Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Paul Koning via cctalk]

> 
> On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 1:57 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk
>  wrote:
>> http://bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp11/dectape/LCM_Early_PDP-11

I looked over these, more precisely the ones that related to the PDP11.  Here 
are some notes.  The most significant item from my point of view is that it 
contains much of a very early RSTS (so early that it was still called BTSS).  
Together with a scanned listing I have of the BTSS kernel it may amount to just 
about a complete system.  I need to get that scan run through OCR...

paul

118647.tu56:

palx11.mac: PDP11 cross-assembler.  This was used to build PDP11
software early on, such as RSTS-11.

118652.tu56:

iox.p11: appears to be sources for the IOX "paper tape I/O" package,
described as "experimental I/O system".  That wasn't what it was
called when it finally shipped, I believe.

odtx.p11: ODT debugger for IOX.

rts.p11: Early Basic-PLUS for RSTS (referred to as "BTSS" in the
comments).

rtsdoc.rno: Brief documentation for some of the operation codes in
rts.p11.

sim11x.sav: I wonder if this might be the famous "Mimic".  Someone
with a suitable PDP-10 system should try to find out.

syslod.p11: tool to create a bootable DECtape.  Later on, "syslod" was
the name of the OS loader program, the one booted from DECtape to load
the OS (at least in the case of DOS).

118653.tu56:

oo.p11: RSTS file processor components.  It's not entirely clear but I
believe these are functions that were implemented as overlays.  Not
everything is precisely file I/O related; as in RSTS-11 V4, the
Basic-PLUS string garbage collector is implemented as a "file
processor" overlay.

rts.p11: Basic-PLUS, similar to the one in 118652.tu56 but appears to
be slightly newer.

118654.tu56:

dos.spp: design spec for DOS-11 V3.

edit11.man: user manual for DOS-11 EDIT program.

fort.spc: design spec for DOS-11 FORTRAN.

l.spc: design spec for DOS-11 LINK.

118656.tu56:

basic.p11: Multi-user BASIC (this is not Basic-PLUS)

syslod.p11: Another copy of the OS loader, essentially the same as the
one on 118652.tu56 but with a few comments cleaned up.

118660.tu56:

p.001 through p.011: software floating point library, appears to be
THREE word format (two word mantissa, one word exponent).  I believe
this was used in RSTS through version 3; in V4A, RSTS-11 switched to
the hardware standard 2-word or 4-word floating point format.

test.001 through test.009: appear to be test programs for the above.

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Paul Koning via cctalk]

> On Mar 24, 2018, at 11:34 PM, Josh Dersch via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> ...
> There's also what looks like some very early RSTS source in there.

The BASIC-PLUS interpreter part, yes.  RTS.P11, there are two versions.  I'll 
look at them more closely.  I have a 1971 listing of "BTSS" which is clearly an 
early, possibl pre-release, version of RSTS.  Just the kernel; the other parts 
were stripped out by the University of Illinois team who were experimenting 
with that code.  (How they got it is unclear.)   It has been scanned but not 
OCRed yet.

That plus the RTS code might be close to a full RSTS V0.1...

The 118600 tape has floating point emulation code in it, it appears to be the 
3-word floating point that was reportedly used in RSTS through V3.  In V4A, DEC 
switched to the 2 word and 4 word formats that were used in the 11/45 floating 
point processor.

paul

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Josh Dersch via cctalk]

On 3/24/2018 8:23 PM, Nigel Williams via cctalk wrote:


On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 1:57 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk
 wrote:

http://bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp11/dectape/LCM_Early_PDP-11

Thanks everyone for preserving these items.

In the unpacked file dectapes-extracted.zip, folder 118655.tu56 has
within it BASIC.P11.txt, the filename suggesting it might be a version
of BASIC, but the header of the file is this:

;FOCAL-11, VERSION B2

;BY RICK MERRILL

;COPYRIGHT@ 1970,1971 BY
;DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORP, MAYNARD, MASS.

overall the file contents suggest it is FOCAL, is there a way to check
that this is what was on the original tape? and not a handling problem
during the recovery?


I dumped the tapes and can confirm that this is not an error during 
recovery and is what was on the original tape; each tape had a printed 
directory listing taped to it and this listing matches the listing I got 
when extracting the data.  I assume it was misnamed or overwritten at 
some point back in the day.


There is a BASIC.P11 on another tape that has actual BASIC source in it.

There's also what looks like some very early RSTS source in there.

- Josh





As an aside there is an early version of TECO-11 there too:

TITLE TECO   V.21A - 18 AUG 70 - RC CLEMENTS/PMH/CM
SUBTTL TEXT EDITOR AND CORRECTOR

;COPYRIGHT DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORP., 1969,1970, MAYNARD, MASS.

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Nigel Williams via cctalk]

On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 1:57 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk
 wrote:
> http://bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp11/dectape/LCM_Early_PDP-11

Thanks everyone for preserving these items.

In the unpacked file dectapes-extracted.zip, folder 118655.tu56 has
within it BASIC.P11.txt, the filename suggesting it might be a version
of BASIC, but the header of the file is this:

;FOCAL-11, VERSION B2

;BY RICK MERRILL

;COPYRIGHT@ 1970,1971 BY
;DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORP, MAYNARD, MASS.

overall the file contents suggest it is FOCAL, is there a way to check
that this is what was on the original tape? and not a handling problem
during the recovery?


As an aside there is an early version of TECO-11 there too:

TITLE TECO   V.21A - 18 AUG 70 - RC CLEMENTS/PMH/CM
SUBTTL TEXT EDITOR AND CORRECTOR

;COPYRIGHT DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORP., 1969,1970, MAYNARD, MASS.

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Al Kossow via cctalk]

On 3/16/18 10:39 AM, Josh Dersch via cctalk wrote:

> The LCM+L bought them, we're going to image them when they arrive (and I'll
> be sure to send a copy your way).

Josh forwarded images and extracted files to me.
They are up now under
http://bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp11/dectape/LCM_Early_PDP-11

The BASIC source is an early MUBAS

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Marc Howard via cctalk]

Wow.  I never knew they had a carrying case for dectapes.  Kinda makes
sense for the field service folks.

Marc

On Fri, Mar 16, 2018 at 9:07 AM, Glen Slick via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 8:51 AM Al Kossow via cctalk 
> wrote:
>
> > https://www.ebay.com/itm/1372243559202
> >
> > basic.p11
> > syslod.p11
> > rdt.p11
> >
> > all from mid 1971
> > original RSTS?
> >
> > hope the person who got these knows what they bought
> >
>
> Extra digit in that link, try:
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/372243559202
>
> >
>

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Paul Koning via cctalk]

> On Mar 16, 2018, at 11:51 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/1372243559202
> 
> basic.p11
> syslod.p11
> rdt.p11
> 
> all from mid 1971
> original RSTS?
> 
> hope the person who got these knows what they bought

"P11" was the extension used for PDP-11 assembly files very early on.  I assume 
that was because they were cross-assembled on a PDP-10.  Presumably PALX11.MAC 
which is on one of the other tapes!

One of the tapes seems to be a SNOBOL implementation, with LOW and HGH and SHR 
extensions which sounds vaguely familiar from long ago when I briefly used 
TOPS-10.

Another has SIMX11.SAV, wonder if that might be MIMIC.  That would be quite a 
find.  And on the same tape IOX.P11, that sounds like the early "papertape I/O 
executive".

One tape is labeled "New PS/8". 

BASIC.P11 could be the RSTS BASIC code, that too would be a very interesting 
discovery with that date.  SYSLOD is the DOS installer.  RDT I don't recognize.

I'm seriously looking forward to seeing image files of those tapes.  

paul

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Al Kossow via cctalk]

On 3/16/18 10:39 AM, Josh Dersch via cctalk wrote:

> The LCM+L bought them


Good Job! I was hoping you guys did, when I saw there was a copy of PAL10 on 
there.

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Jay Jaeger via cctalk]

> On Mar 16, 2018, at 12:39, Josh Dersch via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> On Fri, Mar 16, 2018 at 9:07 AM, Glen Slick via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 
>> On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 8:51 AM Al Kossow via cctalk 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/1372243559202
>>> 
>>> basic.p11
>>> syslod.p11
>>> rdt.p11
>>> 
>>> all from mid 1971
>>> original RSTS?
>>> 
>>> hope the person who got these knows what they bought
>>> 
>> 
>> Extra digit in that link, try:
>> 
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/372243559202
>> 
>>> 
>> 
> 
> The LCM+L bought them, we're going to image them when they arrive (and I'll
> be sure to send a copy your way).
> 
> - Josh

Ya!!!  I saw those and there were some tapes their that looked like my 
PDP-12 might enjoy then.  

Sent from my iPad

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Josh Dersch via cctalk]

On Fri, Mar 16, 2018 at 9:07 AM, Glen Slick via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 8:51 AM Al Kossow via cctalk 
> wrote:
>
> > https://www.ebay.com/itm/1372243559202
> >
> > basic.p11
> > syslod.p11
> > rdt.p11
> >
> > all from mid 1971
> > original RSTS?
> >
> > hope the person who got these knows what they bought
> >
>
> Extra digit in that link, try:
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/372243559202
>
> >
>

The LCM+L bought them, we're going to image them when they arrive (and I'll
be sure to send a copy your way).

- Josh

Re: Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Glen Slick via cctalk]

On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 8:51 AM Al Kossow via cctalk 
wrote:

> https://www.ebay.com/itm/1372243559202
>
> basic.p11
> syslod.p11
> rdt.p11
>
> all from mid 1971
> original RSTS?
>
> hope the person who got these knows what they bought
>

Extra digit in that link, try:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/372243559202

>

Did anyone on the list get these tapes?

[Al Kossow via cctalk]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1372243559202

basic.p11
syslod.p11
rdt.p11

all from mid 1971
original RSTS?

hope the person who got these knows what they bought