Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
On Dec 3, 2008, at 2:09 PM, David Blanton wrote: I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. I want to remove this item ... is removing this item a good or bad practice? If bad, why? I can't make any appeal to authority, but I can say that I personally find it a bad choice in most situations. If your app allows the entry of any relatively unconstrained text by the user, then the user may have many reasons for wanting to enter special characters. That menu item is the most direct way to do that. (By constrained I mean, for example, a phone number or other purely numeric input. Or, I don't know, DNA sequences where only ATGC are legal.) Why would you want to frustrate your users? Regards, Ken ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
On Dec 3, 2008, at 12:09 PM, David Blanton wrote: I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. There is no sure fire way to remove this menu item. I want to remove this item ... is removing this item a good or bad practice? If bad, why? It is not recommended, as it is part of the Mac OS X user experience, as it is provided to allow the user to easily enter special characters. Why do you want to remove it? -- David Duncan Apple DTS Animation and Printing ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
I do not understand why you would want to remove something that is put in place by Apple for a reason. All of my OS X apps have that menu item, if I were to use that menu item and be used to all apps having it I would hate your app for not having it. Is there a real reason you wish to remove it or just because you dont find a use for it personally? On Dec 3, 2008, at 3:24 PM, Ken Thomases wrote: On Dec 3, 2008, at 2:09 PM, David Blanton wrote: I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. I want to remove this item ... is removing this item a good or bad practice? If bad, why? I can't make any appeal to authority, but I can say that I personally find it a bad choice in most situations. If your app allows the entry of any relatively unconstrained text by the user, then the user may have many reasons for wanting to enter special characters. That menu item is the most direct way to do that. (By constrained I mean, for example, a phone number or other purely numeric input. Or, I don't know, DNA sequences where only ATGC are legal.) Why would you want to frustrate your users? Regards, Ken ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/codebowl%40gmail.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
There is no text entry capability in my app so this menu item looks like I don't know what I am doing. On Dec 3, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Joseph Crawford wrote: I do not understand why you would want to remove something that is put in place by Apple for a reason. All of my OS X apps have that menu item, if I were to use that menu item and be used to all apps having it I would hate your app for not having it. Is there a real reason you wish to remove it or just because you dont find a use for it personally? On Dec 3, 2008, at 3:24 PM, Ken Thomases wrote: On Dec 3, 2008, at 2:09 PM, David Blanton wrote: I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. I want to remove this item ... is removing this item a good or bad practice? If bad, why? I can't make any appeal to authority, but I can say that I personally find it a bad choice in most situations. If your app allows the entry of any relatively unconstrained text by the user, then the user may have many reasons for wanting to enter special characters. That menu item is the most direct way to do that. (By constrained I mean, for example, a phone number or other purely numeric input. Or, I don't know, DNA sequences where only ATGC are legal.) Why would you want to frustrate your users? Regards, Ken ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/codebowl%40gmail.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/airedale% 40tularosa.net This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] David Blanton ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
To any familiar mac user they will know ;) it's the newcomers that will probably wonder, then again they will probably understand once they see that ever app has it. On Dec 3, 2008, at 3:35 PM, David Blanton wrote: There is no text entry capability in my app so this menu item looks like I don't know what I am doing. On Dec 3, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Joseph Crawford wrote: I do not understand why you would want to remove something that is put in place by Apple for a reason. All of my OS X apps have that menu item, if I were to use that menu item and be used to all apps having it I would hate your app for not having it. Is there a real reason you wish to remove it or just because you dont find a use for it personally? On Dec 3, 2008, at 3:24 PM, Ken Thomases wrote: On Dec 3, 2008, at 2:09 PM, David Blanton wrote: I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. I want to remove this item ... is removing this item a good or bad practice? If bad, why? I can't make any appeal to authority, but I can say that I personally find it a bad choice in most situations. If your app allows the entry of any relatively unconstrained text by the user, then the user may have many reasons for wanting to enter special characters. That menu item is the most direct way to do that. (By constrained I mean, for example, a phone number or other purely numeric input. Or, I don't know, DNA sequences where only ATGC are legal.) Why would you want to frustrate your users? Regards, Ken ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/codebowl %40gmail.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/airedale%40tularosa.net This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] David Blanton ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
OK. I'll leave it. Thanks all. On Dec 3, 2008, at 1:29 PM, David Duncan wrote: On Dec 3, 2008, at 12:09 PM, David Blanton wrote: I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. There is no sure fire way to remove this menu item. I want to remove this item ... is removing this item a good or bad practice? If bad, why? It is not recommended, as it is part of the Mac OS X user experience, as it is provided to allow the user to easily enter special characters. Why do you want to remove it? -- David Duncan Apple DTS Animation and Printing David Blanton ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
David, I think there must be a way since this menu item doesn¹t show up in my Entourage compose mail window.To be honest, I never noticed this before. It seems to me that there are many cases where special characters are not appropriate. If it really bothered me I guess I would try to delete all the menu items at windowDidLoad or some such and then repopulate. I searched the archives and found no useful information on how to remove the Special Characters menu item from the edit menu. There is no sure fire way to remove this menu item. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
On Dec 3, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Randy Bradley wrote: David, I think there must be a way since this menu item doesn’t show up in my Entourage compose mail window.To be honest, I never noticed this before. It seems to me that there are many cases where special characters are not appropriate. If it really bothered me I guess I would try to delete all the menu items at windowDidLoad or some such and then repopulate. I'm guessing Entourage is not a Cocoa app? That's probably why. (And a mail compose window would definitely be a place where you'd want to be able to insert special characters...)___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 5:41 PM, Randy Bradley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, I think there must be a way since this menu item doesn¹t show up in my Entourage compose mail window.To be honest, I never noticed this before. It seems to me that there are many cases where special characters are not appropriate. If it really bothered me I guess I would try to delete all the menu items at windowDidLoad or some such and then repopulate. Consider that the special characters palette is system-wide, not app-specific. A user may activate it in another app and then bring yours up with the palette still available, even though it's not appropriate. A user may also wish to activate it within your app before switching to another app where it is appropriate, and will be annoyed to find that you've removed the command. Also consider that there's more to your app than just your code. For example, it would be reasonable to use this palette to ender text into the search box in the Help menu (although this doesn't actually work on Leopard, it would seem) and there may be other text fields around that you haven't explicitly created. Mike ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Special Characters Edit Menu Item
On 4 Dec 2008, at 04:17:22, Michael Ash wrote: Consider that the special characters palette is system-wide, not app-specific. A user may activate it in another app and then bring yours up with the palette still available, even though it's not appropriate. A user may also wish to activate it within your app before switching to another app where it is appropriate, and will be annoyed to find that you've removed the command. Also consider that there's more to your app than just your code. For example, it would be reasonable to use this palette to ender text into the search box in the Help menu (although this doesn't actually work on Leopard, it would seem) and there may be other text fields around that you haven't explicitly created. In addition to what Michael wrote, it is possible for the user to open the character palette from the Input Menu. It is impossible to stop the user getting at the character palette. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
