Re: No stylus on V1 release?
On Sun, 2007-03-25 at 10:54 +0200, Gabriel Ambuehl wrote: On Sunday 25 March 2007 01:16:46 Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). Basically, yes, laser pointers can be dangerous, however, actual damage is not very likely: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pointer#Hazards. As for the rest, I agree with Joe. You could also just take the batteries out ;-) -Sean ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
On Tue, 27 Mar 2007, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote: On Sun, 2007-03-25 at 10:54 +0200, Gabriel Ambuehl wrote: On Sunday 25 March 2007 01:16:46 Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). Basically, yes, laser pointers can be dangerous, however, actual damage is not very likely: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pointer#Hazards. As for the rest, I agree with Joe. You could also just take the batteries out ;-) -Sean You could also not use the darn thing. There are plenty of alternative stylii out on the market, and as far as I know all are compatible with the Neo 1973. You don't even have to set up a special development environment :-) Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Le mardi 27 mars 2007 à 18:07 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz a écrit : On Sun, 2007-03-25 at 10:54 +0200, Gabriel Ambuehl wrote: On Sunday 25 March 2007 01:16:46 Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). Basically, yes, laser pointers can be dangerous, however, actual damage is not very likely: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pointer#Hazards. As for the rest, I agree with Joe. You could also just take the batteries out ;-) -Sean IANAL, but as I've read on Internet, in England and in France, the ownership of laser could be punished by the law... So, if his power exceeds the maximum allowed (1 mW), it could be to seize by the authorities (even without battery) and the owner fined for owning it. http://www.answers.com/topic/laser-pointer The output power of a laser pointer is measured in milliwatts (mW). Typically in Europe/UK the legal requirement is that a laser pointer output not exceed 1 mW; in USA this output is limited to 5 mW for presentation lasers. Lasers with outputs over 5 mW need to be registered with the FDA in the USA. Another interesting link : http://en.allexperts.com/e/l/la/laser_pointer.htm In Switzerland, the sale to the minors (18) is forbidden and all laser pointers (any class) are illegal in football stadium. So, in my case, I'll put it in a drawer and use the stylus of my HTC Himalaya. Perhaps would it be better to replace it by a normal stylus and save some US$ (or replace it by a bigger SDCard)? Or to propose it as an option (with extra charge)? As it would be nice to have the choice of the SDCard capacity (and an extra charge for it, of course). Regard, ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
kkr wrote: Le mardi 27 mars 2007 à 18:07 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz a écrit : On Sun, 2007-03-25 at 10:54 +0200, Gabriel Ambuehl wrote: On Sunday 25 March 2007 01:16:46 Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). Basically, yes, laser pointers can be dangerous, however, actual damage is not very likely: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pointer#Hazards. As for the rest, I agree with Joe. You could also just take the batteries out ;-) -Sean IANAL, but as I've read on Internet, in England and in France, the ownership of laser could be punished by the law... So, if his power exceeds the maximum allowed (1 mW), it could be to seize by the authorities (even without battery) and the owner fined for owning it. In the UK, up to 5mW is allowed. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
* Clare Johnstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] [070325 01:22]: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in Well, I take it on myself to play a representive of the public, guess I have at least as much reason. In my role as dad (well, I'm not a grand dad yet :) ), a dad that just gave her first mobile to his daughter, etc. on, and somebody who sold medical lasers for some years, I'm quite certain, that by the usual standards, I should be blind. Very blind. Guess the way regulators (or TÜV engineers look at it), my brain is probably fried :) Guess I'm a unruly kind, because I type this without a braille display. Basically, a laser pointer, which is bound to be a very weak device, is very far from dangerous. It might be able to hurt the eyes of some persons, but I doubt it. It might be able to raise the temperature of your eye by a degree. It might have negative effects on very small children, but well, these could also choke and die on any pointer. Guess we need to design a phone without small parts. Basically, despite the offical rules governing use of lasers, most people in the field don't take it that serious. Just to make it CRYSTAL CLEAR. This rant applies to red diode lasers, in the 650nm wavelength range with powers 5mW (which are usually used for pointers). There are enough lasers that one can use to hurt himself. Just not the typical laser pointers. a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). Well, you'll be shocked, I've been raised in a home where lasers were kept. *SHOCK* Another shocking thing, you know, some projectors used by people for their home entertainment setups include laser pointers in the remote. *SHOCK* Andreas clare On 2/16/07, Ian Stirling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: denis wrote: Ian Stirling schrieb: Stefan Schmidt wrote: It has a stylus, but no place in the case to hide it. My thoughts on this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Expansion_Back - a modified case. Should we add that page to the hardware wish list? and someone did, thus: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wish_List_-_Hardware#Laser_Pointer ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Dnia poniedziałek, 26 marca 2007, Ewan Marshall napisał: My first stereo had a infared laser remote. Now I know why people insist on having WiFi in neo1973 phone. When everyone quote everything just to add one line traffic on GPRS line will be too expensive to just read mails from ML. Hint: for 5 EUR you will get quite good keyboard with working Delete/Backspace keys. -- JID: hrw-jabber.org OpenEmbedded developer/consultant Contrary to popular belief, Unix is user friendly. It is just selective about who it makes friends with. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
On Sunday 25 March 2007 01:16:46 Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). Basically, yes, laser pointers can be dangerous, however, actual damage is not very likely: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pointer#Hazards. As for the rest, I agree with Joe. pgpMzUM8lvQW1.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
On Sun, Mar 25, 2007 at 08:16:46AM +0800, Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). clare Hi Clare! I like it, that you think about this. But as all laser pointers are battery powered, what's about just not putting batteries in the stylus? Okay, you wont be able to use the torch, but if you feel better with a plain stylus without any extras? _Guessing_ from koen's unboxing the neo pictures, the batteries are shipped seperately, so you just don't install them in the first place and leave them in the box. As one of those few who don't own a laser pointer/torch thingy, I anyway wonder how long the batteries last... Elrond ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Dnia niedziela, 25 marca 2007, Elrond napisał: But as all laser pointers are battery powered, what's about just not putting batteries in the stylus? _Guessing_ from koen's unboxing the neo pictures, the batteries are shipped seperately, so you just don't install them in the first place and leave them in the box. My Neo stylus came with batteries inside and extra ones in box. -- JID: hrw-jabber.org OpenEmbedded developer/consultant Don't mind me, I'm just checking if you are dense enough to cause a tide ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Hi Elrond, Thank you for that. It is a partial solution to my concern about children. I am still hoping for a stylus that is part of the phone, for convenience reasons. The suggestions about an alternative back were promising. My current phone has the stylus in a slot at the back and it is wonderful. I have trained myself always to put it back after use and I always have it, That means all I need to grab to take with me is the phone. The only other thing I carry all the time is my keys. One of them maybe will do as a stylus. clare. On 3/25/07, Elrond [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Mar 25, 2007 at 08:16:46AM +0800, Clare Johnstone wrote: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). clare Hi Clare! I like it, that you think about this. But as all laser pointers are battery powered, what's about just not putting batteries in the stylus? Okay, you wont be able to use the torch, but if you feel better with a plain stylus without any extras? _Guessing_ from koen's unboxing the neo pictures, the batteries are shipped seperately, so you just don't install them in the first place and leave them in the box. As one of those few who don't own a laser pointer/torch thingy, I anyway wonder how long the batteries last... Elrond ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). clare On 2/16/07, Ian Stirling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: denis wrote: Ian Stirling schrieb: Stefan Schmidt wrote: It has a stylus, but no place in the case to hide it. My thoughts on this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Expansion_Back - a modified case. Should we add that page to the hardware wish list? and someone did, thus: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wish_List_-_Hardware#Laser_Pointer ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Clare Johnstone writes: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). While a laser pointer can conceivably do damage, it's nowhere near as dangerous as a steak knife or even a ballpoint pen, and is in nothing like the same league as a bicycle. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Yes, that is the whole problem. This would be an item in constant and casual use in the home, with no special precautions as might be used for knives, hot stoves or poisons, and bound to cause a curious child to experiment with it. clare On 3/25/07, Joe Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Clare Johnstone writes: Dear all, This frightens me in my role as mother, grandmother etc, i.e. a representative of the public to which you hope to sell this phone. Essentially any laser device powerful enough to be useful has no place in a home which may ever have children in it. (Even quite old ones). While a laser pointer can conceivably do damage, it's nowhere near as dangerous as a steak knife or even a ballpoint pen, and is in nothing like the same league as a bicycle. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Clare Johnstone writes: Yes, that is the whole problem. This would be an item in constant and casual use in the home, with no special precautions as might be used for knives, hot stoves or poisons, and bound to cause a curious child to experiment with it. clare The whole problem is that while there is some remote possibility of injury, it isn't dangerous enough to be concerned about? Might be used? The kitchen knives have always been right out on the counter available for use. There are no locks on the knobs on the gas stove. The kids had bicycles, and got driver's licenses, right on schedule. I've got a challenge for you: how many documented cases of eye damage from laser pointers have there ever been? How does that number compare with deaths from choking on food in the period since laser pointers were invented? Seriously, you're worried about a complete non-issue. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Salve Harald, Sean, *! Harald Welte schrieb am Donnerstag, den 15. Februar 2007 um 03:37h: we have a stylus that's way too cool to hide it in a device. :)) Hopfully it will be at last *dual use* ;) Sean was about to get some photos of that stylus, but then, as you imagine, there's higher priority items for us at the moment. ;) Don't worry, because we are patient and Sean Moss-Pultz schrieb am Freitag, den 17. November 2006 um 18:46h: Don't any of you guys like surprises? ;-) yes, we do ;-) Cheers, rob PS: And again congratulations, respect and cheers to this great and uniqe project. When ever has a project published so much information before the first release of a device? Many people in the public may ask whey does the Neo1973 doesnt have xyz - because they are used to choose a product and that software features that wouldn't work from the beginning seldom would be relaised for the coustumers - they got to often the answer: please buy the latest device to use this software feature... So OpenMoko/Neo1973 is soo cool, so much fun that I'm very thankfull that you guys started and run this project - even without surprises it would be great, Great, absolutly GREAT! ; ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Hello. On Thu, 2007-02-15 at 01:01, kkr wrote: I can't see a stylus on the pictures (on openmoko.org)... Has it one? It has a stylus, but no place in the case to hide it. regards Stefan Schmidt signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
:-( I hope it will have a place for it on the V2... For not to lose it. Le jeudi 15 février 2007 à 01:19 +0100, Stefan Schmidt a écrit : Hello. On Thu, 2007-02-15 at 01:01, kkr wrote: I can't see a stylus on the pictures (on openmoko.org)... Has it one? It has a stylus, but no place in the case to hide it. regards Stefan Schmidt ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
Stefan Schmidt writes: Hello. On Thu, 2007-02-15 at 01:01, kkr wrote: I can't see a stylus on the pictures (on openmoko.org)... Has it one? It has a stylus, but no place in the case to hide it. Ouch. I'll move that to #1 on my wish-list for V2 ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: No stylus on V1 release?
On Thu, Feb 15, 2007 at 01:40:04AM +0100, kkr wrote: :-( I hope it will have a place for it on the V2... For not to lose it. we have a stylus that's way too cool to hide it in a device. Sean was about to get some photos of that stylus, but then, as you imagine, there's higher priority items for us at the moment. -- - Harald Welte [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
