Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgWv9gACgkQOjLpvpq7dMoiAgCfV9VGnh3bJsRrINgKv3ZpiWHS EccAni4y2rw7cCWiA+BawFggpCk1x2wz =/Aqv -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re[2]: Video Playback virtually impossible on Neo Freerunner? (Re:Video of Qt 4.4 on Neo1973: brings iPhone like graphics)
Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On ma, 2008-04-28 at 09:26 -0500, Tim Shannon wrote: But isn't it still limited by the bandwidth available from the micro SD card? Maybe I misunderstood that. Yes it is. It's just that sending mpeg4 packets to the glamo takes just a _tiny_ bit less bandwidth than sending entire uncompressed frames. (Also the CPU will have more time to spend for doing the I/O.) But anyway I have to admit that n800 which has comparable resources (400MHz ARM11, quite big 800x480 screen with quite data slow output, SD\MMC cards which causes a decent load on CPU on heavy I\O, etc) is able to play videos with Mplayer pretty nice.Virtually any MP4 of internet quality plays well.And even lots of CD-sized DIVX movies (someone calls this DVD rip) are OK without recoding, though they're wasting lots of space on card and you may want to re-rip DVDs with more optimal parameters set or recode (the only hardware cheat is hardware picture resizing which takes no CPU cycles).Actually, video looks quite good and I'm pretty sure that such things as Neo *can* play videos.At least some of them.As for hardware decoders I have to mention that they tend to be picky in what they're willing to decode and what thy're refuse to decode.Actually, n800's DSP MP3 decoder for example refuses to decode certain MP3 streams.True hardware decoders are often even more picky and people usually hate that.Software decoders are less picky and willing to play much more formats and even semi-bugged or semi-damaged data (and once there is waste numbers of codecs on planet, you'll encounter such crap sooner or later). ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? 2008/4/29 Andy Green [EMAIL PROTECTED]: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgWv9gACgkQOjLpvpq7dMoiAgCfV9VGnh3bJsRrINgKv3ZpiWHS EccAni4y2rw7cCWiA+BawFggpCk1x2wz =/Aqv -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 10 or more phones order
On Mon, Apr 28, 2008 at 11:45 PM, Federico Lorenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Haha, one of the bests laughs I've had on here! Although I'm pretty
sure it violates PEP 346356 which clearly states that thou should not
use exec and base64 :)
If you think that python one-liner without base64 is better, here it is:
(lambda f=(lambda n, v: globals().update({n: v})): f(set, f))() or
set(wr, lambda v:
__import__(sys).stdout.write(str(v).strip()+\n)) or
set(phone_count, 42) or wr(Please order %s % , .join([BOX for
_i in xrange(phone_count // 10)] + [SINGLE for _i in
xrange(phone_count % 10)]))
Have a nice day. ;)
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Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? | Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. | Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? They won't draw any power when off... that part works as intended. It's only when you turn them on, the transistor causes the CPU pin itself to eat current itself due to an oversight. The effect in consumption terms is something as if you lit several LEDs instead of the one, say. But the LEDs come on and off as normal, are lit properly, etc. In normal use the LEDs aren't on much if at all, so it isn't anything that would stop me getting an A5 personally. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXGtEACgkQOjLpvpq7dMqdMACgimwT/C7TFsv+edbZQIzFN0zE 5tYAnjamWgbP2T42BLJFrOMMU8q/0V52 =e/Vh -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Re[2]: Video Playback virtually impossible on Neo Freerunner? (Re:Video of Qt 4.4 on Neo1973: brings iPhone like graphics)
On Tue, 29 Apr 2008 16:04:25 +0400 t3st3r [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On ma, 2008-04-28 at 09:26 -0500, Tim Shannon wrote: But isn't it still limited by the bandwidth available from the micro SD card? Maybe I misunderstood that. Yes it is. It's just that sending mpeg4 packets to the glamo takes just a _tiny_ bit less bandwidth than sending entire uncompressed frames. (Also the CPU will have more time to spend for doing the I/O.) But anyway I have to admit that n800 which has comparable resources (400MHz ARM11, quite big 800x480 screen with quite data slow output, SD\MMC cards which causes a decent load on CPU on heavy I\O, etc) is able to play videos with Mplayer pretty nice.Virtually any MP4 of internet quality plays well.And even lots of CD-sized DIVX movies (someone calls this DVD rip) are OK without recoding, though they're wasting lots of space on card and you may want to re-rip DVDs with more optimal parameters set or recode (the only hardware cheat is hardware picture resizing which takes no CPU cycles).Actually, video looks quite good and I'm pretty sure that such things as Neo *can* play videos.At least some of them.As for hardware decoders I have to mention that they tend to be picky in what they're willing to decode and what thy're refuse to decode.Actually, n800's DSP MP3 decoder for example refuses to decode certain MP3 streams.True hardware decoders are often even more picky and people usually hate that.Software decoders are less picky and willing to play much more formats and even semi-bugged or semi-damaged data (and once there is waste numbers of codecs on planet, you'll encounter such crap sooner or later). word of warning. you may THINK the freerunner (ta02) and n800/810 are comparable devices when it comes to video. you would be wrong if you think this. they most certainly are NOT. very far from that. i have an n800 - i have done development and graphics benchmarking etc. on it. i have done the same on the neo1973 (gta01) and freerunner(gta02). though you may think they are comparable - the video buses are an order of 4x faster on the n800 for starters (from memory about 25m/s to the video card - and THAT was considered SLOW). -- Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
How complicated would surgery to fix this be? Is it reasonable to create a wiki page detailing hw fix? Matt -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Green Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:56 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec) -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? | Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. | Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? They won't draw any power when off... that part works as intended. It's only when you turn them on, the transistor causes the CPU pin itself to eat current itself due to an oversight. The effect in consumption terms is something as if you lit several LEDs instead of the one, say. But the LEDs come on and off as normal, are lit properly, etc. In normal use the LEDs aren't on much if at all, so it isn't anything that would stop me getting an A5 personally. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXGtEACgkQOjLpvpq7dMqdMACgimwT/C7TFsv+edbZQIzFN0zE 5tYAnjamWgbP2T42BLJFrOMMU8q/0V52 =e/Vh -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | How complicated would surgery to fix this be? Is it reasonable to | create a wiki page detailing hw fix? Well, both transistors are accessible without popping a can, but a) they are tiny and fiddly, and b) the dual transistor might not be easily available with integral base resistors. Also the dual transistor is in a place where it is right up near a can and is fiddly to get to. So I wouldn't say it was realistic for normal end users to consider. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXLREACgkQOjLpvpq7dMph1wCfY8ZautNtXIDtOIO9jEoIeh+P g/EAoIQmYW7Yg+9SCbFgryiJGUp84ZPS =TVQU -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
Steve kindly emailed me on this issue and said: The A5 boards have been reworked to remove the [LED] issue. So WRT LEDs a5 and a6 have the same power consumption. Therefore you wouldn't need to dig out your soldering iron. Does anyone know the other differences with power consumption are between boards? Tim up OM software will eschew the frivoulous lighting of LEDs. On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 2:58 PM, Crane, Matthew [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How complicated would surgery to fix this be? Is it reasonable to create a wiki page detailing hw fix? Matt -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Green Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:56 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec) -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? | Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. | Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? They won't draw any power when off... that part works as intended. It's only when you turn them on, the transistor causes the CPU pin itself to eat current itself due to an oversight. The effect in consumption terms is something as if you lit several LEDs instead of the one, say. But the LEDs come on and off as normal, are lit properly, etc. In normal use the LEDs aren't on much if at all, so it isn't anything that would stop me getting an A5 personally. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXGtEACgkQOjLpvpq7dMqdMACgimwT/C7TFsv+edbZQIzFN0zE 5tYAnjamWgbP2T42BLJFrOMMU8q/0V52 =e/Vh -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | Steve kindly emailed me on this issue and said: | | The A5 boards have been reworked to remove the [LED] issue. So WRT | LEDs a5 and a6 have the same power consumption. Oh well, problem gone then :-) - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXNa4ACgkQOjLpvpq7dMrFNQCeMAFfMhPqofWvenavZKAk03Oy 1OwAn2wQ12e/9xc2LvUNxqpaPAOOrNec =4jUi -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Crane, Matthew wrote: | How complicated would surgery to fix this be? Is it reasonable to | create a wiki page detailing hw fix? | | Matt | | | | -Original Message- | From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Green | Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:56 AM | To: List for Openmoko community discussion | Subject: Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future | Button and LED software spec) | | | Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | | | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? | | | Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. | | | Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? | | They won't draw any power when off... that part works as intended. | | It's only when you turn them on, the transistor causes the CPU pin | itself to eat current itself due to an oversight. The effect in | consumption terms is something as if you lit several LEDs instead of the | one, say. But the LEDs come on and off as normal, are lit properly, | etc. | | In normal use the LEDs aren't on much if at all, so it isn't anything | that would stop me getting an A5 personally. | | -Andy I believe I've read somewhere (probably another branch of this thread) that the LED issue will be fixed for all shipping Freerunners because they just need to switch out a transistor (though the current testing models still have it). So no surgery will be necessary. - --Bert -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIFy9AVfxFjPpfJ3oRAnVnAJ93Muj5ScPQ0X1NCJ1U36vARayNBgCeI2xL 5Jvjs1Skm5rk06gHJiRRrtg= =3Cjq -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
Yay! That ends the turmoil going on in my mind between my impatience and my crippling desire to have the best of everything! On Tue, 2008-04-29 at 15:41 +0100, Tim Coggins wrote: Steve kindly emailed me on this issue and said: The A5 boards have been reworked to remove the [LED] issue. So WRT LEDs a5 and a6 have the same power consumption. Therefore you wouldn't need to dig out your soldering iron. Does anyone know the other differences with power consumption are between boards? Tim up OM software will eschew the frivoulous lighting of LEDs. On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 2:58 PM, Crane, Matthew [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How complicated would surgery to fix this be? Is it reasonable to create a wiki page detailing hw fix? Matt -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Green Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:56 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec) -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? | Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. | Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? They won't draw any power when off... that part works as intended. It's only when you turn them on, the transistor causes the CPU pin itself to eat current itself due to an oversight. The effect in consumption terms is something as if you lit several LEDs instead of the one, say. But the LEDs come on and off as normal, are lit properly, etc. In normal use the LEDs aren't on much if at all, so it isn't anything that would stop me getting an A5 personally. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXGtEACgkQOjLpvpq7dMqdMACgimwT/C7TFsv+edbZQIzFN0zE 5tYAnjamWgbP2T42BLJFrOMMU8q/0V52 =e/Vh -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Italy User Group
Pietro m0nt0 Montorfano ha scritto: Andrea Debortoli ha scritto: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GroupSales#Italy Just 2 things, when someone insert his/her name should also update the number at the top, just under the city! Hey, we are 37 people!! :D I waited for this thread... All countries have one :P. Anyway I think we should spam a little more around on blogs, forums and so on. Anyone can do this bad work? :) -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness)
Ok.. I'm severely jet lagged but I will try to throw some closure on this and hope it is coherent. Steve has been very cordial and enlightening in his mails to me. The last I have yet to digest and respond to but overall it is good, constructive stuff. After reading the diaglogue that has ensued, I totally understand why he wanted to take the conversation private. We'll has some things and go from there. Sorry for starting a firestorm. I want to let everyone know I don't intend to be negative and that was why I sent that last message. If I see problems, I want to offer solutions. I also want to thank Stroller for his phenomenal job for capturing (and translating) what I was trying to say. There was one statement made that I want to comment on... I mean marketing is really just how to sellSNIP That statement could not be farther from the truth, IMHO. I think any Tech CEO worth his salt would tell you the same. That very statement and belief is why so many startups in Silicon Valley (and probably worldwide) with very amazing products have gone bankrupt. I have friends that lived through that nightmare. That mindset is the very essence of the problem my original e-mail was trying to address. I couldn't have summed it better myself. It makes it sound like engineering comes up with a product all on it's own, throws it over a wall and to Marketing and says here, sell it. Kind of like a hot potato. That was the case once... in the 60's, I believe. Today, any company that had that mindset would not last long unless they had very deep pockets. Yes, I have a specific company in mind. My thought is let's roll that marketing effort over to this project from a community perspective. A lot of Open Source projects already do it.. Open Office is the first one that comes to mind. One of the thing I want to do with Steve is draw some boundaries... What is in Openmoko's court, and what is in the community's court regarding marketing... etc. In the meantime, let's roll out the FreeRunner and once it's out, well attack the next project publicly. Ok.. I'm going to sleep now. :) Cheers! Lowell On Mon, Apr 28, 2008 at 6:58 PM, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: thanks for explaining that to folks -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Stroller Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 2:01 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness) On 28 Apr 2008, at 17:54, hank williams wrote: I have to say my unvoiced thoughts were the same as Ryan's. I was not at all clear why a call for the community to help figure marketing stuff out would be met by a request to take the discussion off list as though it was somehow inappropriate for public discussion. It seemed like a very strange response. Now reading the responses to Ryan's comments seem even more strange. I feel like I am missing something because the responses to Ryan's comments seem on the surface, inappropriate as well. If you read further back in this thread you'll see that the subject changed in reply to my message, Re: Ugliness (26 April 2008 13:58:04 BST). If you read back you'll see that before that someone was complaining the Freerunner will never sell in the mass-market because me my friends think it's ugly, and my counterpoint was, heck, I'm sure FIC have done some market research (focus groups c). Lowell Higley obviously knows his stuff regarding selling tech products, and he raises some interesting points. I immediately wanted to reply to them, but I could have spent hours doing so. Not to argue with him, just to purse interesting avenues of discussion. But Lowell's insights are far more in depth than your average Xbox vs Playstation, who's-winning-the-format-war, fanbois' forum thread. As Lowell says: Marketing is much more than holding focus groups and creating sales copy. There is competitive analysis, business cases, marketing requirements, negotiating with engineering over the final product, schedule.. and the list goes on. My point is, as I look at things and put the picture together, I see no strong marketing presence in the FreeRunner. Where's the MRD? Where's the focus group? Where's the business case? In case you don't speak the business jargon, competitive analysis means how much does the competition sell for, how much will it cost us to make a similar product and how much profit can we make?. Business cases and the results of focus groups, say FIC stating that you your friends may think it's ugly, but we reckon we can sell XX thousand units and make $yyy profit aren't really any of our business. In his second message (27 April 2008 18:16:11 BST) Lowell raises the goal of the OpenMoko project, which is ostensibly the best possible mobile phone software stack that can be installed over a wide range of phones. But underlying that is
Re: Italy User Group
2008/4/29 Marco Trevisan (Treviño) [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pietro m0nt0 Montorfano ha scritto: Andrea Debortoli ha scritto: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GroupSales#Italy Just 2 things, when someone insert his/her name should also update the number at the top, just under the city! Hey, we are 37 people!! :D I waited for this thread... All countries have one :P. Anyway I think we should spam a little more around on blogs, forums and so on. Anyone can do this bad work? :) I've already done this on www.neo1973.it but there's no many others places where we're sure to find interested peoplemaybe you could convince felipe...:)... bye Andrea -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Italy User Group
Hey, we are 37 people!! :D now 38 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Italy User Group
Andrea Debortoli wrote: I've already done this on www.neo1973.it http://www.neo1973.it but there's no many others places where we're sure to find interested peoplemaybe you could convince felipe...:)... Ok, I'll contact him... :) -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness)
I understand what you're saying about engineers tossing a product over the wall being a throw back. *Of course* there's back and forth and both marketing and rnd contributing to each other.. But I think it is typical for engineers to yearn for a larger role in marketing decisions and, less so, marketing to overstate their role in product engineering. Both groups have strong investments in the product dev process in different ways. I think engineering tends to be more of a group development effort, where marketing relies more on the strength of individuals, all with very good reasons. If the concerns are too overlapped, or if there is no seperation and specialization, I don't think that works well generally. I think there's very high value wrt role seperation and specialization. I don't think it was suggested that there was some kind of wall in the middle, that's ridiculous. But the best products come from a respect for the others roles and intense focus on what people are good at. Matt From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lowell Higley Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 12:11 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness) Ok.. I'm severely jet lagged but I will try to throw some closure on this and hope it is coherent. Steve has been very cordial and enlightening in his mails to me. The last I have yet to digest and respond to but overall it is good, constructive stuff. After reading the diaglogue that has ensued, I totally understand why he wanted to take the conversation private. We'll has some things and go from there. Sorry for starting a firestorm. I want to let everyone know I don't intend to be negative and that was why I sent that last message. If I see problems, I want to offer solutions. I also want to thank Stroller for his phenomenal job for capturing (and translating) what I was trying to say. There was one statement made that I want to comment on... I mean marketing is really just how to sellSNIP That statement could not be farther from the truth, IMHO. I think any Tech CEO worth his salt would tell you the same. That very statement and belief is why so many startups in Silicon Valley (and probably worldwide) with very amazing products have gone bankrupt. I have friends that lived through that nightmare. That mindset is the very essence of the problem my original e-mail was trying to address. I couldn't have summed it better myself. It makes it sound like engineering comes up with a product all on it's own, throws it over a wall and to Marketing and says here, sell it. Kind of like a hot potato. That was the case once... in the 60's, I believe. Today, any company that had that mindset would not last long unless they had very deep pockets. Yes, I have a specific company in mind. My thought is let's roll that marketing effort over to this project from a community perspective. A lot of Open Source projects already do it.. Open Office is the first one that comes to mind. One of the thing I want to do with Steve is draw some boundaries... What is in Openmoko's court, and what is in the community's court regarding marketing... etc. In the meantime, let's roll out the FreeRunner and once it's out, well attack the next project publicly. Ok.. I'm going to sleep now. :) Cheers! Lowell On Mon, Apr 28, 2008 at 6:58 PM, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: thanks for explaining that to folks -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Stroller Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 2:01 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness) On 28 Apr 2008, at 17:54, hank williams wrote: I have to say my unvoiced thoughts were the same as Ryan's. I was not at all clear why a call for the community to help figure marketing stuff out would be met by a request to take the discussion off list as though it was somehow inappropriate for public discussion. It seemed like a very strange response. Now reading the responses to Ryan's comments seem even more strange. I feel like I am missing something because the responses to Ryan's comments seem on the surface, inappropriate as well. If you read further back in this thread you'll see that the subject changed in reply to my message, Re: Ugliness (26 April 2008 13:58:04 BST). If you read back you'll see that before that someone was complaining the Freerunner will never sell in the mass-market because me my friends think it's ugly, and my counterpoint was, heck, I'm sure FIC have done some market research (focus groups c).
Community Update???
Hello Steve, Michael, since the last official community update was a few week ago i just have a short question about the status of freerunner. As i understood Steves last Update the PVTs are done and MP is ongoing. OM is just wating for a shipable SW. Did i get thar right? Regards Andreas ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Community Update???
Andreas Hennig wrote: since the last official community update was a few week ago Months? :o :| Anyway I do prefer they're working on shipping the Frerunners to us, than on writing here... BTW I'd like to read some twitter-form status-mails from them :) -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness)
On 4/29/08, Lowell Higley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean marketing is really just how to sellSNIP That statement could not be farther from the truth, IMHO. I think any Tech I agree 100% with Lowell. When I think of marketing I think of Apple and Google. Apple is for some specific group of people while Google manage to reach all. Why? It is not because Google is free. Try to compare OpenOffice with m$ office. M$ office gets its users because it's pushed on us (huge availability and commenly known). Google engineered what the market requested. They found out what people wanted and how to give it to them. I remember that I started using the search engine because someone recommended it to me. This was many years ago... other people recommended me other search engines. Some might be better, but Google is good enough so I do not change right now. I have no idea about marketing, but I like Steve's idea about open marketing. If we show the phone to many people, some of them might get interested. I started using Linux because a friend of me told me about it. If Openmoko should get out to x million people, I think we all need to work together. Remember it is in our own interest to make Openmoko survive. Showing off the phone would make a difference. If we want to show something to non-hackers, we (the community) needs to develop a a lot of nice software, so that people say Wow! I want that feature!. I remember my friend told me that he don't care about what his phone is able to do, as long as it is slim, long battery capacity and that he is able to send/receive calls/SMS. Now I wonder, which features would be so valuable that he would not care about the physical design? If the phone was also a nitendo wii? Well, then it is up to us, the community, to implement software that makes the phone work as a nitendo wii. Only this way will garantee success. Lack of features in hardware (e.g. camera) must be compensated for in software (e.g. image drawing programs and support for sending/receiving images). If Openmoko survives, we could get more open firmware and GPL'ed drivers. If Openmoko gets 1% of the mobile market, they can start to push companies into GPL. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness)
The how to sell comment I made was a vast generalization meant to differentiate the roles of marketing and engineering in a crass way. Very easy to jump on, I know. Do you really think google engineers part of the day to day marketing meetings there? Or the same at Apple? Or sony? I doubt it.. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Flemming Richter Mikkelsen Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 2:04 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness) On 4/29/08, Lowell Higley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean marketing is really just how to sellSNIP That statement could not be farther from the truth, IMHO. I think any Tech I agree 100% with Lowell. When I think of marketing I think of Apple and Google. Apple is for some specific group of people while Google manage to reach all. Why? It is not because Google is free. Try to compare OpenOffice with m$ office. M$ office gets its users because it's pushed on us (huge availability and commenly known). Google engineered what the market requested. They found out what people wanted and how to give it to them. I remember that I started using the search engine because someone recommended it to me. This was many years ago... other people recommended me other search engines. Some might be better, but Google is good enough so I do not change right now. I have no idea about marketing, but I like Steve's idea about open marketing. If we show the phone to many people, some of them might get interested. I started using Linux because a friend of me told me about it. If Openmoko should get out to x million people, I think we all need to work together. Remember it is in our own interest to make Openmoko survive. Showing off the phone would make a difference. If we want to show something to non-hackers, we (the community) needs to develop a a lot of nice software, so that people say Wow! I want that feature!. I remember my friend told me that he don't care about what his phone is able to do, as long as it is slim, long battery capacity and that he is able to send/receive calls/SMS. Now I wonder, which features would be so valuable that he would not care about the physical design? If the phone was also a nitendo wii? Well, then it is up to us, the community, to implement software that makes the phone work as a nitendo wii. Only this way will garantee success. Lack of features in hardware (e.g. camera) must be compensated for in software (e.g. image drawing programs and support for sending/receiving images). If Openmoko survives, we could get more open firmware and GPL'ed drivers. If Openmoko gets 1% of the mobile market, they can start to push companies into GPL. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
emulator config problem
hi, i followed instructions at: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU i got the code and i started config but i got this error, can someone tell me more how to mand this and configure and build it p.s. i use ubuntu/debian --- error -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/home/ahmo/workspace/openmoko/qemu-neo1973# ./configure --target-list=arm-softmmu WARNING: gcc looks like gcc 4.x Looking for gcc 3.x Found gcc-3.4 Install prefix/usr/local BIOS directory/usr/local/share/qemu binary directory /usr/local/bin Manual directory /usr/local/share/man ELF interp prefix /usr/gnemul/qemu-%M Source path /home/ahmo/workspace/openmoko/qemu-neo1973 C compilergcc-3.4 Host C compiler gcc make make install install host CPU i386 host big endian no target list arm-softmmu gprof enabled no profiler no static build no -Werror enabled no SDL support no mingw32 support no Adlib support no AC97 support no GUS support no CoreAudio support no ALSA support no EsounD supportno DSound supportno FMOD support no OSS support yes VNC TLS support no kqemu support yes Documentation no The error log from compiling the libSDL test is: /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:1:17: SDL.h: No such file or directory /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c: In function `main': /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: `SDL_INIT_VIDEO' undeclared (first use in this function) /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: for each function it appears in.) ERROR: QEMU requires SDL or Cocoa for graphical output To build QEMU without graphical output configure with --disable-gfx-check Note that this will disable all output from the virtual graphics card. -- www.vedran.ba 2/204 - 2/224 - 2/255 - 2/281 - 14/24 - 17/53 - 36/4 ... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: emulator config problem
On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 09:58:35PM +0200, Vedran Alajbegović wrote: hi, i followed instructions at: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU i got the code and i started config but i got this error, can someone tell me more how to mand this and configure and build it p.s. i use ubuntu/debian --- error -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/home/ahmo/workspace/openmoko/qemu-neo1973# ./configure [snip] The error log from compiling the libSDL test is: /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:1:17: SDL.h: No such file or directory /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c: In function `main': /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: `SDL_INIT_VIDEO' undeclared (first use in this function) /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: for each function it appears in.) ERROR: QEMU requires SDL or Cocoa for graphical output To build QEMU without graphical output configure with --disable-gfx-check Note that this will disable all output from the virtual graphics card. It means that you're missing the SDL development package. On my Debian system, there's a bunch of them, but libsdl1.2-dev seems to be the main one. Hugo. -- === Hugo Mills: [EMAIL PROTECTED] carfax.org.uk | darksatanic.net | lug.org.uk === PGP key: 515C238D from wwwkeys.eu.pgp.net or http://www.carfax.org.uk --- The English language has the mot juste for every occasion. --- signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: emulator config problem
ah, i had another one thank you i hope i'll have no problems with build On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 10:27 PM, Hugo Mills [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 09:58:35PM +0200, Vedran Alajbegović wrote: hi, i followed instructions at: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU i got the code and i started config but i got this error, can someone tell me more how to mand this and configure and build it p.s. i use ubuntu/debian --- error -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/home/ahmo/workspace/openmoko/qemu-neo1973# ./configure [snip] The error log from compiling the libSDL test is: /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:1:17: SDL.h: No such file or directory /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c: In function `main': /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: `SDL_INIT_VIDEO' undeclared (first use in this function) /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: for each function it appears in.) ERROR: QEMU requires SDL or Cocoa for graphical output To build QEMU without graphical output configure with --disable-gfx-check Note that this will disable all output from the virtual graphics card. It means that you're missing the SDL development package. On my Debian system, there's a bunch of them, but libsdl1.2-dev seems to be the main one. Hugo. -- === Hugo Mills: [EMAIL PROTECTED] carfax.org.uk | darksatanic.net | lug.org.uk === PGP key: 515C238D from wwwkeys.eu.pgp.net or http://www.carfax.org.uk --- The English language has the mot juste for every occasion. --- -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIF4SpIKyzvlFcI40RAvBJAJ4n7XSyp21qkjR6SVBFNP19YH/dagCaAr39 vE1V/zHvBWJxHbkFmnUn/Nc= =mzf5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- www.vedran.ba 2/204 - 2/224 - 2/255 - 2/281 - 14/24 - 17/53 - 36/4 ... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: emulator config problem
and yes.. i finally fall in love with this thing :D 2008/4/29 Vedran Alajbegović [EMAIL PROTECTED]: ah, i had another one thank you i hope i'll have no problems with build On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 10:27 PM, Hugo Mills [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 09:58:35PM +0200, Vedran Alajbegović wrote: hi, i followed instructions at: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU i got the code and i started config but i got this error, can someone tell me more how to mand this and configure and build it p.s. i use ubuntu/debian --- error -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/home/ahmo/workspace/openmoko/qemu-neo1973# ./configure [snip] The error log from compiling the libSDL test is: /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:1:17: SDL.h: No such file or directory /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c: In function `main': /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: `SDL_INIT_VIDEO' undeclared (first use in this function) /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once /tmp/qemu-conf--15860-.c:3: error: for each function it appears in.) ERROR: QEMU requires SDL or Cocoa for graphical output To build QEMU without graphical output configure with --disable-gfx-check Note that this will disable all output from the virtual graphics card. It means that you're missing the SDL development package. On my Debian system, there's a bunch of them, but libsdl1.2-dev seems to be the main one. Hugo. -- === Hugo Mills: [EMAIL PROTECTED] carfax.org.uk | darksatanic.net | lug.org.uk=== PGP key: 515C238D from wwwkeys.eu.pgp.net or http://www.carfax.org.uk --- The English language has the mot juste for every occasion. --- -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIF4SpIKyzvlFcI40RAvBJAJ4n7XSyp21qkjR6SVBFNP19YH/dagCaAr39 vE1V/zHvBWJxHbkFmnUn/Nc= =mzf5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- www.vedran.ba 2/204 - 2/224 - 2/255 - 2/281 - 14/24 - 17/53 - 36/4 ... -- www.vedran.ba 2/204 - 2/224 - 2/255 - 2/281 - 14/24 - 17/53 - 36/4 ... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Community Update???
Whi not have an official openmoko twitter stream? On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 8:10 PM, Marco Trevisan (Treviño) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andreas Hennig wrote: since the last official community update was a few week ago Months? :o :| Anyway I do prefer they're working on shipping the Frerunners to us, than on writing here... BTW I'd like to read some twitter-form status-mails from them :) -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- My corner of the web: http://blog.ramsesoriginal.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness)
Ok, my experience in the marketing field is very specific, and my experience as an engineer is practically non-existant (i'm still studying), so i wil lsimply step back and listen to you guys on this discussion. I just wanted to point out a really cool idea/product/service (call it like you want): http://zooppa.com/ I'ts a really cool idea of making advertisement social.. in some sort of way. I really like this idea and would liek to point it to you guys :D On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 10:12 PM, Lowell Higley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Matt.. I think I get a sense of where you are coming from. As an engineer, one thinks oh no, here comes these marketing people with their unrealistic requirements again. Been there. Even been on the giving end. :( On the flip side, as a marketer one sometimes thinks, Man, will these guys ever get a clue, no one wants that feature set. In a *perfect* world, engineers and marketers would be equal partners.. I don't think I've actually seen this work perfectly yet but I know the relationship I built with the engineering at Unisys was hard earned and it was built on trust (both ways.) It was a pretty good relationship and took me a few years to build. You have to treat the other side as part of the team, not the enemy as we have instincts to do. I've done it, I know. Here's how I see the roles working in an open environment... The marketing team creates a list of features that the product needs to have. There is a lot that goes into this I want to keep it simple for now. They sit down with the engineering team and create a list of agreed upon features (even suggested features engineering brings to the table) that go into the next product, prioritized of course. That list of features is created based on priority and feasibility of hitting the target completion date (agreed upon by everyone.. sort of.) Engineering then makes the magic happen... when a feature or requirement turns out it can't be met (through bug or other technical issue) both teams work out either a revised feature list or target date. Depends on how important that feature is. I've been in situations where I was told 5 days before the target date oh by the way, we dumped that must have feature x. While the engineering team is building the marketing team is working out the future of the next product and creating the collateral and campaign for the product in development. All publicly of course, with the aid of anyone (including the techie folks) that wants to help. I have a lot of ideas. I was thinking the bug database would be a good place to keep feature suggestions/submissions... but I couldn't find a bug database in the wiki. I must be blind. From that point, it's a big cycle. Once you get it going... it's easy to keep on it. The hard part is building the collaborative tools/process to do all this in. I think as an after thought, maybe we don't want to split into teams, just create a logical process... Not sure how that would work, though. People have definite skills in one are or the other. Anyways, that's my hair brained idea... I guess I should talk this out with Steve before I go too much further down this road. Thanks for the feedback. I think I understand your perspective now. Lowell PS - regarding Open Marketing, I'm a fan. I've been attempting to load the framework on my Motorola E680i but not had too much success. Damn QVGA. The people in my LUG know I am very interested in this project so I get questions once a week via IRC on Openmoko. Far from an expert but they seem to like my answer. I know if I had one to show off at a meeting, it would be a hit. On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Crane, Matthew [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I understand what you're saying about engineers tossing a product over the wall being a throw back. *Of course* there's back and forth and both marketing and rnd contributing to each other.. But I think it is typical for engineers to yearn for a larger role in marketing decisions and, less so, marketing to overstate their role in product engineering. Both groups have strong investments in the product dev process in different ways. I think engineering tends to be more of a group development effort, where marketing relies more on the strength of individuals, all with very good reasons. If the concerns are too overlapped, or if there is no seperation and specialization, I don't think that works well generally. I think there's very high value wrt role seperation and specialization. I don't think it was suggested that there was some kind of wall in the middle, that's ridiculous. But the best products come from a respect for the others roles and intense focus on what people are good at. Matt From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lowell Higley Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 12:11 PM To: List
.Mac like service
Hi everyone, I wonder if there's any chance Openmoko could (or is going to) offer a service like apple's .Mac for the Openmoko users. I have some ideas (and I'm sure you have a lot more) that could make this service very useful. I was just about to add it to the wishlist, but I'm not sure where to do it. It is not a hardware matter, but it is not about sofware neither. And please notice I'm not saying it could be just for the Neo1973 and Freerunner users, but Openmoko, and by that I mean future Fic divices as well as other devices running Openmoko. Kosa - Un mundo mejor es posible - ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec)
On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 7:41 AM, Tim Coggins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Steve kindly emailed me on this issue and said: The A5 boards have been reworked to remove the [LED] issue. So WRT LEDs a5 and a6 have the same power consumption. The transistors were replaced with the internal-resistor variety? Well it's very good that it is fixed. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: .Mac like service
On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 4:46 PM, Kosa [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wonder if there's any chance Openmoko could (or is going to) offer a service like apple's .Mac for the Openmoko users. I have some ideas (and I'm sure you have a lot more) that could make this service very useful. What kind of features do you want to see? What are the use cases? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Upgrading 1973 to Freerunner
Ian Stirling wrote: Basically, the screen is glued down, and will be difficult to remove. Actually, that's not the case. I took apart a Neo1973 (GTA01) on the weekend, and the screen is very easy to remove (the only tool required is the Torx screwdriver for the case, the guitar pick so you don't cut your fingers getting the front off, and your fingernails to remove some conductive tape). In fact it would be *very* easy to replace a broken Neo1973 screen with a good screen from another device which has a working screen but a broken circuit board. -- Rod ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: .Mac like service
2008/4/30 Shawn Rutledge [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 4:46 PM, Kosa [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wonder if there's any chance Openmoko could (or is going to) offer a service like apple's .Mac for the Openmoko users. I have some ideas (and I'm sure you have a lot more) that could make this service very useful. What kind of features do you want to see? What are the use cases? my list starts with: *backing up phone settings, including list of installed packages (in case i need to re-install everything) *backing up e-mails/text messages *storing gps coords in case the phone's stolen/lost *backup/storage of any other arbitrary files some or all of these could have the option to be encrypted of course ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: .Mac like service
On 4/30/08, Shawn Rutledge [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 5:44 PM, Robin Paulson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: my list starts with: *backing up phone settings, including list of installed packages (in case i need to re-install everything) *backing up e-mails/text messages *storing gps coords in case the phone's stolen/lost *backup/storage of any other arbitrary files You would want it to be a commercial service like .mac, with a subscription fee and guaranteed reliable service, and use GPRS to access it? Or you would want to just do that stuff with your own PC? I think some of the community members could set up a server for this. Of course there must be some encrytion so the private data is secured. -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 Free your mind - Open(moko) your phone ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: .Mac like service
2008/4/30 Shawn Rutledge [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 5:44 PM, Robin Paulson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: my list starts with: *backing up phone settings, including list of installed packages (in case i need to re-install everything) *backing up e-mails/text messages *storing gps coords in case the phone's stolen/lost *backup/storage of any other arbitrary files You would want it to be a commercial service like .mac, with a subscription fee and guaranteed reliable service, and use GPRS to access it? Or you would want to just do that stuff with your own PC? they could provide multiple levels of service - a free one that can store gps coords, sms (say, 50MB storage) which isn't supported or a paid-for service that has more storage space (5GB?), is supported, has guaranteed service levels, and includes encryption. similar to xdrive, but good access would be however i connect to the web - wifi, gprs, usb connection to my home network, whatever alternatively, an application to sit on my pc and do all this stuff locally would be very useful ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
mobile gps gaming
i just listened to an interesting piece on the bbc about gps gaming on mobile phones: http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/digital_planet.shtml at 15:40 onwards talking about a company in england that is developing innovative games based around gps-equipped phones. http://www.futureplatforms.com/fp/clients/locomatrix/gps_gaming/ they've got one game under development at the moment: The prototype is a multi-player game. Gathering in a field with a mobile phone and a GPS unit each, players hop into the game and then start wandering around the real-world playing field, picking up letters and bringing them back to a home-cell. As the team progresses, they see their letters come together to spell a word. which sounds a bit lame, but more interestingly, there's a 'game designer' in the works, to allow users to put together their won ideas how is java on the neo progressing? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: .Mac like service
-Original Message- From: Robin Paulson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 6:29 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: .Mac like service /snip alternatively, an application to sit on my pc and do all this stuff locally would be very useful To add to this, giving the application the ability to log into the service and sync locally, or update the service with more up-to-date info would be useful. --Tim. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Shipping questions, customer organized distribution in Europe
Well, you remember how we talked about your breadcrumbs project, where you basically create a trail or map of where you have been. So, I started thinking about that and wondering about using the accelerometers, and Then I started to think about all the extreme cases of human movement which would stress the system, and so I thought about parkour, and then I went to youtube to look at some videos just for kicks, and this came up. And the name was born. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vjco3boDZ7A -Original Message- From: Werner Almesberger [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 10:55 PM To: steve Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'List for Openmoko community discussion' Subject: Re: Shipping questions, customer organized distribution in Europe steve wrote: Werner doesn't even know he was the inspiration. Oh, *now* I'm curious :-) - Werner ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Buttonand LED software spec)
See the wiki its technically a component change. Also see earlier mails from tony on the topid. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_GTA02_Hardware#GTA02v6 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tim Coggins Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 7:41 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Buttonand LED software spec) Steve kindly emailed me on this issue and said: The A5 boards have been reworked to remove the [LED] issue. So WRT LEDs a5 and a6 have the same power consumption. Therefore you wouldn't need to dig out your soldering iron. Does anyone know the other differences with power consumption are between boards? Tim up OM software will eschew the frivoulous lighting of LEDs. On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 2:58 PM, Crane, Matthew [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How complicated would surgery to fix this be? Is it reasonable to create a wiki page detailing hw fix? Matt -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Green Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:56 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Freerunner will be GTA02v5 or GTA02v6? (was: Fwd: Future Button and LED software spec) -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | Is it possible to turn off these LEDs via Software? | Yes, they're all controlled from the CPU and default to being off. | Does this mean that they won't draw any power when they're turned off? They won't draw any power when off... that part works as intended. It's only when you turn them on, the transistor causes the CPU pin itself to eat current itself due to an oversight. The effect in consumption terms is something as if you lit several LEDs instead of the one, say. But the LEDs come on and off as normal, are lit properly, etc. In normal use the LEDs aren't on much if at all, so it isn't anything that would stop me getting an A5 personally. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkgXGtEACgkQOjLpvpq7dMqdMACgimwT/C7TFsv+edbZQIzFN0zE 5tYAnjamWgbP2T42BLJFrOMMU8q/0V52 =e/Vh -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Shipping questions, customer organized distribution in Europe
That's what I am working on this very moment -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Hans L Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 4:38 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Shipping questions, customer organized distribution in Europe All this talking about shipping made a lightbulb go off in my head. I'm not sure if this has already been considered, but would it be possible to distribute through Amazon.com? They seem to be very efficient about distributing things, and shipping costs have always been very reasonable(if not completely free) in my experience. I don't know exactly how it works getting distributed by Amazon, but just curious if this has been looked into. Maybe it would be beneficial to all parties involved? -Hans Loeblich ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Re: .Mac like service
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Flemming Richter Mikkelsen wrote: On 4/30/08, Shawn Rutledge [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 5:44 PM, Robin Paulson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: my list starts with: *backing up phone settings, including list of installed packages (in case i need to re-install everything) *backing up e-mails/text messages *storing gps coords in case the phone's stolen/lost *backup/storage of any other arbitrary files You would want it to be a commercial service like .mac, with a subscription fee and guaranteed reliable service, and use GPRS to access it? Or you would want to just do that stuff with your own PC? I think some of the community members could set up a server for this. Of course there must be some encrytion so the private data is secured. I don't think we really need community members to set up a server. There are several existing ftp servers where you can get a free account and store files privately and publicly. The only software you'd need to write would be the openmoko client - which I presume you'd want to show some intelligence regarding what it uploads, what it encrypts before uploading, etc. Whoever took this on would need to make sure the remote backup had a consistent (extensible) structure and format. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.2 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIF+m4jK3MZIZPmKIRArZVAKCJpUIoE5EO0upHVYO3kIyC24FCvgCdH9Ee oOVbneuMf287SFOli5RbDYo= =VxZs -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
