RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
Not that I really care about this thread, but I can't help myself in commenting on this... >Yeah, I bought my suv from Isuzu, and they don't call me to tell me the >improvements that they have made to the new model, when it is coming out, or >which mechanics I should take it to. I guess that if they would be more >proactive in keeping me updated it would be better? Yeah they don't cold call people. That's because all of the manuafacturers have multi-million dollar ad campaigns that try and get your attention while your glued to your tv set. Except for some really screwy car commercials the focus is on why their model of the day is the greatest thing since sliced bread. They don't push mechanics because they push their own service centers. They give incentives to use their service centers. I just bought a new vehicle in October. I'm not sure how many times I've been called or mailed for this that or the other thing. Maybe I should have just put a new engine in my F150 than to buy a new sports car. >Also, my college doesn't call me and tell me if they have any new degrees >that are being offered that might be more up to date than the degrees that I >have. Mine do through snail mail. They tell me all kind of things on how they are improving things. Then they ask for money. Unfortunately, I also receive this sort of info from institutions I never attended. Why are we talking about this again? Lonny Eckert ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
Re: CF5 review in eWEEK
Jones, Matt wrote: > Personally, I believe that Allaire/Macromedia exceed most vendors in > providing information and updates in an easily accessable area. I think it would be more accurate to say that Allaire has done so. Until we see how Macromedia handles details about CF 6 its still only Allaire's release of details that have fuelled recent articles and comments -- We have spent much of the 20th century guarding against a Fahrenheit 451-like state in which books are burned; meanwhile, Huxley's world, in which most people won't even bother to read a book, may be slipping in the back door Jeffrey Klein email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] WWW: http://www.pixelgeek.com/ ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
At 10:45 AM 05/30/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Yeah, I bought my suv from Isuzu, and they don't call me to tell me the >improvements that they have made to the new model, when it is coming out, or >which mechanics I should take it to. I guess that if they would be more >proactive in keeping me updated it would be better? Did you buy it new or used? While, they don't call me, I do get quite a bit of junk mail from my local Dodge dealer, reminding me to schedule my next oil change and I receive yearly info telling me that it's time to trade in my current vehicle for a new one. >Also, my college doesn't call me and tell me if they have any new degrees >that are being offered that might be more up to date than the degrees that I >have. It's not nearly as annoying as the Dodge Dealer, but I do get period updates from my college. Doesn't your college have some sort of alumni newsletter? I even got a personal invite to a meeting to announce their computer science Masters program. I even get info from my high school. I'm not even sure how they found my current address. Maybe it's time to move again. Well, I feel like I'm being devil's advocate, so I'll stop here. Jeffry Houser | mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] AIM: Reboog711 | ICQ: 5246969 | Phone: 860-229-2781 -- Instant ColdFusion 5.0 | ISBN: 0-07-213238-8 Due out June 2001 -- DotComIt, LLC database driven web data using ColdFusion, Lotus Notes/Domino -- Half of the Alternative Folk Duo called Far Cry Fly http://www.farcryfly.com | http://www.mp3.com/FarCryFly -- You sass that hoopy Douglas Adams? Now there's a frood who knew where his towel was. ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
Yeah, I bought my suv from Isuzu, and they don't call me to tell me the improvements that they have made to the new model, when it is coming out, or which mechanics I should take it to. I guess that if they would be more proactive in keeping me updated it would be better? Also, my college doesn't call me and tell me if they have any new degrees that are being offered that might be more up to date than the degrees that I have. Personally, I believe that Allaire/Macromedia exceed most vendors in providing information and updates in an easily accessable area. No they are not perfect, No not every question is addressed. But I am quite happy with the combination of Allaire/Macromedia information and the developer community for exchanging information. -Original Message- From: Arden Weiss [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:26 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK Sorry you missed my point -- I and my clients buy products from a vendor (Allaire/Macromedia) and they choose not to keep the paying customer informed in a proactive manner -- instead they wait for the customer/client/developer to go to their events/websites to get information -- is that how you as a developer behave with your customers? Same with the thread about certification CF4.5 vs 5.0 (recent ongoing thread) -- regarding the real truth about whether CF4.5 certifcation transfers to 5.0 and other related issues -- some think so, some do not -- which is it -- guess who could/should set the record straight in a proactive manner... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:27 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK > Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. Eh? There is nothing in this article that is not available on either the web site, or in the streaming video announcements from last years DevConf (err, which is ALSO on the web site). === Raymond Camden, Principal Spectra Compliance Engineer for Macromedia Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ UIN : 3679482 "My ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is." - Yoda ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
At 10:29 AM 05/30/2001 -0400, you wrote: >Regarding: > > >> Is it allaire's responsibility to make sure *you're* up to speed? > >In a nutshell -- Yes -- not from a technical knowledge point of view of >knowing how to use their product, but defintely from a product availability >and the business reasons why, I as a customer/developer/client should buy >their upgrade -- unless, of course, Macromedia is not interested in >increasing the number of upgrades they sell. They haven't said anything >directly to me or my clients as registered users about upgrading and the >business reasons why? My client's as a registered user don't even know it >exists and won't unless I tell them). I know a evaluation is up on the web site, but it can't be purchased from the Macromedia web-site, and to my knowledge is not available for purchase anywhere. (correct me if I'm wrong). Perhaps they'll send out an e-mail to registered users after the product is available. I know that I would routinely get stuff from Allaire, as a registered user of ColdFusion Studio. I don't think I've gotten anything since merger. Jeffry Houser | mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] AIM: Reboog711 | ICQ: 5246969 | Phone: 860-229-2781 -- Instant ColdFusion 5.0 | ISBN: 0-07-213238-8 Due out June 2001 -- DotComIt, LLC database driven web data using ColdFusion, Lotus Notes/Domino -- Half of the Alternative Folk Duo called Far Cry Fly http://www.farcryfly.com | http://www.mp3.com/FarCryFly -- You sass that hoopy Douglas Adams? Now there's a frood who knew where his towel was. ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
well i guess that's the difference. i know my clients' business very well, whereas macromedia/allaire does not. so they cannot tell me what is best from a business perspective for my clients. i apply what i construe to be the best solution(s) for their needs - from my own experience & research, whether it's CF, JSP, etc. and btw - after i signed up for the beta program i received constant emails about availability of beta versions and the release candidates. and from participating in the forums at beta.allaire.com i learned quite a bit about when to expect the release of CF5. whereas macromedia/allaire can probably communicate more efficiently, it's also (in my opinion) good business for the vendor/consultant/whatever to be *proactive* and learn from what they're told by companies *as well* as what they seek on their own. -Original Message- From: Arden Weiss [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 7:29 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK Regarding: >> Is it allaire's responsibility to make sure *you're* up to speed? In a nutshell -- Yes -- not from a technical knowledge point of view of knowing how to use their product, but defintely from a product availability and the business reasons why, I as a customer/developer/client should buy their upgrade -- unless, of course, Macromedia is not interested in increasing the number of upgrades they sell. They haven't said anything directly to me or my clients as registered users about upgrading and the business reasons why? My client's as a registered user don't even know it exists and won't unless I tell them). What is Macromedia's viewpoint on the "business reasons" (not techie reasons) that a firm should upgrade to 5.0 -- can anyone point to a source on their web site that addresses this issue (here I go hunting instead of them providing). Note: As a comparision, I got an annoucement from Adobe about their new Actobat 5.0 product which I promptly went out and bought, because they also gave me a few business reasons why to upgrade. Maybe that is one reason why Adobe's stock is rising and Macromedia's isn't... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Dylan Bromby [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 9:49 AM To: CF-Talk Subject:RE: CF5 review in eWEEK as far as being *proactive*, you could have signed up for the CF5.0 beta test and learned all about it for months before its release. is it allaire's responsibility to make sure *you're* up to speed? i can't imagine what my business would be like if i waited for others to educate me about technology. -Original Message----- From: Arden Weiss [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 6:26 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK Sorry you missed my point -- I and my clients buy products from a vendor (Allaire/Macromedia) and they choose not to keep the paying customer informed in a proactive manner -- instead they wait for the customer/client/developer to go to their events/websites to get information -- is that how you as a developer behave with your customers? Same with the thread about certification CF4.5 vs 5.0 (recent ongoing thread) -- regarding the real truth about whether CF4.5 certifcation transfers to 5.0 and other related issues -- some think so, some do not -- which is it -- guess who could/should set the record straight in a proactive manner... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:27 AM To: CF-Talk Subject:RE: CF5 review in eWEEK > Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. Eh? There is nothing in this article that is not available on either the web site, or in the streaming video announcements from last years DevConf (err, which is ALSO on the web site). === Raymond Camden, Principal Spectra Compliance Engineer for Macromedia Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ UIN : 3679482 "My ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is." - Yoda ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
Regarding: >> Is it allaire's responsibility to make sure *you're* up to speed? In a nutshell -- Yes -- not from a technical knowledge point of view of knowing how to use their product, but defintely from a product availability and the business reasons why, I as a customer/developer/client should buy their upgrade -- unless, of course, Macromedia is not interested in increasing the number of upgrades they sell. They haven't said anything directly to me or my clients as registered users about upgrading and the business reasons why? My client's as a registered user don't even know it exists and won't unless I tell them). What is Macromedia's viewpoint on the "business reasons" (not techie reasons) that a firm should upgrade to 5.0 -- can anyone point to a source on their web site that addresses this issue (here I go hunting instead of them providing). Note: As a comparision, I got an annoucement from Adobe about their new Actobat 5.0 product which I promptly went out and bought, because they also gave me a few business reasons why to upgrade. Maybe that is one reason why Adobe's stock is rising and Macromedia's isn't... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Dylan Bromby [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 9:49 AM To: CF-Talk Subject:RE: CF5 review in eWEEK as far as being *proactive*, you could have signed up for the CF5.0 beta test and learned all about it for months before its release. is it allaire's responsibility to make sure *you're* up to speed? i can't imagine what my business would be like if i waited for others to educate me about technology. -Original Message- From: Arden Weiss [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 6:26 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK Sorry you missed my point -- I and my clients buy products from a vendor (Allaire/Macromedia) and they choose not to keep the paying customer informed in a proactive manner -- instead they wait for the customer/client/developer to go to their events/websites to get information -- is that how you as a developer behave with your customers? Same with the thread about certification CF4.5 vs 5.0 (recent ongoing thread) -- regarding the real truth about whether CF4.5 certifcation transfers to 5.0 and other related issues -- some think so, some do not -- which is it -- guess who could/should set the record straight in a proactive manner... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:27 AM To: CF-Talk Subject:RE: CF5 review in eWEEK > Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. Eh? There is nothing in this article that is not available on either the web site, or in the streaming video announcements from last years DevConf (err, which is ALSO on the web site). === Raymond Camden, Principal Spectra Compliance Engineer for Macromedia Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ UIN : 3679482 "My ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is." - Yoda ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
as far as being *proactive*, you could have signed up for the CF5.0 beta test and learned all about it for months before its release. is it allaire's responsibility to make sure *you're* up to speed? i can't imagine what my business would be like if i waited for others to educate me about technology. -Original Message- From: Arden Weiss [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 6:26 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK Sorry you missed my point -- I and my clients buy products from a vendor (Allaire/Macromedia) and they choose not to keep the paying customer informed in a proactive manner -- instead they wait for the customer/client/developer to go to their events/websites to get information -- is that how you as a developer behave with your customers? Same with the thread about certification CF4.5 vs 5.0 (recent ongoing thread) -- regarding the real truth about whether CF4.5 certifcation transfers to 5.0 and other related issues -- some think so, some do not -- which is it -- guess who could/should set the record straight in a proactive manner... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:27 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF5 review in eWEEK > Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. Eh? There is nothing in this article that is not available on either the web site, or in the streaming video announcements from last years DevConf (err, which is ALSO on the web site). === Raymond Camden, Principal Spectra Compliance Engineer for Macromedia Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ UIN : 3679482 "My ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is." - Yoda ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
What did the article address that hasn't been mentioned before on this list or made readily available on Allaire's site? Benjamin S. Rogers Web Developer, c4.net Voice: (508) 240-0051 Fax: (508) 240-0057 -Original Message- From: Arden Weiss [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:10 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: CF5 review in eWEEK Very interesting overview of CF5 and beyond at following link... http://www.zdnet.com/eweek/stories/general/0,11011,2764421,00.html Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from Allaire/Macromedia. Here we developers are -- acting essentially as outside sales folks for Macromedia -- and we have to depend on insight such as this from 3rd party sources -- oh well. ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
Sorry you missed my point -- I and my clients buy products from a vendor (Allaire/Macromedia) and they choose not to keep the paying customer informed in a proactive manner -- instead they wait for the customer/client/developer to go to their events/websites to get information -- is that how you as a developer behave with your customers? Same with the thread about certification CF4.5 vs 5.0 (recent ongoing thread) -- regarding the real truth about whether CF4.5 certifcation transfers to 5.0 and other related issues -- some think so, some do not -- which is it -- guess who could/should set the record straight in a proactive manner... ^ / \__ (@\___ / O /(_/ /_/ Whoof... 410-757-3487 -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:27 AM To: CF-Talk Subject:RE: CF5 review in eWEEK > Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. Eh? There is nothing in this article that is not available on either the web site, or in the streaming video announcements from last years DevConf (err, which is ALSO on the web site). === Raymond Camden, Principal Spectra Compliance Engineer for Macromedia Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ UIN : 3679482 "My ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is." - Yoda ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
Re: CF5 review in eWEEK
Allaire has been mentioning the move to a Java Engine (NEO) since last November at the developer's conference. Howie - Original Message - From: "Arden Weiss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Talk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:09 AM Subject: CF5 review in eWEEK > Very interesting overview of CF5 and beyond at following link... > > http://www.zdnet.com/eweek/stories/general/0,11011,2764421,00.html > > Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. > > Here we developers are -- acting essentially as outside sales folks for > Macromedia -- and we have to depend on insight such as this from 3rd party > sources -- oh well. > > ^ > / \__ >(@\___ > / O > /(_/ > /_/ > Whoof... > 410-757-3487 > > > > > ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
RE: CF5 review in eWEEK
> Sad that this kind of insight is not available direcly from > Allaire/Macromedia. Eh? There is nothing in this article that is not available on either the web site, or in the streaming video announcements from last years DevConf (err, which is ALSO on the web site). === Raymond Camden, Principal Spectra Compliance Engineer for Macromedia Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ UIN : 3679482 "My ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is." - Yoda ~~ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-talk@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
