Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Josh via CnC-List]

https://stingysailor.com/2015/06/27/diy-soft-shackles-for-quick-and-easy-headsail-changes-2/

The alpine butterfly is the single best improvement for me.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1980 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD

Jun 16, 2022 13:32:30 David Knecht via CnC-List :

> What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
> from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
> attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over 
> knots.  Thanks- Dave
> 
> S/V Aries
> 1990 C&C 34+
> New London, CT
> 
> [cid:4073BE72-4704-4EA7-8EBA-B73B833F502B]
> 

Stus-List Return crew

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

All

We had to return to Bermuda because the starter failed  I am looking for
available crew who could fly to Bermuda and help bring our Hylas 49 back to
Annapolis early next week. Please email me if available. I had assembled a
great group of C&Cers but their schedules did not take into account a four
or five  day delay in departure
-- 
Joel

Stus-List Re: air conditioner pump

[CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List]

Thanks for the AC pump responses. 
It made me research further and I may be able to improve my installation and 
fix my problem.   In 2014, I mounted the pump that came with the 16000 Webastco 
vertically with the pump under the motor and it was a pain to prime but worked 
until this year.

March pumps states that my method of mounting the pump can cause an air bubble 
to get caught right where the magnetic coupler sits.  They prefer the pump to 
be horizontal and if mounted vertically, to have the pump above the motor so 
any air bubble is on the other end. 

I'll see if I can correct my mounting setup before ordering a new pump.

Chuck S



> On 06/16/2022 11:24 AM Bill Coleman via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> I have a Primetimepump.com which is well built, mostly SS. Only problem I 
> had with it was an impeller explosion, which they had a repair kit for.
> For smaller units, I have a dometic LC-2CP that seems to work well. I 
> replaced the original once on a trip, I thought the bearings were shot by the 
> horrible noise, but unfortunately I threw it out. I later discovered the new 
> one would make the same noise if it wasn't primed properly. As you  probably 
> know, they won't pull a head. A priming valve is essential.
> Someone mentioned a Refrigeration pump, but it seems these are usually 
> 12V DC, and the AC Pumps are usually 120V AC, the same voltage as the units.
> 
> Bill Coleman
> Entrada Erie PA
> 
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2022 at 11:15 AM CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com > wrote:
> 
> > > Hey guys,
> > 
> > I need to replace the air conditioner pump and wondered if anybody 
> > has recommendations.
> > 
> > Chuck
> > 
> > > 

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List]

Point of correction I think. If each sheet is attached with its own shackle, no 
size reduction. The force is same because only one sheet pulls at a time.

Get Outlook for Android

From: Novabraid via CnC-List 
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 2:17:50 PM
To: 'Stus-List' 
Cc: csgilchr...@comcast.net 
Subject: Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds


Dave,

I think the size of the soft shackle (if you’re just using one) may be part of 
the issue.  Soft shackles are made from high modulus fibers, usually either 
Dyneema or Spectra (both UHMWPE) or some generic version of the same material.  
All of which are far stronger than your sheets thus allowing you to downsize 
your soft shackle to something smaller than the sheet itself.  Conventional 
wisdom with regards to virtually anybody buying sheets or sheet attachments is 
they want them large enough to handle easily and similarly, the soft shackles 
are a bit easier to handle with gloves if they’re sized appropriately large.  
But they don’t need to be.  If you’re using a 7/16 genoa sheet, the largest 
that soft shackle needs to be regarding strength is either 3/16” or ¼” 
diameter.  That alone should make it easier for the shackle to pass by the 
shrouds.  On my boat, the issue becomes the sheet hanging up on the turnbuckles 
of the shrouds.  I’ve solved that issue by putting turnbuckle boots made of a 
chafe material over the offending hardware and have no problems whatsoever.

Back to the soft shackles, you mentioned you use a single soft shackle to hold 
both sheets.  I’ve been a fan of using 2 smaller soft shackles which serves two 
purposes.  If I have a sheet issue (like a winch override, an unfortunate wrap 
around something or the need to change a jib), its easier to do so with 
individual shackles so you can simply change tacks and release each sheet 
independently.  That also allows for slightly smaller shackles as well.

Just my 2 cents..

Chuck Gilchrest

1983 Landfall 35





From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:45 PM
To: Jeffrey A. Laman 
Cc: CnC CnC discussion list ; David Knecht 

Subject: Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds



The sheets have loops spliced into the ends and the soft shackle just goes 
through the two loops and attaches to itself.  I have no problem with my 100% 
genoa, but my 145 hangs up often.  Do you have protective tubes around your 
shrouds or bare rod?  Dave





S/V Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT

[cid:image001.png@01D8818B.3701ED20]



On Jun 16, 2022, at 1:36 PM, Jeffrey A. Laman 
mailto:jlam...@outlook.com>> wrote:



Dave,

I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved your 
problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years ago, I have 
not had a single hangup.

Jeff Laman

81C&C34

Harmony

Ludington, MI



From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.com>>
Cc: David Knecht mailto:davidakne...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds



What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over knots.  
Thanks- Dave



S/V Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List]

Protective tubes wouldn't matter.
I use one soft shackle, 1/4" that attaches both sheets. If 2 shackles are used, 
same size since both sheets never pull at same time. The stopper knot on 
shackle has to be on outside, away from shrouds. No problems with 135 or 155.

Get Outlook for Android

From: David Knecht 
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:45:04 PM
To: Jeffrey A. Laman 
Cc: CnC CnC discussion list 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

The sheets have loops spliced into the ends and the soft shackle just goes 
through the two loops and attaches to itself.  I have no problem with my 100% 
genoa, but my 145 hangs up often.  Do you have protective tubes around your 
shrouds or bare rod?  Dave


S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

[cid:4073BE72-4704-4EA7-8EBA-B73B833F502B]

On Jun 16, 2022, at 1:36 PM, Jeffrey A. Laman 
mailto:jlam...@outlook.com>> wrote:

Dave,
I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved your 
problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years ago, I have 
not had a single hangup.
Jeff Laman
81C&C34
Harmony
Ludington, MI

From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.com>>
Cc: David Knecht mailto:davidakne...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over knots.  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

Stus-List Re: 37+ Polars (How about 34+)

[Richard Servance via CnC-List]

Awesome files that Josh shared.  Thanks for them.  Has anyone done the same
for the 34 Plus?

Sail safe,


*Richard Servance*

1990 C&C 34+

svbluehea...@gmail.com

@svblueheaven

Seattle, WA



>
>

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

I used to use a bowline to tie the sheets and then switched to eye splices with 
the soft shackle, but the problem persists.  Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



> On Jun 16, 2022, at 2:13 PM, rjcasciato--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Dave:  Are you using an eye splice in the end of the sheet or are you using a 
> bowline know to make that loop?  I agree with Jeff, I’ve been making my own 
> soft shackles for over 5 years and  there has not been one snag on anything.
>  
> You mention “a problem over knots”  ?
>  
> Ron C.
>  
> From: Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List  > 
> Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:37 PM
> To: CnC CnC discussion list  >
> Cc: Jeffrey A. Laman mailto:jlam...@outlook.com>>
> Subject: Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds
>  
> Dave,
> I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved 
> your problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years ago, 
> I have not had a single hangup.
> Jeff Laman
> 81C&C34
> Harmony
> Ludington, MI
> From: David Knecht via CnC-List  >
> Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
> To: CnC CnC discussion list  >
> Cc: David Knecht mailto:davidakne...@gmail.com>>
> Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds
>  
> What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
> from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
> attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over 
> knots.  Thanks- Dave 
>  
> S/V Aries
> 1990 C&C 34+
> New London, CT
> 
> 

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Novabraid via CnC-List]

Dave, 

I think the size of the soft shackle (if you’re just using one) may be part
of the issue.  Soft shackles are made from high modulus fibers, usually
either Dyneema or Spectra (both UHMWPE) or some generic version of the same
material.  All of which are far stronger than your sheets thus allowing you
to downsize your soft shackle to something smaller than the sheet itself.
Conventional wisdom with regards to virtually anybody buying sheets or sheet
attachments is they want them large enough to handle easily and similarly,
the soft shackles are a bit easier to handle with gloves if they’re sized
appropriately large.  But they don’t need to be.  If you’re using a 7/16
genoa sheet, the largest that soft shackle needs to be regarding strength is
either 3/16” or ¼” diameter.  That alone should make it easier for the
shackle to pass by the shrouds.  On my boat, the issue becomes the sheet
hanging up on the turnbuckles of the shrouds.  I’ve solved that issue by
putting turnbuckle boots made of a chafe material over the offending
hardware and have no problems whatsoever.

Back to the soft shackles, you mentioned you use a single soft shackle to
hold both sheets.  I’ve been a fan of using 2 smaller soft shackles which
serves two purposes.  If I have a sheet issue (like a winch override, an
unfortunate wrap around something or the need to change a jib), its easier
to do so with individual shackles so you can simply change tacks and release
each sheet independently.  That also allows for slightly smaller shackles as
well.

Just my 2 cents..

Chuck Gilchrest

1983 Landfall 35

 

 

From: David Knecht via CnC-List  
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:45 PM
To: Jeffrey A. Laman 
Cc: CnC CnC discussion list ; David Knecht

Subject: Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

 

The sheets have loops spliced into the ends and the soft shackle just goes
through the two loops and attaches to itself.  I have no problem with my
100% genoa, but my 145 hangs up often.  Do you have protective tubes around
your shrouds or bare rod?  Dave

 

 

S/V Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT








On Jun 16, 2022, at 1:36 PM, Jeffrey A. Laman mailto:jlam...@outlook.com> > wrote:

 

Dave,

I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved
your problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years
ago, I have not had a single hangup.

Jeff Laman

81C&C34

Harmony

Ludington, MI

  _  

From: David Knecht via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> >
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.com> >
Cc: David Knecht mailto:davidakne...@gmail.com> >
Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

 

What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment
from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to
attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over
knots.  Thanks- Dave

 

S/V Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT




 

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List]

I went with doing eye splices on the sheets and using  soft shackle.  No more hang ups on the rigging or baby stay since.Tom BuscagliaS/V Alera 1990 C&C 37+/40Vashon WAP 206.463.9200C 305.409.3660On Jun 16, 2022, at 10:32 AM, David Knecht via CnC-List  wrote:What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over knots.  Thanks- Dave
S/V Aries1990 C&C 34+New London, CT

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[rjcasciato--- via CnC-List]

Dave:  Are you using an eye splice in the end of the sheet or are you using
a bowline know to make that loop?  I agree with Jeff, I've been making my
own soft shackles for over 5 years and  there has not been one snag on
anything.

 

You mention "a problem over knots"  ?

 

Ron C.

 

From: Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List  
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:37 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: Jeffrey A. Laman 
Subject: Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

 

Dave,

I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved
your problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years
ago, I have not had a single hangup.

Jeff Laman

81C&C34

Harmony

Ludington, MI

  _  

From: David Knecht via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> >
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.com> >
Cc: David Knecht mailto:davidakne...@gmail.com> >
Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds 

 

What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment
from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to
attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over
knots.  Thanks- Dave 

 

S/V Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT




 

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

The sheets have loops spliced into the ends and the soft shackle just goes 
through the two loops and attaches to itself.  I have no problem with my 100% 
genoa, but my 145 hangs up often.  Do you have protective tubes around your 
shrouds or bare rod?  Dave


S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



> On Jun 16, 2022, at 1:36 PM, Jeffrey A. Laman  wrote:
> 
> Dave,
> I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved 
> your problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years ago, 
> I have not had a single hangup.
> Jeff Laman
> 81C&C34
> Harmony
> Ludington, MI
> From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
> Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
> To: CnC CnC discussion list 
> Cc: David Knecht 
> Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds
>  
> What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
> from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
> attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over 
> knots.  Thanks- Dave
> 
> S/V Aries
> 1990 C&C 34+
> New London, CT
> 
> 

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Richard Bush via CnC-List]

 I second Jeff Laman's comments; I have used soft shackles for several years 
without issue; my sheets used to hang up all of the time prior to switching to 
the soft shackles...and although I was originally skeptical of them, I am a 
believer now!
 
Richard
 s/v Bushmark4: 1985 C&C 37, CB; Ohio River, Mile 584.4

Richard N. Bush Law Offices 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine 
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255 
 
-Original Message-
From: Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List 
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: Jeffrey A. Laman 
Sent: Thu, Jun 16, 2022 1:36 pm
Subject: Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

#yiv1728409670 P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;}Dave,I am curious how your soft 
shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved your problem.  After attaching 
sheets with a soft shackle a couple years ago, I have not had a single 
hangup.Jeff Laman81C&C34HarmonyLudington, MI
From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: David Knecht 
Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds What have people found to be 
the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment from catching on the shrouds 
during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to attach the sheets to the clew, 
but that has not solved the problem over knots.  Thanks- Dave
S/V Aries1990 C&C 34+New London, CT

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List]

Dave,
I am curious how your soft shackle is installed and why that hasn't solved your 
problem.  After attaching sheets with a soft shackle a couple years ago, I have 
not had a single hangup.
Jeff Laman
81C&C34
Harmony
Ludington, MI

From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:32 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: David Knecht 
Subject: Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over knots.  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

[cid:4073BE72-4704-4EA7-8EBA-B73B833F502B]

Stus-List Genoa sheets catch on shrouds

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

What have people found to be the best way to keep the genoa sheet attachment 
from catching on the shrouds during a tack?  I use a dyneema soft shackle to 
attach the sheets to the clew, but that has not solved the problem over knots.  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

Stus-List Re: air conditioner pump

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

I have a Primetimepump.com which is well built, mostly SS. Only problem I
had with it was an impeller explosion, which they had a repair kit for.
For smaller units, I have a dometic LC-2CP that seems to work well. I
replaced the original once on a trip, I thought the bearings were shot by
the horrible noise, but unfortunately I threw it out. I later discovered
the new one would make the same noise if it wasn't primed properly. As you
probably know, they won't pull a head. A priming valve is essential.
Someone mentioned a Refrigeration pump, but it seems these are usually 12V
DC, and the AC Pumps are usually 120V AC, the same voltage as the units.

Bill Coleman
Entrada Erie PA

On Tue, Jun 14, 2022 at 11:15 AM CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hey guys,
>
> I need to replace the air conditioner pump and wondered if anybody has
> recommendations.
>
> Chuck
>

Stus-List Re: 37+ Polars

[RON CASCIATO via CnC-List]

Hi Rob, Not free, but Google ORR-EZ VALID LIST. This boat list will have your 37+.You search for your boat; in the left margin is a number, clicking on that will produce the ORR-EZ rating certificate.newer alternative to PHRF.ORR-EZ will also have a link to a new "performance package" which contains all the information you're looking fortables, charts, and an excellent set of instructions.Like I said, not free.$150.The real trick is to get the crew trained to use themGood luckRon C.ImpromtuC&C 38MKIIC. '77On Jun 16, 2022 7:43 AM, Rob Hamlin via CnC-List  wrote:Thanks Ken and an excellent reference for all things C&C 37/40 -RobSent from my iPhoneOn Jun 15, 2022, at 11:53 PM, Ken Heaton  wrote:Hi Rob,See page 35 of the C&C 37+ Owners Manual (77 pages with illustrations) for a Polar Diagram (not a table, sorry). There is a link to a downloadable copy of the C&C 37+ Owners Manual here: https://c-c-37-40.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_25.htmlKen HeatonS/V Salazar - Can 54955C&C 37/40 XL - Hull # 67Cape Breton Island, Nova ScotiaC&C 37/40 XL SalazarOn Wed, 15 Jun 2022 at 14:50, Rob Hamlin via CnC-List  wrote:Anyone have the polars in a table format?

Thanks
Rob


Sent from my iPhone

Stus-List Re: 37+ Polars

[Rob Hamlin via CnC-List]

Thanks Ken and an excellent reference for all things C&C 37/40 

-Rob

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 15, 2022, at 11:53 PM, Ken Heaton  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Rob,
> 
> See page 35 of the C&C 37+ Owners Manual (77 pages with illustrations) for a 
> Polar Diagram (not a table, sorry). There is a link to a downloadable copy of 
> the C&C 37+ Owners Manual here: 
> https://c-c-37-40.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_25.html
> 
> Ken Heaton
> S/V Salazar - Can 54955
> C&C 37/40 XL - Hull # 67
> Cape Breton Island, Nova Scotia
> 
> C&C 37/40 XL Salazar
> 
>> On Wed, 15 Jun 2022 at 14:50, Rob Hamlin via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> Anyone have the polars in a table format?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> Rob
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone