Re: Soldapullt original vs III

[drlegendre .]

I've used Hakko vacuum de-soldering stations, and will agree that - at
least for production work - they are superior. But most of my handwork and
re-work has been with spring-loaded solder suckers, and here's what I've
found.

The full-size 'Soldapult' devices are probably the best of the bunch, in
terms of both vacuum power and displacement. They're also easier than some
to clear out. Now having said this, I will NEVER again buy a genuine Edsyn
Soldapult tool, after my experience with that company.  It went like this:

Bought a brand-new full-size Soldapult at +retail+ from an auth'd
distributor. It worked for exactly around 20 minutes until it broke,
totally. Said distributor +refused+ to take it back, told me to contact the
manufacturer (and you'll see why, next). Contacted Edsyn and they simply
refused to warranty it - period - no matter what.. I even told them exactly
what went wrong and asked for the (simple) parts I'd need to repair it.

Nope! Sorry! Nada.

Then I got on the eBay and bought 2X of the China knock-offs plus 4X spare
tips, which have been working fine now for 7-8 yrs. I put my faith in Edsyn
and they just gave me the fat finger. Heck with that outfit.

On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 9:00 PM, Eric Smith  wrote:

> On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 7:33 PM, dwight  wrote:
>
> > It is interesting, I do take longer with the hand tools but I've never
> > seen as much damage as with a desoldering type iron.
> > The tips are too small to hold a good tin and the suction cools the
> > joint too fast.
> >
> > Doing it with regular irom and a pullit does take skill. One has to know
> > how to work the pin and the iron. One has to know when a pin is
> > desoldered by feel.
> >
>
> I've always had mediocre results at best when using a separate sucker, and
> good results with a vacuum desoldering station. I use a Hakko 472D-01, and
> it works beautifully. I've desoldered thousands of connections with it, and
> have never had any damage to PCBs or components.  I have two different size
> tips for it, and haven't had any issue with the tip tinning. Once the
> solder melts and you hit the button, it extracts the solder far faster than
> it can cool, so I've never had any problem with cooling the joint to
> quickly.
>
> Patience is also required.
> >
>
> Patience is almost always a good idea, but it's not required with a good
> vacuum desoldering station. Last fall I installed a DIN 41612 connector on
> the wrong side of a board, and only discovered that after soldering more
> than half of the 96 pins. I thought it was going to be a nightmare removing
> it, but the Hakko made short work of it (less than 5 minutes), and it came
> out very cleanly.
>
> Hakko says that the replacement for the discontinued 472D-01 (110W) is the
> FR410-03 (140W), and it looks like a nice unit, but it is much more
> expensive. The FM-204 (70W) would be easier on the budget, but I haven't
> tried it, so I have no idea whether the reduced wattage would be an issue.
>
> Some people may be unaware that with temperature-controlled soldering
> equipment, more wattage is almost always better.  That is NOT true for
> uncontrolled (or poorly controlled) soldering equipment, such as cheap
> soldering pencils; with those it's quite possible and easy to damage
> boards, as a consequence of either too little or too much wattage.
>
> Eric
>

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Pete Lancashire]

Currently about the only thing remaining I would come close to being
rare is a IBM 360/55 Front panel, spent $300+100 shipping in the early
to mid 90's for it.

I have a Tektronix 6130 that as an (ex) employee were were able to
build at cost. The 6130 is pretty much the same as a 4132

Does a prototype Sparc-1 Pizza box qualify ? Came from a friend who
worked for Sun.


How about use to own ?

I had a shop that burned down to the ground. In it were three Tek
6205's one fully working and the rare of the rare a Tek 6210 with 3
CPU boards, and a CDC SMD disk drive that went with the 6210, plus
about 4 boxes of boards and still. one box in it had a prototype 6400
CPU, the 64xx was a bitslice + custom logic CPU that emulated a
National CPU but a lot faster. Also in that shop was a pretty much
unused IBM 129.

Use to own a PDP 11/40 (the big box version) that consisted of 4
racks, got it for $100 + truck rental + pizza for two friends. one
rack was the controller for two RP03 disk drives, another rack were 6
RK05's, a DEC TU?? in the third, the 4th I emptied, was full of serial
line cards,   CPU plus a tape reader and punch in the 5th, other
external stuff were a couple CDC 80MB SMD drives, a IBM Card reader,
and two line printers, it filled 1/2 of a 1000 sq foot basement. Long
story but I gave it away when I moved. When I got the CDC's I never
used the RP's again, but since they were so heavy they stayed until it
went away.





On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 2:11 PM, Ken Seefried  wrote:
> From: "Rick Bensene" 
>>
>> - A Tektronix 4132 Unix workstation  using a National 32016 CPU and a
>> 4.2bsd port called UTek
>
> Those seem quite rare now, especially if it works.  You should
> preserve an image of UTek if possible.  Any chance you have the
> install media?
>
> KJ
>

RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[John GEREMIN - Engineer]

Greetings from Australia, 'Down Under' and the Australian Computer Museum 
Society Inc.


Congratulations to Jay on his working HP-2000s.

I bought my HP-2000f from Liverpool Hospital (NSW) in the early 1980s for 
either $5,000 or $10,000.
A lot of money in those days - I had a crazy idea of setting up some sort 
of bureau.

I got it home (in a terrace in Chippendale) in two trips. Plus heaps of doco.
I re-assembled it, put in a switch for selectable baud rate on the console 
port.

Later the power supply for the disk failed and has not been repaired.
It now sits in the HP Museum in Melbourne, VIC. See www.HPmuseum.net home page.

The HP Museum is a vast store of HP information and artefacts.
Sadly, the curator/originator Jon Johnston died last year on Mt Everest.
His memorial service will be held next month, contact me for details.

Regards,  John GEREMIN, i...@acms.org.au


--

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2017 12:02:26 -0600
From: "Jay West" 
To: "'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'"

Subject: RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item
do you own? [Tek 4132]
Message-ID: <000201d26f59$87e1cb60$97a56220$@classiccmp.org>
Content-Type: text/plain;   charset="utf-8"

I'd have to say my HP-2000 systems that are running are the rarest that 
I'm aware of. I know of a few folks who have various bits and pieces 
towards assembling one, but not complete. I know two collectors who (each) 
have most if not all of the parts, but the systems are far from 
operational and likely never will be.


So I fairly strongly suspect that my running HP-2000's are the only ones 
left, anywhere. I have one HP-2000/Access system using dual 2100A/S cpus 
with HP paper tape readers and punches, another HP-2000/Access system 
using dual 21MX/E's, and an HP-2000/E using one 21MX. Each of those have 
their own 7900, 7906 disc drives and 7970 (not the 2000/E) tape units.


I think the most I ever paid for a system at once was $1500 for a 
"system", and about $2000 for a pallet of two incomplete systems. But in 
order to get the 3 HP-2000 systems mentioned above and running, I'm sure 
it's edged uncomfortably into the 5 digit range.


All the other systems in my collection, while perhaps highly sought 
after... there are tens if not hundreds of identical systems in other 
collectors hands.


J



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Michael Thompson]

I have two Sun 386i systems. It has an Intel 386 processor and runs SunOS.
Not exactly a big seller for Sun. I met some of the designers at the Vintage
Computer Festival East 2.0 in Burlington, MA.

-- 
Michael Thompson

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Leif Johansson]

On 2017-01-16 21:42, Chris Hanson wrote:
> On Jan 12, 2017, at 12:12 PM, Leif Johansson  wrote:
>>
>> I saved one of the MIT CADR top-of-rack plates (the one with the logo
>> and a sticker from the lab on it). Me and peter recently discovered
>> he saved the rest of the box. Will probably reunite at some point :-)
> 
> Nice! Any media/storage with it too, or just the system itself?

dunno

> 
> The full software stack for the CADR is available so even if you don’t have 
> storage or media, if you could interface something emulating what it expects, 
> the system could be brought back to life.

kewl!

door hinges needed for hp racks

[Evan Koblentz]

Vintage Computer Federation just got this:

http://vcfed.org/evan/hpmini.jpg

We have the left/right cabinet doors, but the cabinets are missing all 
of the hinges where the door pins sit. Does anybody have spares?

Re: 8085 IO ports

[allison]

On 01/16/2017 08:37 PM, Adrian Graham wrote:
> On 15/01/2017 16:59, "allison"  wrote:
>
>>> I've thought of that which is why I'm chasing down details on the Viewdata
>>> chip and the D8741A which I assume is being used as a keyboard controller.
>>> There are also 3 modules on the phone side which I can't find anything
>>> about, marked "NKT NMC1515", NMC1516 and NMC1517.
>> 8741A is likely keyboard controller.  FYI its the eprom version of 8041A
>> (the a is important). That part is easy to dump the EPROM and analyse as its
> only 1K.
>
> Yep, done that fortunately. My MQP programmer can read it and also the PAL
> that does the ROM selection so I know they're both OK.
>>  
>> You can use a 8048 disasembler on that, nearly the same part save for
>> the slave IO structure and a few instructions.
> Glen Slick has already done that for me, much better results than what I
> could get out of the d48 disassembler.
>
>> So its possible to use those pins (4 of them) as inputs without interrupts
>> on all or none as you can read their state.  RST7.4 is also special as
>> its edge
>> triggered (and transition activates it and it sets a latch) so unlike
>> the other
>> the state of the pin can be a pulse rather than a LEVEL.
> OK, that might explain why there's only two entry points for those interrupt
> pins in the code.
>  
>> So it seems there is a keyboard interrupt and video (scan line) interrupt
>> plus the RTC (time keeping and ?).  You also have phone line events in
>> there.
> Tonight I discovered the D8741A is a controller for the little microcassette
> unit that's seriously not well with rust and damaged/rotted/exploded caps :/
>  
>> FYI the software structure is familiar and likely straight out of the
>> book for the 8085.
>> You are preserving cpu status (AC-PSW), BC, DE, HL pairs, then working
>> on the interrupt event.
> OK.
>
>>> Ok, it never gets interrupted then.
>> You would also see /INTA (interrupt acknowledge) trigger.
> I don't remember seeing that when I was monitoring all the control lines and
> I've just noticed on my drawings I've left out INTA, must rectify that.
>  
>> Do find a copy (its definitely on line) of the 8085 users manual,
>> september 1978
> I'll have a look for that at work tomorrow, there's every chance we've got
> it in the library.


http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/intel/MCS80/MCS80_85_Users_Manual_Jan83.pdf

That's the later 1983 version but its the book you want.  

>> It really sounds like the unit suffered a high voltage transient
>> (lighting, ESD, power supply
>> over voltage).
> Yeah, the previous owner did power it up and got smoke but I thought that
> was just the RIFA mains filter popping. Currently I'm up to 6 replaced chips
> that all had dead inputs and the startup opamp (ICL7611). Fortunately the
> non-replaceable ones are OK.
>
> On the tape drive controller board are a pair of very messy 25V caps that I
> thought had rotted because of damp - the tape transport itself is probably
> beyond saving through rust - but could they have exploded I wonder.
>  
Likely history but if the parts move and the head is ok then clean it
really well
replace the caps and try.

>> of TTL across 12 boards to bring it back to life.  The only MOS device
>> (had a hole in it)
>> was a 8251A USART to the H19 terminal (also toasted).  Z80 was still
>> good and still
>> in that system working to this day (along with a 8085A subprocessor).
> Strewth, that's some troubleshooting effort!

I had bought the Netronics explorer 8085 just before that bolt.  That
gave me
a S100 chassis that would run even bad cards (think SDK85 with S100 bus
interface).
That made it possible to go a card at a time for function and level of
function.
Figure maybe 250 more more hours to get it running again and almost a year
chasing random failures that were overstress induced.  I still use that
machine
after dumping the 8kx8 cards for a larger 64K static it has performed well.
Around 1980 it went through a series of mods and adds to upgrade it to
multiporcessor.

>> Sockets on the other hand have caused me no small amount of bedevilment.
>> If its not machined pin and old its likely trouble.
> I do wonder about the sockets though they're all turned pin. The RAM refresh
> and first ROM socket were badly verdigris'd with the battery leaking all
> over that part of the board but they test OK with a DMM.
>  
The turned pin are heavy and will stand that the copper under them
or leading to them may be gone

FYI vinegar or lemon juice will neutralize it, the battery (likely nicd)
is alkaline.
Rinse with water and dry.
 Hummm...  4116 dram, that means you have external refresh logic or they are
 going cheap and doing refersh on a interrupt (or maybe) timed loop.
>>> There's an MC2342A doing the refresh and that's looking OK now that I've
>>> swapped it. The original chip had no working outputs.
>> Ok, blown  that make what I said earlier of a ESD incident likely.
>> Check the DRAM too

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 07:39:00PM -0500, Michael Thompson wrote:
> I have two Sun 386i systems. It has an Intel 386 processor and runs SunOS.
> Not exactly a big seller for Sun. I met some of the designers at the Vintage
> Computer Festival East 2.0 in Burlington, MA.

I like this machine just because it has the signatures of the designers 
on the inside :)

/P

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[Tom Watson]

Most unusual:

I've got a complete card deck of Witran for the IBM 1620.  Witran is an 
interpretive Fortran compiler (not even Fortran II) that was load & go.  It was 
written in 1964.

Somewhere I have a listing as well.

Yes, it goes back a ways.

Re: Close encounters of the CADR kind

[Alfred M. Szmidt]

   Noel Chiappa wrote:
   > My memory of the CONS machine is that, like the Chess Machine, it was
   > a special purpose CPU hung off the AI PDP-10. (Or maybe the Chess
   > Machine was attached to MC? I forget.)

   Would that Chess Machine be the one called CHEOPS?

   And oh, since I may have the attention of LispM hackers, I'll take this
   opportutity to ask what CAIOS was?  It seems intimately related to
   Chaosnet.  Maybe an earlier name for Chaos, or a Chaosnet hardware device?

CHAOS;ARC 1 contains some interesting bits, not that they make it
clearer.  Early name for Chaos?

PDP10 CAIOS 2037 EDT  Saturday, 10 July 1976
DAM

   It seems more reasonable for ML to have an interface on it directly
than to use e.g. a crufty DL10.  Maybe other 10s want to go direct, 
also?

   What needs to be done to attach a caios net interface directly
to a pdp10 I/O bus, rather than via an 11.

   Both ML and MC have open-collector type TTL I/O buses.  The cable
requirements are a little different, but otherwise they appear to
be about the same.  The ML one terminates in the Morton box.  The MC one
starts at the impterface and doesn't go anywhere at the moment.
Probably two cables could be arranged that presented the same interface
at one end, and at the other end one had DEC connectors with the ML
pinout, and the other had Augat-board connectors with the MC pinout.
As far as I know AI doesn't have a TTL I/O bus (i.e. a set of level
converters designed for more than one device.)  Should it be given
one or should it work through one or more pdp11s?  DM has one, but
who cares?

   [F once said something about using tristate for the MC TTL I/O
bus, but according to the prints it's unibus-style open collector.]

   Putting a caios net interface on a 10 seems pretty easy since it 
needn't
use DMA or even hairy interrupts; as on the 11 the data can be copied
in and out of the buffer under program control.  The data probably ought
to go in and out in 32 bit chunks rather than 16.  One problem is there
is no SSYN on the I/O bus.  The receive and transmit buffers shift one
bit each tick of the 8 MHz clock, so it would take 4 micro seconds to
do it.  On the transmit side, a DATAO AOBJN loop might possibly be too
fast, although there is supposed to be only one I/O bus operation every
4 micro seconds (is this true on the KL?  I seem to recall some "fast
I/O bus" option.)

   On the receive side, the way the current interface works is when
the 11 reads from CAIRBF, it stalls the 11 while the bits are shifted
out of the RAM into the 16-bit shift register, then when the bits
are in the shift register gives SSYN.  On a pdp10 the processor would
expect the bits to be there 1 usec after it gave the DATAI signal,
which isn't enough time.  One possibility is to change the design
so the bits shift after the DATAI instead of before.  Then the first
DATAI would input garbage, but initiate shifting in of the first data
word which the second DATAI would pick up.  Again, if the 10 was in
a DATAI AOBJN loop it might DATAI faster than the interface could shift
the bits over.

   One way to add delay to insure that the 10 doesn't DATAI or DATAO
too fast is to require a CONI in that loop.  The receive side might
want one anyway so it could check whether it had read the whole message
yet.

   Another detail is the pdp11 versus pdp10 byte reversal lossage.  I
suggest there be a CONO'able flag which controls multiplexors to and
from the I/O bus so that the 10 can select either to have the bits
in correct order for 16-bit bytes or for 8-bit bytes.  So it would
read or write the header of a packet in 16-bit mode, switch to 8-bit
mode for the data, and switch back to 16-bit mode for the trailer (the
destination/source/crc words).  All this time it would be transferring
32 bits on each I/O bus cycle.

   Another problem is that the source my# kludge which works by
putting the number on the unibus and reading it back wouldn't work
because of the 32 bit words (maybe other reasons, too.)  This could
be changed.  E.g. a "last word" CONO bit which is set before the
DATAO.  Then the 10 can DATAO a word with the destination # in the
high 16 bits and the hardware can fill in the source # in the low 
16 bits.

   There needn't be any provision for the 10 to send or receive messages
not a multiple of 32 bits long.  Actually, messages will be a multiple
of 32 data bits + 32 bi

AW: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Gottfried Specht]

A HP 1300A 13" XY Display (S/N 921-00913).

This is the Product that Dave Packard gave the "HP Medal of Defiance" to Chuck 
House for (see his excellent book " The HP Phenomenon: Innovation and Business 
Transformation"). In Chucks own words: 

" The new applications for this display box were compelling.  It became the 
first commercially available computer graphics CRT.  Beyond Alan Kay’s 
‘personal computer’, Doug Engelbart bought one to experiment in the first 
demonstrated computer network in the famous “Mother of All Demos”.  It won a 
Hollywood Oscar for technical screen graphics, it was the surgery room display 
for Dr. Norman DeBakey’s first artificial heart transplant, and it was the 
basis for the TV space video of Neil Armstrong’s foot landing on the moon July 
20, 1969. Seventeen thousand large-screen display units ultimately sold, for 
thirty-five million dollars.  Development costs were a pittance, less than 
three hundred thousand dollars.  Profits were in excess of six million dollars."

Kind regards,
Gottfried
_ 
Gottfried Specht | gottfr...@specht-online.com |  +49 211 151695+49 151 2911 
2915 


-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] Im Auftrag von Andy Cloud
Gesendet: Dienstag, 10. Januar 2017 23:10
An: cctalk@classiccmp.org
Betreff: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

Hi Everyone!

I thought this would be an interesting question to ask around - What's the 
rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

For me, personally, I have a Altair 8800!

Looking forward to hearing your answers

>_Andy

Re: Soldapullt original vs III

[Paul Koning]

> On Jan 16, 2017, at 10:00 PM, Eric Smith  wrote:
> 
> ...
> Some people may be unaware that with temperature-controlled soldering
> equipment, more wattage is almost always better. 

Yes.  I've had a Weller WTCPS since college, serious money for a student but 
it's been worth it.  It's already lasted 40 years and still doing exactly as 
well as ever.  The technology is utterly foolproof (the temperature sensing is 
based on elementary physics and can't drift).

I used to have a Soldapullt but lost it somehow; it was reliable.  Pre-ESD tip, 
though.  I now use a smaller freebie from a PCB fab house, which works ok.  
Yes, adding solder to improve heat transfer is important.  My current approach 
is to start with the sucker and finish with solder wick.

paul

RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[Rik Bos]

> -Oorspronkelijk bericht-
> Van: cctech [mailto:cctech-boun...@classiccmp.org] Namens Glen Slick
> Verzonden: dinsdag 17 januari 2017 4:32
> Aan: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> Onderwerp: Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item
> 
> On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 5:23 PM, Jay West  wrote:
> >
> > In the end HP1000 meant a 21MX M, E, K, or F - which was 2105,
> > 2108, 2112, 2109, 2113, 2111, 2117. I think some later AXXX systems
> > were also considered HP1000's, but that's out of my area (too new).
> >
> 
> The L-Series 2103L and the A-Series A400, A600, A600+, A700, A900,
> A990 were all called HP 1000 systems. They maintained software compatibility
> with previous generation HP 1000 computers, although the I/O interfaces used
> by the L-Series and A-Series were incompatible with the previous generation HP
> 1000 computers.
> 
> I have a couple of A900 boxes that I need to get RTE-A running on them
> someday.

I've an A600 in a 'cooler box' and a A990 with a 7912 drive combination.
If you need a pre-installed RTE hpi-image let me know.
 -Rik

RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[Rik Bos]

My rarest item is a Diehl Alphatronics a very rare combination of 
computer/calculator it's a same kind machine as the HP 9820A or some Wang 
calculators from the era (early 70ties).
I also have the service manuals for this machine and some spares to keep it 
running.
Other rare items in my collection are the HP 9821A actually a HP 9820A with a 
cassette drive like the HP 9830.  
And a HP 9831A which is basically a HP 9825A with firmware to run HP 9830 basic 
and a different keyboard, but the firmware also works 1n the HP 9825A.
I also have part of a memory core module(6 layers) from an IBM 1401.

-Rik

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Jon Elson]

On 01/16/2017 03:02 PM, Pete Lancashire wrote:

Currently about the only thing remaining I would come close to being
rare is a IBM 360/55 Front panel, spent $300+100 shipping in the early
to mid 90's for it.

Hmm, what's a 360/55?  I know the 360/50 and the 360/65 
quite well. Seems there is some mention of a /55, but what 
is different about it from a model 50?


Thanks,

Jon

Re: 8085 IO ports

[Adrian Graham]

On 17 January 2017 at 02:14, allison  wrote:

>
> 
>
> That's the later 1983 version but its the book you want.
>

Thanks, that was some light reading over lunchtime. The descriptions of the
interfacing helped a lot so tonight I need to finish tracing out the
SAA5070 LUCY circuit and the non data bus lines going to the keyboard
because I've not found anything that (I'm guessing) should interrupt the
CPU to say there's been keyboard activity.

> On the tape drive controller board are a pair of very messy 25V caps that
I

> > thought had rotted because of damp - the tape transport itself is
> probably
> > beyond saving through rust - but could they have exploded I wonder.
> >
> Likely history but if the parts move and the head is ok then clean it
> really well replace the caps and try.
>

The transport motors move fine but the head unit itself is badly rusted
around the edges. I also don't know what capacitance the ex-caps are since
they're that badly damaged but that's info I can hopefully get from the
other unit since that one isn't damaged internally but is equally dead.


> >> in that system working to this day (along with a 8085A subprocessor).
> > Strewth, that's some troubleshooting effort!
>
> I had bought the Netronics explorer 8085 just before that bolt.  That
> gave me
> a S100 chassis that would run even bad cards (think SDK85 with S100 bus
> interface).
>

Just googled it, that must've been expnsive when it was new!


> The turned pin are heavy and will stand that the copper under them
> or leading to them may be gone
>

I tested the sockets by resting the board on a sponge wrapped in tin foil
connected to one lead of my DMM.


> FYI vinegar or lemon juice will neutralize it, the battery (likely nicd)
> is alkaline.
> Rinse with water and dry.
>

Oh yes, that was the first thing I did when I removed the battery :)


> You can always inject a really slow processor clock, isn't rated for it
> but it does
> run down to less than 1khz. You can then watch signal with a bunch of leds.
>

I bought a test clip so I can watch every line with a logic analyser. It's
proved to be a useful investment!

Cheers,
-- 
adrian/witchy
Owner of Binary Dinosaurs, the UK's biggest home computer collection?
www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk

Re: 8085 IO ports

[Tony Duell]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 1:15 AM, Adrian Graham
 wrote:
> On 15/01/2017 14:38, "Tony Duell"  wrote:
>
>> But do you know it''s not doing I/O. OK IO/M is never going into the
>> right state for
>> I/O, but what that _really_ means is that the 8085 is never executing
>> any IN or OUT
>> type instructions. But of course memory mapped I/O is possible
>> (storing or loading
>> at particular locations that happen to be I/O devices) on any processor that
>> can
>> access memory (including the 8085). I've seen small 8085 and Z80 control
>> systems
>> with only memory-mapped I/O.
>
> I pondered that too but the reference says IN and OUT are used for
> non-memory mapped I/O and there's a few of those instructions in the code.
> Whether they're being executed at this point in time is moot.

Basically, memory mapped I/O means having devices addressed as memory that
perform I/O functions. You access them with the same load/store
instructions that
you use on real memory. On some processors (6502, 6800, 68000. PDP11, etc)
that's all you have, there are no special I/O instructions. On others
(8080, 8085,
Z80, PDP8, P850, etc) you have special I/O instructions accessing I/O devices.
The address spaces are totally separate, I/O location 0 has nothing to do with
memory location 0. On the 8085, an I/O instructon (IN or OUT) will cause
IO/M to be asserted (other state from when the CPU is accessing memory).

Note that on a machine with I/O instructions (like the 8085) there is
(a) nothing
to stop you having memory mapped I/O (that processor can access memory),
and (b) nothing to stop you having a mix of memory mapped and I/O mapped
I/O. You might have simple devices mapped as I/O ports, but video memory
(which is a sort-of I/O device in that storing something there causes it to
appear on the screen) memory-mapped. As an aside, the TRS-80 model 1
had almost everything (video, keyboard, printer port, etc) _memory mapped_,
the only standard I/O mapped device was the cassette unit.


> I've now traced all of them and its associated pair of supporting chips
> (LS04 and an MM74C906) and it's a tape controller, it's only using port 2
> and all the lines go to the tape drive header.
>
>>> There are also 3 modules on the phone side which I can't find anything
>>> about, marked "NKT NMC1515", NMC1516 and NMC1517.
>>
>> Are these potted blocks, or can you see the components on them?
>
> They're the big green rectangles visible in this picture -

Ah I can see what appear to be thick-film resistors on them
(the black rectangles). Are there more conventional components
on the underside?

> http://www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk/STCexecutelboard.jpg
> The D8741A is above them and the SAA5070 LUCY chip is to the right.
>
>> Could this be part of the serial data transfer? There will be incoming data
>> at 1200 baud. There should be some kind of demodulator (maybe one of the
>> modules) and a serial-to-parallel converter You've not mentioned a serial 
>> chip
>> (is there one), if not then I would expect it to be simulated in software.
>> Maybe on the 8085, maybe on the 8741.
>
> LUCY does that, it's also where the keyboard connector's lines split off so
> the whole data bus goes up to the keyboard module too. I now need to check

Ah, I'd forgotten there was an SAA5070 on this board...


> Now, having just typed that it's making me think of what Allison said about
> lightning or ESD, I know the previous owner of this machine powered it up
> before putting it on eb*y and 'the smoke came out' which I thought initially
> was just the RIFA mains filter popping (it had), but look at this picture:
>
> http://www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk/STCExecutelBlownCaps.jpg
>
> These are on the tape drive controller board and I thought they'd rotted
> through exposure to moisture for several years but could they have exploded
> instead? The damage looks old so I don't think that power up is responsible.

What is the tape drive? That board has a distinct look of Philips about it. What
tapes does it use? If I were a gambling man I would guess at Phlips
minicassettes
(not microcassettes). I think I know that drive...

If it is the drive I am thinking of, I have one somewhere, meaning I can look up
the capacitors.

But I would expect the thing to produce video without it.

I don't suppose you have a logic analyser? This is the sort of problem
that would
have me using said instrument to see what the processor is executing.

-tony

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Chuck Guzis]

I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
area seems to be gear of major brands.

Does anyone collect Varian minis?
Or General Automation?
Or any one of the many non-DEC, HP, etc. minis?  Heck, I don't read much
about DG minis  on this list--and they were a major force.

--Chuck

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[william degnan]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:09 PM, Chuck Guzis  wrote:

> I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
> area seems to be gear of major brands.
>
> Does anyone collect Varian minis?
> Or General Automation?
> Or any one of the many non-DEC, HP, etc. minis?  Heck, I don't read much
> about DG minis  on this list--and they were a major force.
>
> --Chuck
>
>
I think it's simply an availability thing ...I have manuals for a lot of
the non DEC minis, have to settle for simH, where am I going to get a
Varian?

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Jon Elson]

On 01/17/2017 11:09 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:

I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
area seems to be gear of major brands.

Does anyone collect Varian minis?
I had a Varian 620F a long time ago.  It was a whole bunch 
of wire-wrap boards.  It sort of tried to work, but was very 
flaky.  I was able to store some words into the core memory, 
but it seemed like every couple minutes it would zero out a 
word or two (I guess it was failing to write back the 
contents after the destructive readout.)  Without 
schematics, it was impossible to do much about it.


Jon

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Paul Koning]

> On Jan 17, 2017, at 12:13 PM, william degnan  wrote:
> 
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:09 PM, Chuck Guzis  wrote:
> 
>> I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
>> area seems to be gear of major brands.
>> 
>> Does anyone collect Varian minis?...
>> 
>> 
> I think it's simply an availability thing ...I have manuals for a lot of
> the non DEC minis, have to settle for simH, where am I going to get a
> Varian?

Yes, they are bound to be harder to find.  But with decent manuals you can add 
them to SIMH.  It's not that hard.  Then it becomes a matter of finding 
software.

Things seem to be worse yet with non-US computers.  You see very little mention 
of those, and (apart from BESM) nothing in SIMH.  UK computers get mentioned 
once in a while, other parts of Europe even less.  As a former Dutchman, I've 
wanted to find Philips computer documentation -- it seems to be non-existent.  
The first machine I did significant work on was a Philips PR8000; the grand 
total coverage of that machine on the WWW appears to be a one line entry in a 
book listing computers manufactured in the 1970s.  Similarly, I know Siemens 
made minicomputers, because I used a precision plotter driven by one of those 
-- a machine used around that time to draw postage stamp and paper money 
designs for the Dutch government.  Haven't seen that one either.

It may be that some of those computers aren't all that interesting, in the 
sense of not offering any unusual capabilities or architecture wrinkles.  But 
that's certainly not true for all of them; the PR8000, for example, has an 
approach to interrupts that's quite efficient and one I haven't seen since.

paul

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[Nico de Jong]

I wouldnt be surprised if I were the only one with a Philips PTS mini, or 
rather a set of spares that can be combined into one. The PTS series is a 
swedish development, based on Philips P800 hardware, but with a lot of extra 
adapters so it could be used for banks, airlines, etc.
BTW : I'm still looking for a 5 MB drive, called PTS 6876. It is also known 
under other (Philips) names.

/Nico

  - Original Message - 
  From: Rik Bos
  To: 'General Discussion: On-Topic Posts'
  Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2017 3:58 PM
  Subject: RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item


  My rarest item is a Diehl Alphatronics a very rare combination of 
computer/calculator it's a same kind machine as the HP 9820A or some Wang 
calculators from the era (early 70ties).
  I also have the service manuals for this machine and some spares to keep 
it running.
  Other rare items in my collection are the HP 9821A actually a HP 9820A 
with a cassette drive like the HP 9830.
  And a HP 9831A which is basically a HP 9825A with firmware to run HP 9830 
basic and a different keyboard, but the firmware also works 1n the HP 9825A.
  I also have part of a memory core module(6 layers) from an IBM 1401.

  -Rik

--
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SPAMfighter has removed 10908 of my spam emails to date.
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Varian, GA was: Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Bob Rosenbloom]

On 1/17/2017 9:09 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:

I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
area seems to be gear of major brands.

Does anyone collect Varian minis?
Or General Automation?
Or any one of the many non-DEC, HP, etc. minis?  Heck, I don't read much
about DG minis  on this list--and they were a major force.

--Chuck

I have a Varian 620 L and 620I but have never tried to power them up. 
Also have a GA SPC-16/80, SPC-12, and 18/30.


I would really love to play with the 18/30 but have very little 
documentation on it. No hardware docs at all. It's
compatible with the IBM 1800 and 1130, both of which I have, so would 
great to get running. Some photos of it

are on my web site. http://dvq.com/oldcomp/minis.htm

If anyone has documentation on the 18/30 please contact me (or get it to 
bitsavers).


Bob


--
Vintage computers and electronics
www.dvq.com
www.tekmuseum.com
www.decmuseum.org

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Brent Hilpert]

On 2017-Jan-17, at 9:13 AM, william degnan wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:09 PM, Chuck Guzis  wrote:
> 
>> I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
>> area seems to be gear of major brands.
>> 
>> Does anyone collect Varian minis?
>> Or General Automation?
>> Or any one of the many non-DEC, HP, etc. minis?  Heck, I don't read much
>> about DG minis  on this list--and they were a major force.
>> 
>> --Chuck
>> 
>> 
> I think it's simply an availability thing ...I have manuals for a lot of
> the non DEC minis, have to settle for simH, where am I going to get a
> Varian?

Right here (satire):

www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-VARIAN-DATA-MACHINES-620-L-100-COMPUTER-620L100-620-L100-/311466122329

I'd love to collect also-ran minis, I find the variety and architectural 
variations and forgotten history interesting.
But as you say: availability. And then the peripherals and software to make 
complete systems are even rarer.
And documentation. 

And on the rare occasions when they do show up, nowadays you get silly prices 
like this one.
That unit has been on ebay for many months, maybe near or over a year now.
I think it started out at 10,000 or some such.

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Al Kossow]

On 1/17/17 9:09 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:

> Does anyone collect Varian minis?
>

I had a few 620's, the most interesting was the 18-bit version.

No software to speak of for them. I even talked to the guy who ended up
supporting them down in LA when Sperry spit them out. The only thing he
had was a diagnostic tape.

Probably the most interesting Varian system I had was an integrated data
acquistion system they built with a fixed head disk and point plot display.
I'm hoping the person who bought it is able to save the software which in
theory is still in core an on the disk.

--

We have some software at CHM for the General Automation 18/30, which is a
little more interesting since it was very similar architecturally to the IBM
1800. The name comes from it being a cross between the 1800 and 1130.

--

I recovered some software for the Computer Automation museum a while ago
http://www.computer-automation-museum.org/ca/
don't know if there's been much activity there.

--

Primarily, it seems the activity has been centering around people working on
various simulators for minis in SIMH.

Re: Varian, GA was: Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Al Kossow]

let me see what I can get to on it. we got a ton of stuff from the stuff we 
bought in Germany

On 1/17/17 10:00 AM, Bob Rosenbloom wrote:

> I would really love to play with the 18/30 but have very little documentation 
> on it. No hardware docs at all. It's
> compatible with the IBM 1800 and 1130, both of which I have, so would great 
> to get running. Some photos of it
> are on my web site. http://dvq.com/oldcomp/minis.htm
> 
> If anyone has documentation on the 18/30 please contact me (or get it to 
> bitsavers).
> 
> Bob
> 
> 

Re: 8085 IO ports

[allison]

On 1/17/17 11:38 AM, Adrian Graham wrote:

On 17 January 2017 at 02:14, allison  wrote:



snippage>



That's the later 1983 version but its the book you want.


Thanks, that was some light reading over lunchtime. The descriptions of the
interfacing helped a lot so tonight I need to finish tracing out the
SAA5070 LUCY circuit and the non data bus lines going to the keyboard
because I've not found anything that (I'm guessing) should interrupt the
CPU to say there's been keyboard activity.


Figured that may help.

On the tape drive controller board are a pair of very messy 25V caps that

I


thought had rotted because of damp - the tape transport itself is

probably

beyond saving through rust - but could they have exploded I wonder.


Likely history but if the parts move and the head is ok then clean it
really well replace the caps and try.


The transport motors move fine but the head unit itself is badly rusted
around the edges. I also don't know what capacitance the ex-caps are since
they're that badly damaged but that's info I can hopefully get from the
other unit since that one isn't damaged internally but is equally dead.


The important spaces are the tape head face and the backside where the 
leads are.



in that system working to this day (along with a 8085A subprocessor).

Strewth, that's some troubleshooting effort!

I had bought the Netronics explorer 8085 just before that bolt.  That
gave me
a S100 chassis that would run even bad cards (think SDK85 with S100 bus
interface).


Just googled it, that must've been expnsive when it was new!

As systems of the day went it was cheap as the base unit plus the upgrades
like the s100 frame, backplane and all were fairly inexpensive.  I had 
power

supply, memory and many of the parts to populate it.

THe basic main board was not that expensive ass it was mostly unpopulated...
Adding Level A though E added stuff but their cost barely doubled it to 
maybe

the 400$ level.  At that point its S100 bus but NO S100 boards and 4K ram
on the main board and 8K of eprom (with M$ rom basic), the 8755 with a
2K monitor/debugger, and uses bit bash serial IO (very minimal hardware).

I caught a break as around theyn I was testing JAWS 64K S100 dram board
for Netronics in as many s100 crates as I had access to in 1978-79 
(quite a few)
so I worked a deal.  Paid less as I could get the boards and mechanical 
bits and populate
from my stocks.  The Jaws memory was the best Dram design for S100 of 
the day

as it worked in everything I'd tried 8080/8085 or z80 plus one 1802!

For the longest time the config was 64kdram board (Jaws), VDM-1, MITS SIOB,
and NS* MDS floppy controller and it ran NS*dos or CP/M as needed. 
Without S100
boards in it it had monitor and 4K ram plus basic so that was enough to 
exercise ram

cards, Io boards and the MDS controller.

I later rewrote the monitor and pulled the MDS controller, VDM-1, and 
MITS SIO, to
a Compupro interfacer II, so now it has an early IDE disk project for 
disk (a paltry

100mb drive).   I still have it and use it.

That's the rest of the story.



The turned pin are heavy and will stand that the copper under them
or leading to them may be gone


I tested the sockets by resting the board on a sponge wrapped in tin foil
connected to one lead of my DMM.


Yes, but do the pins connect to other ICs now?  I've see that stuff 
remove copper and leave pads.



FYI vinegar or lemon juice will neutralize it, the battery (likely nicd)
is alkaline.
Rinse with water and dry.


Oh yes, that was the first thing I did when I removed the battery :)



You can always inject a really slow processor clock, isn't rated for it
but it does
run down to less than 1khz. You can then watch signal with a bunch of leds.


I bought a test clip so I can watch every line with a logic analyser. It's
proved to be a useful investment!
I must have a dozen or more with leads.  handy for its here but not 
there... why?


Allison



Cheers,

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Alan Frisbie]

I just joined this list, so I'm not sure which of the items I own
would be considered by this group to be rare or unusual, but here
goes...

Imlac PDS-1D graphics terminal, with the large screen and detached
keyboard.   Also a second one with the small screen and attached
keyboard, but the chassis and cards are suitable only for parts.

DEC TU56 dual-DECtape drive (goes with my PDP-11/34)

DEC VS60/GT48 graphics display (goes with my PDP-11/34)

DEC RKV11D Q-Bus controller for RK05 disks (on my LSI-11/73 system)
Originally, it only supported 16-bit addressing, but I added the
chip and wires to make it support 18-bit addressing.   I have never
even heard of another of these controllers, so I assume it is rare.

Things that I assume are non-rare include an IBM 82 card sorter,
Cardamation keypunch, assorted paper tape gear, and a True Data
card reader (on my LSI-11/73 system).

All of this was operating here at one time or another, but the
clutter has become so bad that it is difficult to get them connected
(or even get at them) these days.

I recently retired, so my #1 job now is getting rid of all the stuff
I accumulated over my almost 50 years in the computer industry.   I
have three rental storage units full of stuff and the cost is
killing me!   Is it OK to post ads on this list?

Alan Frisbie

RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Jay West]

General automation - yes. I have a zebra 1750, 2820, and 3000.
Microdata M6000
I have lots of DG gear as well... but that's starting to get sent out here
and there :)

J

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Chuck Guzis
Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2017 11:09 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you
own? [Tek 4132]

I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer area
seems to be gear of major brands.

Does anyone collect Varian minis?
Or General Automation?
Or any one of the many non-DEC, HP, etc. minis?  Heck, I don't read much
about DG minis  on this list--and they were a major force.

--Chuck

Re: 8085 IO ports

[Paul Koning]

> On Jan 17, 2017, at 1:22 PM, allison  wrote:
> 
> On 1/17/17 11:38 AM, Adrian Graham wrote:
>> On 17 January 2017 at 02:14, allison  wrote:
>> 
>>> ...
>>> 
>> The transport motors move fine but the head unit itself is badly rusted
>> around the edges. I also don't know what capacitance the ex-caps are since
>> they're that badly damaged but that's info I can hopefully get from the
>> other unit since that one isn't damaged internally but is equally dead.
> 
> The important spaces are the tape head face and the backside where the leads 
> are.

Also any tape guides, both the tape surface and the tape edge guide surfaces.  

paul

Joking, was Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Steven M Jones]

On 01/17/2017 10:58, Alan Frisbie wrote:
> 
> ... getting rid of all the stuff
> I accumulated over my almost 50 years in the computer industry.   I
> have three rental storage units full of stuff and the cost is
> killing me!   Is it OK to post ads on this list?

No, no it isn't! Best you send me a private message about the items you
wish to get rid of, and I'll make sure only the "appropriate" ones are
forwarded to the list...

:D

Re: 8085 IO ports

[Adrian Graham]

On 17/01/2017 16:53, "Tony Duell"  wrote:

> Z80, PDP8, P850, etc) you have special I/O instructions accessing I/O devices.
> The address spaces are totally separate, I/O location 0 has nothing to do with
> memory location 0. On the 8085, an I/O instructon (IN or OUT) will cause
> IO/M to be asserted (other state from when the CPU is accessing memory).

OK. I'd have thought in this case the D8741A would count as a non-memory
mapped I/O device?
 
> Note that on a machine with I/O instructions (like the 8085) there is
> (a) nothing
> to stop you having memory mapped I/O (that processor can access memory),
> and (b) nothing to stop you having a mix of memory mapped and I/O mapped
> I/O. You might have simple devices mapped as I/O ports, but video memory
> (which is a sort-of I/O device in that storing something there causes it to
> appear on the screen) memory-mapped. As an aside, the TRS-80 model 1
> had almost everything (video, keyboard, printer port, etc) _memory mapped_,
> the only standard I/O mapped device was the cassette unit.

My video RAM is a pair of 2114s which the teletext processor should be
looking at as a page store, I'm still chasing down your idea that it should
be initialised somehow before it starts producing a video sync.

>> They're the big green rectangles visible in this picture -
> 
> Ah I can see what appear to be thick-film resistors on them
> (the black rectangles). Are there more conventional components
> on the underside?

Yep, on the left two. I haven't dared to pull them from the board though
even though they're socketed.
 
>> through exposure to moisture for several years but could they have exploded
>> instead? The damage looks old so I don't think that power up is responsible.
> 
> What is the tape drive? That board has a distinct look of Philips about it.
> What tapes does it use? If I were a gambling man I would guess at Phlips
> minicassettes (not microcassettes). I think I know that drive...

The drive has no maker stamp on it but I think you're right with the
minicassettes - the ejecting lid looks bigger than a microcassete. As it
happens there's an identical one on ebay right now!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NO-NAME-3922-536-07860-392253607860-CASSETTE-STATION
-/300633626181

Pictures are JUST at the wrong angle to find anything useable on the caps!

> If it is the drive I am thinking of, I have one somewhere, meaning I can look
> up the capacitors.

Cool. They actually might be readable - the detritus that I thought was
exploded cap looks like it might be external muck so I'll clean it up and
see what I can get.
 
> But I would expect the thing to produce video without it.

Yes, I'd expect video or at least a sync as soon as it's been running for
300usec which is what the datasheet says is all it takes to work out it's
running in 'off hours' mode and to generate its own sync. One thing that CAN
be seen on both the built-in TV and my external CUB despite lack of sync is
for all intents and purposes random crap which again makes me think
something isn't initialising properly.
 
> I don't suppose you have a logic analyser? This is the sort of problem
> that would
> have me using said instrument to see what the processor is executing.

I have, a small 16 channel one that's Saleae Logic compatible so I'm slowly
learning how to drive that too. I should be able to decode addresses and
suchlike using it shouldn't I.

Cheers,

-- 
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[geneb]

On Tue, 17 Jan 2017, Jon Elson wrote:


On 01/17/2017 11:09 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:

I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
area seems to be gear of major brands.

Does anyone collect Varian minis?
I had a Varian 620F a long time ago.  It was a whole bunch of wire-wrap 
boards.  It sort of tried to work, but was very flaky.  I was able to store 
some words into the core memory, but it seemed like every couple minutes it 
would zero out a word or two (I guess it was failing to write back the 
contents after the destructive readout.)  Without schematics, it was 
impossible to do much about it.


I used to work on a 727 flight simulator that used a Varian 620 to 
generate the visuals.  The display was capable of addressing 1024 points 
of light and that's how the runways and airport outline were drawn. 
Pretty neat stuff.  Here's some pics of the system that ran the sim:

http://flightweb.simpits.org/BehindTheScenes/727sim_page1.html

g.


--
Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007
http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind.
http://www.diy-cockpits.org/coll - Go Collimated or Go Home.
Some people collect things for a hobby.  Geeks collect hobbies.

ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment
A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes.
http://scarlet.deltasoft.com - Get it _today_!

Re: 8085 IO ports

[Adrian Graham]

On 17/01/2017 18:22, "allison"  wrote:

>> The transport motors move fine but the head unit itself is badly rusted
>> around the edges. I also don't know what capacitance the ex-caps are since
>> they're that badly damaged but that's info I can hopefully get from the
>> other unit since that one isn't damaged internally but is equally dead.
> 
> The important spaces are the tape head face and the backside where the
> leads are.

As luck would have it there's one on ebay right now, but it's a bit steep at
$75 + nearly as much again in shipping. Also while it would be nice to have
a fully functioning unit at the end of this I'm not sure the cassette is
worth spending much time on apart from to replace what's obviously damaged
and at least go for something that's seen by the controller.

> THe basic main board was not that expensive ass it was mostly unpopulated...
> Adding Level A though E added stuff but their cost barely doubled it to
> maybe
> the 400$ level.  At that point its S100 bus but NO S100 boards and 4K ram
> on the main board and 8K of eprom (with M$ rom basic), the 8755 with a
> 2K monitor/debugger, and uses bit bash serial IO (very minimal hardware).

Only $400-ish? I'm surprised given the functionality it had.
 
> I later rewrote the monitor and pulled the MDS controller, VDM-1, and
> MITS SIO, to
> a Compupro interfacer II, so now it has an early IDE disk project for
> disk (a paltry 100mb drive).   I still have it and use it.

Heh, we all remember when 100mb was a luxury :)

> Yes, but do the pins connect to other ICs now?  I've see that stuff
> remove copper and leave pads.

Yep, I've buzzed out all the lines between ROM chips as well as the RAM
refresh, that was the second thing I did after cleaning up the battery
residue and making sure I'd not had full-on socket rot like I had in my
Amiga2000.

>> I bought a test clip so I can watch every line with a logic analyser. It's
>> proved to be a useful investment!
> I must have a dozen or more with leads.  handy for its here but not
> there... why?

Indeed. New ones are surprisingly expensive though, I paid ukp20 for a 14
pin one but it's paid for itself in not having to move 14 analyser cables
from pin to pin 16 times...

-- 
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?

any thoughts where this might be?

[Al Kossow]

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rgkAAOSw-0xYfg9p/s-l1600.jpg

from

www.ebay.com/itm/351959392585

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Paul Koning]

> On Jan 17, 2017, at 2:50 PM, geneb  wrote:
> 
> On Tue, 17 Jan 2017, Jon Elson wrote:
> 
>> On 01/17/2017 11:09 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
>>> I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
>>> area seems to be gear of major brands.
>>> Does anyone collect Varian minis?
>> I had a Varian 620F a long time ago.  It was a whole bunch of wire-wrap 
>> boards.  It sort of tried to work, but was very flaky.  I was able to store 
>> some words into the core memory, but it seemed like every couple minutes it 
>> would zero out a word or two (I guess it was failing to write back the 
>> contents after the destructive readout.)  Without schematics, it was 
>> impossible to do much about it.
> 
> I used to work on a 727 flight simulator that used a Varian 620 to generate 
> the visuals.  The display was capable of addressing 1024 points of light and 
> that's how the runways and airport outline were drawn. Pretty neat stuff.  
> Here's some pics of the system that ran the sim:
> http://flightweb.simpits.org/BehindTheScenes/727sim_page1.html

Nice.

I saw (but never used) a Varian 16 bit mini in college.  Forgot the model 
number; I used to have the handbook but it seems to have been lost.  It was 
used because of its microprogramming capabilities.  The control panel was 
unusual: lights and switches basically, but the switches were membrane 
push-buttons.  So the entire front panel was a smooth surface.

paul

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Jerry Weiss]

> On Jan 17, 2017, at 12:58 PM, Alan Frisbie  wrote:
> 
> I just joined this list, so I'm not sure which of the items I own
> would be considered by this group to be rare or unusual, but here
> goes…
> 

Hi Alan,

Nice to see you on the list.   If memory serves me correctly, you presented 
a talk on (very) high speed data acquisition at DECUS a few decades ago.   

> DEC RKV11D Q-Bus controller for RK05 disks (on my LSI-11/73 system)
> Originally, it only supported 16-bit addressing, but I added the
> chip and wires to make it support 18-bit addressing.   I have never
> even heard of another of these controllers, so I assume it is rare.
> 
There was also a third party Q-Bus controller that handled 18 bit DMA.
I don’t recall the vendor, but I remember using in on Diablo RK03’s.

I once upgraded a DEC DR11B in a smilier fashion.  It was 18bit addressable,
but would not transfer across a 32Kbyte boundary.   After reviewing the prints
it turned out to be very easy to add another counter chip fix this.  I glued to 
another
chip dead bug style (downside up) and soldered a few wires.   I always liked 
the ability to improve things.

> 
> I recently retired, so my #1 job now is getting rid of all the stuff
> I accumulated over my almost 50 years in the computer industry.   I
> have three rental storage units full of stuff and the cost is
> killing me!   Is it OK to post ads on this list?
> 
> Alan Frisbie
> 


I actually accumulating more as I semi-retire.   If they don’t let you
post, let us know where you will be listing things.

Regards,
Jerry 
j...@ieee.org

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Al Kossow]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diego_Garcia#/media/File:Diegogarcia.jpg

On 1/17/17 12:02 PM, Al Kossow wrote:
> http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rgkAAOSw-0xYfg9p/s-l1600.jpg
> 

I thought it looked familiar. One of those places I looked at on the big Google 
Earth display
we have in the CHM lobby.

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Charles Anthony]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:02 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:

> http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rgkAAOSw-0xYfg9p/s-l1600.jpg
>
> from
>
> www.ebay.com/itm/351959392585
>
>
I think:

Pacific Remote Islands Marine National Monument.

http://www.topsecretwriters.com/2012/05/5-abandoned-military-bases-across-the-globe/

-- Charles

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Charles Anthony]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:30 PM, Charles Anthony <
charles.unix@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:02 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:
>
>> http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rgkAAOSw-0xYfg9p/s-l1600.jpg
>>
>> from
>>
>> www.ebay.com/itm/351959392585
>>
>>
> I think:
>
> Pacific Remote Islands Marine National Monument.
>
> http://www.topsecretwriters.com/2012/05/5-abandoned-
> military-bases-across-the-globe/
>
> -- Charles
>
16°43'31.55" N 169°32'22.08" W

https://www.google.com/maps/@16.72543,-169.53947,2696m/data=!3m1!1e3

RE: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[mark]

From: "Jay West" 


Was it possible to configure an Access system with a mix of a 21MX and 
2100?

(I'm not challenging the assertion; it just never occurred to me...)

According to the documentation - specifically "no". Both processors must 
be

the same type.
However, after digging in to it year ago, I see no reason that it 
shouldn't
work and others on the list said they were fairly certain that it did 
work.


Thanks for the info!

From: Glen Slick 

The L-Series 2103L and the A-Series A400, A600, A600+, A700, A900,
A990 were all called HP 1000 systems. They maintained software
compatibility with previous generation HP 1000 computers, although the
I/O interfaces used by the L-Series and A-Series were incompatible
with the previous generation HP 1000 computers.


I have a couple of A900 boxes that I need to get RTE-A running on them 
someday.


I used the A-Series quite a bit in the mid-80's.  By that time, the 
operating system of choice had moved on from RTE-6 to RTE-A, which I quite 
liked in general.  For control applications, it had several nice features 
for priority control, inter-process communication, etc.  It also handled a 
fully hierarchical file system, which was still not a given at that time. 
However, I wasn't too pleased with the "full screen editor"; it worked by 
sending a couple of screen-fulls of text to the terminal (must be an 
HP26xx), then reading it back off the screen after you'd done any editing 
locally.  It worked better than one might think, but one of the first things 
I did was write a character-at-a-time editor that used the WordStar / Turbo 
Pascal key mappings (in Fortran-77, BTW).


With the A600, and at the end the A400, you could get a whole multi-user 
computer system, including a smallish disk drive (I think up to 60 MB) all 
in one 6U rack mount chassis, which I thought was pretty neat at the time. 
I had one, including two terminals, 7912 disk/tape drive, printer, and all 
the documentation and system generation media (720k floppy disks!) - I got 
it all for free when a customer upgraded to PCs, but gave it all away to 
Goodwill when I got married.


On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 07:39:00PM -0500, Michael Thompson wrote:

I have two Sun 386i systems. It has an Intel 386 processor and runs SunOS.
Not exactly a big seller for Sun. I met some of the designers at the 
Vintage

Computer Festival East 2.0 in Burlington, MA.


I had one of those also, courtesy of a friend with a two-digit employee 
number at Sun.  I really enjoyed it, being able to run multiple copies of 
DOS on a Unix machine in a windowed environment (this was well (this was at 
least 5 years before Windows 3.0 came out).  Apparently the sales force 
actively *didn't* sell the unit, presumably because the price - and 
therefore commission - was too low.  Gave that one away, too...

~~
Mark Moulding

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Tony Duell]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 6:58 PM, Alan Frisbie  wrote:
> I just joined this list, so I'm not sure which of the items I own
> would be considered by this group to be rare or unusual, but here
> goes...

Don't I remember you from vmsnet.pdp11 or comp.sys.dec?



> DEC RKV11D Q-Bus controller for RK05 disks (on my LSI-11/73 system)
> Originally, it only supported 16-bit addressing, but I added the
> chip and wires to make it support 18-bit addressing.   I have never
> even heard of another of these controllers, so I assume it is rare.

They're not common. I have one (not modified for 18 bit addressing).



>  Is it OK to post ads on this list?

Yes, AFAIK. An early FAQ for this list specifically allowed ads (for
sale and wanted) and I don't think that has changed. Provided said
ads are related to classic computing of course.

-tony

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[william degnan]

I don't own one yet, but I believe there is an IBM or UNIVAC mainframe or
obscure mini computer somewhere in the bowels of these old DuPont office
buildings in nearby Wilmington, Delaware.  ...where are they all now?I
only need one IBM 360, UNIVAC, PDP 6, something like that so I can join
into this conversation :-)

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Al Kossow]

and more than you ever wanted to know about what it was used for
http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA379709


On 1/17/17 12:34 PM, Charles Anthony wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:30 PM, Charles Anthony <
> charles.unix@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 12:02 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:
>>
>>> http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rgkAAOSw-0xYfg9p/s-l1600.jpg
>>>
>>> from
>>>
>>> www.ebay.com/itm/351959392585
>>>
>>>
>> I think:
>>
>> Pacific Remote Islands Marine National Monument.
>>
>> http://www.topsecretwriters.com/2012/05/5-abandoned-
>> military-bases-across-the-globe/
>>
>> -- Charles
>>
> 16°43'31.55" N 169°32'22.08" W
> 
> https://www.google.com/maps/@16.72543,-169.53947,2696m/data=!3m1!1e3
> 

Re: 8085 IO ports

[Tony Duell]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 7:15 PM, Adrian Graham
 wrote:
> On 17/01/2017 16:53, "Tony Duell"  wrote:
>
>> Z80, PDP8, P850, etc) you have special I/O instructions accessing I/O 
>> devices.
>> The address spaces are totally separate, I/O location 0 has nothing to do 
>> with
>> memory location 0. On the 8085, an I/O instructon (IN or OUT) will cause
>> IO/M to be asserted (other state from when the CPU is accessing memory).
>
> OK. I'd have thought in this case the D8741A would count as a non-memory
> mapped I/O device?

It's very likely to be I/O mapped as it's only a couple of locations.

[...]

>>> They're the big green rectangles visible in this picture -
>>
>> Ah I can see what appear to be thick-film resistors on them
>> (the black rectangles). Are there more conventional components
>> on the underside?
>
> Yep, on the left two. I haven't dared to pull them from the board though
> even though they're socketed.

Do be careful, the substrate is a brittle ceramic material...

>
>>> through exposure to moisture for several years but could they have exploded
>>> instead? The damage looks old so I don't think that power up is responsible.
>>
>> What is the tape drive? That board has a distinct look of Philips about it.
>> What tapes does it use? If I were a gambling man I would guess at Phlips
>> minicassettes (not microcassettes). I think I know that drive...
>
> The drive has no maker stamp on it but I think you're right with the
> minicassettes - the ejecting lid looks bigger than a microcassete. As it
> happens there's an identical one on ebay right now!
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/NO-NAME-3922-536-07860-392253607860-CASSETTE-STATION
> -/300633626181

That's the one. It's a Philips mechanism. I have at least one somewhere. I will
try to find it. I don't think I have the schematic for it, but at
least I can look at the
PCB and find component values.


>
> Yes, I'd expect video or at least a sync as soon as it's been running for
> 300usec which is what the datasheet says is all it takes to work out it's
> running in 'off hours' mode and to generate its own sync. One thing that CAN
> be seen on both the built-in TV and my external CUB despite lack of sync is
> for all intents and purposes random crap which again makes me think
> something isn't initialising properly.

Yes. It sounds like the processor is not initialising the video system,
clearing video RAM, etc.

Now either the processor is waiting for an interrupt (but from what)? or
ir's not running the right code. CPU trouble, ROM troublem, RAM
trouble, address decoder trouble?

>
>> I don't suppose you have a logic analyser? This is the sort of problem
>> that would
>> have me using said instrument to see what the processor is executing.
>
> I have, a small 16 channel one that's Saleae Logic compatible so I'm slowly
> learning how to drive that too. I should be able to decode addresses and
> suchlike using it shouldn't I.

Can you clock the analyser from an external input rather than sampling
every 10us or whatever? If so, clock it from the Rd/ signal and grab the
16 address lines (8 on the processor pins, 8 on an address latch, most
likely a 74LS373, which you will have to find!). Now you can see the
sequence of locations that the CPU is reading. Most (but not all) will be
instructions. Find one, compare with the listing, see if the sequence makes
sense.

-tony


>

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Chuck Guzis]

On 01/17/2017 12:53 PM, Al Kossow wrote:
> and more than you ever wanted to know about what it was used for 
> http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA379709

Anent that, we had, in my division at CDC, quite a few people who'd put
in time at Kwajelein, where there is/was apparently quite a pile of iron.

I recall that a couple folks in my department even put in time in Tan
Son Nhut with, IIRC, CDC 3000 series systems during the Vietnam police
action.

Military deployments of otherwise commercial iron is something that's
not covered very well in most online histories that I've come across.

--Chuck

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Adrian Graham]

On 17/01/2017 20:02, "Al Kossow"  wrote:

> www.ebay.com/itm/351959392585

Off topic but the island airbase is Johnston Atoll -
http://www.urbanghostsmedia.com/2010/04/isolated-and-abandoned-military-airb
ase-johnston-atoll/

-- 
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Pete Lancashire]

I had a DG Nova (guess one could call it a Nova 1) Loaned it to who I
though was a friend, he vanished one day. The Nova showed up at a
local surplus store but even though I had proof it was mine, I had the
release letter from the company I worked for and got it from, he would
not even sell it to me.

Had one maybe two unused development boards and an extender, and a few
tapes, one being BASIC.

Interesting instruction format

-pete

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 9:09 AM, Chuck Guzis  wrote:
> I find it curious that what seems to be collected in the minicomputer
> area seems to be gear of major brands.
>
> Does anyone collect Varian minis?
> Or General Automation?
> Or any one of the many non-DEC, HP, etc. minis?  Heck, I don't read much
> about DG minis  on this list--and they were a major force.
>
> --Chuck
>
>

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [eBay warning]

[Mark Linimon]

> Does anyone collect Varian minis?

Oddly I was shown this eBay ad when looking at Al's latest post.  Don't
know if anyone else spotted it.

Machine looks nice but far, far, out of my price range:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-VARIAN-DATA-MACHINES-620-L-100-COMPUTER-620L100-620-L100/311466122329?_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D40757%26meid%3D1f25f0b7eb4847ad960f4d83c951daa4%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D351959392585

mcl

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [eBay warning]

[Mark Linimon]

sorry, I see that someone else had already posted this.

I'm only about 100 messages behind on the list.

mcl

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [eBay warning]

[william degnan]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 5:48 PM, Mark Linimon  wrote:

> > Does anyone collect Varian minis?
>
> Oddly I was shown this eBay ad when looking at Al's latest post.  Don't
> know if anyone else spotted it.
>
> Machine looks nice but far, far, out of my price range:
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-VARIAN-DATA-MACHINES-
> 620-L-100-COMPUTER-620L100-620-L100/311466122329?_trksid=
> p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%
> 3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D40757%26meid%3D1f25f0b7eb4847ad960f4d83c951
> daa4%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D351959392585
>
> mcl
>


Been on ebay for year(s)

MU5 Software

[Rob Jarratt]

With all this talk on the list recently about rare machines, here is a
really long shot.

 

I am interested in MU5, a research computer built at the University of
Manchester in the 70s, which I know for a fact no longer exists. However, I
would like to find any software, in any form, for it. Does anyone here have
anything, or know who to ask?

 

I have already been in contact with some of the people most closely
associated with MU5 and drawn a blank so far. I am also  aware of some
documents in the National Archive of the History of Computing which may help
and I will be going to consult those soon.

 

Regards

 

Rob

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Ethan Dicks]

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 3:18 PM, Jerry Weiss  wrote:
>
>> On Jan 17, 2017, at 12:58 PM, Alan Frisbie  wrote:
>> I just joined this list, so I'm not sure which of the items I own
>> would be considered by this group to be rare or unusual, but here
>> goes…
>>
> Hi Alan,
>
> Nice to see you on the list.   If memory serves me correctly, you presented
> a talk on (very) high speed data acquisition at DECUS a few decades ago.

I might have been in the audience for that talk...

>> DEC RKV11D Q-Bus controller for RK05 disks (on my LSI-11/73 system)
>> Originally, it only supported 16-bit addressing, but I added the
>> chip and wires to make it support 18-bit addressing.   I have never
>> even heard of another of these controllers, so I assume it is rare.

Cool.  Is that mod documented (on-line, that is... not just on some
35-year-old paper)?  I have an RKV11D that I've used under RT-11 with
16-bit memory... love to put it on a larger machine.

Good luck on posting your stuff.  I'm far away so I'm not likely to be
interested in anything huge and heavy, but I'll take a peek.

Cheers,

-ethan

Re: any thoughts where this might be?

[Noel Chiappa]

> From: Adrian Graham

> the island airbase is Johnston Atoll

I was thinking that didn't look like Diego Garcia (which is an atoll), but
rather Johnston Island. (Well, I guess technically its name is Johnston
Atoll, but since it doesn't have the 'circular' above-water of the 'classic'
atoll, I think of it as an island.) Cool story of surviving a Cat III typhoon
on it here:

  http://www.travelbughawaii.com/Ioke.htm

I wonder if the other pictures in the eBay item are of facilities on the
island? I wonder who bought them - some interesting computer pictures in
there.

Noel

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Paul Anderson]

Last year I picked up some documentation on the PDP16  family. Does anyone
have any hardware, docs, software or knowledge on it?

I have not had much time to look at it since I got it, and want to see how
it compares to my PDP14 items.

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 5:49 PM, Ethan Dicks  wrote:

> On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 3:18 PM, Jerry Weiss  wrote:
> >
> >> On Jan 17, 2017, at 12:58 PM, Alan Frisbie 
> wrote:
> >> I just joined this list, so I'm not sure which of the items I own
> >> would be considered by this group to be rare or unusual, but here
> >> goes…
> >>
> > Hi Alan,
> >
> > Nice to see you on the list.   If memory serves me correctly, you
> presented
> > a talk on (very) high speed data acquisition at DECUS a few decades ago.
>
> I might have been in the audience for that talk...
>
> >> DEC RKV11D Q-Bus controller for RK05 disks (on my LSI-11/73 system)
> >> Originally, it only supported 16-bit addressing, but I added the
> >> chip and wires to make it support 18-bit addressing.   I have never
> >> even heard of another of these controllers, so I assume it is rare.
>
> Cool.  Is that mod documented (on-line, that is... not just on some
> 35-year-old paper)?  I have an RKV11D that I've used under RT-11 with
> 16-bit memory... love to put it on a larger machine.
>
> Good luck on posting your stuff.  I'm far away so I'm not likely to be
> interested in anything huge and heavy, but I'll take a peek.
>
> Cheers,
>
> -ethan
>

WTB: DEC M8310

[W2HX]

I am looking to buy a (preferably working) DEC PDP-8/e M8310 board. I have one 
that isn't working correctly. Mine is repairable, but it will be an easier 
repair with a working one on hand to compare results and pinpoint the problem.

What have you got? Please contact me directly to discuss.
Thanks
Eugene

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own? [Tek 4132]

[Jon Elson]

On 01/17/2017 01:50 PM, geneb wrote:


I used to work on a 727 flight simulator that used a 
Varian 620 to generate the visuals.  The display was 
capable of addressing 1024 points of light and that's how 
the runways and airport outline were drawn. Pretty neat 
stuff.  Here's some pics of the system that ran the sim:
http://flightweb.simpits.org/BehindTheScenes/727sim_page1.html 



Was that a McDonnell Vital system?  That's where the Varian 
I had came from.  Vital II had stroke writing and variable 
beam width, ideal for painting the runway, stripes, numbers, 
etc.


Yeah, I think the rack cabinet I have matches the one in 
your photo.


Jon

Re: What is the most prized possession in your collection?

[Curious Marc]

Johannes,

Woohoo! Beautiful hardware, nice pictures!

Marc

 

From: cctalk  on behalf of Johannes Thelen 

Reply-To: "cctalk@classiccmp.org" 
Date: Saturday, January 14, 2017 at 9:42 AM
To: "cctalk@classiccmp.org" 
Subject: Re: What is the most prized possession in your collection?

 

 

Hard to say which one is most lovely, maybe I just list three most important 
for me. First is my full IBM 1800 system including 2311 drives, 1627 plotter, 
etc... http://ennenmikrotietokoneita.blogspot.fi/2015/08/1800-kesakuvia.html

I got CPU to run a year ago, other parts are under progress. Big and noisy 
beast, gotta love it.

 

Second would be weird decimal based thing, IBM 1620 Model I: 
http://ennenmikrotietokoneita.blogspot.fi/2016/06/ibm-1620-model-i-uusi-lelu-kokoelmaan.html

Pretty hard to get back to life, memory is corroded and Model B typewriter is 
missing. Maybe some day...

 

Third, Honeywell H316. Exactly I have two of these, both running.  The first 
one is mint conditioned tabletop version, another is rack version with HSA 
option.

https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/114704705421528969208/albums/6114938694824762945/6295389986969789474?pid=6295389986969789474&oid=114704705421528969208

https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/114704705421528969208/albums/6114938694824762945/6143407067711382802?pid=6143407067711382802&oid=114704705421528969208

 

- Johannes Thelen

Finland

Before microcomputers blog (Finnish) http://ennenmikrotietokoneita.blogspot.fi/

 

 

 

New: IBM 5285

[Jason T]

My latest acquisition, an IBM 5285 kinda-computer/kinda-terminal:

https://goo.gl/photos/pTVhWc7mYukBeQjAA

Basically, a System/[34|36] era terminal with a local CPU and a couple
8" floppies crammed in.  I received no disks or docs with it, but
there are manuals, product releases and other docs for the 5280 line
on Bitsavers.

What are my chances of finding a bootable disk(s) for this machine?
Or failing that, images that could, through whatever wizardry, be
written out?  The product release doc mentions a number of disk
formats used by the line. My drives are the "2D" model, which appear
to be the higher density/capacity disks.  Beyond that, I don't know
what format it would have used.

>From the handful of hits I found in Google's trade-magazine scans, I
get the idea this line didn't do well.

-j

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Jeff Woolsey]

On 1/15/17 8:58 PM, Jeff Woolsey wrote:
> Burroughts E1400 deskside unit for the accounting machine.  It's 1966
> vintage, and has a couple core planes.  I have the printset, too.  It
> makes a dandy table, and hasn't seen any moving electrons (or holes) for
> 30 years.  The local museum refused it, though.
>
I forgot that I had photos of this thing online somewhere:

http://www.jlw.com/retro/slafmac/


-- 
Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
"Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item

[Warner Losh]

I have an Ultrix daemon mouse mouse pad Don't know if that
qualifies as unique or not based on all the other cool stuff that has
flown by...

Warner

On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 8:02 PM, Tom Watson  wrote:
> Most unusual:
>
> I've got a complete card deck of Witran for the IBM 1620.  Witran is an 
> interpretive Fortran compiler (not even Fortran II) that was load & go.  It 
> was written in 1964.
>
> Somewhere I have a listing as well.
>
> Yes, it goes back a ways.

Re: Vector Graphics PROM/RAM Board?

[Dennis Boone]

 > Does anyone have experience with the Vector Graphics PROM/RAM
 > card...like this one.
 > http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/s100c/vector/promram.jpg
 > (This is not my card...mine is not jumpered in upper right.)
 > I have some documentation with mine and two PROMs loaded in A0 and A1
 > (VIMON loaded on them), but am having some trouble getting any
 > response from it.  Most likely a config issue or a conflict with other
 > RAM.

Win,

There are two resources that might be useful to you:

1. The VECTOR-GRAPHIC mailing list, inhabited by a couple of former
Vector employees, among others -
http://h-net.msu.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=vector-graphic

2. The Vector Graphic file archive -
http://vector-archive.org/index.php

De

Re: What's the rarest or most unusual computer-related item do you own?

[Pete Lancashire]

It is a typo .. should have been 50

Upside down on the basement floor

http://petelancashire.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=7885

waiting to be mounted. I do not have a the original IBM 360 aluminum
name plate, but got one of eBay, in not so good shape, plans are to
have a new one done at a local anodizing shop

-pete

On Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 8:22 AM, Jon Elson  wrote:
> On 01/16/2017 03:02 PM, Pete Lancashire wrote:
>>
>> Currently about the only thing remaining I would come close to being
>> rare is a IBM 360/55 Front panel, spent $300+100 shipping in the early
>> to mid 90's for it.
>>
> Hmm, what's a 360/55?  I know the 360/50 and the 360/65 quite well. Seems
> there is some mention of a /55, but what is different about it from a model
> 50?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jon
>

Vector Graphics PROM/RAM Board?

[Win Heagy]

Does anyone have experience with the Vector Graphics PROM/RAM
card...like this one.
http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/s100c/vector/promram.jpg
(This is not my card...mine is not jumpered in upper right.)
I have some documentation with mine and two PROMs loaded in A0 and A1
(VIMON loaded on them), but am having some trouble getting any
response from it.  Most likely a config issue or a conflict with other
RAM.

Feel free to ping me at whe...@gmail.com

Thanks...Win

Netronics VID-64 terminal board

[Brad H]

I was wondering if anyone out there had documentation for this.  I got one with 
a homebrew computer I'm trying to revive.  Netronics documentation seems to be 
extremely scarce, which is odd given how popular it is.
Brad