Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
Same. Have had a voyage to St Pierre and Miquelon on the bucket list since I was a kid, thanks to Farley Mowat. I reread that book last summer, and enjoyed it just as much as I did back in the 70s, and probably laughed even more. Dave On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 21:19, Andrew Burton via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > On side note. I grew up sailing on my dad’s C&C 27 in British Columbia. On > one cruise, I read a book by Canadian author Farley Mowat called The Boat > Who Wouldn’t Float, about a pair of fellows buying and converting a small > fishing schooner in Newfoundland. > Mowat talks a lot about the area and I’ve wanted to cruise there since. My > club has a cruise in Nfld this summer but my wife thinks we should attend > our daughter’s wedding instead of joining them. > I highly recommend the book for any sailor with a sense of humour: “Black > coffee made with rum as a substitute for water is a drink of considerable > authority.” > > Andy > > Andrew Burton > 26 Beacon Hill > Newport, RI > USA02840 > > http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ > +401 965-5260 > > On Jan 15, 2022, at 21:06, Ken Heaton via CnC-List > wrote: > > > I don't think it is easy to stay in the US for more than 12 month either. > But you only have to leave and go to another country for 15 days, then you > can return and start the clock over again. I'm not sure what the similar > rule is for Canada. > > Ken H. > > On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 21:44, Dave S wrote: > >> Andy - you might need to make a short trip to st Pierre and Miquelon. >> >> Eurozone VAT is similar I believe, non-paid boats need to leave briefly >> and return to reset the clock (or pay) and paid boats can’t be gone too >> long or they lose their paid status. >> I think I see a retirement gig in the med in my future! >> Dave >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jan 15, 2022, at 7:28 PM, Robert Abbott via CnC-List < >> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: >> >> Ken, >> >> Thank you all of this...everything one could want on the subject matter. >> >> Robert Abbott >> AZURA >> C&C 32 - #277 >> Halifax, N.S. >> >> On 2022-01-15 4:59 p.m., Ken Heaton wrote: >> >> Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept >> their boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually >> officially importing them, so never paid import duties: >> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 >> >> In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have >> any lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in >> Baddeck, Nova Scotia is still in business. >> >> Ken H.. >> >> >> >> On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: >> >>> The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 >>> months). The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at >>> least 20 years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily >>> enforced. In theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer >>> than 12 months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. >>> But there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the >>> repairs, maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core business >>> of Henry Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And >>> though the necessary “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs >>> officers have never been very exacting about the matter. >>> >>> For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in >>> Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed >>> the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard >>> related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to >>> allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about >>> import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large >>> repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 >>> months) if required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. >>> >>> This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just >>> having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue >>> of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government >>> agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement >>> increased as a result. >>> >>> Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: >>> https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ >>> >>> Here is another view: >>> https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ >>> >>> Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note >>> the wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): >>> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html >>> >>> Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: >>> ht
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
On side note. I grew up sailing on my dad’s C&C 27 in British Columbia. On one cruise, I read a book by Canadian author Farley Mowat called The Boat Who Wouldn’t Float, about a pair of fellows buying and converting a small fishing schooner in Newfoundland. Mowat talks a lot about the area and I’ve wanted to cruise there since. My club has a cruise in Nfld this summer but my wife thinks we should attend our daughter’s wedding instead of joining them. I highly recommend the book for any sailor with a sense of humour: “Black coffee made with rum as a substitute for water is a drink of considerable authority.” Andy Andrew Burton 26 Beacon Hill Newport, RI USA02840 http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ +401 965-5260 > On Jan 15, 2022, at 21:06, Ken Heaton via CnC-List > wrote: > > > I don't think it is easy to stay in the US for more than 12 month either. > But you only have to leave and go to another country for 15 days, then you > can return and start the clock over again. I'm not sure what the similar > rule is for Canada. > > Ken H. > >> On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 21:44, Dave S wrote: >> Andy - you might need to make a short trip to st Pierre and Miquelon. >> >> Eurozone VAT is similar I believe, non-paid boats need to leave briefly and >> return to reset the clock (or pay) and paid boats can’t be gone too long or >> they lose their paid status. >> I think I see a retirement gig in the med in my future! >> Dave >> Sent from my iPhone >> On Jan 15, 2022, at 7:28 PM, Robert Abbott via CnC-List wrote: >>> Ken, >>> >>> Thank you all of this...everything one could want on the subject matter. >>> >>> Robert Abbott >>> AZURA >>> C&C 32 - #277 >>> Halifax, N.S. >>> >>> On 2022-01-15 4:59 p.m., Ken Heaton wrote: Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept their boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually officially importing them, so never paid import duties: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have any lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia is still in business. Ken H.. On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: > The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 months). > The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at least > 20 years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily > enforced. In theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer > than 12 months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. > But there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the > repairs, maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core > business of Henry Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova > Scotia. And though the necessary “repairs” may not have been very > extensive, customs officers have never been very exacting about the > matter. > > For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in > Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that > allowed the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large > shipyard related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this > rule was to allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to > worry about import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. > Legitimate large repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long > as four years (48 months) if required, and permission for the > extension(s) is granted. > > This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just > having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue > of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the > government agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so > enforcement increased as a result. > > Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: > https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ > > Here is another view: > https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ > > Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note > the wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html > > Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html > > The actual letter of the law here: > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html > htt
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
I don't think it is easy to stay in the US for more than 12 month either. But you only have to leave and go to another country for 15 days, then you can return and start the clock over again. I'm not sure what the similar rule is for Canada. Ken H. On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 21:44, Dave S wrote: > Andy - you might need to make a short trip to st Pierre and Miquelon. > > Eurozone VAT is similar I believe, non-paid boats need to leave briefly > and return to reset the clock (or pay) and paid boats can’t be gone too > long or they lose their paid status. > I think I see a retirement gig in the med in my future! > Dave > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jan 15, 2022, at 7:28 PM, Robert Abbott via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > > Ken, > > Thank you all of this...everything one could want on the subject matter. > > Robert Abbott > AZURA > C&C 32 - #277 > Halifax, N.S. > > On 2022-01-15 4:59 p.m., Ken Heaton wrote: > > Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept > their boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually > officially importing them, so never paid import duties: > https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 > > In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have > any lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in > Baddeck, Nova Scotia is still in business. > > Ken H.. > > > > On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: > >> The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 >> months). The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at >> least 20 years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily >> enforced. In theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer >> than 12 months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. >> But there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the >> repairs, maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core business >> of Henry Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And >> though the necessary “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs >> officers have never been very exacting about the matter. >> >> For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in >> Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed >> the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard >> related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to >> allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about >> import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large >> repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 >> months) if required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. >> >> This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just >> having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue >> of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government >> agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement >> increased as a result. >> >> Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: >> https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ >> >> Here is another view: >> https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ >> >> Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note >> the wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html >> >> Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html >> >> The actual letter of the law here: >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-3-eng.html >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d8/d8-1-1-eng.html >> >> Ken H. >> >> > Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with > the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks > - Stu > > Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
Andy - you might need to make a short trip to st Pierre and Miquelon. Eurozone VAT is similar I believe, non-paid boats need to leave briefly and return to reset the clock (or pay) and paid boats can’t be gone too long or they lose their paid status. I think I see a retirement gig in the med in my future! Dave Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 15, 2022, at 7:28 PM, Robert Abbott via CnC-List > wrote: > > Ken, > > Thank you all of this...everything one could want on the subject matter. > > Robert Abbott > AZURA > C&C 32 - #277 > Halifax, N.S. > > On 2022-01-15 4:59 p.m., Ken Heaton wrote: >> Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept their >> boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually >> officially importing them, so never paid import duties: >> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 >> >> In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have >> any lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in >> Baddeck, Nova Scotia is still in business. >> >> Ken H.. >> >> >> >> On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: >>> The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 months). >>> The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at least 20 >>> years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily enforced. In >>> theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer than 12 >>> months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. But >>> there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the repairs, >>> maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core business of Henry >>> Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And though the >>> necessary “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs officers have >>> never been very exacting about the matter. >>> >>> For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in >>> Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed >>> the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard >>> related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to >>> allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about >>> import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large >>> repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 >>> months) if required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. >>> >>> This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just >>> having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue >>> of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government >>> agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement >>> increased as a result. >>> >>> Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: >>> https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ >>> >>> Here is another view: >>> https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ >>> >>> Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note the >>> wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): >>> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html >>> >>> Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: >>> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html >>> >>> The actual letter of the law here: >>> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html >>> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-3-eng.html >>> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d8/d8-1-1-eng.html >>> >>> Ken H. >>> > > Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with > the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Canadian Luxury Tax
Andrew, As you are aware, Ken Heaton has provided all the specifics on this I need to know. And as a side note, I could understand spending time cruising the Bras d'ors..., you would find cursing the coast of Newfoundland much of the time. Robert Abbott AZURA C&C 32 - #277 Halifax, N.S On 2022-01-15 6:24 p.m., Andrew Burton via CnC-List wrote: I see the law is 12 months, then pay duty. I spoke to Henry about this and got his take on the situation, but also spoke to people in the Halifax area who made essentially the same points. And even still, the law precludes what I want to do; that is, head to NS early summer and cruise to the area for the summer, then lay up over the winter and cruise farther the following summer, a total of 15 months or so. A broker in Halifax told me that I could probably get away with it, but “probably” not losing my boat to the Mounties isn’t good enough. Andy Andrew Burton 26 Beacon Hill Newport, RI USA 02840 http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ +401 965-5260 Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
Ken, Thank you all of this...everything one could want on the subject matter. Robert Abbott AZURA C&C 32 - #277 Halifax, N.S. On 2022-01-15 4:59 p.m., Ken Heaton wrote: Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept their boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually officially importing them, so never paid import duties: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have any lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia is still in business. Ken H.. On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 months). The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at least 20 years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily enforced. In theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer than 12 months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. But there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the repairs, maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core business of Henry Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And though the necessary “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs officers have never been very exacting about the matter. For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 months) if required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement increased as a result. Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ Here is another view: https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note the wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html The actual letter of the law here: https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-3-eng.html https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d8/d8-1-1-eng.html Ken H. Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
I see the law is 12 months, then pay duty. I spoke to Henry about this and got his take on the situation, but also spoke to people in the Halifax area who made essentially the same points. And even still, the law precludes what I want to do; that is, head to NS early summer and cruise to the area for the summer, then lay up over the winter and cruise farther the following summer, a total of 15 months or so. A broker in Halifax told me that I could probably get away with it, but “probably” not losing my boat to the Mounties isn’t good enough. Andy Andrew Burton 26 Beacon Hill Newport, RI USA02840 http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ +401 965-5260 > On Jan 15, 2022, at 15:59, Ken Heaton via CnC-List > wrote: > > > Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept their > boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually > officially importing them, so never paid import duties: > https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 > > In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have any > lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, > Nova Scotia is still in business. > > Ken H.. > > > >> On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: >> The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 months). >> The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at least 20 >> years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily enforced. In >> theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer than 12 months) >> in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. But there’s an >> exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the repairs, maintenance >> and storage of such yachts has been the core business of Henry Fuller of the >> Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And though the necessary >> “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs officers have never been >> very exacting about the matter. >> >> For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in Canada >> without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed the >> boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard related >> jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to allow >> shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about import >> duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large repairs >> can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 months) if >> required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. >> >> This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just >> having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue of >> it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government >> agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement >> increased as a result. >> >> Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: >> https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ >> >> Here is another view: >> https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ >> >> Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note the >> wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html >> >> Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html >> >> The actual letter of the law here: >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-3-eng.html >> https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d8/d8-1-1-eng.html >> >> Ken H. >> >> >> >>> On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 15:35, Robert Abbott via CnC-List >>> wrote: >>> Andrew, >>> >>> I am interested to know more about this CDN Luxury Tax on US boats here in >>> Canada for a period of time. I can't find anything on the CDN Govt >>> websites on the law. >>> >>> Do you have a source/ website, anything I can use to get started on finding >>> out the specifics? >>> >>> Anything would help. Thanking you in advnace. >>> >>> Robert Abbott >>> AZURA >>> C&C 32 - #277 >>> Halifax, N.S. >>> >>> On 2022-01-12 5:16 p.m., Andrew Burton via CnC-List wrote: There’s also a newish Canadian law that taxes US boats if they are in Canada for more than a short amount of time. It has put several yards out of business, including a friend in NS who used to work on and store a bunch of US boats very winter. It put the kibosh on my plans to cruise to Bras D’or one summer, leave the bot and then cruise Newfoundland the next summer. Andy Andrew Burton 26 Beacon Hill Newport, RI USA
Stus-List Re: C&C Cutting Boards are ready
Stu; I tried to go back in the order for but I think ended up ordering one additional cutting board; Can I just mail you a check for the difference in shipping? thanks Richard Richard N. Bush Law Offices 2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 502-584-7255 -Original Message- From: Stu via CnC-List To: C&C Email List Cc: Stu Sent: Fri, Jan 14, 2022 12:35 pm Subject: Stus-List C&C Cutting Boards are ready Finally – here is the link to order the C&C Cutting Boards -- http://cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards/ If you find problems with the site, please let me know ASAP. Thanks. Stay safe ‘n’ healthyStuThanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - StuThanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
Further to this, it appears some of Henry's American clients had kept their boats in Canada continuously for up to 18 years without ever actually officially importing them, so never paid import duties: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/tariff-for-non-canadian-boat-owners-threatens-yard-1.1322571 In the long run, the rules were not changed, and this didn't seem to have any lasting effect on Henry's business. The Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia is still in business. Ken H.. On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 16:53, Ken Heaton wrote: > The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 months). > The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at least 20 > years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily enforced. In > theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer than 12 > months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. But > there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the repairs, > maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core business of Henry > Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And though the > necessary “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs officers have > never been very exacting about the matter. > > For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in > Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed > the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard > related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to > allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about > import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large > repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 > months) if required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. > > This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just > having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue > of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government > agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement > increased as a result. > > Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: > https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ > > Here is another view: > https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ > > Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note > the wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html > > Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html > > The actual letter of the law here: > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-3-eng.html > https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d8/d8-1-1-eng.html > > Ken H. > > > > On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 15:35, Robert Abbott via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > >> Andrew, >> >> I am interested to know more about this CDN Luxury Tax on US boats here >> in Canada for a period of time. I can't find anything on the CDN Govt >> websites on the law. >> >> Do you have a source/ website, anything I can use to get started on >> finding out the specifics? >> >> Anything would help. Thanking you in advnace. >> >> Robert Abbott >> AZURA >> C&C 32 - #277 >> Halifax, N.S. >> >> On 2022-01-12 5:16 p.m., Andrew Burton via CnC-List wrote: >> >> There’s also a newish Canadian law that taxes US boats if they are in >> Canada for more than a short amount of time. It has put several yards out >> of business, including a friend in NS who used to work on and store a bunch >> of US boats very winter. >> It put the kibosh on my plans to cruise to Bras D’or one summer, leave >> the bot and then cruise Newfoundland the next summer. >> Andy >> >> >> >> Andrew Burton >> 26 Beacon Hill >> Newport, RI >> USA02840 >> >> http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ >> +401 965-5260 >> >> On Jan 12, 2022, at 14:47, Dennis C. via CnC-List >> wrote: >> >> >> When the US imposed the luxury tax in the 90's or whenever, it put 17,000 >> boat builders in the unemployment line. Luxury car salespersons also >> suffered. Legislators and bureaucrats are woefully ignorant of the law of >> unintended consequences. >> >> Did it result in increased tax collections? Not really. As it only >> applied to new yachts bought in the US, rich folks simply bought yachts in >> Europe and brought them home, as I recall. >> >> Other anecdotal laws we seem to forget: the U shaped curve (governs >> efficiencies of volume), the 95% rule (it's easy to pick up the first 95% >> of that pound of sugar you spilled). And there's always the law above them >> all, Murphy's Law. >> >> -- >> Dennis C. >> Touche' 35-1 #83 >> Man
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
The "short amount of time" Andrew refers to is one full year (12 months). The ``newish" law Andrew referred to has been on the books for at least 20 years ( I think since the fall of 1998) but has been spottily enforced. In theory, US boats are not supposed to overwinter (stay longer than 12 months) in Canada without being legally imported and paying duty. But there’s an exception. If a boat needs repairs, it may stay—and the repairs, maintenance and storage of such yachts has been the core business of Henry Fuller of the Cape Breton Boat Yard in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. And though the necessary “repairs” may not have been very extensive, customs officers have never been very exacting about the matter. For many years quite a number of American boats spent years on end in Canada without being officially imported, using this loophole that allowed the boats to remain here if "major overhaul" and other large shipyard related jobs were being done to them. The intention of this rule was to allow shipyards to bid on large projects without having to worry about import duties if the job stretched out beyond 12 months. Legitimate large repairs can be extended beyond 12 months, up to as long as four years (48 months) if required, and permission for the extension(s) is granted. This loophole was being abused as many of these boats were really just having light seasonal maintenance done. Henry Fuller made a public issue of it back in the fall of 2013 and so drew the attention of the government agency tasked with enforcing the law, forcing their hand so enforcement increased as a result. Some coverage of Henry's complaints are here: https://www.oceannavigator.com/bad-news-from-baddeck/ Here is another view: https://contrarian.ca/2013/09/06/how-the-feds-are-killing-a-77-year-old-cape-breton-business/ Here is a link to the actual rules and information for travellers (note the wording on that page has not needed to been changed since 2014): https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/menu-eng.html Information about the length of time permitted for repairs are here: https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/fv-be/importation-eng.html The actual letter of the law here: https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-1-1-eng.html https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-3-eng.html https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d8/d8-1-1-eng.html Ken H. On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 at 15:35, Robert Abbott via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > Andrew, > > I am interested to know more about this CDN Luxury Tax on US boats here in > Canada for a period of time. I can't find anything on the CDN Govt > websites on the law. > > Do you have a source/ website, anything I can use to get started on > finding out the specifics? > > Anything would help. Thanking you in advnace. > > Robert Abbott > AZURA > C&C 32 - #277 > Halifax, N.S. > > On 2022-01-12 5:16 p.m., Andrew Burton via CnC-List wrote: > > There’s also a newish Canadian law that taxes US boats if they are in > Canada for more than a short amount of time. It has put several yards out > of business, including a friend in NS who used to work on and store a bunch > of US boats very winter. > It put the kibosh on my plans to cruise to Bras D’or one summer, leave the > bot and then cruise Newfoundland the next summer. > Andy > > > > Andrew Burton > 26 Beacon Hill > Newport, RI > USA02840 > > http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ > +401 965-5260 > > On Jan 12, 2022, at 14:47, Dennis C. via CnC-List > wrote: > > > When the US imposed the luxury tax in the 90's or whenever, it put 17,000 > boat builders in the unemployment line. Luxury car salespersons also > suffered. Legislators and bureaucrats are woefully ignorant of the law of > unintended consequences. > > Did it result in increased tax collections? Not really. As it only > applied to new yachts bought in the US, rich folks simply bought yachts in > Europe and brought them home, as I recall. > > Other anecdotal laws we seem to forget: the U shaped curve (governs > efficiencies of volume), the 95% rule (it's easy to pick up the first 95% > of that pound of sugar you spilled). And there's always the law above them > all, Murphy's Law. > > -- > Dennis C. > Touche' 35-1 #83 > Mandeville, LA > > On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 1:33 PM Bill Coleman via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > >> OK, I know I should just get back to work, but this is a very thought >> provoking Bill about to take place, >> >> and it is like watching a slow motion train wreck. >> >> >> >> The American Version of the 90’s may not have been what completely killed >> C&C, but it certainly guaranteed it. >> >> >> >> What do they say, “Those who do not remember the mistakes of the past are >> condemned to repeat them in the future” ?! >> >> It’s been about a generation, long enough to forget, I guess. And Canada >> has a lot to lose. >> >> >> >> >> https://marinefabricatormag.com/2021/12/20/analysis
Stus-List Re: Canadian Luxury Tax
Andrew, I am interested to know more about this CDN Luxury Tax on US boats here in Canada for a period of time. I can't find anything on the CDN Govt websites on the law. Do you have a source/ website, anything I can use to get started on finding out the specifics? Anything would help. Thanking you in advnace. Robert Abbott AZURA C&C 32 - #277 Halifax, N.S. On 2022-01-12 5:16 p.m., Andrew Burton via CnC-List wrote: There’s also a newish Canadian law that taxes US boats if they are in Canada for more than a short amount of time. It has put several yards out of business, including a friend in NS who used to work on and store a bunch of US boats very winter. It put the kibosh on my plans to cruise to Bras D’or one summer, leave the bot and then cruise Newfoundland the next summer. Andy Andrew Burton 26 Beacon Hill Newport, RI USA 02840 http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ +401 965-5260 On Jan 12, 2022, at 14:47, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: When the US imposed the luxury tax in the 90's or whenever, it put 17,000 boat builders in the unemployment line. Luxury car salespersons also suffered. Legislators and bureaucrats are woefully ignorant of the law of unintended consequences. Did it result in increased tax collections? Not really. As it only applied to new yachts bought in the US, rich folks simply bought yachts in Europe and brought them home, as I recall. Other anecdotal laws we seem to forget: the U shaped curve (governs efficiencies of volume), the 95% rule (it's easy to pick up the first 95% of that pound of sugar you spilled). And there's always the law above them all, Murphy's Law. -- Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 1:33 PM Bill Coleman via CnC-List wrote: OK, I know I should just get back to work, but this is a very thought provoking Bill about to take place, and it is like watching a slow motion train wreck. The American Version of the 90’s may not have been what completely killed C&C, but it certainly guaranteed it. What do they say, “Those who do not remember the mistakes of the past are condemned to repeat them in the future” ?! It’s been about a generation, long enough to forget, I guess. And Canada has a lot to lose. https://marinefabricatormag.com/2021/12/20/analysis-shows-canadas-proposed-luxury-tax-will-have-heavy-impact-on-marine-industry/ https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1991-06-13-9102220626-story.html Bill Coleman Entrada, Erie, PA Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution --https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: C&C Cutting Boards are ready (2nd try)
Same here…no amount. And I forgot how much I was supposed to pay. So I abandoned my efforts…for now. Tom Buscaglia S/V Alera 1990 C&C 37+/40 Vashon WA P 206.463.9200 C 305.409.3660 > On Jan 15, 2022, at 7:59 AM, Joe Della Barba via CnC-List > wrote: > > > I put in the order and sent $43.00. It is not totally clear to me if it > worked correctly, the Paypal screen didn’t include any order info. > > > Joe Della Barba > Coquina C&C 35 MK I > Kent Island MD USA > > > Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with > the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: C&C Cutting Boards are ready (2nd try)
I put in the order and sent $43.00. It is not totally clear to me if it worked correctly, the Paypal screen didn’t include any order info. Joe Della Barba Coquina C&C 35 MK I Kent Island MD USA Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
Stus-List Re: C&C Cutting Boards are ready (2nd try)
On 1/14/2022 12:35 PM, Stu via CnC-List wrote: Finally – here is the link to order the C&C Cutting Boards -- http://cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards/ If you find problems with the site, please let me know ASAP. Thanks. Stay safe ‘n’ healthy Stu On Fri, 14 Jan 2022 at 23:19, Wade Glew via CnC-List wrote: > I did not see a link to the order form or payment platform. Is it too late > to order 10x14 with Oh Boy name? > Wade > Oh Boy 33-2 > > On Fri, Jan 14, 2022, 12:50 stu--- via CnC-List, > wrote: > >> I think the PayPal problem has been resolved. Try Again. >> >> Stu >> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help >> with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - >> use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray >> Thanks - Stu > > Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with > the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks > - Stu Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
