Wanted: beta testers for QuantumSTEP on the Neo GTA01
Hi all, we are now looking for beta (well, it is more "alpha") testers for the new Cocoa/GNUstep/X11 based GUI stack and SDK for the Neo. Requirements: a) you own a GTA01b4 (we need to install a special kernel version), b) have a Mac with at least MacOS X 10.4, c) have (some) experience in Xcode, Interface Builder and Cocoa, d) are interested in trying this alternate system (meaning alternate to OpenMoko, Qtopia, Android, iPhone SDK) and giving feedback. Our aim: The software is not yet ready for real beta testing, since many mostly implemented features are not yet working (e.g. nil phone functionality) or still have (very) rough edges. It is more about the general concept and we are interested in your experiences, comments, hints and directions for further improvements to make it what the iPhone SDK probably will not be. What is working: * launching of applications (you can write or port your own code using C, Obj-C, Xcode and Interface Builder!) * Bluetooth scanning * some demo apps (Polygons, Sudoku, ...) * Stop Watch * RPN Calulator (like an HP15C) * Chess (only the GUI - the interface to the GNUchess engine is missing) * Morse decoder (by tapping on the screen...) * Color and Font manager panels * some more... Next Steps: If you are interested, please send me a mail and I will provide you instructions where to download and how to install. More Info: http://www.quantum-step.com/wiki.php?page=About http://www.quantum-step.com/swi/showdetail.php?app=4423 You are also invited to subscribe to the public announcements and discussion mailing lists: http://groups.google.de/group/com-quantumstep-announce http://groups.google.de/group/quantumstep-discuss Thank you very much, Nikolaus Schaller Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG http://www.goldelico.com Digital Tools for Independent People ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: quantum step on Neo
Am 29.01.2008 um 15:30 schrieb rakshat hooja: I just saw the following link. http://www.quantum-step.com/wiki.php?page=OpenMoko- Edition&referer=About According to this it seems that it is possible to at least boot quantum step on the Neo. Anyone know if the PIM applications on quantum step are usable on the the Neo. I currently use Yes, it can boot. And you can start some preliminary PIM functions that are already sketched: http://www.quantum-step.com/swi/showdetail.php?app=4409 http://www.quantum-step.com/swi/showdetail.php?app=4408 (screen shot comes from very old AppKit) http://www.quantum-step.com/swi/showdetail.php?app=4422 ( --- " --- ) But you can't really use them so far. One key issue is that we have no config to use a bluetooth keyboard. And inter-process communication fails so the on-screen keyboard doesn't interwork. Ubuntu to connect with my Neo but I do have a mac book and if the quantum step PIM can sync with the mac it would be great. Syncing is planned but not ready. But you can expect perfect and complete sync between a Mac and QuantumSTEP since both will use the same data structures for contacts, events, tasks etc. So there will be no data loss by syncing. I have sent out a request for alpha/beta testers today. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wanted: beta testers for QuantumSTEP on the Neo GTA01
Am 30.01.2008 um 12:33 schrieb Thomas Gstädtner: Maybe you should have mentioned, that your project and the SDK is not OpenSource and not available in source. Yes and no - there is no black&white answer. The total QuantumSTEP system is not 100% open source but approx. 80%. These 80% are the core parts (libraries, frameworks) to develop your own applications. This part is called mySTEP and is derived from GNUstep which is all licensed by FSF using the LGPL. This is the SDK. So the SDK *is* completely open source. Please look here for the open source of the SDK: http://www.quantum-step.com/download/sources/mySTEP/ http://www.quantum-step.com/download/sources/mySTEP-src-2.4B659.tgz If you are missing some sources, please let me know. Finally, you are free to replace our own non-open parts (applications) to get a 100% functional system. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: ***[Possible UCE]*** Re: Wanted: beta testers for QuantumSTEP on the Neo GTA01
Dear Ugo Raffaele Piemontese, Am 30.01.2008 um 15:07 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Dear Dr. Nikolaus Schaller, I'd like to test QuantumSTEP, but I don't have a mac. It's a big problem for me: for example, I'd like to write a review on my neo1973-dedicated blog [1], but I can't... I'm really interested in this project, and I was planning to translate something, even a user guide, into Italian. I have been reading everything written about it so far. Are you planning to release a jff2 rootfs image in the future? Yes, it is planned. We even have mkfs.jffs2 running on the Mac. But compiling a working jffs2 image is quite complex to retain the correct file owners and permissions. Kindest regards, Ugo Raffaele Piemontese Same to you, Nikolaus Schaller -- - [1] http://www.rudiaelinux.com/openmoko/ -- -- DEXGATEMICRO il centralino VoIP multifunzione per l'azienda. Prova gratuita per 4 utenti! Scopri tutte le funzionalita' sul sito Dexgate.com -- -- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wanted: beta testers for QuantumSTEP on the Neo GTA01
Not required IMHO... 1. "Alternate" distros or projects usually have their own discussion lists (e.g. [EMAIL PROTECTED]) 2. QuantumSTEP uses many parts of OpenMoko and just replaces some parts. See it as an alternate Application Suite. Am 30.01.2008 um 18:01 schrieb Jeff Andros: Is it possible to create a "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" list for stuff on the alternate software distro's? It seems kind of wierd that we're using openmoko's lists to discuss its "competitors" ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Any OS X developers out there working with OpenMoko?
Am 02.02.2008 um 01:50 schrieb Christopher Earl: Porting all the Linux stuff to OSX should be pretty easy afterall , OSX is just a Unix clone too For larger project (not relying on the least common denominator) it is not as easy as you might think. There are important differences between OSX and Linux: * endianness (on older Macs) * availability of some system calls * availability of some system tools * same features, options, syntax for system tools * availability of some libraries * same features, options, syntax for libraries Even worse if you want seamless GUI integration. Look e.g. at OpenOffice/NeoOffice and the outcome. It works but is "ugly" on a Mac. The fink and MacPorts projects have done a lot of work to adapt and provide build-recipies for many tools and libraries. But sometimes this is incomplete or even outdated because it needs a lot more effort to make packages OSX compatible instead of adapting to different Linux flavours (which sometimes differ only in search paths). Even automaked projects sometimes have issues. A prominent example which is very important for the question in the subject: nobody did succeed to completely install and run OpenEmbedded on OSX so far. The reasons are like described above * some tools are not directly available for OSX * or have a different option syntax * there are inherent assumptions of shell syntax features that Linux has recently added but where OSX uses an older BSD shell * some packages compile and run test code which assumes a full set of Linux header files * some build phases assume that Linux specific system tools (e.g. creating & mounting file systems) are available * ... So you have to choose between porting some hundred dependencies first or installing Linux in a VM... Even more challenging is the other way round: porting OSX (i.e. Darwin) to the Neo. Why would one consider that? IMHO the most interesting part is IOKit and its power management concepts. This could simplify device driver development and porting to new devices. It is quite similar to the Linux kernel modules concept but more powerful (you can write multithreaded drivers in C++). Porting to ARM devices is possible since Darwin is open source. And the iPhone also runs on an ARM processor. But I think such a project requires a lot of heroes looking for ultimate challenges. And don't heroes only exist in fairy tales? -- hns ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: now Koolu makes a phone too ;-)
Am 08.02.2008 um 08:30 schrieb Michael Shiloh: Yes, Koolu is a distributor. Michael I thought that there are no distributors defined yet except the one in Germany mentioned recently? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [link]Better than free
Am 26.02.2008 um 20:27 schrieb Flemming Richter Mikkelsen: On 2/17/08, andy selby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/kelly08/kelly08_index.html I know its Slashdoted, but could not hold out from sharing anyway. Sorry ;) In the future could you put a description of what you are linking to? It seems to be a blog entry about free culture, cant be bothered to read much today. It was actually the 8 reasons why people would pay for free software:) I read it differently: it is 8 added value qualities for which people would still pay for in a world of free content. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
OSX issue: Anyone successful to config RNDIS/Ethernet Gadget on 10.5.2
Hi, I have now upgraded my Mac to 10.5.2 and tried to connect the OpenMoko through RNDIS. Opening the System Settings shows a new interface called RNDIS/ Ethernet Gadget but it is shown as a Phone Modem. So, I can configure a phone number but no LAN address... Any success/idesas to save some time? As soon as it works, I can update the MacOSX wiki pages. Nikolaus ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OSX issue: Anyone successful to config RNDIS/Ethernet Gadget on 10.5.2
Am 01.03.2008 um 00:47 schrieb Nick Guenther: On 2/29/08, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi, I have now upgraded my Mac to 10.5.2 and tried to connect the OpenMoko through RNDIS. Opening the System Settings shows a new interface called RNDIS/ Ethernet Gadget but it is shown as a Phone Modem. So, I can configure a phone number but no LAN address... Any success/idesas to save some time? As soon as it works, I can update the MacOSX wiki pages. Nikolaus When are you plugging the phone in? If you plug it in at bootloader maybe Leopard is remembering the device it saw there, and not the ethernet gadget that the kernel presents. Doesn't depend on... It also gives the Interface the name "RNDIS Ethernet Gadget", but regards it as a modem. Well, there is still AJZaurusUSB which works. Would have been nice to use a system driver. Nikolaus ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: MiniOne
Am 06.03.2008 um 10:41 schrieb Gabriel Ambuehl: On Thursday 06 March 2008 09:57:22 Mario Wewer wrote: Hello community, does anyone of you already have a "Meizu MiniOne" Phone? You mean it's *not* vapor ware but actually for sale? There was a note on the German online magazine Heise-online that the German tax and duties authorities have confiscated all Meizu MiniOne devices during CeBIT because of patent infringement issues: http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/104558 And before you ask: yes, this is possible and legal. A company who has a patent in Europe can ask the tax authorities to confiscate infringing hardware as product piracy *when they are imported and enter the European Union*. In the case of CeBIT it is much simpler to wait until the manufacturer shows everything on their booth, than trying to find something in the baggage of the exhibitor's staff at the airports. The importer must then show proof that he has valid licenses and has paid any relevant fees. If he has or does not infringe patents, he can ask the original company who has done this for compensation (i.e. damage in image, loss of revenue and customers). The latter point shows that the patent owners must be quite sure what they do (or have enough money). But this all takes time and CeBIT has already closed its doors. The same has happened several times for MP3 players in previous years. Basically all this is a "service" that one gets by having a patent and paying the patent fees. He can ask tax&duty authorities for help to protect against infringing imports. So my conclusion is: it is not vapor because these devices exist - but they can't be sold or imported legally into the EU. Nikolaus ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: MiniOne
Am 06.03.2008 um 11:10 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: Am 06.03.2008 um 10:41 schrieb Gabriel Ambuehl: On Thursday 06 March 2008 09:57:22 Mario Wewer wrote: Hello community, does anyone of you already have a "Meizu MiniOne" Phone? You mean it's *not* vapor ware but actually for sale? There was a note on the German online magazine Heise-online that the German tax and duties authorities have confiscated all Meizu MiniOne devices during CeBIT because of patent infringement issues: http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/104558 And before you ask: yes, this is possible and legal. A company who has a patent in Europe can ask the tax authorities to confiscate infringing hardware as product piracy *when they are imported and enter the European Union*. In the case of CeBIT it is much simpler to wait until the manufacturer shows everything on their booth, than trying to find something in the baggage of the exhibitor's staff at the airports. The importer must then show proof that he has valid licenses and has paid any relevant fees. If he has or does not infringe patents, he can ask the original company who has done this for compensation (i.e. damage in image, loss of revenue and customers). The latter point shows that the patent owners must be quite sure what they do (or have enough money). But this all takes time and CeBIT has already closed its doors. The same has happened several times for MP3 players in previous years. Basically all this is a "service" that one gets by having a patent and paying the patent fees. He can ask tax&duty authorities for help to protect against infringing imports. So my conclusion is: it is not vapor because these devices exist - but they can't be sold or imported legally into the EU. There is an update to the article: it was NOT the MiniOne but an MP3 player. The MiniOne is back on CeBIT again. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: freerunnter - get it over trisoft
Am 20.03.2008 um 13:53 schrieb Matthias Ringwald: I didn't follow up on all the previous mails, but 399 EURO = 624 USD which looks like a > 50 % rip off compared to the mentioned 399 USD here. So I would have to buy it in the US and even get rid of the sales tax.. Well, if you consider sales taxes, extended warranty (24 months), recycling (WEEE), localized manual, support hotline, lower shipment cost, shipment within 1-3 days etc. as not neccessary, it might look like "ripping off"... But note that you get more than a plain device when ordering from a reseller than ordering directly in Taiwan or the US. My impression is that people have the tendency to compare low US prices without any add-ons with the EU prices which must include every price component. So, please read the previous mails where it has already been explained. BTW: if you order in the EU from Switzerland, you can reduce the price by the reseller's country VAT (e.g. 19% in Germany). But you may have to pay your Swiss import tax. This may also apply if you order directly from the US depending on your country's customs rules. So I am not sure that you can legally get rid of any sales taxes. Finally, what I really find strange is calling this "ripping off". You could also say the same for any product, because they do not sell at 0 USD. There are people who work hard to get devices from Taiwan into your hands. Do you really expect them to be altruistic to do that work for free? Free and Open does not necessarily mean "Free Beer". Another area of freedom: we also have free trade in most parts of the world so you are free to choose the best location to buy. Nikolaus http://www.handheld-linux.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Price of the Freerunner spare parts
If the goal is to have only one kind of "spares kit", I would put in: 1-2 batteries (100% original) 1 battery cover (100% original) 1 USB charger (if that is a special one) no LCD no other components (e.g. no USB cables, memory chips, they are commodity) I think resellers can put 2 or 3 devices aside to extract other parts like LCDs or PCBs for repair. They are quite expensive parts anyway so the difference to a full Neo becomes smaller. Am 27.03.2008 um 17:42 schrieb steve: Maybe I just create a "spares" product? with 3 batteries, and some other goodies thrown in? What goodies would go in that bag? Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko project future - Dreamliner vs. 737
To all those who are frustrated. First of all, please note the recent message from Steve that the Freerunner is already in production rampup (PVT), i.e. the hardware engineering phase is finished. Usually this means just weeks and no longer months until sales can start. But taking your picture of "liftoff", and knowing about all those eagerly waiting members on this list who have expected something different, I have worked on a solution for those who have different needs than the Freerunner will fulfill. The best result so far is sort of a "737" Open Linux PDA-Smartphone (when compared to the Neo "Dreamliner"). While the alternate device lacks WiFi, GPS, USB-Host and the latest kernels, it comes with * Quadband (800/850/1800/1900) * a 1.3Mpix camera * a builtin telescpoe pen * weights just 90g * is mature (i.e. end-user ready incl. power management) and * runs Qtopia (not the latest one) out of the box. I am in discussion with the manufacturer about the SDK and the limitations of openness. But what I have already tried with the sample devices is that it is really possible to install and run Sharp Zaurus binaries and cross-compile some code. Since I don't know if discussing alternatives to the Openmoko fits into the rules of this list, please send me a private mail (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ) if you are interested, or follow the links in the signature. With kind regards, Nikolaus Schaller http://www.handheld-linux.com http://groups.google.de/group/org-letux-discuss PS: we plan to add both, the Freerunner and this alternate device to our shop so you have more choice Am 07.04.2008 um 23:58 schrieb Ron K. Jeffries: OpenMoko is a brilliant concept. I hope to buy a Freerunner when it's relatively safe to go in the water. Before we jump down the throats of those who express some frustration about how the release schedule has taken longer than we all hoped, here's my non-emotional comment in support of those who are frustrated. I do no know why, but the OpenMoko project (Hardware and software) objectively is dragging out. From the sidelines, it is difficult to judge whether this VIRTUOUS project will or will not achieve liftoff, or will crash off the end of the runway. yes, absolutely, developing in a fully open environment means everybody knows each and every wart along the way. Apple and Steve Jobs did not have that burden, nor do Nokia, or LG, Samsung, Motorola. BUT the OpenMoko project likely does not have enough financial capital and human resource to accomplish its lofty ambitions. I passionately hope I am TOTALLY WRONG. But the track record to date is "dodgy" at best. -- Ron K. Jeffries http://blog.eronj.com http://twitter.com/rjeffries ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko project future - Dreamliner vs. 737
Ooops... Must have been done while having some blackout... Am 08.04.2008 um 09:27 schrieb Kevin Zuber: Hi, You really should host your pictures on your own server and not include it out of a forum. (e.g. picture http://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=5358 is used in http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Letux%20380 ) Thanks for this hint... So users have to register in that forum to see the picture in your shop... not really useful :) Well, the forum is great but you are right that we shouldn't require users to subscribe there... Am Dienstag, den 08.04.2008, 08:16 +0200 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: To all those who are frustrated. First of all, please note the recent message from Steve that the Freerunner is already in production rampup (PVT), i.e. the hardware engineering phase is finished. Usually this means just weeks and no longer months until sales can start. But taking your picture of "liftoff", and knowing about all those eagerly waiting members on this list who have expected something different, I have worked on a solution for those who have different needs than the Freerunner will fulfill. The best result so far is sort of a "737" Open Linux PDA-Smartphone (when compared to the Neo "Dreamliner"). While the alternate device lacks WiFi, GPS, USB-Host and the latest kernels, it comes with * Quadband (800/850/1800/1900) * a 1.3Mpix camera * a builtin telescpoe pen * weights just 90g * is mature (i.e. end-user ready incl. power management) and * runs Qtopia (not the latest one) out of the box. I am in discussion with the manufacturer about the SDK and the limitations of openness. But what I have already tried with the sample devices is that it is really possible to install and run Sharp Zaurus binaries and cross-compile some code. Since I don't know if discussing alternatives to the Openmoko fits into the rules of this list, please send me a private mail (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ) if you are interested, or follow the links in the signature. With kind regards, Nikolaus Schaller http://www.handheld-linux.com http://groups.google.de/group/org-letux-discuss PS: we plan to add both, the Freerunner and this alternate device to our shop so you have more choice Am 07.04.2008 um 23:58 schrieb Ron K. Jeffries: OpenMoko is a brilliant concept. I hope to buy a Freerunner when it's relatively safe to go in the water. Before we jump down the throats of those who express some frustration about how the release schedule has taken longer than we all hoped, here's my non-emotional comment in support of those who are frustrated. I do no know why, but the OpenMoko project (Hardware and software) objectively is dragging out. From the sidelines, it is difficult to judge whether this VIRTUOUS project will or will not achieve liftoff, or will crash off the end of the runway. yes, absolutely, developing in a fully open environment means everybody knows each and every wart along the way. Apple and Steve Jobs did not have that burden, nor do Nokia, or LG, Samsung, Motorola. BUT the OpenMoko project likely does not have enough financial capital and human resource to accomplish its lofty ambitions. I passionately hope I am TOTALLY WRONG. But the track record to date is "dodgy" at best. -- Ron K. Jeffries http://blog.eronj.com http://twitter.com/rjeffries ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: ssh over bluetooth
There is nothing special with ssh over Bluetooth. In fact it is "ssh over TCP over IP over PPP (or similar) over Bluetooth RFCOMM". Please refer for configuration details to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Bluetooth_Support#Networking As soon as you have IP over Bluetooth, you can use ssh. Am 12.04.2008 um 14:25 schrieb Pietro m0nt0 Montorfano: Hi, from what I know everyone is talking about using the neo with the usb but noone has told anything regarding an ssh session (or something similar) over bluetooth. So is it possible to use the neo like that? Bluetooth usually provide a serial port emulation (rfcom) if it's like that we can provide something like a login shell over that tty (yes a login because the bluetooth protocol usually is not so secure). What about that? Don't know if it's just a feature or if it's possible to implement something like that. Cya Pietro ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: next costumers location
Am 13.04.2008 um 12:00 schrieb flexd: If ordering from the US (or anywhere really), would it be possible to have the package marked as a gift to evade taxes and such? Norwegian taxes are high, so we'll probably pay like half a phone extra >_< I would say: only if it really is a gift. Everything else is unethical and criminal... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Target Market (was: Re: Charger?)
Am 14.04.2008 um 18:07 schrieb Lowell Higley: On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 4:01 AM, thomasg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>Well, you'll get used to it :) >>USB-Charging is fine. You can use a standard usb-wallcharger as well as any mini-usb cable or usb-carchargers and so on. I know this isn't the case, but if were to HAVE to plug it into a computer, it would be a deal killer for me. I haven't been home in over a month. I am a road warrior (I spend 80% of my time on the road) and I don't always have the option to pull out my laptop to charge my phone. Make sense? I'm going to change the topic a little bit. I'm a little concerned about the direction of these messages. It seems like the thought that goes into them isn't that consumer focused. It's more personal opinion based than anything else, personal preference. My original statement was to reflect the thought of what a consumer expects (not want) in a phone they buy. I know for now this is still a geeky device for those of like that like cool tech toys. But isn't the end goal to create a device that end consumers would want to buy? I see mentions here and there but I don't see a concerted effort to make this a consumer device one day. That was what I was trying to say more than, "hey, I have to have a wall charger." Let me give you another example... I've probably showed 20 people pics of the Neo1973. You want to know what I hear? "Man, that's ugly!" That's what I hear every time. I have made the same observations when showing the Neo. An additional feedback came from a former key account manager who had sold millions of phones to Vodafone and other MNOs: it is impossible to sell this industrial design to any mobile network operator because they are fashion and not technology driven. My hope is that the GTA03 will have a much more appealing redesign (i.e. new industrial design, going through some focus groups). Otherwise there will never be a mass market version since there will be no support of any MNO. Look how the iPhone has raised the bar and how the whole industry is following because the mass market starts to take the iPhone as the reference. Why is the iPhone such a success? Because of technology? Not really. There are devices out there with comparable (or even better) feature set (e.g. higher screen resolution, UMTS). It is because it has really new appearance, interaction and materials. The Neo is good and really good hardware quality (I have seen many devices which are much worse) but it is not at all outstanding. Except its Linux openness. But that is something only a very very small target group is interested per se. Anyway, it is too late to change anything with the GTA02. Now you're thinking "so what? it's functional". You and I may not care what it looks like, but consumers do. I'm guessing no focus group was done by FIC way back when as the prototype was created. It was a bunch of techie/engineering types that generally have no clue what consumers want. I can say that because I used to be one of those techie types that focused on the technology versus the requirements of the customer. I'm not trying to bash the team in any respect.. They've done a great job pioneering the first "freed phone". Just maybe the consumer isn't their/our focus? And if not, will it ever be? Let's hope so. The bottom line is who is the target market for this product? That's who I am always going to answer questions for. Anyways, I digress. I'm sure I'll get a few barbs/flames out of this one. For GTA01 and GTA02 it is clearly the Linux hacker who likes to install his own kernels and wants to help developing and fixing the Openmoko software (by spending his spare time). No end-user/consumer. IT departments of large enterprises? No. Just my 2ct from being an engineer by education who has worked 10 years in product management and product strategy/roadmap development of a large mobile phone manufacturer... Nevertheless I see the Freerunner as a project that needs to be supported (just for idealistic reasons). -- hns PS: we work with Openmoko to redistribute the Freerunner in Europe so that you don't have to care about import taxes and missing or complicated warranties. We are already taking preorders: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Target Market (was: Re: Charger?)
Am 14.04.2008 um 22:08 schrieb Marcus Bauer: On Mon, 2008-04-14 at 20:06 +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: I have made the same observations when showing the Neo. An additional feedback came from a former key account manager who had sold millions of phones to Vodafone and other MNOs: it is impossible to sell this industrial design to any mobile network operator because they are fashion and not technology driven. My personal view is looking at the Neo as a Linux computer and not just as a phone - this opens a completely different perspective: as such the Neo is an absolutely unique device. There is only one similar device which is the N810 but it lacks the GSM modem. It is a Linux computer that simply fits into your pocket. Yes, it is a Linux computer that fits into our pockets. But who cares? Only our small community of Linux geeks. But there is no *mass market* for that. The mass market is not interested in a) computer in the pocket b) what is inside a device (Linux or something else) It must * look great * be easy to use * simply work * entertain * cheap is better The iPhone is not marketed as a Computer. It is marketed as the combination of Internet, Music player and Communicator. So, it is an Entertainment player device. Everyone wants to get entertainment. Therefore it has positive appeal for the masses. Our community is IMHO a small community for which Linux and freedom of software development is the most attractive entertainment. Therefore, I conclude that the Neo will remain a niche product unless it becomes more consumer oriented (as the original post indicated) - or someone makes the masses clear that they need a Linux computer in their pocket. An old rule says: people buy what they think they want, not what you think they need. -- hns ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Our new Main page of wiki
Just a vote: I like the old one more. Am 17.04.2008 um 12:58 schrieb Ivo Anjo: Hi. Personally, I liked the old one better, and the colors on this one (mainly the background color of the tables) are pretty agressive. Ivo On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 11:28 AM, Brenda Wang <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: Hi, all: Here is the new main page of our wiki. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Test_main_page It will switch to Main page soon. Please feel free to give us your feedback . Regards Brenda ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Engineering Driven vs. Community Driven (was Re: Ugliness)
Hi all, although I am jumping in the middle of the discussion, I think I have some valuable contributions to bridge the engineering, marketing and community points of views. Am 29.04.2008 um 20:03 schrieb Flemming Richter Mikkelsen: On 4/29/08, Lowell Higley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: When I think of marketing I think of Apple and Google. Apple is for some specific group of people while Google manage to reach all. Why? This raises Question 1: why don't we think of "Openmoko"? It is not because Google is free. Try to compare OpenOffice with m$ office. M$ office gets its users because it's pushed on us (huge availability and commenly known). Google engineered what the market requested. They found out what people wanted and how to give it to them. I remember that I started using Question 2 (already asked by Lowell): which market requirements did Openmoko find by focus groups? BTW: There are Mobile Phone market studies for approx. 5000$ which make predictions for the next 5 years. Nonsense? No. I did read and compare in 2005 the Strategy Analytics study from 2001 and it was quite accurately predicting camera phones, smartphones, MP3 players, typical screen sizes etc. Which all were quite rare in 2001. Well, such a study never goes down to the level that the 2003 study did predict the iPhone or Openmoko to come in 2007:) But they can predict technological platforms to come. I.e. 256MB RAM, 600MHz processor, VGA display. Comparing that with a 2001 Desktop PC gives an indication that 2008 is the year of originally Desktop OS platforms to be mobilized. IMHO using a community to discuss and reinvent the same things is a good approach, but can't replace solid studies by specialists. So defining the next generation product is not necessarily a community process. Question 3: is the Openmoko project aware of these studies and using them? the search engine because someone recommended it to me. This was many years ago... other people recommended me other search engines. Some might be better, but Google is good enough so I do not change right now. I have no idea about marketing, but I like Steve's idea about open marketing. If we show the phone to many people, some of them might get interested. I started using Linux because a friend of me told me about it. Marketing has two aspects: a) Market knowledge/intelligence, i.e. who are the customers, what do they want, how can we achieve that. This is the question about "Engineering vs. Community driven". b) Market communication: this is making the market aware of the products As someone who observes this project since it became public in November 2006, Openmoko did have a great start by the initial announcements and got a lot of press coverage, because it was * unknown * different (the openness approach) * announced first products for February 2007 The reason why there was so much coverage is simple: There had been rumours of an iPhone by end of 2006. And everyone thought that there is someone coming around the corner who is better and even faster than Apple. Now, let's compare what potential customers find if they research what they find in the Internet: * great start (termed the "iPhone killer") * but delayed product delivery and not yet finished (software) * Openmoko did a really good job in showing and explaining the device on many conferences * iPhone has sold millions * iPhone is also Open (to a reasonable extent) and it is very easy to switch from Linux development to OSX So, the initial impression of being fast could not at all be hold. Unfortunately this is the notion that many "multipliers", i.e. magazines and gazettes have. If they now will get the press release that the Freerunner is being shipped, who will print this message? Financial Times? They live from talking about the new and unexpected. The heroes. Here we are back to Apple Marketing. They celebrate their products, announcements and achievements as heroes. Quesion 4: how can we change that? Answer: we can't change the past. So, we have to change the future. Question 5: What must be improved? Perhaps Openmoko device delivery must be faster. I know that all of you are now crying that we all need to have a 110% perfect hardware. But the price we pay for this is that devices are coming later and this adds up to low interest by people who are *not* interested in the platform per se. And, there must be hero stories for the gazettes. Isn't there anyone who was in a critical situation and could get help only because he/she did have an Openmoko? If Openmoko should get out to x million people, I think we all need to work together. Remember it is in our own interest to make Openmoko survive. Showing off the phone would make a difference. If we want to show I had shown the Neo to many people and was astonished how many did already know it. Nevertheless many of them would not change their cur
Re: Freerunner on a Mac ...
On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 9:15 AM, Rod Whitby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: My point was that the dfu-util program used to flash the Openmoko device is a very portable utility, and can be compiled on just about any reasonable OS, including OS-X. Openmoko Flasher includes a precompiled, universal version to make life easier (i.e. Mac-like). In fact, it's already been done: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:SNMoore Great, I hadn't seen this! Perhaps Michael should add it to his 'Howto start using the Neo'? IMHO, he should better add http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MacOS_X#Flashing_to_your_device which has a reference to the User:SNMoore page since that is the general MacOS X resource page in the WIki ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner on a Mac ...
AFAIK, the Freerunner itself can install software when connected to a
Mac. You'll need to setup networking, but I guess that will be covered
in the FAQ.
Here ("Welcome to the OpenMoko page devoted to MacOS X users!"):
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MacOS_X
What I am wondering about (and maybe you as wel...) is if it will be
possible to re-flash the Freerunner using a Mac. Since I also own a
Mac, that would be nice to know...
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Re: Question about future devices (GTA03,04)
Am 05.06.2008 um 17:12 schrieb steve: > Ya, there are also ugly taxes on FM last time I looked. ( in EU) AFAIK 14 % import duties for "broadcast receivers". Therefore some companies split production between basic device + receiver module (china) and final assembly in europe. Then, the 14% are charged on import of the receiver modules only and not for the complete device. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
IMHO, reducing any Openmoko device to QVGA will be the end of the Openmoko project. And I have business reasons to wish that OM survives... There are plenty of QVGA designs out there and I even have an offer and a sample of a Linux smartphone at half the price of the OM. It works, has 90g, Quadband, and an integrated stylus. But QVGA. This makes the difference. I have shown a QVGA Acer n30 and the VGA Neo on FOSDEM and LinuxTag to the public. Everybody considered the VGA as better although the Acer is approx. 30% faster (because it has less rendering to do). So, where would be the uniqueness of OM devices? The average mass market customer doesn't care about full openness. Please consider basic rules of marketing. And, consider purchasing a Device Feature Roadmap from Strategy Analytics (they are really good) and ask what the percentage prediction for VGA vs. QVGA is for 2009. They are good in predictions because they look into the roadmaps of the component manufacturers. http://www.strategyanalytics.com/default.aspx?mod=NavigationHeader&a0=42 Tracking 30+ enabling technologies in the mobile devices market and provides analytical views on the major issues likely to drive or hinder diffusion of these technologies into the global wireless devices markets. The WDS service was first to market with a quarterly camera phone analysis and market share, and has extended that leadership position on technologies including WLAN, digital TV, CMOS and CCD cameras, Operating Systems and software, removable storage media, GPS, and other wireless connectivity technologies like Zigbee, NFC, and USB. Device Feature Roadmaps and evolution across key global markets. Research in this area includes analysis of feature phone evolution with forecasts by device type; device vendor share by device type; device segmentation analysis by ASP tier, with forecasts; extended analysis of ultra-low handset diffusion drivers and forecasts; and in- depth analysis of key device types, i.e. TV enabled handsets and MP3/ music enabled devices. http://www.strategyanalytics.com/default.aspx?mod=ReportAbstractViewer&a0=3736 http://www.strategyanalytics.com/default.aspx?mod=ReportAbstractViewer&a0=3899 Nikolaus Am 05.06.2008 um 14:32 schrieb rakshat hooja: quick question - would you prefer a qvga lcd (save a bit of cost) since we'e going to need to software-drive all graphics - the fewer pixels you have to fill, the better for speed. i'm really tossing up if the speed of qvga is worth the loss of resolution. i'm just not sure. I have a Sharp 903 with qvga, 2.4 inch, Nokia N95 with qvga, 2.4 inch and the Neo 1973 with VGA, 2.8 inch. By far the best screen for reading is the Sharp one. On closer examination you can see pixels which you dont on the Neo but the display just feels better, crisper and better on the eyes. When you view higher res photos the Neo display seems better but not by much. The N95 is also good when you look at it on its own and one has no problems reading anything but when kept next to the Neo 1973 and Sharp 903 one can tell the display is not in the same league. (the Sharp is also visible in the sun though I dont think its trans-reflective) The point I am trying to make is that the quality of LCM being used matters as much as qvga or vga. Qvga is sufficient for almost all needs on a mobile phone size device and would be great if it provides cost and speed improvements. But it has to be a really good quality QVGA. Personally I love the resolution and form factor of the PSP Slim LCM and would love to see something similar on GTA0X. Rakshat ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
Am 06.06.2008 um 09:45 schrieb Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman): > On Fri, 6 Jun 2008 09:09:55 +0200 "Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller" <[EMAIL > PROTECTED] > > > babbled: > >> IMHO, reducing any Openmoko device to QVGA will be the end of the >> Openmoko project. And I have business reasons to wish that OM >> survives... > > why would it be the end? the majority of phones in the non-japan > world are > qvga. it'd be no worse than most things out there. Yes, the majority is. And has been brought out last year. So, is this the scale for the 2009 market? There was some shift with high end PDA displays. In approx. 2006 most QVGA models were dropped and only VGA remained. E.g. Acer n30 -> n310. Another point from my discussions at LinuxTag: people want to have a successor for the Sharp Zaurus. The C750 introduced VGA in 2005 (or so). So, we don't get anyone who wanted to have a Zaurus successor! >> There are plenty of QVGA designs out there and I even have an offer >> and a sample of a Linux smartphone at half the price of the OM. It >> works, has 90g, Quadband, and an integrated stylus. But QVGA. This >> makes the difference. This is my core argument: I can buy a "GTA03 / QVGA" today. I don't have to wait for OM to develop such a reduced device. Therefore I want OM to stay with VGA because it is leading and unique... >> I have shown a QVGA Acer n30 and the VGA Neo on FOSDEM and LinuxTag >> to >> the public. Everybody considered the VGA as better although the Acer >> is approx. 30% faster (because it has less rendering to do). > > for us qvga would be give or take 3 times faster. thats a massie > difference to > 30%. The Acer n30 has a 266 MHz Samsung S3C2410, QVGA The Neo1973 has a S3C2410AL-26 with 266 MHz, VGA Rendering a quarter of pixels appears to be not all the tasks the processor has to do. I have not done a FPS comparison between both. >> So, where would be the uniqueness of OM devices? The average mass >> market customer doesn't care about full openness. > > the problem is - if you have a nice screen but the engine to power > it is > underpowered, you will suffer from complaints of it just being slow > then > instead. Yes, slowness is the most critical complaint. But how should I convince anyone to buy an OM if I also have a QVGA device which feels fast (based on OMAP 730 and some Qt 2.x)? >> Please consider basic rules of marketing. And, consider purchasing a >> Device Feature Roadmap from Strategy Analytics (they are really good) >> and ask what the percentage prediction for VGA vs. QVGA is for 2009. >> They are good in predictions because they look into the roadmaps of >> the component manufacturers. >> >> http://www.strategyanalytics.com/default.aspx?mod=NavigationHeader&a0=42 > > don't need them. just go to tokyo and look what's there on sale now. > what's > there will be what the rest of the world gets to doing 2 years later. Not necessarily. The iPhone wasn't there 3 years ago. And i-mode never became popular. But I agree that you can see some technology there already built into devices. > [EMAIL PROTECTED]" is now the top of the line display. but again - you > need/want the > graphics back end to fill that many pixels smoothly. right now we > are pushing > that at best. :) How is the iPhone doing it? It has Half-VGA resolution and "feels" very smooth. > but even so - in the ultra-high-tech of japan's mobile phone telco's > qvga is > still VERY COMMON. if we want to play the "my specs are better than > your specs" > game right now, we will lose. we do not have the sourcing power of the Unfortuntely, I have to play that game if I want to sell OM devices... > competing vendors. we often can't even get the better components at > all, let > alone for a good price. we get what we can get. sure - we have a vga > screen, > but really, how good is that if the rest of the device can't > smoothly handle > the screen? it isn't just dpi. if all you measure a device on is dpi > and pixel There is one strategic aspect to consider: If you keep the same display model and vendor, it saves engineering time and you can drive down cost by getting more and more volume from a single vendor. This may outweight any better price of a different vendor. > count, you are being silly. how it looks matters even more. dpi > helps there, > but so does compositing, translucency, smooth animation etc. in fact > these > probably have a much greater "buy me" effect. by far more. i'll put > money on > that bet actually (this is just speaking from having don
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
Hi, (I try to cut out some citations). > this is my dilemma. win with dpi and sharpness, but then lose in > smoothness/speed. i lean a bit to- smoothness myself, but i want to > hear the > "peanut gallery" so to speak :) (please don't take offence! i'm > seriously about > listening that's why i ask!) Someone has already pointed out that the dilemma is more on the processor. I.e. the problem should be solved by a faster processor with better GPU rather than challenging and and trying to redue user's expectations. Can you build container trucks smaller because then they need much less parking space? >>> don't need them. just go to tokyo and look what's there on sale now. >>> what's >>> there will be what the rest of the world gets to doing 2 years >>> later. >> >> Not necessarily. The iPhone wasn't there 3 years ago. And i-mode >> never >> became >> popular. But I agree that you can see some technology there already >> built into >> devices. > > hmm. i lived in japan for 4 years. my experience is that japan > introduces into > their phones what the rest of the world does 2 years later. years ago > multi-megapixel phones were out. 5 years ago the default was 2mpixel > and qvga. > the ipone really is not amazing in terms of tech specs. it's fairly > far behind. This can be reversed: if Japan already has WVGA mobile phones, probably since beginning of 2008, they will become available in 2009 in the rest of the world. What I mean with the iPhone is that although it has only half the number of pixels it "feels" dramatically faster than a Neo. I believe it would still feel fast on full VGA and I could read web pages better. Maybe we will even have some news on that on Monday... BTW, even the Apple Netwon did have more than QVGA (=> 336 × 320) but that is not really comparable. > it has a hardware-accelerated 3d chipset with full opengl drivers. > and a very > good chipset at that. that is why. as for half-vga. that's still > HALF the Yes. This should be IMHO the future for GTA03 - use a better chipset rather than a worse display resolution. > pixels the freerunner/neo1973 have. *IF* we shipped the same screen > - we'd have > better performance. i find it interesting how so many peole rave > about how > great the iphone screen is - but its tech specs are not so hot. it's > dpi is > pretty bad compared to the standard these days. but that sure as > hell has not > stopped it selling. :) this is why i ask - actual products and > reality seem to > show that dpi is not a major factor. at least as best i can tell. I have now done some test with the mySTEP GUI stack which sits on X11. The one I have shown during LinuxTag. Some application I have choosen makes regular screen updates: Neo 1973every 0.5 seconds (due to more work for the higher number of pixels) Acer n30every 0.3 seconds (same CPU but QVGA) Zaurus C3100every 0.3 secons (with X/Qt on VGA) So, the difference is not that large by different architectures and display resolutions. The astonishing thing is that the C3100 is faster than the Neo with the same display. I.e. Display resolution by itself can not be the main issue with speed. Well, this is not transferrable to games or video players, but it indicates the direction. >> Yes. But this is in some conflict with providing an open platform >> that >> others >> can adapt to their user's needs. If it has QVGA it rules out many >> commercial >> projects where eye-candy and video speed is not that important but >> high >> information density. > > but then we have the reverse too. the question is - which is more > important? in > the world of phones the mass market is as it is higher volume, but > again - it > depends. i am wondering what projects would not be possible at qvga? > seriously? > ones you can actually read and use? this is my point. try and actual > 2.8" > screen at qvga for a while - try apps on it. they are still quite > usable and > visible. you may need to just deal with coarser fonts etc. but - > it's still all Yes, they are. But just "Quite". Not excellent. More difficult to read. It is like Porsche could reduce one or two gear levels. Can still be used as a car :-) mySTEP has resolution independence so that the identical app binaries work on both resolutions and try to show the same size. So it is easy to have both (Acer n30 / Neo 1973) sitting next to each other. There are large differences in how the same application looks. It is much more crisp on the Neo VGA. Let's reverse the question - would you reduce the resolution of your desktop system? What do you currently have? 1024*1280 or more? You can still do everything like writing software, e-mail, web browsing, gaming. Probably even faster. But how would it appear? Future oriented or old fashioned? > there. :) i'm serious! if you have examples of projects that would > ONLY work if > we shipped a 2.8"
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
>>> How is the iPhone doing it? It has Half-VGA resolution and "feels" >> very smooth. > > it has a hardware-accelerated 3d chipset with full opengl drivers. > and a very > good chipset at that. that is why. as for half-vga. that's still > HALF the > pixels the freerunner/neo1973 have. *IF* we shipped the same screen > - we'd have > better performance. i find it interesting how so many peole rave > about how > great the iphone screen is - but its tech specs are not so hot. it's > dpi is I would also like to have a better screen on the iPhone! If you open a web page you have always to zoom in the first step. > pretty bad compared to the standard these days. but that sure as > hell has not It would still be approx. 30% better than a QVGA 2'8... > stopped it selling. :) this is why i ask - actual products and > reality seem to > show that dpi is not a major factor. at least as best i can tell. I have now thought a lot about why they have chossen 320x480. Most probably, they have spent a lot of money and useability research to find the **best compromise** between number of pixels, dpi, speed, readibility, information density and cost. Conclusion: * QVGA is worse (!) than the best compromise (as benchmarked by the iPhone) * VGA is better to use - which has its price. So how should one decide between two contradicting requirements? In the view of openness and unknown future applications, I would pay the price to go beyond the best compromise. Even if it needs a more expensive processor to get the speed. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: resolution preferences??
> When I first saw the Neo's screen I was amazed by how crisp the > graphics were and the shine on the Openmoko logo looked real to me. > The > first thing I tried was the terminal (of course) and I was happy that > the text could be zoomed, and was still readable. I am short sighted > and have seen the graphics on the iPhone and they seemed ok, but this > is the first phone display that I have been impressed with. I fully agree: QVGA: the minimum to be useable HVGA (iPhone): good enough VGA: impressive Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
> but there is definitely a "i want as insane a dpi as i can get" > group here. > this is for sure. the question is - is it really the majority of > users. :) Hm. You can't answer that before defining who "the user" is (choose between: me, you, this community, worldwide population)? Discussing the QVGA vs. VGA vs. new CPU question before answering the above question can't find an end... BTW: If we go to the level "There appears to be a small 'i want as insane cheap display i can get' group here.", this will become opinion bashing because it shows up different personal targets. Marketing science has invented the concept of "target groups" and plurality in product offerings to cover that problem. And the role of a "Product Manager" to balance and decide that (I have done such a job for 10 years). Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
> we could just not ever even ask you guys and you get what you are > given. too > bad. no input at all. i've opened up the floor for input - but i'm > trying to > dig specific things out of it - not things that smell of"i just want > higher > specs". or keeping up with the joneses. i want real use case > scenarios that > make real sense. :) This discussion starts to become quite boring. Isn't a single potential customer who says "I want it and I am willing to pay for it" enough? There have been several here on this list, if I remember correctly who expressed exactly that. BTW: a use case doesn't say anything about required quality. It describes a sequence of interactions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_case). Sorry, but I can't disclaim my academic history :) Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
> i asked for use case because i am not just talking quality. i am > talking a case > where vga makes something possible at all or not. where something > just wouldn't > be usable or possible without vga. that is what i asked. i want a > use case for > vga. not just a "it looks a bit nicer". Examples mentioned before: * 24x80 console terminal for remote access of a server * previewing a >300 kPix image (that isn't much resolution!) without scrolling/zooming panning * monthly overview for a calendar where each day shows a reasonably useful content * reading 12pt text (not only seeing that there are lines) of a web page designed for >=VGA without scrolling One more observation: TV systems initially started with approx. 300 lines (QVGA) and rapidly invented the half-line interlacing system to come to 500-600 lines (more than VGA). So, the early TV from the 40ies were not good enough but the 500-600 lines from the 50ies were good enough for 50 years. Now comes HDTV. The use case was unchanged: viewing broadcast movies. I think, generally everything *can* be done on a smaller resolution. The "solutions" are: * scrolling * flipping between pages * reducing content So, I am quite sure you will *not* find *any* application that is really *impossible* to use on QVGA... As said before - you can *use* a Porsche as a vehicle if it has at least one gear level. But would one buy it? BR, Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: AW: Openmoko official resell partners
Hi all, to clarify some questions you may have: 1. we work closely together with Trisoft so you will get your Freerunner at approx. the same time (1-2 days) independently of where you place(d) your order 2. the direct link is http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner (the server appears to be a little slow currently) 3. we currently do not take final orders but you can queue up by placing a "Request", but you have not yet to pay 4. we accept major credit cards and IBAN bank transfer. If you have an EU VAT registration number we can deduce the German VAT if you provide correct details. 5. Requests will be processed on first come first served base as soon as we have devices to ship. We will send you a mail when to pay and complete the order. 6. we can ship worldwide, although that might not be reasonable for you (quite high shipment cost and we have only the GTA02 EU version) Nikolaus Schaller (the one who fights to keep VGA!) Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.goldelico.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People Am 11.06.2008 um 14:44 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: > Is trisoft.de not an official reseller? Which reseller will > receive the first phones? > > thx. > > Ursprüngliche Nachricht > Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Datum: 11.06.2008 11:43 > An: "List for Openmoko community discussion" > > Betreff: Openmoko official resell partners > > Dear Community, > You should already know Pulster and IDA, they are our official > reseller > in the Germany and India. > Today, I want to introduce new partners in Germany and UK, you can > buy > freerunner from them for save your shipping cost and time. > We also have a formal press will release to public later. > > Germany > Golden Delicious Computers- _http://www.goldelico.com _Dr.Nikolaus > Schaller > > UK > TrueBox Technologies - http://www.TrueBox.co.uk Mr. Rob wood > > Besides, I am talking with CEO of Bearstech France about > cooperation, so > far they are very closely to become my next official partner. > > BR > > Harry > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: AW: Openmoko official resell partners
Hi all, to clarify some questions you may have: 1. we work closely together with Trisoft so you will get your Freerunner at approx. the same time (1-2 days) independently of where you place(d) your order 2. the direct link is http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner (the server appears to be a little slow currently) 3. we currently do not take final orders but you can queue up by placing a "Request", but you have not yet to pay 4. we accept major credit cards and IBAN bank transfer. If you have an EU VAT registration number we can deduce the German VAT if you provide correct details. 5. Requests will be processed on first come first served base as soon as we have devices to ship. We will send you a mail when to pay and complete the order. 6. we can ship worldwide, although that might not be reasonable for you (quite high shipment cost and we have only the GTA02 EU version) Nikolaus Schaller (the one who fights to keep VGA!) Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.goldelico.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People Am 11.06.2008 um 14:44 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: > Is trisoft.de not an official reseller? Which reseller will > receive the first phones? > > thx. > > Ursprüngliche Nachricht > Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Datum: 11.06.2008 11:43 > An: "List for Openmoko community discussion" > > Betreff: Openmoko official resell partners > > Dear Community, > You should already know Pulster and IDA, they are our official > reseller > in the Germany and India. > Today, I want to introduce new partners in Germany and UK, you can > buy > freerunner from them for save your shipping cost and time. > We also have a formal press will release to public later. > > Germany > Golden Delicious Computers- _http://www.goldelico.com _Dr.Nikolaus > Schaller > > UK > TrueBox Technologies - http://www.TrueBox.co.uk Mr. Rob wood > > Besides, I am talking with CEO of Bearstech France about > cooperation, so > far they are very closely to become my next official partner. > > BR > > Harry > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: AW: Openmoko official resell partners
Am 11.06.2008 um 19:48 schrieb Adilson Oliveira: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > Dr.H.Nikolaus Schaller escreveu: > >> 6. we can ship worldwide, although that might not be reasonable for >> you (quite high shipment cost and we have only the GTA02 EU version) >> > > I wasn't aware that there are different versions depending on your > location. Is the difference just the GSM frequency (850 vs 900MHz)? There are two different versions: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_GTA02_Hardware (go to the bootom line "Certification"). 850/1800/1900 Band 900/1800/1900 Band Both operate worldwide but each one is more flexible in its main location since networks service only two out of the four frequencies. We have choosen to have only the EU version in our shop. BR, Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
Am 13.06.2008 um 22:36 schrieb Joerg Reisenweber: >> We really aren't going to redo this discussion again, are we? >> >> Last time we had these discussion[1] it ended up with some seting >> up a >> forum[2] on http://forums.makeopensource.com/ Go there and be happy >> with > your >> forum if thats what you really want, but please stop redoing the same >> discussion over and over again. >> > Thanks for this post! :-) > I suggest stopping this thread now, due to everybodies lack of > anything new to > contribute. > /j Someone wanting to volunteer to post a monthly FAQ on this list? This is definitively FAQ#1. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use votation system?
Depends on what you want to get out of the opinion poll. An expert view or a "mass market" view. Or a democratic expert decision? They may (and will!) differ and my proposal would be to get a view into both. Nikolaus Am 15.06.2008 um 21:18 schrieb steve: > > > Could we weight votes by code committed. No code. No vote. > > > > > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michele > Renda > Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2008 1:25 AM > To: List for Openmoko community discussion > Subject: Re: Why not use votation system? > > Hi Steve > > I think I was a bit mis-understood. > > I didn't told that all the decisions must to be took with a votation > system! > If we would do so I think we will not have a phone, but a microwave. > > My idea was only: when Openmoko has to take a decision between two > equivalent solution and WANT to know the opinions of the comunity to > use a > votation system. But only for opinion asked by OM, like it was for > the audio > jacket. > > And in every case must to be clear that also if the votation say > "choose A" > the final decision must to be tooken by OM, because you must to > invest on > it. > > I hope I clarified something :) > > steve wrote: >> The complexity of the decision is deeper than that. >> >> It involves cost, engineering budget, schedule, price, return on >> investment, parts availability. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brad >> Midgley >> Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2008 12:12 PM >> To: List for Openmoko community discussion >> Subject: Re: Why not use votation system? >> >> Michele >> >> >>> Do you want feature X or feature Y? >>> >> >> you might need a table representing the cost and business feasibility >> of each feature. We've seen a lot more transparency on the 3g >> decision >> recently which reveals it to be more complicated than people thought. >> >> -- >> Brad >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Font type and size was (QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03)
This inspires me to do a different calculation based on biological and physical facts: According to (German) Wikipedia http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auflösungsvermögen the human eye can separate two distinct points if they are displaced in an angle of 2' (2 minutes, i.e. 0.0333 degrees). For lines and structures the resultion is up to 0.3' (i.e. 0.005 degrees). Now, if you hold the display in distance of 40cm from your eyes (half arm-length), this translates to (40cm * tan(0.0 deg)) 0.02 cm, i.e. 0.2 mm to see separate points. On a display with 4.5 x 6 cm this means it should have at least 225 x 300 pixels ~ 130 dpi. QVGA. But stop - to see separate points, you must have one that is on, then one that is off and again one that is on. I.e. you need twice the pixel density or you would simply have a homogenous surface! => 450 x 600 pixels ~ 260 dpi i.e. VGA Now, the 2' was to distinguish two single white spots on an otherwise black background. The lines and structure resolution of our eyes and our image processing unit is much better. So, more than VGA is definitively seen as better by most people (or they need new glasses). Antialiasing just does a low-pass filter on the image so that the eye is not so much disturbed by the rasterization of the pixels. Conclusion: * QVGA is much worse than the precision of the human eye, so I would assume most people can read a better display * Antialiasing does not improve the information content, it just smoothens the edges * VGA appears to match the precision to see two separated dots * >VGA would still be observed as superior * Antialiasing is no longer required if we go to approx. 1200 x 1500 pixels ~650 dpi on a 2.8 '' display in a distance of 40cm. This is the biophysical limit where improved resultion becomes invisible. If you hold it closer (with appropriate glasses or young eyes) you will still be able to see pixels. Finally let's try a look into the future: in 10 years such high resolution displays may be available (e-book!) since the display manufacturers already know this and work towards the limits. But since all the discussion wasn't about quality but display and CPU cost this is not important... Nikolaus Am 17.06.2008 um 07:17 schrieb Hans L: > On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 8:59 PM, Dale Schumacher > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> If your current display is around 150dpi, you can see what QVGA >> would be >> like with something like this: >> >> xterm -fn '*-clean-*--6-*-c-40*' & >> >> This will give you a terminal window with a 4x6 font cell (3x5 for >> characters + 1px spacing). Note that the automatic "smear bold" >> make this >> font unreadable, but the non-bold works. >> >> However, I would much prefer to use a larger font on a VGA-size >> display with >> 285dpi, like this: >> >> xterm -fn '*-clean-med*--16-*-c-80-*' -fb '*-clean-bold*--16-*-c-80- >> *' & >> > > I think that in order to most accurately simulate the viewing > experience of a handheld device, ideally you want to show the same > number of pixels in a particular angle of view. > Since the pixels per inch of the GTA display are most likely not the > same as your computer monitor, you can adjust this effective angle of > view by changing your distance from your monitor. > > After some wikipedia and a little arithmetic, I think that the > situation can be simplified to the following equation: > > Dcm = Dhh * PPIhh / PPIcm > > Dcm = viewing distance of computer monitor > Dhh = viewing distance of hand-held device > PPIhh = Pixels Per Inch of hand-held device > PPIhh = Pixels Per Inch of computer monitor > > I held up my current phone, as if I was about to type something on the > keypad, and determined that a comfortable position for me is to hold > my phone roughly 12" in front of my eyes. > > The GTA02 device has 640 pixels along it's longest dimension of 2.27". > 640 / 2.27 is about 282 PPI > The monitor I'm using right now has 1024 pixels on its horizontal, and > is 12" wide, which comes to about 85 pixels per inch. > > So, in order to simulate the GTA02 displaying VGA xterm at 12" > viewing distance: > > 12" * 282ppi / 85ppi = about 40" > > I can then view this command from 40" away from my monitor: >> xterm -fn '*-clean-med*--16-*-c-80-*' -fb '*-clean-bold*--16-*-c-80- >> *' & > > ...and it will theoretically take up the same field of view as a (VGA) > GTA02 at 12" > > To compare with a same sized QVGA screen, view at half distance as > previous command(20" for me): >> xterm -fn '*-clean-*--6-*-c-40*' & > > Disclaimer: I'm certainly no expert in visual perception or optics, > and even my geometry is a little rusty, so please correct me if any of > this doesn't make sense. > > So, with the geeky number crunching out of the way, my conclusion to > this experiment is that I find that (my simulated version of) 640x480 > on a 2.27" screen is very readable at 80x24, and very useful (to my > eyes anyways). > >
Re: Why not use forum? -> Use OESF.org forum
>> Hi! >> I was wondering - why are we not using forum for community? >> It's much better to view, you can subscribe and unsubscribe to the >> topics you want and etc. I have been notet that a new (Sub-)Forum has been created: http://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?showforum=161 OESF is one of the largest fora systems and was initially a Zaurus User Group. But now it covers everything around embedded/mobile/ handheld Linux devices including embedded Debian, Android, OpenBSD, OpenZaurus... So, Openmoko also fits into this environment with some 8000 subscribers. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
Am 18.06.2008 um 21:08 schrieb Stroller: > > On 18 Jun 2008, at 12:45, Ewan Marshall wrote: >> ... >> Also how do you get unread message notification on forums? >> ... forums only do whole threads, not individual post in thread. > > I've started using a new forum recently, there being no mailing-lists > I can find for this particular subject, and am reminded how damned > irritating this is. Which forum software is there in use? There are differnt ones. > > > The forum software shows which threads have new messages, but when I > click on them I'm shown the whole page of upto 40 messages. I scroll > through them and find something interesting, only to realise that I > already read that message yesterday. I then have to scroll all the > way to the bottom of the page to work out which messages within the > thread are new. If the thread is a long one I have to then go to the > next page & do the same thing again. > > This is the fundamental failing of forums, IMO, but the lack of Is the generalization to all fora software systems valid? > > automatic quoting is also a considerable hindrance. As the thread I know many fora which have automatic quoting. > > drifts away from the original topic you can't tell who is replying to > whom. It is impossible to know what someone is referring to when they > make a short post such as "I have that one too, and it's great" - is > it the original device described in the message topic, or the > alternative suggested by Dave a few posts in? That is the same with mails (IMHO even worse). My conclusion of all those discussions is: We need both in parallel. Each system has its benefits and let's decide users themselves. So please let this mailing list exist! And if (and only if) you are interested in a forum or someone asks you why not to use a forum, please refer to existing fora as e.g.: http://forums.makeopensource.com http://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?showforum=161 http://www.neo1973-germany.de (German) Please also note that fora become more valuable by heavy useage. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
My conclusion of all those discussions is: We need both in parallel. Since there was no entry in the Wikii, I have created one: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Discussion_Forums Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
Am 19.06.2008 um 10:52 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: > I think the right way is to register openmoko mailing list at > something like Nabble. > This way we will not separate forum and mailing list users. If someone IMHO they are already separated by different expectations that are simply not fulfilled. Otherwise the topic would not reappear every 3 months. In the long run I think we must give up the idea of a single solution fits all. > likes forum - he will have a possibility to post on a forum, and m-l > users will receive an e-mail and vice versa. For those who really like a forum such a gateway is not a really acceptable solution and does not solve the problem in features and useability they have. Unfortunately, the mailing list users usually have not the experience to deeply understand the differences. Therefore, my conclusion is that both should simply exist (and can be used how people prefer it). > I think mailing list admin has to register at Nabble. > What do you think about this? Yes. Should IMHO also be done. And then listed on the new Wiki page. > > > On 6/19/08, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> My conclusion of all those discussions is: >> >> We need both in parallel. >> >> Since there was no entry in the Wikii, I have created one: >> >> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Discussion_Forums >> >> Nikolaus >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Enough already (too many posts about forum vs. mail lists)
Am 20.06.2008 um 03:23 schrieb Kevin Dean: > You really should post that on the forum. :) Yes, please identify one at: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Discussion_Forums > > > -Kevin > > On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 6:07 PM, Ron K. Jeffries > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> People, >> >> It's time to end the infinite string of emails about >> using a forum vs not using one. NOW! >> >> For $diety's sake, don't those interested in the world's >> first completely open mobile phone/portable computer >> have something of substance to chat about? >> >> How about discussing the mechanics and schedule for >> getting OpenMoko so-called "ASU" >> to released, stable software? >> >> enough already. >> >> [smile] >> >> Ron K. Jeffries >> >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> >> > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FreeRunner Quick Start User Guide
Great! One comment on Chapter 7: "Currently, the utility dfu_util is only provided for Linux. Support for dfu_util under Windows and Macintosh will be provided at a later date." That is not accurate (at least for OSX). See: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MacOS_X There is also an Openmoko Flasher tool for the Macintosh since August 2007. BR, Nikolaus Am 24.06.2008 um 15:03 schrieb Shakthi Kannan: > Hi, > > I have prepared docbook format documentation for > http://quickstart.openmoko.org/. The .xml and generated .html is > available from: > > svn checkout svn://svn.projects.openmoko.org/svnroot/qsug > > Please review it, and let me know of any changes. Will need to add > pictures, and fill-in the remaining text. > > Thanks! > > SK > > -- > Shakthi Kannan > http://www.shakthimaan.com > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Slashdot post but no web store?
Am 26.06.2008 um 18:14 schrieb arne anka: > as truebox.co.uk announces having om in stock now (more or less), what > about the german distributors subscribed to this list (dr schaller > and c > pulster at least): any news on freerunners received? Hi all, as far as I understood the Openmoko web shop will open on 4th of July. And, Openmoko, Inc. has shipped the Freerunners we have bought on 25th of June and they are currently in airfreight and customs transit. As soon as they arrive, we will add CE, Green Dot, User manual etc. and what else we have to comply to when we sell within the European Union. This may need one or two more days. If you want to be amongst the first who receive them, we are already taking preorders: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner Happy Freerunning, Nikolaus Schaller Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.goldelico.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Openmoko and google trends
Am 28.06.2008 um 12:09 schrieb Yorick Moko: Check google trends: http://www.google.com/trends?q=Openmoko%2C++FreeRunner&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0 I would have expected at least a small spike for the last few days. I have seen a big spike when switching to view the last 30 days. (date=all => date=mtd) http://www.google.com/trends?q=Openmoko%2C++FreeRunner&ctab=0&geo=all&date=mtd&sort=0 Nikolaus___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Where to buy Freerunner in Europe?
There are other distributors. Please refer to: http://www.openmoko.com/distributors-europe.html Nikolaus Schaller (in charge of http://www.handheld-linux.com ) Am 01.07.2008 um 12:08 schrieb Jay Vaughan: > Hi all, > > I've just tried to place an order for one Freerunner with Pulster.eu, > and discovered there aren't any left? So where do I buy one from in > Europe? > > Alternatively, I think I can do a 10-pack deal .. between my workplace > (THALES) and the playground (MetaLab.at), I for sure can come up with > 9 other interested parties. How do I do this? Please advise. > > ; > -- > Jay Vaughan > > > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Where to buy Freerunner in Europe?
Who told you? We still have some devices for you (because not all pre-orders have been paid so far): http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner But I can't tell how long that lasts. Please note that we have a priority queue. If you place an order you are queued up (by order date - not by speed of payment) so that you will automatically have a reservation for the next shipment if you fall beyond this first shipment. Of course, we will tell you about the status so that you always know what is going on. The next shipment is under negotiation, but will be avaliable soon. Nikolaus Schaller http://www.goldelico.com Official Openmoko Distributor Am 30.06.2008 um 14:11 schrieb Bumbl: > Afaik all the freerunners which came to Europe with the first shipment > are selled out. > > Jay Vaughan schrieb: >> Hi all, >> >> I've just tried to place an order for one Freerunner with Pulster.eu, >> and discovered there aren't any left? So where do I buy one from in >> Europe? >> >> Alternatively, I think I can do a 10-pack deal .. between my >> workplace >> (THALES) and the playground (MetaLab.at), I for sure can come up with >> 9 other interested parties. How do I do this? Please advise. >> >> ; >> -- >> Jay Vaughan >> >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> >> > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: freerunner unable to work with 3G SIMCards?
Am 04.07.2008 um 17:19 schrieb Kevin Zuber: > Any news here? > > I got the same error with the commands: > AT > STR=`AT' > RSTR=`OK' > AT+CPIN? > STR=`AT+CPIN?' > RSTR=`+CPIN: SIM PIN' > AT+CPIN=MYPIN > STR=`AT+CPIN=MYPIN' > cme error: 3 > RSTR=`+CME ERROR: 3' > > What could be the reason? > > Thanks alot. I got this error 3 on a very old D2 (Vodafone) SIM card when using the command line access. But PIN entry and registration through the GUI works. So, this one must be a different error. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: freerunner unable to work with 3G SIMCards?
Am 07.07.2008 um 15:05 schrieb Kevin Zuber: > Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 14:46 +0200 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus > Schaller: >> Am 04.07.2008 um 17:19 schrieb Kevin Zuber: >> >>> Any news here? >>> >>> I got the same error with the commands: >>> AT >>> STR=`AT' >>> RSTR=`OK' >>> AT+CPIN? >>> STR=`AT+CPIN?' >>> RSTR=`+CPIN: SIM PIN' >>> AT+CPIN=MYPIN >>> STR=`AT+CPIN=MYPIN' >>> cme error: 3 >>> RSTR=`+CME ERROR: 3' >>> >>> What could be the reason? >>> >>> Thanks alot. >> >> I got this error 3 on a very old D2 (Vodafone) SIM card when using >> the >> command line access. >> But PIN entry and registration through the GUI works. So, this one >> must be a different error. > > That was only a syntax error. Try it again with AT+CPIN="MyPIN". Don't > forget the " and ". Then it should work with your D2 SIM card using > the > command line, because I tried it with an 9 year old D2 SIM card > yesterday. Ok, works now. Unfortunately, this does not help those with a non-working 3G SIM card. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner @ handheld-linux Shop
Hi all, we have shipped all devices we did have on Tursday and Friday. Depending on destination, delivery may need 1-4 working days. Jan's package was sent on Thursday to the Netherlands, while Peter's did go to Sweden on Friday. Unfortunately, tracking information has to be transferred manually into the shop system. Therefore, most shipments don't have the tracking info yet. Well, they can arrive without :-) But I am working to improve that. As well as finding out what a solution could be with some 3G SIM cards. A new batch has already been ordered and will need some days to arrive and prepare. Happy Freerunning, Nikolaus Schaller Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Mobile Office Solutions http://www.handheld-linux.com Am 07.07.2008 um 20:51 schrieb Peter Thorin: Jan, did you get any tracking information on the order status page before receiving it? I have ordered it from handheld-linux.com also, and the order status page tells me it has been shipped, but also "Tracking: data not yet available". I'm mostly wondering if I should get my hopes up of getting it this week, since I will go on vacation next week, would be sweet to bring it :) On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 7:27 PM, Jan de Haan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Yes! I've got mine! (From http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner) Jan. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Peter Thorin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Otterhällegatan 1 SE-411 18 Göteborg Sweden http://www.kartena.se ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Discussion_Forums Am 08.07.2008 um 07:55 schrieb W.Kenworthy: > I thought someone has already set up a forum - but few can be bothered > using it so perhaps thats your answer. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: When will the sale of GSM 900 start?
Am 09.07.2008 um 06:34 schrieb Alexander Frøyseth: > And is it any other stores that sells ten packs? Look here: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner Nikolaus Schaller, responsible for that... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: When will the sale of GSM 900 start?
How did you calculate that? 349 EUR - 10% for 10 pack => 314,10 EUR less 19% VAT => 263,95 EUR exchange rate 1,55 => 409,12 US$ Compare that to 399 US$. Nikolaus Am 09.07.2008 um 09:20 schrieb Alexander Frøyseth: 2008/7/9 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Am 09.07.2008 um 06:34 schrieb Alexander Frøyseth: > And is it any other stores that sells ten packs? Look here: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner Nikolaus Schaller, responsible for that... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community No option 546USD for one is to much ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
EU resellers & dsitributors - was Re: When are the sale gonna start?
If anyone is interested in becoming a local reseller but without taking the additional work of * sending money T/T advance to Asia, * managing air freight, * importing from Asia, * adding a user manual that complies to EU rules for products, * handling WEEE, * taking the currency exchange risks etc., we offer smaller resellers to work with us instead of learning all this again. Our registered resellers get a good rebate from us since we have much higher aggregated volume when ordering from Openmoko. And, they are served from our stock (as soon as we have enough) so there is lower delay compared to ordering from Asia. We are also working on getting more accessories into the portfolio which are not necessarily provided by Openmoko. So, you get a one-stop- shop of everything around the Freerunner with low risk. If you are interested in becoming a local reseller in any EU country, please contact me. Requirements are: EU-VAT-ID registration and reseller type of business (incl. VAR). BR, Nikolaus Schaller Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner Am 28.07.2008 um 05:07 schrieb steve: > We have just signed up a disty in sweden, so you should be able to > buy from > there shortlty > > I don’t hae dates, getting ready for linux world > > > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alexander > Frøyseth > Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2008 1:02 AM > To: List for Openmoko community discussion > Subject: When are the sale gonna start? > > Like the topic, when are the sale gonna start? > It is 26. July here (Norway) and the clock shows 10:00 AM (and since > the US > is about 9 hour after us, the time is about 01:00 AM). > > > I almost can't wait any longer :) > > Alexander Frøyseth > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Request for Help: SYSTEMS fair 21th-24th October in Munich, Germany
Hi all in Munich, Bavaria, Germany (or anywhere else who wants to visit Munich in October): We can get a small booth (12 sqm somewhere near IBM) at the SYSTEMS fair in the "PERSPEKTIVE OPEN SOURCE" area. http://www.systems.de/ http://www.systems.de/de/Home/besucher/themen/themenueberblick#20135120 http://www.systems.de/link/de/20155618#20155618 For further planning, I need * people who want to help planning * people who want to staff the booth * ideas what to present * potential sponsors (my company is willing to do some sponsoring but probably not all) Please write me your ideas. Nikolaus Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: odd mail, pretends to be from openmoko sales dep
Hi all, although I am not at all an official spokesperson for Openmoko, I can confirm that Ailsa has taken over the role of sales from "Openmoko Harry" Tsai and Elsie Lee, who both have left Openmoko recently. For us distributors, Ailsa is the current main contact person regarding orders and sales topics. What I want to suggest to Openmoko, Inc. is to provide an official list (Wiki Page) who is in which role. And instead of just asking for it I have started that page myself: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/People Nikolaus Schaller Am 14.03.2009 um 10:16 schrieb Fernando Martins: > > arne anka wrote: >> Dear Sir, >> >> Thank you for the interest in Openmoko. >> Since I have seen you name in the group sales list at the wiki, I was >> wondering if you have already received what you intended to buy. If >> not, >> please let me know, so that I can help you processing your order. >> >> If you have any question, please do not hesitate to let me know. >> >> Sincerely, >> >> Ailsa Huang >> sales dept. >> Openmoko,inc. >> >> > If header is correct, it looks like a salesperson or PR rookie > thingy :-) > > Fernando > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
IPhoneOS on Freerunner
Have you seen yesterday? http://openmoko-fr.org/wiki/index.php/IPhoneOS_on_Freerunner Well, it is/was a good April joke. But this one isn't. http://www.quantum-step.com/wiki.php?page=About http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/gallery/menu.php?gallery=members&album_id=16 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Sean's speech at ESC about making a 3G device
> > Sean discussed three things at OpenExpo. > > 1. Our successes. > 2. Our mistakes. > 3. Our challenges > > I won't go over 1& 2 but I'll cover #3 since rasters perception has > a bit of color added to it. Only a tiny bit and he's entitled > to that color commentary, I'll just add what Sean and I, as authors > of the presentation, had as our message. Is it possible for you to upload the slides somewhere so that we can read what was presented? Or is there some video? Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Planning for the 1st Openmoko Munich workshop has started
Here is the discussion thread in German: http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=1112 Topics will be about and around Openmoko. I.e. information, presentations, hands-on hacking, community building, futher developments, etc. Please register your location here: http://fly-society.de/web/openmoko/ so that we know where to organize the next workshops. And if you want to attend the meeting in Munich, please choose your preferences here: http://doodle.com/2pa84t7dfyqqrhiu Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: IPhoneOS on Freerunner
Am 02.04.2009 um 13:37 schrieb ivanshirok...@gmail.com: > Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller пишет: >> Have you seen yesterday? >> >> http://openmoko-fr.org/wiki/index.php/IPhoneOS_on_Freerunner >> >> Well, it is/was a good April joke. >> >> But this one isn't. >> > Have you ckecked it out? >> http://www.quantum-step.com/wiki.php?page=About >> http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/gallery/menu.php?gallery=members&album_id=16 Yes. You need to mail the developers to get a beta tar package and some special instructions to install it on the Freerunner. And you need to start it from the command line since it is not integrated into a flash image. The GUI has some rough edges but it already works as a technology demonstrator. I have played some GNUchess on its GUI. It is not complete, but has a lot of potential. Even the potential to run real iPhone apps since it is also based completely on C and Objective-C. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Munich April Stammtisch
Hi, to all Freerunner owners living or working in or near Munich, Germany: Once again we plan a "Stammtisch" to take place at 19 Uhr, Die Wildsau - Balanstrasse 121 - 81549 München - http://www.die-wildsau.de Please vote for your preferred date through: http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=1107&p=11622&hilit=muenchen#p11625 (http://www.doodle.com/ezrymw66khm4xvzb) Details from the last "Stammtisch" (in German): http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=660&start=45&hilit=stammtisch This time there will be again many topics: GTA03, Munich Freerunner Workshop, Meet each other in person, etc. See you all, Nikolaus Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Slashdotted
Hi Lothar, Jörg, Sean, Steve, and all others who are interested in a future GTA03, I have also been thinking for a while in exactly the same direction. Making the development of the GTA03 a community activity. Supported and sponsored by individuals and companies who are interested in the results. On one hand HW development needs a clear and close communication between people. On the other hand it needs a large number of supporters who keep their fingers out until they are asked. But synchronizing activities is much more difficult than with SW (using SVN or GIT). What we IMHO therefore need is: * a core team that works (at least semi-)professionally on it. I think the community is large enough to provide enough members with all expertise that is required (from mechanics over battery to RF etc.). * a clear milestone plan as in every successful hardware development project * a specification freeze at some point in the milestone plan * openness to ask for help into the community to judge between several similar technical solutions for the same requirement * funding of the project organization (e.g. we can set up a community funds or society or association or however the legal form has to be choosen). Funding levels could start at 5€ per year for students and go upwards for individuals and companies. And special services (e.g. managing the production of 100 customized units) could even provide more funding for the organization. A word to all those who think Hardware can not be developed by a community should take a look at: http://www.amsat.org/ Building, launching and operating not only 1 but approx. 50 satellites in the past 30 years is definitively more complex than building an open smartphone. Nikolaus Am 05.04.2009 um 19:39 schrieb Lothar Behrens: > > Am 05.04.2009 um 18:14 schrieb Joerg Reisenweber: > >> Am So 5. April 2009 schrieb Lothar Behrens: >>> Hi, >>> >>> I am mostly reading and sometime writing here. If it was useful or >>> useless - I don't know. But anyway. >>> Isn't it possible to also develop hardware collaboratively? >> [...] >> Hi Lothar, >> nope this won't fly. It's basically the sw pov approach to hw >> development >> Steve mentioned in one of his current posts. > > I may read his post... > >> >> Developing hw is more than creating a good looking schematics in >> Eagle, and >> tasks like layout are partially done by autorouter and the other >> half is a >> *close* *interactive* process between the layout gal, the EE guys, >> the RF >> guys, the ME dept, sourcing dept etc etc. > > It is indeed difficult. But otoh are many hw projects (http://opencores.org/ > or http://opencollector.org/ for sample), > or at least hw related. > >> >> IIRC OM had some really nasty experience when outsourcing some >> layout task. >> Just because the layout didn't understand exactly what EE had in >> mind when >> creating the schem, and EE didn't closely check the work of >> layouters. >> > > I don't speak about outsourcing. I have made similar experiences with > outsourcing: > > An EE project (motor control) should be outsourced, but the schematics > were sent by faximile! > The result was about writing an application to compare the netlists to > compare the then distinct > projects (different wire names and the like). > > So don't split any EE project or work with different versions without > a CVS or SVN! > > But giving development boards or mobile phone development kits would > be an option to > broaden the idea behind open mobile phone. Say, a GSM kit could be > used for the carPC hobby > engineer. And there are really GSM modules sold by other companies. > (http://www.gsm-modem.de/ > ) > > Then you have the control about your pcb design, but propably broaden > your product palette. > > Not all developers need a complete telephone. But you could indeed get > more value if the > 'components' of a mobile device also spread the globe - as a > development kit or separately. > >> for your Q about project files instead of pdf: OM is making money by >> selling >> hw, so there's not much sense in publishing data that doesn't help >> EE guys in >> community to understand the hw but instead is only needed for >> production >> purposes. In the end you can't do anything on a single-device basis >> with >> layout or schem proj data you couldn't do without it. Or are you the >> guy >> who's etching 8-layer at home and soldering uBGA by hand? ;-) You >> can't patch >> a ready-done 8layer PCB, no matter what your document files are (sw >> POV on >> hw!). And no company is going to invest in producing some dozen >> proto PCB >> done by "anonymous" community guys, without checking each and every >> trace and >> footprint again what in the end for sure is more work than doing it >> inhouse >> from scratch. > > I don't mean that you grab the prototypes blindly for your use. But > didn't you think, the comunity > will also help in hardware aspects? > > Maybe the
Re: Leather case for Neo freeruner now 29 Euros
Am 07.04.2009 um 13:29 schrieb Matthias Apitz: > El día Tuesday, April 07, 2009 a las 01:15:52PM +0200, David Reyes > Samblas Martinez escribió: > >> HI >> well topic says all >> Now the Openmoko leather case is at 29 Euros Vat included + >> Shipping costs >> at www.truxbrain.com/shop BTW: if you haven't one yet, I have a sample that you can look at (see below) >> Yes, the topic says at all: NOW for 29 Euros (and maybe tomorrow for > 1 Euro); it sounds that folks are leaving a sinking ship :-( > I have encountered in the FR the toy I was always looking for: a UNIX > server with X11 for my pocket or belt which also can make phone calls, > Internet, Wifi, GPS, ... FYI, there is a "Stammtisch" soon where you can share the fun you have: http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=1107&sid=9dc4cd9320b3fca17f4519f1ed022dd4 > I'm one of those using it as their only and daily phone device... but, > where to go now in the future? well, the device will continue > serving some time, > maybe even years as it is, but after that? We can discuss that as well... Nikolaus > > > Thx > > matthias > -- > Matthias Apitz > Manager Technical Support - OCLC GmbH > Gruenwalder Weg 28g - 82041 Oberhaching - Germany > t +49-89-61308 351 - f +49-89-61308 399 - m +49-170-4527211 > e - w http://www.oclc.org/ http://www.UnixArea.de/ > People who hate Microsoft Windows use Linux but people who love UNIX > use FreeBSD. > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Leather case for Neo freeruner now 29 Euros - sample unit shown at "Munich Stammtisch"
Am 08.04.2009 um 12:52 schrieb Matthias Apitz: >> FYI, there is a "Stammtisch" soon where you can share the fun you >> have: >> >> http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=1107&sid=9dc4cd9320b3fca17f4519f1ed022dd4 > > I have put my availability into http://www.doodle.com/ezrymw66khm4xvzb Great (it is difficult to judge who is behind the user ids). So, everyone else who is living in or near Munich, Germany is invited to join! > and by the way: I've shared already my fun with the FR in Havana in > the > Local Linux User Group: > http://www.unixarea.de/OpenMokoLiaHab/ Looks like a really good presentation (I have no specific training in Spanish - just some French&Latin...). Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Debuzzing
Dear community, it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find solutions for important topics that the community has and can't solve alone. Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) have worked behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework solution that can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the EU harmonized market. 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company in Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at low cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of collected devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming and outgoing shipments, the combination is the solution. 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/export hassle). Please note that there will be a rework fee. The final price is not yet clear (expected to be less than 30 EUR incl. shipment) because we are in intensive discussions with Openmoko how they can help to reduce this fee for you. 3) Rework will take approx. 1 week and could start immediately, provided we get the promised replacement components in time. 4) If you are interested, please register yourself and your device at the following link. We will then follow up with details about handling, address to send to, time schedule, final pricing etc. http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework So stay tuned, Nikolaus Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 29.04.2009 um 10:44 schrieb Helge Hafting: > Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: >> Dear community, >> >> it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find solutions >> for important topics that the community has and can't solve alone. >> Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) have worked >> behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework solution that >> can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the EU harmonized >> market. >> >> 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company in >> Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at low >> cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of collected >> devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming and outgoing >> shipments, the combination is the solution. >> > > Will they do the bass fix too? For an extra fee probably, as the weak > bass isn't really a defect. The bass fix (bigger capacitors) was > published here, can they take a look at that too? We have done this but the Bass-Fix is much more complicated (opening the shields, adding wires etc.) and probability of damaging the device is much higher. The Buzz-Rework can be done by opening the front cover only (2x Torx). > I hope doing both fixes at once will be economical, as most of the > work > is common to both jobs. (Ship the phone only once, take it apart only > once, reassemble only once, ship it back only once.) > > If they verify the buzz fix with a test call, then they'll even verify > the bass fix didn't break anything at the same time. > >> 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners >> within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ >> export >> hassle). > > What is the problem with a country outside EU? If the Norwegian > government adds a tax or fee, as they usually do, then the payment > is my > problem. Not yours. They post office simply notify me and hold the > returning package back until I sort it out. All they need to calculate > tax is the receipt for the repair fee. I guess this is provided > anyway, > as businesses normally provide a receipt. Sure, there is a receipt. The issue is that we receive incoming packages through German customs and customs charges a tax based on the value of the incoming goods. Getting tax exemption is possible but needs a lot of extra paperwork and depends on the country it is coming from. So we limit it to the EU in the first step. If that works well, we can try to find a solution for other european countries as well. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 29.04.2009 um 14:28 schrieb Yorick Moko: > And what about the sd-card?? > that is a very easy fix to do > Joerg advised to fix it also It is not really necessary to do that when using a more recent kernel that can switch off the SD card clock: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GPS_Problems But it does not look very complicated so I will take your suggestion and find out what we can do. Nikolaus > > > On Wed, Apr 29, 2009 at 11:36 AM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller > wrote: >> >> Am 29.04.2009 um 10:44 schrieb Helge Hafting: >> >>> Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: >>>> Dear community, >>>> >>>> it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find >>>> solutions >>>> for important topics that the community has and can't solve alone. >>>> Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) have worked >>>> behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework solution >>>> that >>>> can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the EU harmonized >>>> market. >>>> >>>> 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company >>>> in >>>> Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at low >>>> cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of collected >>>> devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming and >>>> outgoing >>>> shipments, the combination is the solution. >>>> >>> >>> Will they do the bass fix too? For an extra fee probably, as the >>> weak >>> bass isn't really a defect. The bass fix (bigger capacitors) was >>> published here, can they take a look at that too? >> >> We have done this but the Bass-Fix is much more complicated >> (opening the >> shields, adding wires etc.) and probability of damaging the device is >> much >> higher. >> >> The Buzz-Rework can be done by opening the front cover only (2x >> Torx). >> >>> I hope doing both fixes at once will be economical, as most of the >>> work >>> is common to both jobs. (Ship the phone only once, take it apart >>> only >>> once, reassemble only once, ship it back only once.) >>> >>> If they verify the buzz fix with a test call, then they'll even >>> verify >>> the bass fix didn't break anything at the same time. >>> >>>> 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners >>>> within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ >>>> export >>>> hassle). >>> >>> What is the problem with a country outside EU? If the Norwegian >>> government adds a tax or fee, as they usually do, then the payment >>> is my >>> problem. Not yours. They post office simply notify me and hold the >>> returning package back until I sort it out. All they need to >>> calculate >>> tax is the receipt for the repair fee. I guess this is provided >>> anyway, >>> as businesses normally provide a receipt. >> >> Sure, there is a receipt. >> >> The issue is that we receive incoming packages through German customs >> and customs charges a tax based on the value of the incoming goods. >> Getting tax exemption is possible but needs a lot of extra paperwork >> and depends >> on the country it is coming from. >> >> So we limit it to the EU in the first step. If that works well, we >> can >> try to find a solution >> for other european countries as well. >> >> Nikolaus >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 28.04.2009 um 22:30 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > Dear community, > > it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find solutions > for important topics that the community has and can't solve alone. > Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) have worked > behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework solution that > can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the EU harmonized > market. > > 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company in > Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at low > cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of collected > devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming and > outgoing shipments, the combination is the solution. > > 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners > within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ > export hassle). Please note that there will be a rework fee. The > final price is not yet clear (expected to be less than 30 EUR incl. > shipment) because we are in intensive discussions with Openmoko how > they can help to reduce this fee for you. Openmoko has given us now full support and therefore, we can reduce the fee dramatically. A bad news is that you have to cover 2 way shipment. But another good news is that Openmoko provides a free battery as a gift for each shipment. > 3) Rework will take approx. 1 week and could start immediately, > provided we get the promised replacement components in time. That well need some days so I expect that we can start rework in the second week of May. > 4) If you are interested, please register yourself and your device > at the following link. We will then follow up with details about > handling, address to send to, time schedule, final pricing etc. > > http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework This page has now become an order page. Please "purchase" the service. > > > So stay tuned, > Nikolaus > > > Mobile Office Solutions > by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG > Buchenstr. 3 > D-82041 Oberhaching > +49-89-54290367 > http://www.handheld-linux.com > > AG München, HRA 89571 > VAT DE253626266 > Komplementär: > Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH > Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 > Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller > > Digital Tools for Independent People > > > > > > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 30.04.2009 um 16:53 schrieb Leonti Bielski: Are there any limitations on shipment? As fas as I understand you can rework only batches of phones, so if let's say someones sent it extra fast second day shipment they still will have to wait for others that have sent phones by extra slow shipment. Right? Most probably yes. But it is not that you have to wait for slow phones. Incoming devices are collected until a certain batch is completed. That will be brought to the reworker. Rework itself does not take much time. But testing, repacking, labeling, shipping out again. So I can't estimate yet how fast the inbox fills up and how long it takes to move to the outbox. Are there any limitations by which date phones should be delivered? (I'm aware the date is not known yet but lets say rework is scheduled to 11 of may - phones should be delivered by 8th of may for example). The main limitation is that you should not send it unneccessarily early - because we can't start rework before we have the components in our hands. Theoretically, the best fit would be if your phone arrives at the same moment as the components... Or does it work in other way? Will we have to wait for phones of other users before the rework? Generally we try to do it as fast as possible, but please expect something between 1 and 2 weeks total processing time - time without a FR. This includes 2x shipment + some time in the collection queue. Leonti On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 4:17 PM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller > wrote: Am 28.04.2009 um 22:30 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > Dear community, > > it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find solutions > for important topics that the community has and can't solve alone. > Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) have worked > behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework solution that > can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the EU harmonized > market. > > 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company in > Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at low > cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of collected > devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming and > outgoing shipments, the combination is the solution. > > 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners > within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ > export hassle). Please note that there will be a rework fee. The > final price is not yet clear (expected to be less than 30 EUR incl. > shipment) because we are in intensive discussions with Openmoko how > they can help to reduce this fee for you. Openmoko has given us now full support and therefore, we can reduce the fee dramatically. A bad news is that you have to cover 2 way shipment. But another good news is that Openmoko provides a free battery as a gift for each shipment. > 3) Rework will take approx. 1 week and could start immediately, > provided we get the promised replacement components in time. That well need some days so I expect that we can start rework in the second week of May. > 4) If you are interested, please register yourself and your device > at the following link. We will then follow up with details about > handling, address to send to, time schedule, final pricing etc. > > http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework This page has now become an order page. Please "purchase" the service. > > > So stay tuned, > Nikolaus > > > Mobile Office Solutions > by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG > Buchenstr. 3 > D-82041 Oberhaching > +49-89-54290367 > http://www.handheld-linux.com > > AG München, HRA 89571 > VAT DE253626266 > Komplementär: > Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH > Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 > Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller > > Digital Tools for Independent People > > > > > > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 30.04.2009 um 16:17 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > > Am 28.04.2009 um 22:30 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > >> Dear community, >> >> it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find >> solutions for important topics that the community has and can't >> solve alone. Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) >> have worked behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework >> solution that can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the >> EU harmonized market. >> >> 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company >> in Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at >> low cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of >> collected devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming >> and outgoing shipments, the combination is the solution. >> >> 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners >> within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ >> export hassle). Please note that there will be a rework fee. The >> final price is not yet clear (expected to be less than 30 EUR incl. >> shipment) because we are in intensive discussions with Openmoko how >> they can help to reduce this fee for you. > > Openmoko has given us now full support and therefore, we can reduce > the fee dramatically. A bad news is that you have to cover 2 way > shipment. But another good news is that Openmoko provides a free > battery as a gift for each shipment. > >> 3) Rework will take approx. 1 week and could start immediately, >> provided we get the promised replacement components in time. > > That well need some days so I expect that we can start rework in the > second week of May. Parts are now on air freight and will arrive in Munich within the next days. So it looks as if we can start next week. >> 4) If you are interested, please register yourself and your device >> at the following link. We will then follow up with details about >> handling, address to send to, time schedule, final pricing etc. >> >> http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework > > This page has now become an order page. Please "purchase" the service. > >> >> >> So stay tuned, >> Nikolaus >> >> >> Mobile Office Solutions >> by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG >> Buchenstr. 3 >> D-82041 Oberhaching >> +49-89-54290367 >> http://www.handheld-linux.com >> >> AG München, HRA 89571 >> VAT DE253626266 >> Komplementär: >> Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH >> Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 >> Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller >> >> Digital Tools for Independent People >> >> >> >> >> >> > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 06.05.2009 um 22:23 schrieb Korbinian Rosenegger: > Hi > > Is it possible to bring the devices to you in person? This could save > shipping costs for all of us who can use the S-Bahn without additional > costs or pass the A995 regularly since it's about 1 km from the next > S-Bahn station (Deisenhofen) or less than 4 km from the A995 to your > address in Oberhaching (distances measured in Google Maps). I understand your idea, but we can't manage it that way for several reasons, I can't discuss here in detail. One is that we are not doing the rework ourselves but by a company in Munich. So there is no chance for you to wait for the rework. Then, we think by using "Hermes Versand", your cost for shipping in is just 4 EUR. So we are not farther away than your next Hermes office (see http://www.hermespaketshop.de/ and teh Paketshop Locator). Finally, the free battery given by Openmoko is thought as compensation for the shipping cost. Best regards, Nikolaus > cu Korbi > > > > On Tue, 2009-04-28 at 22:30 +0200, Dr.H.NikolausS wrote: >> Dear community, >> >> it is the philisophy of Golden Delicious Computers to find solutions >> for important topics that the community has and can't solve alone. >> Therefore, we (Golden Delicious Computers and TRIsoft) have worked >> behind the scenes and are close to offer a Buzz rework solution that >> can in principle serve all Freerunner Owners in the EU harmonized >> market. >> >> 1) We have identified a very good professional SMD rework company in >> Munich, Germany who are capable and willing to do the rework at low >> cost and high quality, but only if we deliver batches of collected >> devices. Since we are experienced in collecting incoming and outgoing >> shipments, the combination is the solution. >> >> 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners >> within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ >> export >> hassle). Please note that there will be a rework fee. The final price >> is not yet clear (expected to be less than 30 EUR incl. shipment) >> because we are in intensive discussions with Openmoko how they can >> help to reduce this fee for you. >> >> 3) Rework will take approx. 1 week and could start immediately, >> provided we get the promised replacement components in time. >> >> 4) If you are interested, please register yourself and your device at >> the following link. We will then follow up with details about >> handling, address to send to, time schedule, final pricing etc. >> >> http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework >> >> So stay tuned, >> Nikolaus >> >> >> Mobile Office Solutions >> by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG >> Buchenstr. 3 >> D-82041 Oberhaching >> +49-89-54290367 >> http://www.handheld-linux.com >> >> AG München, HRA 89571 >> VAT DE253626266 >> Komplementär: >> Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH >> Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 >> Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller >> >> Digital Tools for Independent People >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 08.05.2009 um 09:52 schrieb DJDAS: > Marco Trevisan (Treviño) ha scritto: >> Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: >> >>> 2) Therefore we plan to offer this service to all Openmoko owners >>> within the EU harmonized market / tax union (to avoid re-import/ >>> export >>> hassle). Please note that there will be a rework fee. The final >>> price >>> is not yet clear (expected to be less than 30 EUR incl. shipment) >>> because we are in intensive discussions with Openmoko how they can >>> help to reduce this fee for you. >>> >> >> Is this rework fee valid also for your customers? Don't you offer a >> kind >> of warranty? >> > The same for me, I'm your customer too. > Thank you in advance for your answer. > Bye! Sorry, I missed the first mail. Maybe, you did not read the final announcement (the 30 EUR was the initial upper limit) that there is only 3 EUR left over just that our shop software calculates the correct shipment fee that covers shipment expenses. The rework itself is essentially for free and Openmoko provides an additional free battery to make good your efforts and the time you don't have the Freerunner to use. Nikolaus Schaller Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cofundus call recorder competition results
Great and thanks to the developers! This is the approach that makes the Openmoko a useful device that is finally superior to others. Nikolaus Am 08.05.2009 um 14:35 schrieb rakshat hooja: There were 2 entries for the cofundus call recorder competition. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Call_Recorder by Tom and http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dictator by Matthias Both fulfilled enough requirements and worked well (there were problems with different distros but with FSO based SHR testing they were ok). The person I asked to judge the softwares (Shakti Singh) liked Dictator for its user interface and call recorder for its implementation of splitting the incomming and outgoing voice into different channels. He has decided to declare both the submissions as joint winners and the prize money being divided among the two. Shakti suggested that the leather case be given to Tom as his solution worked straight out of the box while Matthias solution now fully functional with the second revision. I would request all of you to try the applications and provide feedback to the authors (or enhance them yourselves as the are open licensed) Also I would like to thank Tom and Matthias for the excellent applications they have written. This was a much sought after feature request on the Freerunner. Thanks Rakshat -- -- Please use Firefox as your web browser. Its protects you from spyware and is also a very feature rich browser. www.firefox.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 08.05.2009 um 21:46 schrieb Jon Levell: > Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: > >> expenses. The rework itself is essentially for free and Openmoko >> provides an additional free battery to make good your efforts and the >> time you don't have the Freerunner to use. > > I've tried to order this but when I try and pay via a credit card, I > get a blank screen. I see that it warns about pop-up blockers on the > page but I've even tried using IE6 (under Wine) and I still get the > blank screen. > > Is the payment processing broken at the moment? Not generally. Several people have reported a blank screen that is only shown on the first attempt. But we can't debug that easily, because it appears only for real payments and not in debug mode. According to the logic it *should* be a https protected page from either ipayment.de or your bank. If someone can find out the URL of the blank page that would really help us. Thanks, Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Invitation: First Openmoko Workshop in Munich
Dear all, we (Rene *relei* and some other Free Runners in Munich area) are planning the first Openmoko Users Workshop in Munich. It will start on some Friday evening and go until Saturday night. Most likely we will get a room at the Munich University of Applied Sciences. The exact weekend is not yet determined so you are invited to vote: http://doodle.com/d5wzgyd68sid66zp For the agenda, Dr. Mickey will talk about programming with FSO. We also want to invite you to give presentations where you can demonstrate or show us what you have done. Either about software, hardware documentation, programming languages etc. is very welcome. Any level (from beginner to very experienced) is welcome. German or English is both ok (but you should understand German if you are coming as a visitor to get most out of the meeting). Detailed discussions around the workshop (in German) can be found here: http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=1112&start=30#p12443 Please spread this invitation to whoever you think is interested in such a workshop. Nikolaus PS: there will be no agenda topic "Buzz-Fix-Party" because that would require a much different technical setup. Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 13.05.2009 um 12:26 schrieb Max: > В Птн, 08/05/2009 в 10:24 +0200, Pander пишет: > >> I had my phone recently fixed in a fix party in Germany. Do I also >> get a >> free battery? > > I'm also interested in this one - should I attend buzz-fix party and > get > free battery somehow or it's better to buzz-fix via Nikolaus offer > (Pulster if I'm not mistaken)? No, we are Golden Delicious Computers (aka "The Handheld-Linux Shop"). > What's the procedure of ordering free battery for phone fixed on > buzz-fix party? > > best regards, > Max. Generally you can choose between looking if someone is organizing a buzz-fix party or you can send your device to us for the rework service. Both approaches have pros and cons. E.g. during a party you meet nice people and can take your device back immediately. But you may have to travel to distant location - and the main requirement is that there must be someone who organizes this at all. The rework service results in a much longer time without a freerunner but is just as far away from you as the next postal office or courier service. The free battery is a courtesy from Openmoko and is included in both approaches. OM sends a set of spare batteries to the one who organizes a party. He hands them out to you during that party. But I don't know if it applies to "I had my phone recently fixed in a fix party in Germany" or just to future parties. Hope this clarifies a little and gives you more background information for decisions, Nikolaus ___ > > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Dear all, since some of you did not receive our mails (spam filters are sometimes too critical), here a status update: * components have been released by customs and have finally arrived * so you can now send devices to us * please follow the rework service instructions (e.g. just send the device and no accessories to avoid risk that anything is lost). http://www.handheld-linux.com/images/Instructions.pdf * we have got several requests from outside of the EU if we can help - and we would be happy to help - but customs handling to avoid paying import duties twice (by you and/or by us) are too complex and shipment cost is high. So, please organize something in your local region yourself. If you need to discuss how to do it, please drop me a mail. Nikolaus Schaller Am 13.05.2009 um 19:05 schrieb Leonti Bielski: From: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework When choosing a parcel service, please choose one that allows you to track your parcel since we are not responsible for incoming parcels. Since we already have to sent it with the service with tracking there is no point in GD confirming it once more - we should be able to see it in our tracking service. We will confirm anyway, but if it does not arrive - we have no idea how to help otherwise... Leonti On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:53 PM, Yorick Moko wrote: Will we get a notification when Golden Delicious has recieved our device? On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 1:45 PM, arne anka wrote: >> The free battery is a courtesy from Openmoko and is included in both >> approaches. OM sends a set of spare batteries to the one who organizes >> a party. He hands them out to you during that party. But I don't know >> if it applies to "I had my phone recently fixed in a fix party in >> Germany" or just to future parties. > > > at least there where no batteries in braunschweig may 1-3. > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 14.05.2009 um 12:26 schrieb Tony Berth: what will be the price of the re-work? Please refer for all detauls to http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework Mentioning 'Hermes', you mean these guys: http://www.hermespaketshop.de/ Yes, but I think they operate/originate only in Germany. They most likely have partners in other countries (http://www.hermespaketshop.de/paketeversenden_international.php ). The idea behind is that you don't waste 50 EUR for an overnight courier and then have to wait anyway some days until we have repaired. And, they have online tracking for small parcels (petite paquet) which only provide at much higher tariff. But there may be other shipment services with even better conditions. Nikolaus Thanks Tony On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller > wrote: Dear all, since some of you did not receive our mails (spam filters are sometimes too critical), here a status update: * components have been released by customs and have finally arrived * so you can now send devices to us * please follow the rework service instructions (e.g. just send the device and no accessories to avoid risk that anything is lost). http://www.handheld-linux.com/images/Instructions.pdf * we have got several requests from outside of the EU if we can help - and we would be happy to help - but customs handling to avoid paying import duties twice (by you and/or by us) are too complex and shipment cost is high. So, please organize something in your local region yourself. If you need to discuss how to do it, please drop me a mail. Nikolaus Schaller Am 13.05.2009 um 19:05 schrieb Leonti Bielski: From: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework When choosing a parcel service, please choose one that allows you to track your parcel since we are not responsible for incoming parcels. Since we already have to sent it with the service with tracking there is no point in GD confirming it once more - we should be able to see it in our tracking service. We will confirm anyway, but if it does not arrive - we have no idea how to help otherwise... Leonti On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:53 PM, Yorick Moko wrote: Will we get a notification when Golden Delicious has recieved our device? On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 1:45 PM, arne anka wrote: >> The free battery is a courtesy from Openmoko and is included in both >> approaches. OM sends a set of spare batteries to the one who organizes >> a party. He hands them out to you during that party. But I don't know >> if it applies to "I had my phone recently fixed in a fix party in >> Germany" or just to future parties. > > > at least there where no batteries in braunschweig may 1-3. > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Unfortunately no since flashing a blank NOR is a completely different thing. Maybe someone from Eindhoven has a Debug Board and can help you? Am 14.05.2009 um 14:12 schrieb Atilla Filiz: Hello; Is it possible to ask for any other minor fix along with debuzzing? My device came with blank NOR and I don't want to buy a debug board just to use once. I don't mind paying a few extra €s. -- - Atilla Filiz Eindhoven University of Technology Embedded Systems, Master's Programme ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 23.05.2009 um 14:04 schrieb Yorick Moko: > any news on the repair? Rework has been started this week and the first units have been shipped back. > my order status says for quite some time 'Freerunner received.' > is everything going according to shedule? Mostly. We did have a public holiday in Germany on Thursday (and a voluntary holiday on Friday) this week, so this has delayed completion of the first batch this week by the SMD rework company. But I am sure we will have the first major batch reworked by mid of next week. > just curious I completely understand... > > y > > On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller > wrote: >> > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 23.05.2009 um 19:44 schrieb Yorick Moko: > thanks for the update! > i'm gonna miss the buzz ;-) Shouldn't be difficult to mix it into the audio path by some open source software :) Maybe, someone has a nice buzz-audio theme file. > > > On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller > wrote: >> >> Am 23.05.2009 um 14:04 schrieb Yorick Moko: >> >>> any news on the repair? >> >> Rework has been started this week and the first units have been >> shipped back. >> >>> my order status says for quite some time 'Freerunner received.' >>> is everything going according to shedule? >> >> Mostly. >> We did have a public holiday in Germany on Thursday (and a voluntary >> holiday on Friday) this week, so this has delayed completion of the >> first batch this week by the SMD rework company. But I am sure we >> will >> have the first major batch reworked by mid of next week. >> >>> just curious >> >> I completely understand... >> >>> >>> y >>> >>> On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller >>> wrote: >>>> >>> ___ >>> Openmoko community mailing list >>> community@lists.openmoko.org >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Visit at Openmoko
Am 25.05.2009 um 18:22 schrieb Rui Miguel Silva Seabra: > On Mon, May 25, 2009 at 11:40:03PM +0800, Sven Klomp wrote: >> I got invited to a conference in Taiwan and used the occasion to >> stop by the Openmoko office. I use the Freerunner as my daily >> phone, hence I was interested in the people behind it. >> When I arrived, the whole office was empty. 10 minutes later they >> came back from a company meeting. I had prepared quite some >> questions but I didn't got that far. It seems to me that almost >> everyone just got layed of in this very meeting. >> That's not how I'd imagined the visit :-( > > WTF? "Plan B"? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 23.05.2009 um 18:30 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > > Am 23.05.2009 um 14:04 schrieb Yorick Moko: > >> any news on the repair? > > Rework has been started this week and the first units have been > shipped back. A second batch has been reworked. I will test devices tomorrow and then ship out. Nikolaus Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
I should add the status of the Buzz-Rework: * I have received back today all devices that we have received so far until approx. beginning of this week. They will now go to testing and then shipment. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 29.05.2009 um 17:24 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > I should add the status of the Buzz-Rework: > > * I have received back today all devices that we have received so far > until approx. beginning of this week. They will now go to testing and > then shipment. All units have passed the tests and will be shipped after this (long) weekend. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 01.06.2009 um 10:46 schrieb arne anka: >> as there is a software fix. > > imo it is still a workaround, not a fix. For the GSM-Buzz there was not even a SW workaround for those who have been affected. So it had to be fixed. We have estimated that reworking the #1024 is at least 4 times as expensive (because it is done manually and needs much more time to open the GSM shield; how testing could work is also unclear). Therefore, we decided not to offer it as a rework service (since there *is* a solution available). > and standby time jumping up 25% looks a lot to me. If you find a way to DIY to gain these 25%, please share with us. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing
Am 01.06.2009 um 13:16 schrieb Paul Fertser: > "Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller" writes: >>> and standby time jumping up 25% looks a lot to me. >> >> If you find a way to DIY to gain these 25%, please share with us. > > In fact overall time required for hand rework is roughly equal for > both buzz and #1024 fixes. If one has already dismounted the can The key difference is the word "if already dismounted the can". > > (quite easy if one is careful) then changing that particular capacitor > is not a problem at all for a skilled person, it's SMT0805 size, big > enough comparing to 0402 R and it's very conveniently located. > > This is for purely informational purposes for DIY-ers, i'm not > recommending any distributors to offer this rework, quite the > opposite. Thanks for this description which will help DIY-ers! Our reworker just opens the two torx screws, unclips the front cover and then does the Buzz-Rework under a microscope. Then, the front cover is clipped back and torx screws are replaced. This keeps rework cost low even in a high-wage country like Germany (which is still more than the 3 EUR we formally charge - Openmoko is sponsoring the rework). For opening the GSM shield you have to dismantle the whole PCB from the Freerunner plastics and then open the can. Doing the reverse direction means to put the power and aux buttons in place, make sure that the vibramotor and speaker give contact etc. and everything snaps back. This all sums to approx. 4 times as many minutes. That is the time that adds up in our calculation. So if we find a way to apply it without opening the can and dismantling the PCB, it will be the same speed. So it is the simplicity of the buzz-rework that made us start this adventure but more complex reworks are beyond our limits... Aother note to all who read this: the Buzz rework is only required if you have the Buzz problem. If your device does not, there is no need to rework. My personal estimate is that <5% of users have experienced it. And if you don't own a Freerunner yet, you don't necessarily have to wait for A7 devices. So purchasing an A6 is still a good bet. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Openmoko Neo FreeRunner GTA02 versions A5 & A6 Audio Buzz - Quality Enhancement Service
He wrote that he is in the US. We also run the same program for a while for EU customers: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework Nikolaus Am 05.06.2009 um 08:01 schrieb Richy: > from the website: > > Location: > > SDG Systems, LLC > 219 Glen Rape Road > Cranberry Township, PA 16066 > > Seems to be in the USA, according to googleMaps. > > > On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 07:19, Max wrote: >> >> Great to hear that... >> Btw, where do you actually situated?... at least information about >> continent you're in would greatly help in estimating shipment >> costs :) >> >> cheers, >> Max. >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Linux International and Openmoko
I am very happy that my ideas that I had expressed and discussed beginning of April (and even non-public in March) http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/gta03/2009-April/06.html have inspired many people: Steve who pushed for a GTA03 mailing list and opening the design process, Werner who now runs the GTA02-core project and now thank you Jon for proposals to give the community a new home! IMHO, the community is now again going in the right (future oriented) direction and I am happy to see that. Nikolaus http://www.handheld-linux.com by Golden Delicious Computers Am 06.06.2009 um 18:42 schrieb Jon 'maddog' Hall: > Hello, > > I understand that there has been a discussion on this list about > having > a foundation that would represent the community of Openmoko. > > Fifteen years ago Linux International was created to provide services > for the Linux community. It was started as a vendor organization, > at a > time when there were not many vendors interested in Linux. We > handled a > lot of legal and business issues for Linux: > > o Protected the Linux Trademark from people that would "kidnap" it for > various reasons > o Helped to start two certification organizations (we funded some of > the > original testing work for LPI certification) > o Helped to start the Linux Standard Base project, which became the > Free > Standards Group > o Helped to form what became Linuxworld > o Helped many local user groups start local events, most notably the > Atlanta LinuxFest and the Ohio LinuxFest > > We tended to split off the groups we formed, afraid that one vendor > organization would provide too much power in a centralized > organization. > > For various reasons as larger companies started to show interest in > Linux, our membership went to form OSDL, which now is the Linux > Foundation. Linux International as an organization has been dormant > for > about five years. I have still been spreading the word about Free > Software at conferences, through magazine articles and media > interviews. > > Recently I came up with the idea of reforming Linux International into > an "end user" organization, with the concept that no company could > join > as a member, nor sit on the board of directors as a member. Only > individual end users could hold membership, vote, etc. Of course > almost > everybody is an end user of some type of software, so the membership > would be quite "open". I have been working to change the charter of > LI > to reflect this. > > Recently I started another project, not a phone, but otherwise similar > in its needs to Openmoko. This other project will have a community, > be > completely "open", and needs an umbrella organization to help with > legal > work, etc. I intend on forming a sub-group of LI for this project. > > I could offer the same to Openmoko, to be a sub-group of LI. > > Linux International is already a legal entity. We are a > "not-for-profit" in the state of New Hampshire, U.S.A. There are > reasons why LI is a "not-for-profit" instead of a non-profit (501c3 or > 501c6) which have to do with ease of applying revenues, etc. Nothing > stops LI from becoming a 501c6 (501c3 is very restrictive), and > nothing > would stop the sub-group of Openmoko from becoming a non-profit, if > that > is desired. > > Likewise the plans for LI are to have country chapters, with separate > boards for each country chapter. This was planned way before the > current issue with Openmoko, but you could take advantage of the > planned > structure if you wish. > > LI would solicit sponsorships to help fund its work which could come > from companies, but again the voting membership would be from > individuals only. The things that LI does would be "Open" to all. We > do plan on having some things we charge for, to cover costs. > > If the Openmoko community is interested in pursuing this, I would be > happy to discuss LI's plans further with you, and how Openmoko could > fit > into this. > > Warmest regards, > > Jon "maddog" Hall > -- > Jon "maddog" Hall > Executive Director Linux International(R) > email: mad...@li.org 80 Amherst St. > Voice: +1.603.672.4557 Amherst, N.H. 03031-3032 U.S.A. > Cell: +1.603.943. WWW: http://www.li.org > > Board Member: Uniforum Association > Board Member Emeritus: USENIX Association (2000-2006) > > (R)Linux is a registered trademark of Linus Torvalds in several > countries. > (R)Linux International is a registered trademark in the USA used > pursuant to a license from Linux Mark Institute, authorized licensor > of > Linus Torvalds, owner of the Linux trademark on a worldwide basis > (R)UNIX is a registered trademark of The Open Group in the USA and > other > countries. > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Debuzzing in the UK?
http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework Just as far as your nearest Royal Mail... BR, Nikolaus Am 10.06.2009 um 09:08 schrieb Dave Smith: > Hi all, > > It's been a while since I looked at getting the buzz on my FreeRunner > fixed up, after having no luck finding anyone with the right equipment > to be able to perform it amongst local friends and contacts, so I > figured I'd throw a message out on here to see if anyone can point > me in > the direction of anyone in the United Kingdom who has the tools, time, > and inclination to perform the fix for me. :) > > Has anyone any experience with getting someone in this area performing > the fix? > > Thanks in advance, > > Dave > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Project B guessing game was[ Re: Pat Meier (=public relation of Openmoko)]
A handheld beamer for your next presentation... Am 10.06.2009 um 11:39 schrieb David Reyes Samblas Martinez: > It has a screen > it has a button (maybe a direction pad) > it can be holded in one hand. > .. > I vote some kind of wireless low cost tablet ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Golden Delicious offers GTA02A6+ and GTA02A7
Dear all, after organizing the Buzz rework service we have now upgraded our remaining stock of GTA02A6 units so that you don't have to care about rework if you buy a new device from us. And, we already have a handful of the A7 retail units in stock. All our units still include the pouch and the headsets. Most of them have the laser-stylus while some have a pure stylus only (before you ask: we can't open the boxes to guarantee a specific version). Upgraded version (A6+): 279 EUR Retail version (A7): 299 EUR Best regards, Nikolaus Schaller Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: VAT decrease == cheaper freerunners
Unfortunately, Germany did not (yet?) reduce VAT... So we have to stay at 349 EUR incl. 19 %. http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner If they reduce, we will as well... Nikolaus Am 01.12.2008 um 12:02 schrieb Antony King: > Hi all, > > Just a quick plug to say we've updated our shop with the new VAT > rate in the > UK; total price including 15% VAT and courier delivery to UK is now > £330.05 . > > Shop is here: > > https://www.truebox.co.uk/trueboxportal/index.php?wk=shop&thiscat=8 > > We've also got some batteries in for £16 + vat. > > Antony. > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: VAT decrease == cheaper freerunners
I should add that we also have some Accessories. So if you are looking for an Xmas present to extend your Freerunner ;) http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner%3AAccessories Am 01.12.2008 um 19:57 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: > Unfortunately, > Germany did not (yet?) reduce VAT... > > So we have to stay at 349 EUR incl. 19 %. > http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Neo%20Freerunner > > If they reduce, we will as well... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Openmoko cronology
Am 10.11.2008 um 00:56 schrieb David Samblas: > I want to do a presentation for next friday and one of the point I > want > to reflex is the quick evolution of the Openmoko project but I realize > there is no place with a clear cronologie so I will try to post > things I > have found spreaded in wiki, press releases and over the web to try to > have some kind of time line. > > ? 2006 Openmoko was anounced by his founder FIC 2. Nov 2006: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS2986976174.html > > Nov 2006 Openmoko annouce the Neo1973 > Jul 2007 Neo1973 out to the real world > Jan 2008 Openmoko announce the Neo FreeRunner > Feb 2008 Last Neo1973 sold from Openmoko > Jun 2008 Neo FreeRunner Hits the real world > Jul 2008 FSO milestone 2 > Aug 2008 OM2008.8, Debian on Freerunner, Qtopia 4.3.2, Schematics > published > Sep 2008 FSO milestone 3, FDOM, NeoTool, Gentoo, Gestures, > Remoko,Numptyphisycs > Oct 2008 Qt Extended 4.4.1, OM2008.9, http://opkg.org, more than 7 web > browsers, rasteman illume images,QI,Duke3d, Pingus > Nov 2008 Android beta image, FDOMizer, QT EXtended 4.4.2, Doom > > Help will be apreciated I want to matain it as simple as posible to > presentetation but a more detailed on in the wiki will be awesome to > have ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Santa Claus Xmas Specials at Handheld-Linux - only for a limited time!
Jingle bells, Jingle bells, Santa Claus has something for you coming on Monday... http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Santa%20Claus%20Xmas%20Specials Nikolaus Mobile Office Solutions by Golden Delicious Computers GmbH&Co. KG Buchenstr. 3 D-82041 Oberhaching +49-89-54290367 http://www.handheld-linux.com AG München, HRA 89571 VAT DE253626266 Komplementär: Golden Delicious Computers Verwaltungs GmbH Oberhaching, AG München, HRB 16602 Geschäftsführer: Dr. Nikolaus Schaller Digital Tools for Independent People ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Stage of GTA03 development?
Leonti, sorry I was a bit too ironical in my answer. So let me explain. Nikolaus Am 17.12.2008 um 15:24 schrieb Leonti Bielski: > Nikolaus, I don't get what's wrong with my questions? Nothing is wrong with the questions. Only expecting precise answers from the project team before there is an official annoucement of a new device. That is what I allude to with my comments. I have no inside information but I know from other such projects that there is not really a decision being taken at a certain time that can be published before the first samples come out of the factory. It is always possible in such projects to have late changes and revise some previously done decisions. E.g. making the device a little larger. Removing a camera because the supplier can't deliver etc. For the GTA01 and 02 the OM hardware team has been more open - but they also had to discuss endlessly about changed decisions and slipping time schedules. This draws a lot of attention from the real project and does not help to make it faster. > 1. About the case design - it was a poll on ML about different types > of case - with keypad, without, slider, etc. So I think it make sense > to ask what was finally chosen. It could also be that nothing has been choosen yet. Or several variants of which one will finally reach production. So what should OM officially say today? > 2. GSM chip: > Look in here how many chips were considered: > http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoForesight > It makes sense to ask which one was chosen, doesn't it? Mickey has given a statement showing a clear preference. But until it has been purchased in quantities, shipped to the factory and prepared for production, it is not finally "choosen". > > > 3. GTA03 is internal codename, like GTA01 and GTA02, but they are > called Neo1973 and Neo Freerunner. I seriously doubt GTA03 will go on > sale with GTA03 name. Yes, I doubt as well. But fixing the brand name is not required until approx. 2 months before launch. If we assume (which can be completely wrong) that launch is in Summer - nothing could have been choosen at all. As said before, I don't know about their internal project plans and how good they achieved any milestones. > > > 4 and 5, don't want even bother to comment this. There is no specific availability announced. And no price. So the only thing we can guess from the outside is that they will have a comparable price to other devices and devices will come when they are finished. > > > Leonti > >>> Hello! >>> As proud Freerunner owner I'm interested in how the development of >>> GTA03 goes. >>> I'm not going to buy it - there is still a lot of fun with FR, but >>> it >>> would be interesting to know something about next open phone. >>> Wiki page is outdated and there is no updates on ML. >>> Does someone know how everything is going with gta03? >>> 1. What case design is chosen? >> >> A good one. >> >>> 2. What gsm chip? >> >> The best one! >> >>> 3. How will it be called? >> >> GTA03! >> >>> 4. When is release date (+/- 3 month :)) ? >> >> 12:00 (I don't know on which day) >> >>> 5. Price estimate. >> >> Comparable to others. >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Stage of GTA03 development?
IMHO this is quite irrelevant. What the OM ecosystem needs is to go into a direction as shown by AppStore, Android Market etc. I.e. a full solution consisting of: a) Content (the open variant will be Wikipedia, Openstreetmap etc.) b) Application Store (that is what projects.openmoko.org should be turned into) c) compatible Devices with more and more stable hard & software that can easily access this open content So if that is becoming available, the device itself and its roadmap isn't that important at all. Nikolaus Am 16.12.2008 um 20:08 schrieb Leonti Bielski: > Hello! > As proud Freerunner owner I'm interested in how the development of > GTA03 goes. > I'm not going to buy it - there is still a lot of fun with FR, but it > would be interesting to know something about next open phone. > Wiki page is outdated and there is no updates on ML. > Does someone know how everything is going with gta03? > 1. What case design is chosen? A good one. > 2. What gsm chip? The best one! > 3. How will it be called? GTA03! > 4. When is release date (+/- 3 month :)) ? 12:00 (I don't know on which day) > 5. Price estimate. Comparable to others. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
