug 21, 2017 7:28 pm Subject: RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature Hi Lisa, Yes that is the section. I have found it very useful over the years. The other section I use quite frequently starts on page 465 in my copy and lists the churches and Freguesia they are in. Just curious did you by the copy and where did you get it and how much. It is very hard to find and the last time I saw one listed it was around $300. Rick Richard Francis Pimentel Epping, NH Researching, Riberia Grande, Riberinha, Achada Grande, Bretanha, and Ponta Delgada, Sao Miguel, Acores From: themom8682 via Azores Genealogy [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 7:06 PM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature Rick, I was able to get a copy of the book you reference, Azores Islands A History, and I'm wondering if the "standardized last name spellings" that you refer to is the list of names covering about 70 pages that is in a table format giving the Family Name, Name Derivation, Family Origin, and Family Armorial information. That is the only lengthy list of names I see that refers to families/general population. Thank you, Lisa Vierra Turrentine (and as you can see my family does not use the standardized spelling ;) ) On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:59:33 AM UTC-7, Richard Francis Pimentel wrote: I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways and he can be found. There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was spelled in the record. Rick From: azo...@googlegroups.com [mailto:azo...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Azores Genealogy group Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature G'day folks, Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean descendant how do I determine what's modern? Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple official documents where even in same document names have been spelt differently. Suggestions?. Tony -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+un...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
Hi Lisa, Yes that is the section. I have found it very useful over the years. The other section I use quite frequently starts on page 465 in my copy and lists the churches and Freguesia they are in. Just curious did you by the copy and where did you get it and how much. It is very hard to find and the last time I saw one listed it was around $300. Rick Richard Francis Pimentel Epping, NH Researching, Riberia Grande, Riberinha, Achada Grande, Bretanha, and Ponta Delgada, Sao Miguel, Acores From: themom8682 via Azores Genealogy [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 7:06 PM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature Rick, I was able to get a copy of the book you reference, Azores Islands A History, and I'm wondering if the "standardized last name spellings" that you refer to is the list of names covering about 70 pages that is in a table format giving the Family Name, Name Derivation, Family Origin, and Family Armorial information. That is the only lengthy list of names I see that refers to families/general population. Thank you, Lisa Vierra Turrentine (and as you can see my family does not use the standardized spelling ;) ) On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:59:33 AM UTC-7, Richard Francis Pimentel wrote: I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways and he can be found. There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was spelled in the record. Rick From: azo...@googlegroups.com [mailto:azo...@googlegroups.com ] On Behalf Of Azores Genealogy group Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature G'day folks, Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean descendant how do I determine what's modern? Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple official documents where even in same document names have been spelt differently. Suggestions?. Tony -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+un...@googlegroups.com . Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
Rick, I was able to get a copy of the book you reference, Azores Islands A History, and I'm wondering if the "standardized last name spellings" that you refer to is the list of names covering about 70 pages that is in a table format giving the Family Name, Name Derivation, Family Origin, and Family Armorial information. That is the only lengthy list of names I see that refers to families/general population. Thank you, Lisa Vierra Turrentine (and as you can see my family does not use the standardized spelling ;) ) On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:59:33 AM UTC-7, Richard Francis Pimentel wrote: > > *I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, > Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My > Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his > name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is > Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag > (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort > name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways > and he can be found.* > > *There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern > spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather > than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was > spelled in the record.* > > > > *Rick* > > > > *From:* azo...@googlegroups.com [mailto: > azo...@googlegroups.com ] *On Behalf Of *Azores Genealogy > group > *Sent:* Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM > *To:* Azores Genealogy > *Subject:* [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature > > > > G'day folks, > > > > Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever > using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but > what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean > descendant how do I determine what's modern? > > > > Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple > official documents where even in same document names have been spelt > differently. > > > > Suggestions?. > > > > Tony > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Azores Genealogy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to azores+un...@googlegroups.com . > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
No my family arrived in 1900 and were all in Massachusetts. Rick From: azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kim White Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2017 8:18 PM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature Thank you all for this thread on Paleography. Rick, do you happen to have an Ed. Pimentell in your tree? This person would have been living in the Hayward, California area in 1897. I have an old newspaper clipping with a picture of the "Forester's Band," "Haywards," taken in 1897. Along with a few of my ancestors, an "Ed. Pimentell" is named in the picture, too. Cheers, Kim On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:59:33 AM UTC-7, Richard Francis Pimentel wrote: I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways and he can be found. There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was spelled in the record. Rick From: azo...@googlegroups.com [mailto:azo...@googlegroups.com ] On Behalf Of Azores Genealogy group Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature G'day folks, Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean descendant how do I determine what's modern? Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple official documents where even in same document names have been spelt differently. Suggestions?. Tony -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+un...@googlegroups.com . Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
Thank you all for this thread on Paleography. Rick, do you happen to have an Ed. Pimentell in your tree? This person would have been living in the Hayward, California area in 1897. I have an old newspaper clipping with a picture of the "Forester's Band," "Haywards," taken in 1897. Along with a few of my ancestors, an "Ed. Pimentell" is named in the picture, too. Cheers, Kim On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:59:33 AM UTC-7, Richard Francis Pimentel wrote: > > *I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, > Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My > Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his > name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is > Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag > (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort > name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways > and he can be found.* > > *There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern > spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather > than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was > spelled in the record.* > > > > *Rick* > > > > *From:* azo...@googlegroups.com [mailto: > azo...@googlegroups.com ] *On Behalf Of *Azores Genealogy > group > *Sent:* Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM > *To:* Azores Genealogy > *Subject:* [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature > > > > G'day folks, > > > > Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever > using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but > what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean > descendant how do I determine what's modern? > > > > Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple > official documents where even in same document names have been spelt > differently. > > > > Suggestions?. > > > > Tony > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Azores Genealogy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to azores+un...@googlegroups.com . > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
I standardize last name spellings using James Guill’s list from Vol 5, Azores Islands a History. In this book he has listed SOUSA not Souza. My Genealogy program allows flexibility on names. My grandfather spelled his name Pimental, according to his Baptismal record the correct spelling is Pimentel. In my Genealogy program I entered his name as Pimental, As a Tag (name variation) I entered his name as Pimentel. I also entered his sort name as Pimental. This way when I search, his name will be listed both ways and he can be found. There is a list of first names that are the approved names and modern spellings in Portugal. I use the modern spellings for example Joao rather than Joam, Anna rather than Ana. I also make a note on how the name was spelled in the record. Rick From: azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Azores Genealogy group Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:18 AM To: Azores Genealogy Subject: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature G'day folks, Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean descendant how do I determine what's modern? Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple official documents where even in same document names have been spelt differently. Suggestions?. Tony -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
Tony you need to go to the AzoresGenWeb site and download the Basic Portuguese Paleography. In the center of the booklet it lists given names and surnames in the modern spellings. Also, James Guill's book *The History of the Azores , *if you could find a copy, has a section with surnames in the modern spellings. Check out the Terceira Marriage Index on the CCA site, they use the modern spellings. Rosemarie rcap...@gmail.com Researching Sao Jorge, Terceira, Graciosa, Faial and Pico, Azores, Isola delle Femmine, Sant' Elia, Sicily On Tue, Aug 8, 2017 at 1:18 AM, Azores Genealogy group < tony_amar...@hotmail.com> wrote: > G'day folks, > > Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever > using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but > what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean > descendant how do I determine what's modern? > > Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple > official documents where even in same document names have been spelt > differently. > > Suggestions?. > > Tony > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Azores Genealogy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
Tony A, You'll learn as you go along. Manoel de Souza is... Given name(s): Manuel de Last name: Sousa Da, de, do, d' are surname prefixes. They aren't part of the last name unless that person uses it today as their legal name (my cousin, Altino Demelo's last legal name is Demelo, so I have that way, but I tell my program to file him under the Ms). Anna is Ana. Many double consonants that were considered to be repetitive were dropped. So it's Ana now. I think there may be a small name list on the Azores Gen Web. Cheri Cheri Mello Listowner, Azores-Gen Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada On Tue, Aug 8, 2017 at 1:18 AM, Azores Genealogy group < tony_amar...@hotmail.com> wrote: > G'day folks, > > Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever > using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but > what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean > descendant how do I determine what's modern? > > Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple > official documents where even in same document names have been spelt > differently. > > Suggestions?. > > Tony > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Azores Genealogy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
[AZORES-Genealogy] Portuguese Nomenclature
G'day folks, Recently there has been discussion on using modern Portuguese whenever using family tree databases. I fully support such a standardisation but what is the definitive reference source document? As a non speaking Aorean descendant how do I determine what's modern? Examples to You use de Sousa or de Souza, Anna or Ana, I have multiple official documents where even in same document names have been spelt differently. Suggestions?. Tony -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
