Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
Al, I re-read your question and think you are referring to the manual I am looking for. I don't have the part number but I think it might be this: https://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102665239 What I had was the " 5110 System Logic manual" that was a solid block. Sadly, I threw it away after I spent some time trying to unravel it and failed. Hope this helps, Santo On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 4:17 PM Santo Nucifora wrote: > The manual with the schematics was at the back part > of SY31-0405-3_IBM_5100_Maintenance_Information_Manual_Oct1979.pdf. PDF > page 299 has the keyboard schematic/diagram. > > On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 4:15 PM Al Kossow via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > >> On 6/17/21 1:10 PM, Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: >> > One of the 5110's I acquired >> > had a full set of manuals but they were water damaged and the schematics >> > manual was one solid block of paper with all pages stuck >> > together >> >> what was the part number of that manual? >> >>
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
The manual with the schematics was at the back part of SY31-0405-3_IBM_5100_Maintenance_Information_Manual_Oct1979.pdf. PDF page 299 has the keyboard schematic/diagram. On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 4:15 PM Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > On 6/17/21 1:10 PM, Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: > > One of the 5110's I acquired > > had a full set of manuals but they were water damaged and the schematics > > manual was one solid block of paper with all pages stuck > > together > > what was the part number of that manual? > >
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On 6/17/21 1:10 PM, Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: One of the 5110's I acquired had a full set of manuals but they were water damaged and the schematics manual was one solid block of paper with all pages stuck together what was the part number of that manual?
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
To provide an update on the repairs so far, I've been able to save a few boards while others are waiting for parts. I was able to save a display card (I have two bad ones and one is waiting for parts) and an APL ROS card which is really great. All by replacing some bad TTL logic chips. I still have more work to do. I also have two bad keyboards. It is the actual keyboard assembly as a known working keyboard works fine. I have taken them apart and cleaned them as best I could but that didn't help. One has exactly one key that works (a slash key on the number pad) but no other keys register. The second keyboard doesn't register anything. I am measuring this from the keyboard connector on the keyboard mechanism. One of the 5110's I acquired had a full set of manuals but they were water damaged and the schematics manual was one solid block of paper with all pages stuck together, unfortunately. I could really use some schematics. Does anyone have any schematics for the 5100/5110 they can share? There are some schematics in the 5100 Maintenance Information Manual on Bitsavers but they are more logical diagrams than actual schematics. What I don't know is if my "block of schematics" was like this as well. Any assistance would be much appreciated. Santo On Sat, Jun 12, 2021 at 12:25 PM Chuck Guzis via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > On 6/12/21 1:58 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: > > On Sat, 12 Jun 2021, Tony Duell wrote: > >> I wonder if in the original list, a '1' was misread as a '7' or vice > >> versa. I am told that in some countries the '7' is conventionally > >> written with a crossbar across the downstroke to avoid this. My father > >> always did this, for all it is not common in England. > > > > In Germany, we *always* write a bar across the 7. I don't like uncrossed > > sevens because they are ugly ;-) and hard to distinguish from a 1. > > I do stroke my sevens just for clarity. However, here in the US, few > people write their ones with a serif--just a single vertical stroke. > That, in my experience is not common practice in many European countries. > > Writing zero with a slash, by the same token, probably leaves the > Scandanavian readers puzzled--as "oh" stroked is a letter of the > alphabet. Regardless, I stroked mine--a more universal practice might > have been to write zero with a horizontal or vertical stroke. > > I recall turning in keypunch forms to be punched and receiving my job > back with a note saying "I didn't know if you meant zero or oh, so a did > some of both". Wastebasket meet card deck. > > After that, I pretty much did all my own keypunching; management didn't > like that, but I persisted. > > --Chuck > >
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
Den lör 12 juni 2021 kl 10:54 skrev Christian Corti via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org>: > On Fri, 11 Jun 2021, Santo Nucifora wrote: > > I am currently working on an IBM 5100 that has some issues. I know for > > certain that the 5100 has a bad graphics controller card so I need to dig > > into component level replacements for those ICs I can replace. I have a > > list of logic chip equivalents to the IBM part numbers that are written > on > > the chips but I don't think it's 100% accurate because IBM part number > > 1582601 comes back as 74151 "DATA SEL/MUX" but when I use one of those > > cheap logic chip testers (that is surprisingly accurate), it comes back > as > > a 74157. For the record, if I test a 74151, it comes back as a 74151 so > the > > tester is correct. I just want to make sure the table I have is accurate > > and that the tester is not 100% accurate or if that chip has failed and > > tests like a 74157 in it's state. > > > > This is the current list I am using that I got from somewhere but I don't > > recall where: > > https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-vintage-logic-chip-equivalency-list/ > > Does anyone have an IBM logic chip equivalency table for 74 series logic > > chips? > > This list looks like a faulty transcription of my list here: > ftp://computermuseum.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/ibm/ibmparts.txt > > In my list, it is "1582601 74157 DATA SEL/MUX". > This list came from some IBM internal copies with unknown source. > Thanks for the list Christian! I have a broken 5110 PSU here. Unfortunately it is not covering any of the chips in the IBM 5110 Switch mode PSU. There are three metal cans numbered 1582779, 1582780 and 1582781. 16 pin types. Then there are four 361497 which I think is just three transistors and some resistors (at least that is what a picture I have seen is indicating). The latter type is 12 pin. Anyone that has a clue what the 15827xx are? https://i.imgur.com/MexGosO.jpg /Mattis > Christian >
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On 6/12/21 1:58 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: > On Sat, 12 Jun 2021, Tony Duell wrote: >> I wonder if in the original list, a '1' was misread as a '7' or vice >> versa. I am told that in some countries the '7' is conventionally >> written with a crossbar across the downstroke to avoid this. My father >> always did this, for all it is not common in England. > > In Germany, we *always* write a bar across the 7. I don't like uncrossed > sevens because they are ugly ;-) and hard to distinguish from a 1. I do stroke my sevens just for clarity. However, here in the US, few people write their ones with a serif--just a single vertical stroke. That, in my experience is not common practice in many European countries. Writing zero with a slash, by the same token, probably leaves the Scandanavian readers puzzled--as "oh" stroked is a letter of the alphabet. Regardless, I stroked mine--a more universal practice might have been to write zero with a horizontal or vertical stroke. I recall turning in keypunch forms to be punched and receiving my job back with a note saying "I didn't know if you meant zero or oh, so a did some of both". Wastebasket meet card deck. After that, I pretty much did all my own keypunching; management didn't like that, but I persisted. --Chuck
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
Thanks for that link Christian. I've seen your list before but couldn't find it and the website I got this transcribed list from is long gone. I'll check your list against what I have and make sure the one I have posted is accurate and post a link to yours, if that's okay. Santo On Sat, Jun 12, 2021 at 4:54 AM Christian Corti via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > On Fri, 11 Jun 2021, Santo Nucifora wrote: > > I am currently working on an IBM 5100 that has some issues. I know for > > certain that the 5100 has a bad graphics controller card so I need to dig > > into component level replacements for those ICs I can replace. I have a > > list of logic chip equivalents to the IBM part numbers that are written > on > > the chips but I don't think it's 100% accurate because IBM part number > > 1582601 comes back as 74151 "DATA SEL/MUX" but when I use one of those > > cheap logic chip testers (that is surprisingly accurate), it comes back > as > > a 74157. For the record, if I test a 74151, it comes back as a 74151 so > the > > tester is correct. I just want to make sure the table I have is accurate > > and that the tester is not 100% accurate or if that chip has failed and > > tests like a 74157 in it's state. > > > > This is the current list I am using that I got from somewhere but I don't > > recall where: > > https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-vintage-logic-chip-equivalency-list/ > > Does anyone have an IBM logic chip equivalency table for 74 series logic > > chips? > > This list looks like a faulty transcription of my list here: > ftp://computermuseum.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/ibm/ibmparts.txt > > In my list, it is "1582601 74157 DATA SEL/MUX". > This list came from some IBM internal copies with unknown source. > > Christian >
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On Sat, 12 Jun 2021, Tony Duell wrote: I wonder if in the original list, a '1' was misread as a '7' or vice versa. I am told that in some countries the '7' is conventionally written with a crossbar across the downstroke to avoid this. My father always did this, for all it is not common in England. In Germany, we *always* write a bar across the 7. I don't like uncrossed sevens because they are ugly ;-) and hard to distinguish from a 1. Christian
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On Fri, 11 Jun 2021, Santo Nucifora wrote: I am currently working on an IBM 5100 that has some issues. I know for certain that the 5100 has a bad graphics controller card so I need to dig into component level replacements for those ICs I can replace. I have a list of logic chip equivalents to the IBM part numbers that are written on the chips but I don't think it's 100% accurate because IBM part number 1582601 comes back as 74151 "DATA SEL/MUX" but when I use one of those cheap logic chip testers (that is surprisingly accurate), it comes back as a 74157. For the record, if I test a 74151, it comes back as a 74151 so the tester is correct. I just want to make sure the table I have is accurate and that the tester is not 100% accurate or if that chip has failed and tests like a 74157 in it's state. This is the current list I am using that I got from somewhere but I don't recall where: https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-vintage-logic-chip-equivalency-list/ Does anyone have an IBM logic chip equivalency table for 74 series logic chips? This list looks like a faulty transcription of my list here: ftp://computermuseum.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/ibm/ibmparts.txt In my list, it is "1582601 74157 DATA SEL/MUX". This list came from some IBM internal copies with unknown source. Christian
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On Sat, 12 Jun 2021, Tony Duell via cctalk wrote: In both cases it would require an input pin to become an output, something that I can't see how it would happen. I wonder if in the original list, a '1' was misread as a '7' or vice versa. I am told that in some countries the '7' is conventionally written with a crossbar across the downstroke to avoid this. My father always did this, for all it is not common in England. 50 years ago, I worked for a British physicist who was studying the Van Allen belts at Goddard Space Flight Center. He crossed his '7's. But, he thought it odd when I slashed zeroes.
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On Sat, Jun 12, 2021 at 12:39 AM Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: > > On 6/11/21 3:22 PM, Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: > > The 74151 is an 8:1 multiplexer with complementary outputs. > > The 74157 is a quad 2:1 mux. > > I can't imagine any defect that would cause one to test out > as the other. In both cases it would require an input pin to become an output, something that I can't see how it would happen. I wonder if in the original list, a '1' was misread as a '7' or vice versa. I am told that in some countries the '7' is conventionally written with a crossbar across the downstroke to avoid this. My father always did this, for all it is not common in England. -tony > > > Jon >
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
On 6/11/21 3:22 PM, Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: The 74151 is an 8:1 multiplexer with complementary outputs. The 74157 is a quad 2:1 mux. I can't imagine any defect that would cause one to test out as the other. Jon
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
Thank you for the quick reply. As soon as you wrote that, I checked my list again and I have two entries for 74151. The other is 2392121 which I assume is the right one? Would you mind sharing your list? I can cross-reference and see how accurate mine is. Thanks again, Santo On Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 4:29 PM Paul Berger via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > My reliable list says your cheap logic tester is right 1582601 = 74157 > > Paul. > > On 2021-06-11 5:22 p.m., Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: > > I am currently working on an IBM 5100 that has some issues. I know for > > certain that the 5100 has a bad graphics controller card so I need to dig > > into component level replacements for those ICs I can replace. I have a > > list of logic chip equivalents to the IBM part numbers that are written > on > > the chips but I don't think it's 100% accurate because IBM part number > > 1582601 comes back as 74151 "DATA SEL/MUX" but when I use one of those > > cheap logic chip testers (that is surprisingly accurate), it comes back > as > > a 74157. For the record, if I test a 74151, it comes back as a 74151 so > the > > tester is correct. I just want to make sure the table I have is accurate > > and that the tester is not 100% accurate or if that chip has failed and > > tests like a 74157 in it's state. > > > > This is the current list I am using that I got from somewhere but I don't > > recall where: > > https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-vintage-logic-chip-equivalency-list/ > > Does anyone have an IBM logic chip equivalency table for 74 series logic > > chips? > > > > Any help is much appreciated. > > Santo >
Re: IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
My reliable list says your cheap logic tester is right 1582601 = 74157 Paul. On 2021-06-11 5:22 p.m., Santo Nucifora via cctalk wrote: I am currently working on an IBM 5100 that has some issues. I know for certain that the 5100 has a bad graphics controller card so I need to dig into component level replacements for those ICs I can replace. I have a list of logic chip equivalents to the IBM part numbers that are written on the chips but I don't think it's 100% accurate because IBM part number 1582601 comes back as 74151 "DATA SEL/MUX" but when I use one of those cheap logic chip testers (that is surprisingly accurate), it comes back as a 74157. For the record, if I test a 74151, it comes back as a 74151 so the tester is correct. I just want to make sure the table I have is accurate and that the tester is not 100% accurate or if that chip has failed and tests like a 74157 in it's state. This is the current list I am using that I got from somewhere but I don't recall where: https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-vintage-logic-chip-equivalency-list/ Does anyone have an IBM logic chip equivalency table for 74 series logic chips? Any help is much appreciated. Santo
IBM Logic IC equivalency information needed
I am currently working on an IBM 5100 that has some issues. I know for certain that the 5100 has a bad graphics controller card so I need to dig into component level replacements for those ICs I can replace. I have a list of logic chip equivalents to the IBM part numbers that are written on the chips but I don't think it's 100% accurate because IBM part number 1582601 comes back as 74151 "DATA SEL/MUX" but when I use one of those cheap logic chip testers (that is surprisingly accurate), it comes back as a 74157. For the record, if I test a 74151, it comes back as a 74151 so the tester is correct. I just want to make sure the table I have is accurate and that the tester is not 100% accurate or if that chip has failed and tests like a 74157 in it's state. This is the current list I am using that I got from somewhere but I don't recall where: https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-vintage-logic-chip-equivalency-list/ Does anyone have an IBM logic chip equivalency table for 74 series logic chips? Any help is much appreciated. Santo
