Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
I made the mistake of feeding all stock protein tubs to my sheep this summer when the grass was lush with moisture. i figured the grass had too much water in it to be nutritious. I lost 2 to enterotoxemia or tetanus or clostridium or whatever you want to call it. I covered the tubs and have had no problems. Right now they are eating corn fiber pellets and oat hay, prairie hay, triticale hay and johnson hay free choice. They seem to make the rounds eating a little of each. They really like that oat hay though... Little rascals are getting fat in the worst winter we have had on record so far.. Cecil in OKla - Original Message - From: "Julian Hale" To: Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 5:39 PM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots At 06:48 PM 1/24/2010, I wrote: Giving a ewe a CD/T shot every 2nd or 3rd year, a month or two before breeding time would probably be perfectly adequate to confer (temporary) immunity to the lambs. IMO, lambs should not receive any vaccines prior to 8 weeks, and 12 weeks would be better. The mother's colostrum provides immunity longer than that, and the young lamb's immune system is not able to make use of a vaccine prior to ~8 weeks anyway. So a shot at 12 weeks, one at 15-16 weeks, and if they are staying a booster around 1 year old. Julian OK, I have to modify that advice somewhat. I came across this: http://www.goatworld.com/articles/enterotoxemia/enterotoxemia3.shtml But any older animal that has not had its yearly boosters is at risk, as is a yearling that did not receive at least 2 vaccinations no earlier than 2 months of age AND a booster at 6 months of age, thus has NO antibodies left at 1 year of age! It's a good article. It's target toward goat owners, so it's not 100% applicable to sheep, but worth reading. I lost a goat yesterday to what I believe was enterotoxemia. I probably could have saved her if I'd had the anti-toxin on hand, so I strongly advise everybody to buy some. It's cheap insurance. Here's another good article: http://www.jackmauldin.com/health/enterotoxaemia.htm Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
At 06:48 PM 1/24/2010, I wrote: >Giving a ewe a CD/T shot every 2nd or 3rd year, a month or two before breeding >time would probably be perfectly adequate to confer (temporary) immunity to >the lambs. IMO, lambs should not receive any vaccines prior to 8 weeks, and >12 weeks would be better. The mother's colostrum provides immunity longer >than that, and the young lamb's immune system is not able to make use of a >vaccine prior to ~8 weeks anyway. So a shot at 12 weeks, one at 15-16 weeks, >and if they are staying a booster around 1 year old. > >Julian OK, I have to modify that advice somewhat. I came across this: http://www.goatworld.com/articles/enterotoxemia/enterotoxemia3.shtml >But any older animal that has not had its yearly boosters is at risk, as is a >yearling that did not receive at >least 2 vaccinations no earlier than 2 months of age AND a booster at 6 months >of age, thus has NO >antibodies left at 1 year of age! It's a good article. It's target toward goat owners, so it's not 100% applicable to sheep, but worth reading. I lost a goat yesterday to what I believe was enterotoxemia. I probably could have saved her if I'd had the anti-toxin on hand, so I strongly advise everybody to buy some. It's cheap insurance. Here's another good article: http://www.jackmauldin.com/health/enterotoxaemia.htm Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
At 09:21 AM 1/24/2010, you wrote: >Julian > >My primary concern is any negative effect on the lams or ewes because of the >ewes getting the shot too close to laming time. Do you know if there can be >bad effects to the lams/ewes or just the potential of the lams not getting the >full effect? > >Thanks, > >Dave It's possible, but unlikely, that a vaccine could cause abortion or other problems. Some are notorious for causing injection site reactions and other problems, but CD/T is generally pretty safe. I was concerned with the H1N1 paranoia focusing on pregnant women that expecting mothers would have a lot of reactions to the shot, but it looks like I was worried for nothing. Frankly, no research has been done to see how long these shots are good for, so we don't know. For instance, the rabies shot in dogs is good for 5+ years(some say well over 5 years). Giving a ewe a CD/T shot every 2nd or 3rd year, a month or two before breeding time would probably be perfectly adequate to confer (temporary) immunity to the lambs. IMO, lambs should not receive any vaccines prior to 8 weeks, and 12 weeks would be better. The mother's colostrum provides immunity longer than that, and the young lamb's immune system is not able to make use of a vaccine prior to ~8 weeks anyway. So a shot at 12 weeks, one at 15-16 weeks, and if they are staying a booster around 1 year old. Vaccines have the potential to cause auto-immune disease and other problems, so you want to give as few shots in their lifetime as you can but still maintain immunity. Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT
I am very much a novice agrarian of only three years and have much to learn and have no problem taking correction or suggestions from any one but I believe I am starting to see a pattern with many of the vaccinations and allot of the miscellaneous supplements I see advertised with sheep, cattle, horses, etc. Please correct me if I am in error or any one has a different experience. It seems to me that many issues come from mixing and matching and even feed lot or commercial type environments. I know from many years in my regular profession that much of what is published as the latest and greatest is done so to make money. Am I connecting these errantly or am I seeing what those who have had many more years dealing with sheep, etc already know? Respectfully, Dave - Original Message - From: "Curtis Yeschke" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 4:33 PM Subject: [Blackbelly] CDT How about this: I didn't even know what CDT was. Needless to say, that's one shot they don't get. I use a syringe as a drench, minus the needle, for ivomac, the cheap, off brand. The only shots that I give are antibiotics, that's if they have snotty noses or look "off", and B- complex, if I think they need that extra boost of energy to help them pull out of it. So far, I've lost only one sheep to worms, and she was an auction house buy, and one to an unknown illness, again, auction house buy...though there are quite a few losses due to coyotes. I haven't lost any since because they get antibiotics, worker, and B- complex when they are unloaded. Curtis ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
[Blackbelly] CDT
How about this: I didn't even know what CDT was. Needless to say, that's one shot they don't get. I use a syringe as a drench, minus the needle, for ivomac, the cheap, off brand. The only shots that I give are antibiotics, that's if they have snotty noses or look "off", and B- complex, if I think they need that extra boost of energy to help them pull out of it. So far, I've lost only one sheep to worms, and she was an auction house buy, and one to an unknown illness, again, auction house buy...though there are quite a few losses due to coyotes. I haven't lost any since because they get antibiotics, worker, and B- complex when they are unloaded. Curtis ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
Boy it is confusing isn't it. You will kind of have to work with what you need. I do not give CDT at all. I have a lot of acreage for the stock to run on. And that is one of the factors you will need to consider. Nor do I feed grain to the barbadoes.They do get pellets also a vitiman/mineral block and a sulphur/salt block. Cattle and goats use the same blocks. During fall/winter I also put out loose mineral for all animals. Neither goats (kids) or sheep(lambs) get vaccinated. I have lost 1 goat to tetanus. If there were any horses on the land, there will be tetanus in the soil forever. There were horses here. I think that the diseases that is mostly overlooked when bringing new animals into a flock are the sexually transmitted diseases: Vibrio, clamidia,brucelosis, etc. The flock here has been closed for many years. You will need to so a lot of reading and trial and error to find what works best. The list is great for ideas but then you will have to see what works. Thanks for your efforts Rhonda - Original Message - From: "Dave Andrus" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 1:34 PM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots Another question on top of my other question...Of those who give CDT shots when do you give them to ewes and lambs? I have heard two different scenarios 1) give the shot to the ewe 4 to 6 wks before lambs. I don't know if the lamb should also have the shot with this scenario 2) give the shots to the ewe before breeding then the lamb within 24 hrs after birth. Any input will be appreciated. Dave - Original Message - From: "Dave Andrus" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 10:21 AM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots Julian My primary concern is any negative effect on the lams or ewes because of the ewes getting the shot too close to laming time. Do you know if there can be bad effects to the lams/ewes or just the potential of the lams not getting the full effect? Thanks, Dave - Original Message - From: "Julian Hale" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 12:03 AM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots At 05:39 PM 1/23/2010, you wrote: My ewes are going to start to lamb in about 30 days is it too late to give them CDT shots? TIA, Dave Between 21 and 28 days before lambing would be the most effective time to do this. It takes 21 days from the shot to achieve full immune response, that's why vaccines say to wait 21-28 days between doses. Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/756 - Release Date: 2/4/2008 12:00 AM ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
Another question on top of my other question...Of those who give CDT shots when do you give them to ewes and lambs? I have heard two different scenarios 1) give the shot to the ewe 4 to 6 wks before lambs. I don't know if the lamb should also have the shot with this scenario 2) give the shots to the ewe before breeding then the lamb within 24 hrs after birth. Any input will be appreciated. Dave - Original Message - From: "Dave Andrus" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 10:21 AM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots Julian My primary concern is any negative effect on the lams or ewes because of the ewes getting the shot too close to laming time. Do you know if there can be bad effects to the lams/ewes or just the potential of the lams not getting the full effect? Thanks, Dave - Original Message - From: "Julian Hale" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 12:03 AM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots At 05:39 PM 1/23/2010, you wrote: My ewes are going to start to lamb in about 30 days is it too late to give them CDT shots? TIA, Dave Between 21 and 28 days before lambing would be the most effective time to do this. It takes 21 days from the shot to achieve full immune response, that's why vaccines say to wait 21-28 days between doses. Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
Julian My primary concern is any negative effect on the lams or ewes because of the ewes getting the shot too close to laming time. Do you know if there can be bad effects to the lams/ewes or just the potential of the lams not getting the full effect? Thanks, Dave - Original Message - From: "Julian Hale" To: Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 12:03 AM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots At 05:39 PM 1/23/2010, you wrote: My ewes are going to start to lamb in about 30 days is it too late to give them CDT shots? TIA, Dave Between 21 and 28 days before lambing would be the most effective time to do this. It takes 21 days from the shot to achieve full immune response, that's why vaccines say to wait 21-28 days between doses. Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
At 05:39 PM 1/23/2010, you wrote: >My ewes are going to start to lamb in about 30 days is it too late to give >them CDT shots? > >TIA, > >Dave Between 21 and 28 days before lambing would be the most effective time to do this. It takes 21 days from the shot to achieve full immune response, that's why vaccines say to wait 21-28 days between doses. Julian ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] CDT shots
My ewes are going to start to lamb in about 30 days is it too late to give them CDT shots? TIA, Dave ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
