[Callers] Re: preference for dancing with opposite gender?

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

I’m kinda doubtful about how common reason 2 is, I think most of what might 
superficially seem like insisting on conventional gender roles is actually 
(men's) homophobia—dancing with a man might make me look like a…, or the man 
dancing with me might be a…. (I specify men because I’ve never once lived and 
danced where women were exercised about this—occasionally a preference for 
mixed-gender, but never a strong one). The guy who assaulted me at NEFFA years 
ago because he came across me in the line dancing the “wrong” role didn’t do so 
because I was rejecting conventional gender roles, he did it because of 
homophobia.

Read Weaver
Jamaica Plain, MA
http://lcfd.org

> On Mar 12, 2024, at 1:36 PM, Julian Blechner via Contra Callers 
>  wrote:
> 
> ...
> - So, when someone says they prefer to dance in non-genderfree dances, with a 
> partner of a different binary-presenting gender person, in trad roles, 
> there's 2 possible, non-exclusive reasons:
> 1. That their choice is about courtship, but "make exceptions" for people 
> you're not attracted to. Which, I guess is fine in and of itself, but I think 
> people with this preference often may not consider _just how many exceptions_ 
> there are.
> 2. Their choice is more about embracing traditional gender roles. I'll get 
> back to this
...
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[Callers] Re: Workshop activities for helping dancers improve their skills?

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

I quite like Alan’s tetherball pole, something I’ll keep in mind.

I’ve so rarely found anyone giving too much weight that I’ve thought the 
objections to the term were theoretical rather than practical, but perhaps I’ve 
been lucky (or give too much weight myself). It has occurred to me that “taking 
weight” is perhaps a better term, since that better suggests something you’re 
offering rather than demanding.

When I teach beginners, the very first thing I do is teach giving weight, both 
because I think it’s so important, and because I then point out moments where 
you can do it in all* the other figures. For example, in a chain across, I 
describe the connection that the people crossing have as they take hands and 
pull past as giving weight, awa a very different giving weight in a well-done 
courtesy turn. I think calling all of that “giving weight” is a way of getting 
across that it’s not just one thing, and that it’s really central to the 
difference between dancing near others and dancing with others. And I’ll tell 
beginners that if they’re good at giving weight, they can make lots of mistakes 
and people will think it’s their own fault ‘cause they’ll assume from the good 
giving weight that they’re dancing with a skilled dancer.
*Except wrist-grip star—possible to do it, and if you do you’ll hurt the person 
whose wrist you’re gripping.

The trick I start with for learning it is to have folks in allemande position, 
and then have them go around really fast while paying close attention to what 
that feels like in their hand and arm. I’ll then have them do it again, 
starting out fast and then slowing down (maybe slower than you’d actually dance 
it) while keeping that same feeling in their hand and arm.

But the original question was about _improving_ skills—the specific thing for 
that would be giving weight in a circle, something that so rarely happens. In 
my beginners’ classes, I point out that a circle four is a really boring 
figure, _unless_ everyone is giving weight; then it’s actually a pretty 
worthwhile figure. (It’s why grapevine step has inveigled it’s way from club 
squares—it adds something at least a little interesting to a (weightless, 
poorly done) circle four. I strongly discourage it, since it’s so much harder 
(albeit not impossible) to give steady weight while grapevining.)

Read Weaver
Jamaica Plain, MA
http://lcfd.org

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[Callers] Re: New Terminology Question

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

I’m late enough to the discussion this may not matter, but:

I started to write about the beginners’ class I used to teach, and while doing 
so I saw significant differences from others' lists of basic figures. I 
realized that they’re importantly different things.

My class was about teaching figures (awa bigger/overall dance stuff), which 
meant I left out things that I knew most beginners figured out as soon as they 
say them (e.g., F, wavy line, Calif twirl). It also meant I didn’t make a 
particular point of teaching the names of the figures, I just wanted people to 
experience doing them in a calmer setting than an actual dance, and ask 
questions.

But figures for no-walk-through dances is quite different: there it’s precisely 
the names of the figures that matter, including figures that are obvious when 
seen but not when named. If the discussion continues, it may be helpful to not 
conflate the two.

Read Weaver
Jamaica Plain, MA
http://lcfd.org


> On Sep 15, 2023, at 7:14 AM, Mary Collins via Contra Callers 
>  wrote:
> 
> We in Western New York, well some of us, just attended a callers' workshop. 
> The focus was specifically on the "lesson", a term I avoid since we advertise 
> "no lesson needed". 
> 
> The attendees each gave figures that should be taught during the 15 - 30 min. 
> "lesson".  They ranged from 4 - 15 + moves. I was actually surprised and 
> dismayed at how much information (and talking at) is shared by some. 
> 
> I think that the KISS idea is applicable here. I attend and absorb the George 
> Marshall introductory sessions as often as possible and use his as my model.
> 
> Giving weight in circle, alemande, do-si-do, star, circle, right & left 
> through (to get courtsey turn), swing and now I have added positions of Lark 
> & Robin. There are techniques that are not outlined here such as how I teach 
> partnering & progression that are incorporated within the others.
> 
> Much of what some wanted to teach IMHO belongs in the dance line where it 
> actually makes sense. I also, when there are beginners in the lines, actually 
> teach a new harder move during the walk through, much I must say to the 
> chagrin of experienced dancers. My belief is that those that don't know, 
> learn, those that do get to help which is what they want to do and those that 
> think they know, may get better.
> 
> So now having used many words let's dance! 
> 
> Mary Collins
> 
> 
> On Thu, Sep 14, 2023, 11:14 AM Tony Parkes via Contra Callers 
>  > wrote:
> Bravo, Michael! (I’ve bolded, below, the point on which I want to agree 
> wholeheartedly.) I’ve believed this for years, and had no way of knowing what 
> percentage of active contra callers agreed. I dare to hope that, as Michael 
> is known for writing and advocating difficult sequences, his opinion will 
> carry added weight.
> 
>  
> 
> Over the decades, I’ve seen the number of contra “basics” increase 
> dramatically – from about 12 in the 1960s, when many groups got started, to 
> at least 36 today. I’ve worried that the modern contra world has been going 
> down the same path as modern “western” squares did. There’s always a gap 
> between what a first-timer can grasp in one night and what a dancer needs to 
> know to be comfortable at a dance series. But if “basics” are continually 
> added, the gap gets ever wider, until a lesson or a series of lessons is 
> needed. Western squares started with 6 lessons in the late 1940s; currently 
> the Plus program (the prevailing club level in most parts of the US) contains 
> 97 “basics” and (coincidentally) is recommended to be taught in 97 hours, or 
> about 50 lessons. (Most clubs insist that their callers take less time, which 
> results in new dancers not learning the calls adequately.)
> 
>  
> 
> We contra and trad square callers are nowhere near the excesses of MWSD. But 
> even 36 “basics” are too many for an activity that supposedly anyone can join 
> in without lessons. Some sequences – maybe even some moves – should be 
> reserved for workshops. I’m glad to see an influential modern contra caller 
> speaking out on this.
> 

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[Callers] Re: Advanced dances gone awry

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

Responding, not quite directly, to the organizers’ part of the question. (And 
apologies for tardiness.)

Many years ago LCFD (lcfd.org) decided that at its New England dance camps, 
we’d no longer have experienced-only contra dances during the weekend, unless 
there was a regular or beginners' contra dance happening at the same time; 
instead we’d have “challenging” sessions open to anyone who wanted the 
challenge.

The decision came less from not wanting to exclude people, and more from 
experienced dancers being aggravated with the inexperienced dancers that were 
showing up (which was hardly surprising if there was no other contra at the 
same time), and those inexperienced dancers then feeling, accurately, that they 
weren’t wanted. Community building was paramount for us, so something 
structural that led to antagonism was definitely worth changing. (I’ll 
emphasize the point: when people think about this they tend to think about 
whether they want to exclude folks, but considering how the unexpected mix of 
experience levels will affect how people feel about each other is almost 
certainly a bigger issue.)

We heard from a few people who disagreed with the decision, and a lot who liked 
it. (I’m no longer on the board, and haven’t noticed if the policy has changed.)

(Also, I recognize this isn’t the same as a stand-alone dance, so it’s not a 
direct answer to your question.)

—Read Weaver


> On Apr 16, 2023, at 9:49 PM, Maia McCormick via Contra Callers 
>  wrote:
> 
> I attended an advanced dance this afternoon that was intermediate at best, 
> and had a few raw beginners in there, and it got me wondering:
> 
> 1. As callers, what do you do when a bunch of intermediate and/or beginner 
> dancers show up to an advanced session?
> 2. As organizers, what do you do to try and keep your advanced sessions... 
> advanced? (Either in messaging or at the dance itself?) Obviously I'm not 
> advocating for kicking anyone out, but if a bunch of newbies show up at an 
> advanced session, both they and the dancers who came for gnarly stuff are 
> going to have a less-than-ideal time.
> 3. As dancers (/organizers/callers), how do we elevate the dance level of our 
> local communities? I'm talking about increasing familiarity with some of the 
> less common moves (contracorners, left hand chains, etc.) but also about 
> building awareness of the dance and recovery skills, and technical things 
> like giving satisfying weight, swinging correctly, guiding linemates into the 
> next figure, etc.
> 
> I welcome any thoughts and musings!
> 
> Cheers,
> Maia (Brooklyn, NY)
> --
> Maia McCormick (she/her)
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[Callers] Re: The Spiral Dance

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

Way too late to help with the original request I realize, but perhaps generally 
of interest:

A piece of this dance that I particularly like is that everyone in the line 
will pass face to face with everyone else in the line—but it’s worth pointing 
that out explicitly, or people won’t notice that it’s true. (The leader has to 
turn toward, not away, at some point for that to happen.)

(My association with calling it “The Spiral Dance” is with certain varieties of 
paganism, where that looking-at-everyone-else is a central reason for doing it.)

—Read Weaver

> From: Hannah Chamberlain via Contra Callers 
>  >
>  
> Greeting callers!
> I am calling a friend's wedding this weekend and she requested "the spiral 
> dance," a circle dance where at some point one person leads everyone into a 
> spiral (or, optionally, anywhere around the hall?). I think I've danced it 
> before, but I'm having a hard time finding a name or notes on how to call it. 
> Can anyone share a version with me?
> Thanks in advance,
> Hannah Chamberlain
> (outside of) Portland, ME
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[Callers] Re: actual timing of calls for hey for four

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

Hmm. Not a fan of this way of calling heys—not really a fan of called heys at 
all. There’s too much going on at once: I have to figure out (e.g., with me a 
raven) in quick succession: now I’m being a raven, now I’m being a neighbor, 
now I’m not a lark so I guess I don’t do anything, now I’m being a partner, now 
I’m being a raven...

I’ve concluded that a quicker version of what I do in a beginners’ workshop 
works fine as a demo on the dance floor: find 3 others who can hey, plus me. I 
walk and explain what I’m doing (ideally with quiet music behind me): “right in 
the middle, left on the end, right with no one, left on the end, right in the 
middle, left on the end, right with no one, and I’m home”: the rhythm of what 
I’m saying conveys the timing, “right with no one” is memorable for explaining 
how you can think of it as R-L-R-L-R-L-R, and “right with no one” explains the 
“big loop” timing. Have everyone do it, then demo it again, pointing out that 
the lark is a couple beats behind because they start by taking a couple beats 
to move over to the right while the raven moves in—but you really don’t need to 
have them repeat doing it. There’s also no need to re-demo a left-shoulder hey: 
people won’t even notice that it’s different from what they’ve already learned.

Read Weaver
Jamaica Plain, MA
http://lcfd.org

> On Feb 28, 2020, at 6:14 AM, Katherine Kitching via Contra Callers 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> hello - first time posting to this list so i'm sorry if I do it wrong (looked 
> in archives and couldn't see obvious answer)
> 
>  I am going to teach and call my first dance with a hey this Saturday.. (ie 
> tomorrow)
> 
> our group takes things slow so i'd like to cue every interaction for the 
> first few times, as our previous caller did I don't know how common this 
> is but our previous caller would actually say--
> 
>  ravens pass right
> neighbours pass left
> larks pass right
> partners left
> ravens pass right
> neighbours pass left
> larks pass right 
>  partner balance and swing
> 
> I'm wondering if someone can clarify for me about delivering the calls for 
> this heynormally of course I deliver instructions so the last bit of 
> instruction ends on the beat prior to the figure starting.
> 
> But in the case of the Hey, if I remember correctly the caller actually 
> called out  the actions *as* they were happening 
> 
> Am I remembering correctly and if so is this the best approach?
> 
> In essence-- do I start by calling "ravens pass right" just before they do 
> it, or while they are doing it?
> 
> thanks muchly :)
> 
> Katherine Kitching in Hfx NS Canada 
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[Callers] Re: OT - Calling and US Taxes

[Read Weaver via Contra Callers]

Not the place for specific tax advice, ‘cause I’ll contradict Joe here and say 
that you can definitely still deduct expenses after 3 years of losses, you just 
may not be able to claim the loss (i.e., reduce your overall claimed income and 
hence tax bill).

Also, you only have to make quarterly payments if when you file your taxes at 
the end of the year you'll owe (i.e., write a check to the IRS for) more than 
$1000 (pretty sure that’s the current amount). If you’ve got a job that 
withholds tax from your pay, you can change your W-2 to have more withheld, 
instead of filing quarterly. And iirc, the first year you owe more than $1000 
you won’t have to pay a penalty. (Bear in mind, if you’re trying to figure out 
where you are wrt that $1000, that self-employment tax is about twice as much 
as Social Security, ‘cause you’re paying both the employer and employee parts.)

You may just want to wait till you file taxes this year (maybe do it a little 
early), and pay for in-person tax help this year—my guess is you’ll see that 
it’s simple enough that after that you don’t need extra help. But I have a 
small simple side business and I found that the walk-through that online 
commercial tax filing (it needs to include the self-employment forms) was all I 
needed. Turbo Tax seems to be everyone’s favorite, though now that I know how 
it works I use a cheaper one.

Also, the librarian is your friend—ask this same question at your library. And 
there may be local help for small businesses. Were I’ve lived, tax help during 
tax season often happened at the library, so they may have that info too.

And I’ll say again—this isn’t the place for tax advice: don’t assume what I 
said is right either.


> On Jan 10, 2020, at 5:15 PM, Joe Kwiatkowski via Contra Callers 
>  wrote:
> 
> Slipped fingers. The IRS.gov  website allows you to make 
> estimated tax payments on line. You can also download the forms and 
> instructions if you want. If you don't make a "profit" in your first three 
> years, the IRS calls it a hobby. You still have to pay taxes, but you can't 
> deduct expenses   Find a tax shop or a book on small businesses. JKLasser has 
> some good thouough books.
> 
> Joe Kwiatkowski
> 
> On Jan 10, 2020, at 5:06 PM, Don Veino via Contra Callers 
>  > wrote:
> OK, we all know we're really in this for the outrageous sums of money, right? 
> ;-)
> 
> But if you're lucky, you're finally at the stage where you're at least 
> covering your costs and have enough gigs where you're concerned the IRS may 
> expect you to be reporting your income, recording expenses, etc.
> 
> I've looked into this somewhat and from what I can tell in the US, it 
> involves making quarterly Social Security tax contributions on the income and 
> including the income/expenses toward your estimated tax payments at the 
> Fed/State/Local level. The trick is how.
> 
> Does anyone have a pointer to a good tutorial or other tips/direct advice on 
> the topic?
> 
> (Apologies for the intrusion of the Real World into our magic place...)
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