Re: Fw: BdMax Bird Scare Results
Do you have any explanations or theories as to why BD preps would keep birds out of fully ripe fruit. Yes, and that thisis how I designed it in 1990 and that it worked first time. I dont think that we really need to twist reality. I am looking forward to the day thatmaterialistic science can no longer ignore these results and are pressed to ask how these remedies work. Something either works or it doesn't. Yes this is a wonderful thing about our present capitialism, isnt it. I dont really understand what your comparisons were. Obviously one was compared to water, which was statistically sinificant, but how did the trial compare to other methods of keeping birds out of the area. No other method was compared as far as I know. They all cost, and seeing as though we have no outside subsidies for research, just attaining these results are a significant development for us. Let's hear some more from others who are doing great things with BD preps, whether they are mainline conventional, or radionicists. Here Here GA ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow
Re: Can error be turned to advantage?
Dear Lloyd, Even although it appears from the purist philosophical base of dyed in the wool BD farmers, that there has been a catastrophy from the use of Superphosphate in the comparative trials of the TSR at Dalgetty I feel that what has happened opens the scope of the trials. It must be remembered that this is a long term trial. It is not just what happens in the first year. There is ample documentation (I hope) and photographsof the area at different stages. There is also abuot 50 soil samples from different areas of the block which were taken at the commencement of the trial What is important, in the light of the problems in the EUof using animal sheaves, is that the radionic preps have performed equal to if not better than the conventionallly sprayed and stirred BD preps. During a visit to the trial just prior to the pasture sowing it was commented by Project Coordinator that she observed noticeable differences between the different trials. It was quite obvious that the BD had outperformed the other trials and that there was a marked difference between conventional v BD. My opinion is that Superphosphate or rock phosphate would be beneficial to the land. When the protocols for the trial were being discussed I mentioned that it would be interesting to have a small test strip to test the effects of different additions such as Phosphorus, Zinc or/and Copper. This will probably be done in the second year. A further 550 acre trial is being conducted at Dalgetty on a property which is generally considered to be the worst on the Monaro. other trials that are programmed for this summer are: Aerial spraying of 25000 litres of radionically potentised pig pepper in the New England grazing country: and Aerial spraying of radionically prepared St Johns Wort pepper to further test the use of weed peppers. This will be sprayed in strips so we should be able to observe what happens. Weed peppers lend themselves to broadacre spraying because they are species specific and non toxic to stock. We certainly live in interesting times in Australia these days. James Hedley Lloyd Charles wrote: Hi Roger Boy is this feller a goose ! You have three paddocks ? The BD area is 20 hectares , compost 10 ha and conventional 10 ha - so he "inadvertantly" applies not only twice the amount to twice the area , he puts it on the wrong patch as well - hope nobody paid him for the days work! Yeah! I know you said sane and constructive but these accidents just seem to keep happening. Sane and Constructive According to what he wrote in his lectures Alex Podolinsky was quite prepared to allow small dressings of single superphosphate to kick start run down soils going into BD, only on a one off basis, He said we might need to provide a soluble feed for the first season (my wording) then rock phosphate would take over as the microbial life got into gear, P A Yeomans - probably Australias greatest soil man - also used small quantities of super and lime in similar fashion once only to get things going, this guy turned some horrid shale and slate country into wonderful pasture. OK these guys were using less than you have had spread but there's no choice about that. Along with the cadmium, lead, and mercury, you do get some nice sulphur and a little available calcium coming in with the phosphorus, all of which would probably show low on a soil test there?. Hopefully you have plenty of photos and a written report on the status of the plots up until the accident? some points 1. make sure that the conventional treatment definitely got at least an equivalent dose of super so that the comparison is still valid between BD and it 2 . Ban the perpetrator from the site before he causes any more havoc. 3. try to do some soil and tissue tests to show the difference in availability of nutrients between the two systems - you might be pleasantly surprised. 4. If Glyphosphate is used on the conventional area try to leave a small untreated test, and compare microbial indicators, tendency to crust, extra drying of the soil surface. And if there is a reasonable amount of green material sprayed and incorporated at seeding look very closely for reduced germination and emergence where the greenery was thickest I guarantee you will be unpleasantly surprised on all counts (or some of the farmers will be anyway). Cant think of anything else at the moment - its a shame and potentially a waste of money and time but no going back so you may as well get something from it. Cheers Lloyd Charles 1 ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow
Re: Can error be turned to advantage?
Hi James Thanks for your note. Even although it appears ---that there has been a catastrophy from the use of Superphosphate in the comparative trials of the TSR at Dalgetty I feel that what has happened opens the scope of the trials. It must be remembered that this is a long term trial. It is not just what happens in the first year. It has altered the rules part way through though and you now dont have a non supered area so a dressing of super has become part of the base treatment. Not a problem but a minor glitch. The real problem is in the carelessness of the person who made the mistake andjepoardised the whole thing. There is ample documentation (I hope) and photographsof the area at different stages. I was sure Roger would have this under control There is also abuot 50 soil samples from different areas of the block which were taken at the commencement of the trialWhat is important, in the light of the problems in the EUof using animal sheaves, is that the radionic preps have performed equal to if not better than the conventionallly sprayed and stirred BD preps. You know how I enjoy it when people write things like that last sentence! During a visit to the trial just prior to the pasture sowing it was commented by Project Coordinator that she observed noticeable differences between the different trials. It was quite obvious that the BD had outperformed the other trials and that there was a marked difference between conventional v BD. I think it would be a good idea to get a written report from the co ordinator stating that up until the accident. My opinion is that Superphosphate or rock phosphate would be beneficial to the land. Mine too! that granite country also seriously needs lime. They have been usingmolybdenum fortified super for generations to try and counter the lack of calcium and the trace element imbalances that come with it. Biggest problem with super phosphate is the lock up factor and the lack of cultivation - you end up with all the root system concentrated in the top couple of inches When the protocols for the trial were being discussed I mentioned that it would be interesting to have a small test strip to test the effects of different additions such as Phosphorus, Zinc or/and Copper. This will probably be done in the second year.A further 550 acre trial is being conducted at Dalgetty on a property which is generally considered to be the worst on the Monaro. You know that Monaro country isnt half as bad as you blokes think,when I lived up there the Dalgety shire claimed the highest wool cut per acre in NSW and had the figures to proove it. For twenty years the monaro sheep men flogged the socks off all comers in merino whether trialsall over the state,only lost out when high fine wool prices put them out of it. They are still the best medium and strong wool sheep in this country. Best weaner cattle in the country too! Weed peppers lend themselves to broadacre spraying because they are species specific and non toxic to stock. You'd hope that people will be a little forgiving when results are sometimes not up to their expectations - there are many turning to peppering as a last resort after chemicals have failed - its a big ask in some cases. We certainly live in interesting times in Australia these days. Sure do! Cheers Lloyd Charles ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow
Terminology as Medium as Message: GE/GM/GR/GP
Dear Allan, Steve, Peter (All), Thank you for your end-May replies (below) to my question on when to use the term genetically engineered and when modified. I am in accord that, rather than those two rather value-neutral terms, the ones you suggested -- hacked, prostituted, raped and muddled -- express the truth that this meddling with the very fundamentals of life is at best intrusive, at worst violent, and along that entire range, ending in confusion and destruction a la The Tower of Babel. (On that note, could it be that this Biblical symbol foretells what happens to Nature -- MUDDLED -- when information units of DNA get scattered/inserted ultimately willy-nilly into lifeforms they never were meant to inhabit, as they whisk across the countryside in the form of rogue genetically modified pollen that has escaped their fields of origin, and pollute nontarget lifeforms?) Hacked seems apt in its sugestion of unauthorized (=not in the spirit of life as it has evolved/been created) intrusion and manipulation of others' intellectual property -- namely the IP of God, or of the Universal Life Force (or however you want to conceptualize/feel it) and, ultimately, belonging to the Earth's peoples and animals and all lifeforms that depend for their/our survival, on Nature's Code as it has evolved over eons. Hacking can be seen as a sin of pride. Sin can be/has been, defined as, *separation* -- from God/fellow beings/divine order/Reality. Prostituted likewise suggests perverting and thereby damaging a holy lifeform (in the Christian tradition : The [all] body[/ies] is [are] the Temple[s] of the Holy Spirit), by taking what when in its apotheosis is the ultimate spiritual experience -- lovemaking -- and, by placing it in a one-sided market context, thereby debasing it. Prostitution is sin in its participants' separation from their own integrity as holy (integrated) bodymindsoul beings. Raped, suggesting the violence of taking what is not one's to take, and damaging -- perhaps beyond repair depending on the extent of the intrusion and the degree of strength both of the victim (human or animal/plant) and of the victim's outer support system (surrounding social in the case of humans and/or biological environment for both humans and animal/plants) -- also seems quite apropos. Rape is, short of murder, the worst sin of all, as it can completely ruin and destroy the ground of its victim such that the full, joyous (or miserable, but naturally so) life that victim was equipped at birth to participate in, becomes impossible (short of a miracle). All these terms, in short, seem to me very applicable to substitute for the more value-neutral engineered and modified. Not that anyone asked me to, but may I, however, propose that using genetically polluted in place of ANY of these (either conventional/neutral, or more truthful/value-imbued) terms, could have value to enhancing the penetration/carrying capacity, of anti-GE/GM movement messages? First of all, and perhaps least importantly, every time I write GE or GM, I think of General Electric and General Motors. As egregious as some of the activities of at least the former entity has been (e.g., PCB pollution of the Hudson River), they none of them rise, IMHO, to the level of destruction threatened by changing Earth's foodweb so fundamentally. These companies do not deserve to be implicated, even if only incidentally and only linguistically/acronymically, with the tarred brush of Genetic Pollution. Genetic Pollution, or GP, is a term that every Earth Citizen who has any awareness of the downward spiral of ecological destruction that our environment is sustaining (and it is said that most do have this awareness), will grok. The depth of one's bodymind understanding of what it means to his/her bodymind to live in a *chemically* polluted world, will, I believe, intuitively and naturally carry over, in the masses, to form the ground of an understanding of Genetic Pollution's threat to their and Earth's bodymind, on which the structure of it's harmful because of gut lesions (and whatever else the evidence shows GP food to do/be capable of) can be elaborated. I hope for feedback on this proposal (with apologies if it's already been made elsewhere). Now, as long as I'm proposing stuff, how's about electing Gerard Manley Hopkins, poet laureate of the anti-GP (I won't say forces as that has violent overtones, and we are a peace-loving people) hosts (as in heavenly)? See, for example, this paean to the purity of (unpolluted) Life: http://www.janushead.org/ Gerard Manley Hopkins The Windhover To Christ our Lord I caught this morning morning's minion king- dom of daylight's dauphin, dapple-dawn-drawn Falcon, in his riding Of the rolling level underneath him steady air, and striding High there, how he rung upon the rein of a wimpling wing In his ecstasy! Then off, off forth on swing, As a skate's heel
PS to Terminology as Medium as Message: GE/GM/GR/GP
P.S. I beg your pardon(s) on the url for the Gerard Manley Hopkins poem; it should have been http://www.janushead.org/4-1/windhover.cfm One must go to that page to see his line (inacurately rendered in my email as No wonder of it: shéer plód makes plough down sillion due to my computer's inability to translate accent marks used by Hopkins to make new words) as Hopkins meant it to be seen. Another of Hopkins' gems is at the same site. I see its message as echoing this (from --no doubt faulty-- memory) in The Matrix movies: You (we, each of us) are The One . As I paraphrase that to myself: Unique purpose individually for acting in concert with universal harmony in the grace that humility brings as instruments of divine will and power, as we live Reality-based Truth. http://www.janushead.org/4-1/kingfisher.cfm Gerard Manley Hopkins As kingfishers catch fire, dragonflies draw flame; As tumbled over rim and roundy wells Stones ring; like each tucked string tells, each hung bell's Bow swung finds tongue to fling out broad its name; Each mortal thing does one thing and the same: Deals out that being indoors each one dwells; Selves- goes itself; myself it speaks and spells, Crying What I do is me: for that I came. I say more: the just man justices; Keeps gráce: thát keeps all his goings graces; Acts in God's eye what in God's eye he is-- Chríst. For Christ plays in ten thousand places, Lovely in limbs, and lovely in eyes not his To the Father through the features of men's faces. ca.1882 After reading the above, I am lifted on a wave of feeling to believe that Steiner himself would nominate Hopkins poet-laureate to *Life*, let alone simply to the anti-GP movement! (please forgive me if I blaspheme) _ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow
Re: Can Error be turned to Advantage?
Hi Roger, Maybe a bit of lime, perhaps twice as much as the super added. One would need to consider what effect this would have in relation to other plots in the comparison and what the target designation of the land is to be at the conclusion of the trial. either way the experience needs to be capitalised on. Did / will the application have a short term detrimental effect on some paremeters or was there an improvement? Regards, Peter. - Original Message - From: Roger Pye [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 1:26 PM Subject: Can Error be turned to Advantage? A SE NSW project to compare three methods of revegetation of degraded landscape, namely Biodynamic, Compost Assisted, and Conventional, was recently compromised by the inadvertent application of superphosphate to the biodynamic portion. The project commenced in Nov 2001. Immediately prior to the application, the status of the trial was as follows: Biodynamic Paddock, approx 20 hectares. Nineteen hectares of this has received seven sprays of BD500 at BACA recommended rates and three of 501 ditto, the preps being supplied by the association and mixed using John Wilkes-style flowforms. The remaining hectare was included in the first of the above sprays (back-to-back 500/501) and then hand-sprayed with radionically prepared 500 501 at the same times as the others. In addition, the full paddock received three sprays of liquid soil conditioner (compost tea) prepared on site and applied at 100L per hectare between August and December last year. All of these formulations were completely natural, none contained or were assisted by chemicals. The latest site report (24 May 03) by the consultants (leaders in their field in the SE region) stated in part There is a marked improvement in the fertility present as compared to the conventional section over the time of the trial. The soils are slightly softer and better able to absorb water compared to the conventional site and as it all was at the beginning. Compost Assisted Paddock, approx 10 hectares. This has had one application of 30 tonnes of commercially produced compost applied in June last year and three sprays of the same liquid conditioner as above. Conventional Paddock, approx 10 hectares. This has had three sprays of the same liquid conditioner as above, mainly to keep it viable until seeding time. The plan called for weedicide to be applied before seeding (if required) and the application of superphosphate to encourage and facilitate growth. It is pointless crying over spilt milk. It is equally pointless to expend $A16K on a trial and then just walk away from it with nothing to show for the exercise. Accordingly, Project Management has recommended the occurrence be treated as an 'act of God' and incorporated into the plan, so that from now on the trial will be comparing the effect of Biodynamic substances plus a minimal amount of super with Compost Assisted and Conventional. This will give a four-way comparison at the scheduled end of the trial instead of three-way. The probability is that some farmers would decide to add super in any case to 'kick' any improvement along and this extended comparison could therefore be of considerable benefit one way or another. The purpose of this email is to invite sane and constructive comments on how BDNOW! members would handle the above scenario if placed in the same position as Project Management. Cheers Roger Natural Earth Healing Circle (Link 1, NSW) Ph / Fax: +61 2 6255 3824 Mob: +61 410 469 541 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://earth-careonline.com ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow ___ BDNow mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can unsubscribe or change your options at: http://lists.envirolink.org/mailman/listinfo/bdnow
