Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Hi Robert Is there an image available for the debian ReadonlyRoot for Beaglebone Black? https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Thanks Vic On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 7:39:28 AM UTC-8, RobertCNelson wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:31 AM, toni incog toni@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Still missing the point.. So in that case, you have ext4, and / mounted rw with noatime.. Let's say it's idle: It'll survive a few power yanks and fsck.ext4 will fix it up most of the time.. I'd say about a week before you'll have to reflash the eMMC to due file system corruption... Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Really anything then a week of unclean power down's, start looking at read only root* and other file systems. * We have a beagleboard-xm running on the roof of this building as a webcam taking pictures all day, it's been running (off/on) for over 3 years on the same microSD card running Debian Squeeze, on a read only rootfs.. It's powered by a solar array, so power is variable all day long.. https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Interesting, I will (also) look into ro root solution, thanks! Can I conclude that: 1. journaling ext4 is not as robust as me thought it was only capable of restoring limited damage 2. Yanking power is corrupting the fs, *not* the eMMC. 3. and therefor we can repair the fs by reflash the eMMC without any hardware damage done. thx, Michiel On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 4:39:28 PM UTC+1, RobertCNelson wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:31 AM, toni incog toni@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Still missing the point.. So in that case, you have ext4, and / mounted rw with noatime.. Let's say it's idle: It'll survive a few power yanks and fsck.ext4 will fix it up most of the time.. I'd say about a week before you'll have to reflash the eMMC to due file system corruption... Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Really anything then a week of unclean power down's, start looking at read only root* and other file systems. * We have a beagleboard-xm running on the roof of this building as a webcam taking pictures all day, it's been running (off/on) for over 3 years on the same microSD card running Debian Squeeze, on a read only rootfs.. It's powered by a solar array, so power is variable all day long.. https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Robert On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 7:39:28 AM UTC-8, RobertCNelson wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:31 AM, toni incog toni@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Still missing the point.. So in that case, you have ext4, and / mounted rw with noatime.. Let's say it's idle: It'll survive a few power yanks and fsck.ext4 will fix it up most of the time.. I'd say about a week before you'll have to reflash the eMMC to due file system corruption... Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Really anything then a week of unclean power down's, start looking at read only root* and other file systems. * We have a beagleboard-xm running on the roof of this building as a webcam taking pictures all day, it's been running (off/on) for over 3 years on the same microSD card running Debian Squeeze, on a read only rootfs.. It's powered by a solar array, so power is variable all day long.. https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Is there such a debian image available for beaglebone black ? Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 7:39:28 AM UTC-8, RobertCNelson wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:31 AM, toni incog toni@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Still missing the point.. So in that case, you have ext4, and / mounted rw with noatime.. Let's say it's idle: It'll survive a few power yanks and fsck.ext4 will fix it up most of the time.. I'd say about a week before you'll have to reflash the eMMC to due file system corruption... Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Really anything then a week of unclean power down's, start looking at read only root* and other file systems. * We have a beagleboard-xm running on the roof of this building as a webcam taking pictures all day, it's been running (off/on) for over 3 years on the same microSD card running Debian Squeeze, on a read only rootfs.. It's powered by a solar array, so power is variable all day long.. https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 7:39:28 AM UTC-8, RobertCNelson wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:31 AM, toni incog toni@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Still missing the point.. So in that case, you have ext4, and / mounted rw with noatime.. Let's say it's idle: It'll survive a few power yanks and fsck.ext4 will fix it up most of the time.. I'd say about a week before you'll have to reflash the eMMC to due file system corruption... Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Really anything then a week of unclean power down's, start looking at read only root* and other file systems. * We have a beagleboard-xm running on the roof of this building as a webcam taking pictures all day, it's been running (off/on) for over 3 years on the same microSD card running Debian Squeeze, on a read only rootfs.. It's powered by a solar array, so power is variable all day long.. https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. thx, Michiel On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 4:11:20 PM UTC+1, RobertCNelson wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:05 AM, toni incog toni@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Assume you mean: ... without /un/mounting the drives under Linux. Is there any data (or guesses) on how many times I can power down without unmounting before the eMMC is going to the dodo? Well... This guess needs more data.. Is the partition ro? What file system? etc etc... So without any of the important data, I'll give you the best answer: zero... Yeap zero chance of a 100% data match of data on the drive right before you yank power... Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Assume you mean: ... without /un/mounting the drives under Linux. Is there any data (or guesses) on how many times I can power down without unmounting before the eMMC is going to the dodo? thx, Michiel On Thursday, January 22, 2015 at 8:24:44 PM UTC+1, Gerald wrote: Most common is powering off the board without mounting the drives under Linux. Gerald On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 3:00 PM, bgb...@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Please reference paragraph 5.10 on p37 of BBB SRM. Does memory device contamination occur due to open files in the Linux OS, or due to improperly sequenced power to a memory devices inadvertently writing to a memory device? Thanks, Bruce -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard...@googlegroups.com javascript:. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- Gerald ger...@beagleboard.org javascript: http://beagleboard.org/ http://circuitco.com/support/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:05 AM, toni incog toni.in...@gmail.com wrote: Assume you mean: ... without /un/mounting the drives under Linux. Is there any data (or guesses) on how many times I can power down without unmounting before the eMMC is going to the dodo? Well... This guess needs more data.. Is the partition ro? What file system? etc etc... So without any of the important data, I'll give you the best answer: zero... Yeap zero chance of a 100% data match of data on the drive right before you yank power... Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 9:31 AM, toni incog toni.in...@gmail.com wrote: Sure, let's say just your latest greatest debian kernel 3.14 running headless doing nothing only being great? Still missing the point.. So in that case, you have ext4, and / mounted rw with noatime.. Let's say it's idle: It'll survive a few power yanks and fsck.ext4 will fix it up most of the time.. I'd say about a week before you'll have to reflash the eMMC to due file system corruption... Any experiences with broken eMMCs? How important is using a backup battery in a daily unclean power down situation. What's your feeling: days, weeks, months, years, decades? Really anything then a week of unclean power down's, start looking at read only root* and other file systems. * We have a beagleboard-xm running on the roof of this building as a webcam taking pictures all day, it's been running (off/on) for over 3 years on the same microSD card running Debian Squeeze, on a read only rootfs.. It's powered by a solar array, so power is variable all day long.. https://wiki.debian.org/ReadonlyRoot Hmmm, I guess I've some work to do in shutting down some bbb's properly otherwise I can answer my own question. Thinking aloud a battery and bringing the power button external. Regards, -- Robert Nelson http://www.rcn-ee.com/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
[beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Please reference paragraph 5.10 on p37 of BBB SRM. Does memory device contamination occur due to open files in the Linux OS, or due to improperly sequenced power to a memory devices inadvertently writing to a memory device? Thanks, Bruce -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [beagleboard] Contamination, SD or eMMC, Root Cause
Most common is powering off the board without mounting the drives under Linux. Gerald On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 3:00 PM, bgb...@gmail.com wrote: Please reference paragraph 5.10 on p37 of BBB SRM. Does memory device contamination occur due to open files in the Linux OS, or due to improperly sequenced power to a memory devices inadvertently writing to a memory device? Thanks, Bruce -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- Gerald ger...@beagleboard.org http://beagleboard.org/ http://circuitco.com/support/ -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BeagleBoard group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
