Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] JFace Generics
Ian, Comments below. On 03/09/2013 3:01 AM, Ian Bull wrote: On Sat, Aug 31, 2013 at 12:07 AM, Ed Merks ed.me...@gmail.com mailto:ed.me...@gmail.com wrote: John, Please me be equally provocative. Hi everyone, before we declare thermonuclear war on each other, let's take a step back. Actually I think it's healthy, though somewhat heated discussion John, there is no doubt that the success of Eclipse is a result of vibrant eco-system that has grown-up around the platform. The successful Eclipse projects that build on the platform are just as important as the core. I would argue that EMF (and Ed Merks in particular) is not simply an 'Eclipse Adopter'. In fact, I would say Ed has set the gold standard for Eclipse development. Thanks for the kind words. Ed, John is 100% correct that the project committers get the final say for all decisions. This is not just *how* it works, it's how it *must* work. Eclipse is a meritocracy, and John Arthorne has certainly earned the right to make any decisions regarding the core API -- and I don't think you could find anybody here that would disagree with that. John has gone above and beyond everyone else to ensure that the Eclipse Platform continually ships quality code, on-time. I agree that John is 100% correct on this issue and I, along with my committers, too reserve the right to make such decisions for EMF. I'm just pointing out that this is just one facet of the coin (or more like a die than a coin with many facets)... So, where do we go when two well-respected members of the Eclipse community have a different view of a core component that is shared between them? Actually I doubt we really have a fundamentally different view. John is a very nice person and there are few I respect more than him in our community. He has an exemplary track record. I wonder if the Architecture Council could play a role here? I'm confident that John will do what's right for the Eclipse platform and for the community. I don't think there is currently any precedent for this, but Wayne is re-working some of the EDP and maybe the AC should be given some power to actually 'architect' when different opinions emerge? Thoughts In the end I must agree with the point you reiterate above. It's John's right, and the committer's right, to do with the Eclipse project what they feel is best for the Eclipse project. I trust they will take other obligations into consideration and am reminding them what those obligations are. We definitely don't need some external body acting as an enforcer, though moderators such as yourself are always a welcome addition. Finally, I want to call out Hendrik (the GSoC student working on this). I'm not in any position to judge your work this summer, but as a former GSoC student I couldn't imagine finding myself in a position such as this. Please don't let this little schism discourage you. Yes, don't take the commentary personally. In principle it's an interesting idea. Cheers, Ian ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Status and Outlook for Luna M1
Hi Grégoire, The editor validated, so I hope the build will pass too. ATL and Acceleo have now been reenabled for Luna, though that will only be useful for M2 now. Laurent Goubet Obeo On 02/09/2013 16:34, Laurent Goubet wrote: Disabling all projects every year will always cause such issues : the Acceleo team was in holidays for most of August, which makes us miss M1. The same goes for ATL. Per change, we had one of the EMF Compare Team at hand to activate that one contribution (and even still, he had to tweak our build to manually remove features for which our dependencies are also marked as disabled). I think that leaving the contributions enabled would be better than forcing everyone into this situation : we have to load the aggregator, enable our contribution, check if it works... and come back at regular intervals to check for our dependencies' enablement. This is time consuming for those of us who depend on a few projects... and frustrating since we know that we are in turn blocking others. Not to mention that this always comes at a time where most of us are in holidays and just cannot react. I think this had already been discussed last year, and I do not know if leaving all projects enabled by default is better, at least it would not block anything. Grégoire, Acceleo will be enabled some time tomorrow (CEST), sorry for the wait. Laurent Goubet Obeo On 22/08/2013 18:11, Grégoire Dupé wrote: Hello I'm still waiting for Acceleo and ATL (may be more) to deliver MoDisco. It's quite late in Europe; I've to leave the office. I assume that MoDisco will not be included in Luna M1 :-( Regards, Grégoire - Original Message - From: David M Williams david_willi...@us.ibm.com To: cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Sent: Jeudi 22 Août 2013 10:13:05 Subject: [cross-project-issues-dev] Status and Outlook for Luna M1 Ok, it's Thursday morning :) Only a few more have been enabled, but that includes DTP and BIRT, so that should help Luna (Kepler RC1 repo is already considered done). That allowed me to enabled the JPA portions of WTP (since depends on DataTools) which, I noticed, some others depended on, but I had to leave WTPs JPA Diagram Editor disabled, since it depends on Graphiti, which is not enabled yet. Which brings me to my main point. Scanning the list of 22 disabled contributions, I'd guess about half are leaf components, so if you don't get enabled, it'd hurt no one but your self ... and maybe community and adopters? But, I'd guess, the other half such as graphiti, gmf? a few emf ones? and DLTK are definitely building blocks that need to be enabled or else others downstream can not function or be enabled. If you are a consuming project and need some of those lower level ones enabled, I'd encourage a lot of project-to-project communication so they know how much you depend on them, and the effect they have by being late or incomplete, etc. So, I'm just asking everyone to be aware of your place in the eco system and plan accordingly. I suspect I'm just stating the obvious ... but not sure what else I can do to help. Thanks, = = = = = = = = = actf.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build amalgam.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build amp.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build dltk.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build ecf.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build emf-compare.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build emft-ecoretools.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build emft-eef.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build emft-egf.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build gmp-gmf-tooling.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build gmp-graphiti.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build jwt.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build koneki.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build m2m-atl.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build m2t-acceleo.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build mdt-modisco.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build mft.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build mylyn-docs-intent.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build pdt.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build soa-bpel.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build soa-sca.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build windowbuilder.b3aggrcon - org.eclipse.simrel.build ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev attachment: laurent_goubet.vcf___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
Hi Szymon Your list omits the 'culprit'. It is org.eclipse.osgi.util.NLS that is now Java 6 putting paid to all attempts at internationalization with Java 5. Regards Ed Willink On 02/09/2013 16:41, Szymon Ptaszkiewicz wrote: See http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix for the table of minimum EE per bundle. Szymon From: David M Williams david_willi...@us.ibm.com To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Date: 2013-09-02 17:34 Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Yes and no. As a whole, such for whole Eclipse SDK, even Kepler (If not Juno) said Java 6 required, although there were always some bundles (and combination of bundles) that supported lower VMs. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Probably not announced well. It has been discussed at status meetings, and various bugzillas, that some previous 1.4 or 1.5 bundles were moving to 1.5 or 1.6, but I am not sure there is yet a comprehensive list of those that have. (Other than looking in the manifests themselves). I think it's been assumed no one cares about Java 1.5 any longer ... so, if anyone does (i.e. you have requirements or customers with requirements for 1.5), then I suggest you open a bug on the specific use-case you need to support on 1.5 and what bundle changes prevent that. I'm sure the committers for those components would be willing to re-consider if it impacts adopters. But, the default assumption for testing should be 1.6 ... would be my personal advice. HTH From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/02/2013 11:02 AM Subject:[cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Using a recent (post M1) platform I-build some of my unit tests now fail with a NoClassDef found for Platform. Changing the launch configuration to force JVM 6 and the tests run fine. So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Regards Ed Willink ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3222/6630 - Release Date: 09/02/13 ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
[cross-project-issues-dev] Maven Repo and Sandbox Hudson down?
Does anybody else have problems connecting to [1]? I've got read timeout exceptions since yesterday. The Sandbox Hudson seems to have some issues too. I cannot retrigger the job [2] for example. [1] http://maven.eclipse.org/nexus/content/repositories/milestone-indigo [2] https://hudson.eclipse.org/sandbox/job/eclipse.scout.sdk/104/ smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Maven Repo and Sandbox Hudson down?
On 09/03/2013 02:30 PM, Ken Lee wrote: The Sandbox Hudson seems to have some issues too. I cannot retrigger the job [2] for example. https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=416393 -- Mickael Istria Eclipse developer at JBoss, by Red Hat http://www.jboss.org/tools My blog http://mickaelistria.wordpress.com - My Tweets http://twitter.com/mickaelistria ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
I probably should have mentioned, there are several bugs we are still trying to work through, where the Tycho/Maven build picks a different compiler level than the way PDE used to it ... and not always in the way we intend, for example, https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=415116 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=411419 I am not sure if this is related to the issue you are seeing ... or if merely confirms yet another unannounced change ... but I don't think it changes the bottom line: If you want things different than they are, open a bug or comment on an existing one. If it is merely a matter that you don't really care, but you have to change your test scripts, then all I can say is sorry. From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 08:34 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support beendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Szymon Your list omits the 'culprit'. It is org.eclipse.osgi.util.NLS that is now Java 6 putting paid to all attempts at internationalization with Java 5. Regards Ed Willink On 02/09/2013 16:41, Szymon Ptaszkiewicz wrote: See http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix for the table of minimum EE per bundle. Szymon From: David M Williams david_willi...@us.ibm.com To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Date: 2013-09-02 17:34 Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Yes and no. As a whole, such for whole Eclipse SDK, even Kepler (If not Juno) said Java 6 required, although there were always some bundles (and combination of bundles) that supported lower VMs. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Probably not announced well. It has been discussed at status meetings, and various bugzillas, that some previous 1.4 or 1.5 bundles were moving to 1.5 or 1.6, but I am not sure there is yet a comprehensive list of those that have. (Other than looking in the manifests themselves). I think it's been assumed no one cares about Java 1.5 any longer ... so, if anyone does (i.e. you have requirements or customers with requirements for 1.5), then I suggest you open a bug on the specific use-case you need to support on 1.5 and what bundle changes prevent that. I'm sure the committers for those components would be willing to re-consider if it impacts adopters. But, the default assumption for testing should be 1.6 ... would be my personal advice. HTH From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/02/2013 11:02 AM Subject:[cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Using a recent (post M1) platform I-build some of my unit tests now fail with a NoClassDef found for Platform. Changing the launch configuration to force JVM 6 and the tests run fine. So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Regards Ed Willink ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3222/6630 - Release Date: 09/02/13 ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
Sorry for not communicating this aspect of the Equinox Framework changes in Luna. Obviously we need to spell out the VM requirements clearly for the Equinox framework being included in Luna. the NLS class is part of the Equinox framework which has moved up to requiring Java 6. Sorry for the inconvenience this may have caused. I opened a bug in Equinox to make sure this is clearly documented and allow others to voice concerns over the move to Java 6 [1] Tom [1] https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=416432 From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 07:34 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support beendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Szymon Your list omits the 'culprit'. It is org.eclipse.osgi.util.NLS that is now Java 6 putting paid to all attempts at internationalization with Java 5. Regards Ed Willink On 02/09/2013 16:41, Szymon Ptaszkiewicz wrote: See http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix for the table of minimum EE per bundle. Szymon From: David M Williams david_willi...@us.ibm.com To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Date: 2013-09-02 17:34 Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Yes and no. As a whole, such for whole Eclipse SDK, even Kepler (If not Juno) said Java 6 required, although there were always some bundles (and combination of bundles) that supported lower VMs. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Probably not announced well. It has been discussed at status meetings, and various bugzillas, that some previous 1.4 or 1.5 bundles were moving to 1.5 or 1.6, but I am not sure there is yet a comprehensive list of those that have. (Other than looking in the manifests themselves). I think it's been assumed no one cares about Java 1.5 any longer ... so, if anyone does (i.e. you have requirements or customers with requirements for 1.5), then I suggest you open a bug on the specific use-case you need to support on 1.5 and what bundle changes prevent that. I'm sure the committers for those components would be willing to re-consider if it impacts adopters. But, the default assumption for testing should be 1.6 ... would be my personal advice. HTH From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/02/2013 11:02 AM Subject:[cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Using a recent (post M1) platform I-build some of my unit tests now fail with a NoClassDef found for Platform. Changing the launch configuration to force JVM 6 and the tests run fine. So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Regards Ed Willink ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3222/6630 - Release Date: 09/02/13 ___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev inline: graycol.gif___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
I agree. Let's figure out how to publicly and formally drop support for Java 5. Sun/Oracle discontinued public support in 2009! From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_version_history#J2SE_5.0_.28September_30.2 C_2004.29 J2SE 5.0 entered its end-of-public-updates period on April 8, 2008 updates are no longer available to the public as of November 3, 2009. Is this a Planning Council topic? Mike Milinkovich mike.milinkov...@eclipse.org +1.613.220.3223 From: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org [mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org] On Behalf Of Ed Willink Sent: September-03-13 9:24 AM To: Cross project issues Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Hi I am doing my best to continue support for existing functionality, so in the absence of a clear Eclipse statement that Java 5 support is terminated, I feel I have to continue to keep close to 5. Guava changing to Java 6 was awkward. OSGI changing to Java 6 is very close to a mandatory downstream consequence. Can we please have a clear policy statement rather than a secretive creep. I don't mind changing to Java 6, it probably makes life easier. But I hate this are we 5 or 6 limbo? Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 13:51, David M Williams wrote: I probably should have mentioned, there are several bugs we are still trying to work through, where the Tycho/Maven build picks a different compiler level than the way PDE used to it ... and not always in the way we intend, for example, https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=415116 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=415116 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=411419 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=411419 I am not sure if this is related to the issue you are seeing ... or if merely confirms yet another unannounced change ... but I don't think it changes the bottom line: If you want things different than they are, open a bug or comment on an existing one. If it is merely a matter that you don't really care, but you have to change your test scripts, then all I can say is sorry. From:Ed Willink mailto:e...@willink.me.uk e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 08:34 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform supportbeendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org _ Hi Szymon Your list omits the 'culprit'. It is org.eclipse.osgi.util.NLS that is now Java 6 putting paid to all attempts at internationalization with Java 5. Regards Ed Willink On 02/09/2013 16:41, Szymon Ptaszkiewicz wrote: See http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix for the table of minimum EE per bundle. Szymon From: David M Williams mailto:david_willi...@us.ibm.com david_willi...@us.ibm.com To: Cross project issues mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Date: 2013-09-02 17:34 Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org So it seems that the Platform no longer supports Java 5. Yes and no. As a whole, such for whole Eclipse SDK, even Kepler (If not Juno) said Java 6 required, although there were always some bundles (and combination of bundles) that supported lower VMs. Is this intentional and an unannounced policy change? Probably not announced well. It has been discussed at status meetings, and various bugzillas, that some previous 1.4 or 1.5 bundles were moving to 1.5 or 1.6, but I am not sure there is yet a comprehensive list of those that have. (Other than looking in the manifests themselves). I think it's been assumed no one cares about Java 1.5 any longer ... so, if anyone does (i.e. you have requirements or customers with requirements for 1.5), then I suggest you open a bug on the specific use-case you need to support on 1.5 and what bundle changes prevent that. I'm sure the committers for those components would be willing to re-consider if it impacts adopters. But, the default assumption for testing should be 1.6 ... would be my personal advice. HTH From:Ed Willink mailto:e...@willink.me.uk e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/02/2013 11:02 AM Subject:[cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Using a recent (post M1)
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
Hi I'm sorry John but you are dodging the issue. There is far too much this is what we do, and very little of this is what we require. Most of the Eclipse SDK is "pure" Java code and has no direct dependence on the underlying operating system. The chief dependence is therefore on the Java Platform itself. Portions are targeted to specific classes of operating environments, requiring their source code to only reference facilities available in particular class libraries (e.g. J2ME Foundation 1.1, J2SE 1.4, Java 5, etc). In general, the 4.3 release of the Eclipse Project is developed on a mix of Java SE 6 and Java SE 7 VMs. As such, the Eclipse SDK as a whole is targeted at all modern, desktop Java VMs. Most functionality is available for Java SE 6 level development everywhere, and extended development capabilities are made available on the VMs that support them. Yes there have been a few bundles that needed 1.6 for some time, but it seems like the critical parts of the platform have been 1.5. The list on http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix still shows very little that needs 1.6, so I see no statement that the platform needs 1.6. I delivered my Indigo, Juno and Kepler releases as Java 5 minimum requirement. Clearly the platform and many projects were highly Java 5 tolerant. There should perhaps be a separate overall statement at the top that 1.6 is the minimum requirement (although some bundles may be more tolerant). Or org.eclipse.core.* needs to change to 1.6 Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 14:57, John Arthorne wrote: I seem to have a knack for definitive statements lately so I'll take a try at this. The last Eclipse Platform release to officially support Java 5 was 3.6/Helios. We have not run our tests against Java 5 for several years and can make no claim that it works. Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). Oracle Java end of life was in 2009 (in fact Oracle Java 6 is also past end of life now). Some individual bundles may still support older runtimes but at this point they are the exception rather than the norm. The list of bundle EE levels is updated with each plan revision, but as long as they are within the scope of the current list of reference platforms they are not generally announced individually. John From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 09:24 AM Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5Platform supportbeen discontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi I am doing my best to continue support for existing functionality, so in the absence of a clear Eclipse statement that Java 5 support is terminated, I feel I have to continue to keep close to 5. Guava changing to Java 6 was awkward. OSGI changing to Java 6 is very close to a mandatory downstream consequence. Can we please have a clear policy statement rather than a secretive creep. I don't mind changing to Java 6, it probably makes life easier. But I hate this are we 5 or 6 limbo? Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 13:51, David M Williams wrote: I probably should have mentioned, there are several bugs we are still trying to work through, where the Tycho/Maven build picks a different "compiler level" than the way PDE used to it ... and not always in the way we intend, for example, https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=415116 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=411419 I am not sure if this is related to the issue you are seeing ... or if merely confirms yet another "unannounced change" ... but I don't think it changes the bottom line: If you want things different than they are, open a bug or comment on an existing one. If it is merely a matter that you don't really care, but
[cross-project-issues-dev] Wrong push on Kepler SR2
Hi all, I just did something I don't really understand on the aggregation repository, and pushed a merging commit ( http://git.eclipse.org/c/simrel/org.eclipse.simrel.build.git/commit/?h=Kepler_maintenanceid=0caf9d67fc9d0d0bdcc18485fbb3f1181387d565 ) along with my real commit, as a result I think I broke a number of other projects (emf, xtext, koneki...). I will revert these changes and hope that the merge didn't break anything else. Sorry about that. Laurent Goubet Obeo attachment: laurent_goubet.vcf___ cross-project-issues-dev mailing list cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cross-project-issues-dev
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
I think you dodged the answer :). If you use Java 5, you're have no guarantees. We could change org.eclipse.* to 1.6, but that would be a huge effort for little gain. From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.ukmailto:e...@willink.me.uk Reply-To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.orgmailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Date: Tuesday, 3 September, 2013 10:45 AM To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.orgmailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Hi I'm sorry John but you are dodging the issue. There is far too much this is what we do, and very little of this is what we require. Most of the Eclipse SDK is pure Java code and has no direct dependence on the underlying operating system. The chief dependence is therefore on the Java Platform itself. Portions are targeted to specific classes of operating environments, requiring their source code to only reference facilities available in particular class libraries (e.g. J2ME Foundation 1.1, J2SE 1.4, Java 5, etc). In general, the 4.3 release of the Eclipse Project is developed on a mix of Java SE 6 and Java SE 7 VMs. As such, the Eclipse SDK as a whole is targeted at all modern, desktop Java VMs. Most functionality is available for Java SE 6 level development everywhere, and extended development capabilities are made available on the VMs that support them. Yes there have been a few bundles that needed 1.6 for some time, but it seems like the critical parts of the platform have been 1.5. The list on http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix still shows very little that needs 1.6, so I see no statement that the platform needs 1.6. I delivered my Indigo, Juno and Kepler releases as Java 5 minimum requirement. Clearly the platform and many projects were highly Java 5 tolerant. There should perhaps be a separate overall statement at the top that 1.6 is the minimum requirement (although some bundles may be more tolerant). Or org.eclipse.core.* needs to change to 1.6 Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 14:57, John Arthorne wrote: I seem to have a knack for definitive statements lately so I'll take a try at this. The last Eclipse Platform release to officially support Java 5 was 3.6/Helios. We have not run our tests against Java 5 for several years and can make no claim that it works. Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). Oracle Java end of life was in 2009 (in fact Oracle Java 6 is also past end of life now). Some individual bundles may still support older runtimes but at this point they are the exception rather than the norm. The list of bundle EE levels is updated with each plan revision, but as long as they are within the scope of the current list of reference platforms they are not generally announced individually. John From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.ukmailto:e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.orgmailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 09:24 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5Platform supportbeendiscontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.orgmailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi I am doing my best to continue support for existing functionality, so in the absence of a clear Eclipse statement that Java 5 support is terminated, I feel I have to continue to keep close to 5. Guava changing to Java 6 was awkward. OSGI changing to Java 6 is very close to a mandatory downstream consequence. Can we please have a clear policy statement rather than a secretive creep. I don't mind changing to Java 6, it probably makes life easier. But I hate this are we 5 or 6 limbo? Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 13:51, David M Williams wrote: I probably should have mentioned, there are several bugs we are still trying to work through, where the Tycho/Maven build picks a different compiler level than the way PDE used to it ... and not always in the way we intend, for example, https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=415116 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=411419 I am not sure if this is related to the issue you are seeing ... or if merely confirms yet another unannounced change ... but I don't think it changes the bottom line: If you want things different than they are, open a bug or comment on an existing one. If it is merely a matter that you don't really care, but you have to change your test scripts, then all I can say is sorry. From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.ukmailto:e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
I can't think of any way to be clearer than I already have. The platform requires Java 6, and it has required Java 6 for several years. Next time I do a plan update I will try to make that even clearer. John From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 10:47 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support beendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi I'm sorry John but you are dodging the issue. There is far too much this is what we do, and very little of this is what we require. Most of the Eclipse SDK is pure Java code and has no direct dependence on the underlying operating system. The chief dependence is therefore on the Java Platform itself. Portions are targeted to specific classes of operating environments, requiring their source code to only reference facilities available in particular class libraries (e.g. J2ME Foundation 1.1, J2SE 1.4, Java 5, etc). In general, the 4.3 release of the Eclipse Project is developed on a mix of Java SE 6 and Java SE 7 VMs. As such, the Eclipse SDK as a whole is targeted at all modern, desktop Java VMs. Most functionality is available for Java SE 6 level development everywhere, and extended development capabilities are made available on the VMs that support them. Yes there have been a few bundles that needed 1.6 for some time, but it seems like the critical parts of the platform have been 1.5. The list on http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix still shows very little that needs 1.6, so I see no statement that the platform needs 1.6. I delivered my Indigo, Juno and Kepler releases as Java 5 minimum requirement. Clearly the platform and many projects were highly Java 5 tolerant. There should perhaps be a separate overall statement at the top that 1.6 is the minimum requirement (although some bundles may be more tolerant). Or org.eclipse.core.* needs to change to 1.6 Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 14:57, John Arthorne wrote: I seem to have a knack for definitive statements lately so I'll take a try at this. The last Eclipse Platform release to officially support Java 5 was 3.6/Helios. We have not run our tests against Java 5 for several years and can make no claim that it works. Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). Oracle Java end of life was in 2009 (in fact Oracle Java 6 is also past end of life now). Some individual bundles may still support older runtimes but at this point they are the exception rather than the norm. The list of bundle EE levels is updated with each plan revision, but as long as they are within the scope of the current list of reference platforms they are not generally announced individually. John From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 09:24 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5Platform supportbeendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi I am doing my best to continue support for existing functionality, so in the absence of a clear Eclipse statement that Java 5 support is terminated, I feel I have to continue to keep close to 5. Guava changing to Java 6 was awkward. OSGI changing to Java 6 is very close to a mandatory downstream consequence. Can we please have a clear policy statement rather than a secretive creep. I don't mind changing to Java 6, it probably makes life easier. But I hate this are we 5 or 6 limbo? Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 13:51, David M Williams wrote: I probably should have mentioned, there are several bugs we are still trying to work through, where the Tycho/Maven build picks a different compiler level than the way PDE used to it ... and not always in the way we intend, for example, https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=415116 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=411419 I am not sure if this is related to the issue you are seeing ... or if merely confirms yet another unannounced change ... but I don't think it changes the bottom line: If you want things different than they are, open a bug or comment on an existing one. If it is merely a matter that you don't really care, but you have to change your test scripts, then all I can say is sorry. From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 08:34 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support beendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi Szymon Your list omits the
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
And this is exactly why a granular approach to supported targets is a bad idea. While it does offer some more flexibility in certain situations, it causes massive confusion as to what's supported overall. The decisions on what targets to support are rarely made on bundle-by-bundle basis because a single bundle does not represent a meaningful usecase. It really does pay to go through all the bundles and update the requirements when a decision is made to change these for a broader component. - Konstantin From: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org [mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org] On Behalf Of Ed Willink Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 9:35 AM To: Cross project issues Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued? Hi I must be very dense. Where does it say The platform requires Java 6. Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 17:19, John Arthorne wrote: I can't think of any way to be clearer than I already have. The platform requires Java 6, and it has required Java 6 for several years. Next time I do a plan update I will try to make that even clearer. John From:Ed Willink mailto:e...@willink.me.uk e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 10:47 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java5 Platformsupportbeendiscontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org _ Hi I'm sorry John but you are dodging the issue. There is far too much this is what we do, and very little of this is what we require. Most of the Eclipse SDK is pure Java code and has no direct dependence on the underlying operating system. The chief dependence is therefore on the Java Platform itself. Portions are targeted to specific classes of operating environments, requiring their source code to only reference facilities available in particular class libraries (e.g. J2ME Foundation 1.1, J2SE 1.4, Java 5, etc). In general, the 4.3 release of the Eclipse Project is developed on a mix of Java SE 6 and Java SE 7 VMs. As such, the Eclipse SDK as a whole is targeted at all modern, desktop Java VMs. Most functionality is available for Java SE 6 level development everywhere, and extended development capabilities are made available on the VMs that support them. Yes there have been a few bundles that needed 1.6 for some time, but it seems like the critical parts of the platform have been 1.5. The list on http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix still shows very little that needs 1.6, so I see no statement that the platform needs 1.6. I delivered my Indigo, Juno and Kepler releases as Java 5 minimum requirement. Clearly the platform and many projects were highly Java 5 tolerant. There should perhaps be a separate overall statement at the top that 1.6 is the minimum requirement (although some bundles may be more tolerant). Or org.eclipse.core.* needs to change to 1.6 Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 14:57, John Arthorne wrote: I seem to have a knack for definitive statements lately so I'll take a try at this. The last Eclipse Platform release to officially support Java 5 was 3.6/Helios. We have not run our tests against Java 5 for several years and can make no claim that it works. Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). Oracle Java end of life was in 2009 (in fact Oracle Java 6 is also past end of life now). Some individual bundles may still support older runtimes but at this point they are the exception rather than the norm. The list of bundle EE levels is updated with each plan revision, but as long as they are within the scope of the current list of reference platforms they are not generally announced individually. John From:Ed Willink mailto:e...@willink.me.uk e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 09:24 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5Platform supportbeendiscontinued? Sent by: mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org _ Hi I am doing my best to continue support for existing functionality, so in the absence of a clear Eclipse statement that Java 5 support is terminated, I feel I have to continue to keep close to 5. Guava changing to Java 6 was awkward. OSGI changing to Java 6 is very close to a mandatory downstream consequence. Can we please have a clear policy statement rather than a secretive creep. I don't mind changing
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
Hi I must be very dense. Where does it say "The platform requires Java 6". Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 17:19, John Arthorne wrote: I can't think of any way to be clearer than I already have. The platform requires Java 6, and it has required Java 6 for several years. Next time I do a plan update I will try to make that even clearer. John From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 10:47 AM Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java5Platform supportbeen discontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi I'm sorry John but you are dodging the issue. There is far too much this is what we do, and very little of this is what we require. Most of the Eclipse SDK is "pure" Java code and has no direct dependence on the underlying operating system. The chief dependence is therefore on the Java Platform itself. Portions are targeted to specific classes of operating environments, requiring their source code to only reference facilities available in particular class libraries (e.g. J2ME Foundation 1.1, J2SE 1.4, Java 5, etc). In general, the 4.3 release of the Eclipse Project is developed on a mix of Java SE 6 and Java SE 7 VMs. As such, the Eclipse SDK as a whole is targeted at all modern, desktop Java VMs. Most functionality is available for Java SE 6 level development everywhere, and extended development capabilities are made available on the VMs that support them. Yes there have been a few bundles that needed 1.6 for some time, but it seems like the critical parts of the platform have been 1.5. The list on http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix still shows very little that needs 1.6, so I see no statement that the platform needs 1.6. I delivered my Indigo, Juno and Kepler releases as Java 5 minimum requirement. Clearly the platform and many projects were highly Java 5 tolerant. There should perhaps be a separate overall statement at the top that 1.6 is the minimum requirement (although some bundles may be more tolerant). Or org.eclipse.core.* needs to change to 1.6 Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 14:57, John Arthorne wrote: I seem to have a knack for definitive statements lately so I'll take a try at this. The last Eclipse Platform release to officially support Java 5 was 3.6/Helios. We have not run our tests against Java 5 for several years and can make no claim that it works. Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). Oracle Java end of life was in 2009 (in fact Oracle Java 6 is also past end of life now). Some individual bundles may still support older runtimes but at this point they are the exception rather than the norm. The list of bundle EE levels is updated with each plan revision, but as long as they are within the scope of the current list of reference platforms they are not generally announced individually. John From:Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To:Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date:09/03/2013 09:24 AM Subject:Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5Platform supportbeen discontinued? Sent by:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org Hi I am doing my best to continue support for existing functionality, so in the absence of a clear Eclipse statement that Java 5 support is terminated, I feel I have to continue to
Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5 Platform support been discontinued?
He didn't. He said that the platform doesn't support java5: Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). On 03/09/2013 12:34 PM, Ed Willink wrote: Hi I must be very dense. Where does it say The platform requires Java 6. Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 17:19, John Arthorne wrote: I can't think of any way to be clearer than I already have. The platform requires Java 6, and it has required Java 6 for several years. Next time I do a plan update I will try to make that even clearer. John From: Ed Willink e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 10:47 AM Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java5Platform supportbeendiscontinued? Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org -- Hi I'm sorry John but you are dodging the issue. There is far too much this is what we do, and very little of this is what we require. /Most of the Eclipse SDK is pure Java code and has no direct dependence on the underlying operating system. The chief dependence is therefore on the Java Platform itself. Portions are targeted to specific classes of operating environments, requiring their source code to only reference facilities available in particular class libraries (e.g. J2ME Foundation 1.1, J2SE 1.4, Java 5, etc)./ /In general, the 4.3 release of the Eclipse Project is developed on a mix of Java SE 6 and Java SE 7 VMs. As such, the Eclipse SDK as a whole is targeted at all modern, desktop Java VMs. Most functionality is available for Java SE 6 level development everywhere, and extended development capabilities are made available on the VMs that support them./ Yes there have been a few bundles that needed 1.6 for some time, but it seems like the critical parts of the platform have been 1.5. The list on _http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=eclipse#appendix_ still shows very little that needs 1.6, so I see no statement that the platform needs 1.6. I delivered my Indigo, Juno and Kepler releases as Java 5 minimum requirement. Clearly the platform and many projects were highly Java 5 tolerant. There should perhaps be a separate overall statement at the top that 1.6 is the minimum requirement (although some bundles may be more tolerant). Or org.eclipse.core.* needs to change to 1.6 Regards Ed Willink On 03/09/2013 14:57, John Arthorne wrote: I seem to have a knack for definitive statements lately so I'll take a try at this. The last Eclipse Platform release to officially support Java 5 was 3.6/Helios. We have not run our tests against Java 5 for several years and can make no claim that it works. Since Platform 3.8 it has certainly been impossible to run the complete platform using Java 5 due to Jetty dependency on Java 6 (and possibly other bundles). Oracle Java end of life was in 2009 (in fact Oracle Java 6 is also past end of life now). Some individual bundles may still support older runtimes but at this point they are the exception rather than the norm. The list of bundle EE levels is updated with each plan revision, but as long as they are within the scope of the current list of reference platforms they are not generally announced individually. John From: Ed Willink _e...@willink.me.uk_ mailto:e...@willink.me.uk To: Cross project issues _cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org_ mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org, Date: 09/03/2013 09:24 AM Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Has Java 5Platform support beendiscontinued? Sent by: _cross-project-issues-dev-bounces@eclipse.org_ mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org
